The Coronavirus Thread - Part 3

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Post by BarrileteCosmico Fri Jul 24, 2020 3:45 am

@CBarca wrote:Caught in the middle of the next political firestorm with very little guidance on what to expect come fall, I can't help but feel frustrated at how weak the American people are. Fragile, entitled, selfish and self-serving brats, the lot.

As we move towards a school reopening which won't be the usual face to face 5 days a week, parents and students will be pissed.

Silly me thinking that the lack of in person school would actually lead people to appreciate the jobs teachers have and the role school provides in a kid's life. I'm seeing more vitriol towards teachers than I have for a while. Somehow we're to blame for the lack of federal leadership and the weakness of the American people


The irony is that had everyone done what they were supposed to for the past 3 months then schools could reopen without too much of a controversy. But now, here we are

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Post by Babun Fri Jul 24, 2020 5:47 am

@CBarca wrote:Caught in the middle of the next political firestorm with very little guidance on what to expect come fall, I can't help but feel frustrated at how weak the American people are. Fragile, entitled, selfish and self-serving brats, the lot.

As we move towards a school reopening which won't be the usual face to face 5 days a week, parents and students will be pissed.

Silly me thinking that the lack of in person school would actually lead people to appreciate the jobs teachers have and the role school provides in a kid's life. I'm seeing more vitriol towards teachers than I have for a while. Somehow we're to blame for the lack of federal leadership and the weakness of the American people

The phenomenon isn't just American. My friend who is a science and physics teacher over here says the same. The point is whoever the parents directly see is the "responsible one". They don't care you guys have to abide by the orders from above. Their problem is if the kids don't go to school they need to hire a nanny or someone to look after them while they work. The matter is quite expensive for them.
@Nishankly wrote:While its exploding and still the first wave in India, it's not the worst scenario. The recovery factor is about 0.7 so for every 1 new case, .7 cases recover.

I am worried about how long just this first wave will last, we are desperate and need the vaccine asap

Good job at containing whatever is possible. You guys will make it Thumbs up
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Post by RealGunner Sun Jul 26, 2020 6:11 am

A spike in coronavirus cases in Spain has prompted new measures amid fears of a more widespread "second wave"

Over 900 cases today

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-53539015

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Post by Robespierre Sun Jul 26, 2020 11:04 am

A  RELEVANT thread on what it is happening in Serbia
I 'll try to translate it



In newspapers, you can read news about people's protests in Belgrade against the reintegration of the safety rules caused by Covid-19.

After Coronavirus broke out, Serbia has been rated as  one of the states with the most stringent security measures in circulation. For weeks, old age people have been forced towards  an endless curfew and lockdown  . Well, as many states we could say it...

Anyway, suddenly all these preventive measures  have been canceled since 7 May. Why ? Because elections were going to begin.  Everything started normally again :  people were encouraged to meet each other , concerts were organized, sporting events etc etc
During the "electoral " period, everything was apparently under control in Serbia, the number of infections was stagnant and  more and more people were healed. It had to be the perception.

But,  

As soon as the elections were over,  truth of the facts emerged, : the  Serbian institutions had lied about the real situation in the country. The number of sick ppl , infected  ppl and dead people was actually more than double what the press had reported.

President Vučić, now that the truth has emerged, wants to take again those  prevention measures adopted in the past  , making these even more rigorous, especially in the area around Belgrade.
For this reason, the exhausted  people got gathered  together in front of parlament in protest.
Don't be fooled, there are no protests against anti-covid security measures. These  are protests against a corrupt state made by  tired and exhausted people.

IF YOU CLICK ON THREAD , you can see   strong images of policemen who beat people or vids of  chemical elements and gases launched on the crowd - even gas used in 1997 . These products expire after 5 years, 23 years have passed now.
Devastating.
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Post by BarrileteCosmico Sun Jul 26, 2020 11:20 am

Argentina now has more cases than China

We fought a good fight but in the end people got sick of being stuck home all day and now here we are. The growth is still exponential and shows no signs of stopping any time soon.
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Post by Myesyats Sun Jul 26, 2020 9:12 pm

We are recording 2x more daily cases now than usual. Looks like second wave has started but the first one didnt even end.

It was usually 200-300 cases per day, now its 400-600. I guess lots of weddings etc and summer parties so people dont care.

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Post by BarrileteCosmico Sun Jul 26, 2020 10:09 pm

https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6930e1.htm

"In a multistate telephone survey of symptomatic adults who had a positive outpatient test result for SARS-CoV-2 infection, 35% had not returned to their usual state of health when interviewed 2–3 weeks after testing. Among persons aged 18–34 years with no chronic medical conditions, one in five had not returned to their usual state of health."

Seems to confirm rincon's and rg's experience. Young people shouldn't act fearless about this.
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Post by Babun Mon Jul 27, 2020 8:31 pm

Söder (conservative minister president of Bavaria) warned people to be aware of the looming second wave, the gold price sky rocketed.
I think those people know more than us, the second wave is knocking on the door in Europe. Even stranger, the number of daily Wuhan virus infections has been rising since a week in Spain yet neither UK or Germany classified them as a risk region Laughing
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Post by Hapless_Hans Mon Jul 27, 2020 8:37 pm

Söder doesn't know more than his assistants' instruction to find the way to the next photo op
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Post by Babun Mon Jul 27, 2020 11:10 pm

@Hapless_Hans wrote:Söder doesn't know more than his assistants' instruction to find the way to the next photo op

By those people I meant his assistants, consultants, informants etc.
I don't live by the illusion the politicians do everything themselves, they're just "responsible" for the decisions. He is pretty sure of the second wave which means the people who inform him are of the same opinion (Gesundheitsämter, Virologen und Consultanten).

‘Only those with plastic visors were infected’: Swiss government warns against face shields
https://www.thelocal.ch/20200715/only-those-with-plastic-visors-were-infected-swiss-government-warns-against-face-shields
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Post by Jay29 Tue Jul 28, 2020 1:40 am

@Babun wrote:Söder (conservative minister president of Bavaria) warned people to be aware of the looming second wave, the gold price sky rocketed.
I think those people know more than us, the second wave is knocking on the door in Europe. Even stranger, the number of daily Wuhan virus infections has been rising since a week in Spain yet neither UK or Germany classified them as a risk region Laughing


Not true. UK has put quarantine rules in place for people coming in from Spain:

What are the rules for Spain?
Spain was removed from the list of exempt countries following "a significant change over the last week in both the level and pace" of coronavirus cases, the government said.

People already in Spain can stay for the remainder of their holiday, but must self-isolate for two weeks after returning.

The rules apply to travellers arriving in the UK from anywhere in Spain - including the Canary and Balearic Islands.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/explainers-53221896

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Post by Babun Tue Jul 28, 2020 2:09 am

@Jay29 wrote:
@Babun wrote:Söder (conservative minister president of Bavaria) warned people to be aware of the looming second wave, the gold price sky rocketed.
I think those people know more than us, the second wave is knocking on the door in Europe. Even stranger, the number of daily Wuhan virus infections has been rising since a week in Spain yet neither UK or Germany classified them as a risk region Laughing


Not true. UK has put quarantine rules in place for people coming in from Spain:

What are the rules for Spain?
Spain was removed from the list of exempt countries following "a significant change over the last week in both the level and pace" of coronavirus cases, the government said.

People already in Spain can stay for the remainder of their holiday, but must self-isolate for two weeks after returning.

The rules apply to travellers arriving in the UK from anywhere in Spain - including the Canary and Balearic Islands.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/explainers-53221896

Thumbs up
Still waiting for Germany to react..
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Post by CBarca Tue Jul 28, 2020 2:39 am

@BarrileteCosmico wrote:https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6930e1.htm

"In a multistate telephone survey of symptomatic adults who had a positive outpatient test result for SARS-CoV-2 infection, 35% had not returned to their usual state of health when interviewed 2–3 weeks after testing. Among persons aged 18–34 years with no chronic medical conditions, one in five had not returned to their usual state of health."

Seems to confirm rincon's and rg's experience. Young people shouldn't act fearless about this.


I'm curious about potential effects of asymptomatic individuals as well. Given that the very nature of being asymptomatic means that you, at least outwardly, haven't shown any signs of being sick, I would be pretty surprised to find that it has any effect weeks after, or any effect inside the body.

Still, the fact that a pretty high percentage of individuals who were symptomatic were not completely healed multiple weeks after is concerning. Again, it would be nice to have more information on what this is doing to the lungs of young, healthy, but symptomatic COVID positive individuals. I've seen the horror story headlines of permanent lung damage but

1) How common would something like that be?
2) What is the severity of the damage?
3) What are the implications?
4) Is it more likely that individuals suffer for multiple weeks after being symptomatic but the actuality is anything more damaging than that is extremely rare?

It makes it difficult to properly assess the risks of, say, going back to school, if we don't know what potential outcomes there are beyond death and outbreaks. If high schoolers (in addition to teachers and staff) have even a decent chance of lung damage, I think parents would be wary.
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Post by Babun Wed Jul 29, 2020 12:27 am

@CBarca wrote:
@BarrileteCosmico wrote:https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6930e1.htm

"In a multistate telephone survey of symptomatic adults who had a positive outpatient test result for SARS-CoV-2 infection, 35% had not returned to their usual state of health when interviewed 2–3 weeks after testing. Among persons aged 18–34 years with no chronic medical conditions, one in five had not returned to their usual state of health."

Seems to confirm rincon's and rg's experience. Young people shouldn't act fearless about this.


I'm curious about potential effects of asymptomatic individuals as well. Given that the very nature of being asymptomatic means that you, at least outwardly, haven't shown any signs of being sick, I would be pretty surprised to find that it has any effect weeks after, or any effect inside the body.

Still, the fact that a pretty high percentage of individuals who were symptomatic were not completely healed multiple weeks after is concerning. Again, it would be nice to have more information on what this is doing to the lungs of young, healthy, but symptomatic COVID positive individuals. I've seen the horror story headlines of permanent lung damage but

1) How common would something like that be?
2) What is the severity of the damage?
3) What are the implications?
4) Is it more likely that individuals suffer for multiple weeks after being symptomatic but the actuality is anything more damaging than that is extremely rare?

It makes it difficult to properly assess the risks of, say, going back to school, if we don't know what potential outcomes there are beyond death and outbreaks. If high schoolers (in addition to teachers and staff) have even a decent chance of lung damage, I think parents would be wary.

https://www.spiegel.de/international/world/covid-19-many-people-stay-sick-after-recovering-from-coronavirus-a-d814c20b-fb3d-47b1-bd2b-d6fd65e0ef33

About 1 in 10 still have fatigue symptoms after being recovered. The research is still ongoing, Wuhan virus is still young..
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Post by El Gunner Thu Jul 30, 2020 7:52 pm

y'all seen this? Been all over social media and YouTube but deleted. This is the only copy i can find still

https://www.bitchute.com/video/rdRnZMTAqwE4/
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Post by Jay29 Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:34 pm

Studies have shown hydroxychloroquine not to work against Covid-19.

If they're saying it works if administered early, they need to back that up with proper studies, not anecdotal evidence.

Doctors have used all sorts of drugs to treat the disease, but until you can isolate the effect, you don't know if it actually worked. The patient could have recovered regardless, or it could been some other reason. Simply taking the drug and getting better afterwards isn't enough to say said drug works.

Like, I could have a cold. If I ate a chocolate bar and happened to recover a day quicker than normal, I can't claim the chocolate bar had restorative powers.

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Post by rincon Thu Jul 30, 2020 9:08 pm

@Jay29 wrote:Studies have shown hydroxychloroquine not to work against Covid-19.

If they're saying it works if administered early, they need to back that up with proper studies, not anecdotal evidence.

Doctors have used all sorts of drugs to treat the disease, but until you can isolate the effect, you don't know if it actually worked. The patient could have recovered regardless, or it could been some other reason. Simply taking the drug and getting better afterwards isn't enough to say said drug works.

Like, I could have a cold. If I ate a chocolate bar and happened to recover a day quicker than normal, I can't claim the chocolate bar had restorative powers.

Also, it's from Breitbart
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Post by El Gunner Thu Jul 30, 2020 9:17 pm

@Jay29 wrote:Studies have shown hydroxychloroquine not to work against Covid-19.

If they're saying it works if administered early, they need to back that up with proper studies, not anecdotal evidence.

Doctors have used all sorts of drugs to treat the disease, but until you can isolate the effect, you don't know if it actually worked. The patient could have recovered regardless, or it could been some other reason. Simply taking the drug and getting better afterwards isn't enough to say said drug works.

Like, I could have a cold. If I ate a chocolate bar and happened to recover a day quicker than normal, I can't claim the chocolate bar had restorative powers.


sure, but if it works for some people doesn't that mean something.

just like how some people take traditional healing medicine to treat diseases?
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Post by Hapless_Hans Thu Jul 30, 2020 9:21 pm

what the hell does hydroxychloroquine have to do with "traditional medicine"

It's a drug. Produced by pharma companies. There's studies made about where and how it works.

If you don't believe that these studies are meaningful on the whole, why don't you go into the pharmacy and just randomly take any stuff?
Because who's to tell whether it might not work against whatever?

Well, I tell you who. Studies. What else?
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Post by El Gunner Thu Jul 30, 2020 9:52 pm

i meant the concept behind letting the people having the choice, and the possibility of "placebo effect"

i'm not the biggest believer in pharma drugs believe me. But a drug is simply a chemical compound, just like how there are chemical compounds in aspirin and marijuana and kratom, etc etc, people tend to forget that.
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Post by Babun Thu Jul 30, 2020 10:54 pm

@El Gunner wrote:i meant the concept behind letting the people having the choice, and the possibility of "placebo effect"

i'm not the biggest believer in pharma drugs believe me. But a drug is simply a chemical compound, just like how there are chemical compounds in aspirin and marijuana and kratom, etc etc, people tend to forget that.

Potentially life threatening if left in the hand of a layman. There's a discipline for that, let the take care of it. I don't know what your stance is with science but if you choose to use a product made by it you should also let it go through their own processes to decide whether it works or not before recommending something to a broader population.
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Post by El Gunner Thu Jul 30, 2020 11:49 pm

these aren't layman though as far as i know, mate

and hydroxychloroquine isn't a new drug, it's been around for treatments...
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Post by CBarca Fri Jul 31, 2020 12:45 am

@El Gunner wrote:i meant the concept behind letting the people having the choice, and the possibility of "placebo effect"

i'm not the biggest believer in pharma drugs believe me. But a drug is simply a chemical compound, just like how there are chemical compounds in aspirin and marijuana and kratom, etc etc, people tend to forget that.


Yeah and advocados are a compound. My eggs and toast in the morning are chemical compounds. The water I drink is a chemical.

Saying something is a chemical compounds means nothing because almost everything is. Could you be more specific about what you mean?
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Post by BarrileteCosmico Fri Jul 31, 2020 12:45 am

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/27/health/coronavirus-mask-protection.html

Wearing masks filters out some Covid particles which leads to a less severe exposure and less severe disease.

So even when it's not effective it still helps.
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Post by El Gunner Fri Jul 31, 2020 3:35 am

@CBarca wrote:
@El Gunner wrote:i meant the concept behind letting the people having the choice, and the possibility of "placebo effect"

i'm not the biggest believer in pharma drugs believe me. But a drug is simply a chemical compound, just like how there are chemical compounds in aspirin and marijuana and kratom, etc etc, people tend to forget that.


Yeah and advocados are a compound. My eggs and toast in the morning are chemical compounds. The water I drink is a chemical.

Saying something is a chemical compounds means nothing because almost everything is. Could you be more specific about what you mean?

of course mate, and that's exactly what i meant.

Drugs come with a lot of scrutiny and stereotypes, when in fact just like everything else it is just a chemical compound. A drug in itself is not bad, it's only in combination with other compounds that it has the potential to result in various outcomes.
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Post by S Fri Jul 31, 2020 5:00 am

Just got my results

I have tested +ve for COVID

I had mild symptoms on Monday, took medication and am feeling fine now though. Surprisingly my sister who had full blown symptoms has tested negative. Bit baffling tbh.
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