Islamists attack US embassy in egypt on 9/11

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Post by Yuri Yukuv Fri Sep 14, 2012 12:57 am

@McLewis wrote:
So by your logic, King Juan-Carlos is a dictator.

As he said, Kings are not dictators. It is merely a title. Many men have used it, with widely vary results. Some our beloved, others are reviled, but you cannot consider all of them dictators based on some dogmatic dictionary definition.

Juan carlos doesnt yield absolute power like the middle eastern ones do, european monarchs are just relics from the past not really kings.

@RedOranje wrote:Dictators are ones who, as your own definition points out, are either given authority or seize it via a coup. Kings are hereditary, rather than seizing power and generally accepted as ruling by divine right.

So is the first king a dictator?

What if a dictator passes down power to his son like Bashar Al Assad? Is Bashar really a king masquerading as a dictator? How about Kim Jong Un?

It seems to me anyone who dictates without need for reelection or real power checks is a dictator

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Post by McLewis Fri Sep 14, 2012 1:16 am

@Yuri Yukuv wrote:
@McLewis wrote:
So by your logic, King Juan-Carlos is a dictator.

As he said, Kings are not dictators. It is merely a title. Many men have used it, with widely vary results. Some our beloved, others are reviled, but you cannot consider all of them dictators based on some dogmatic dictionary definition.

Juan carlos doesnt yield absolute power like the middle eastern ones do, european monarchs are just relics from the past not really kings.


Juan Carlos is King of Spain and by your logic, Kings=Dictators. I'm just making you aware of how fallacious such an assumption is.

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Post by McLewis Fri Sep 14, 2012 1:19 am

@Yuri Yukuv wrote:
So is the first king a dictator?

What if a dictator passes down power to his son like Bashar Al Assad? Is Bashar really a king masquerading as a dictator? How about Kim Jong Un?

It seems to me anyone who dictates without need for reelection or real power checks is a dictator

The first king is/was/will be whatever man he wants to be. That is the glory of being King. He can do as he wants. As I said, some have been truly great men, others have been complete douches. They have that freedom due to their station.

Being crowned a king does not make one automatically a dictator.
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Post by Yuri Yukuv Fri Sep 14, 2012 1:30 am

@McLewis wrote:
@Yuri Yukuv wrote:
So is the first king a dictator?

What if a dictator passes down power to his son like Bashar Al Assad? Is Bashar really a king masquerading as a dictator? How about Kim Jong Un?

It seems to me anyone who dictates without need for reelection or real power checks is a dictator

The first king is/was/will be whatever man he wants to be. That is the glory of being King. He can do as he wants. As I said, some have been truly great men, others have been complete douches. They have that freedom due to their station.

Being crowned a king does not make one automatically a dictator.

I dont know why we are making this about definitions in a general sense, we were talking about GCC rulers in particular. I really cant see how the Sauds, Sabahs, Nohayans, Khalifas and Qabooss of this world cant be called dictators. Calling them Kings and denying that they are dictators makes us feel they are of the same cloth as Juan Carlos or the queen of Engand which they obviously are not.
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Post by II Capitano Fri Sep 14, 2012 3:55 am

@che wrote:
@7amood11 wrote:

You're not very bright are you? They don't represent Islam in any way, because killing anybody, regardless of his/her religion is a grave offense and is prohibited in Islam.

that's adorable, but why do so many of them do it?

there are lines in their book that allow killing people, out of context or not... true or false?

So now Islam is to blame? And not "many" actually commit such disgusting crimes, it's a minority who have decided that they will interpret the Qur'an to suit their needs, thus leaving the rest of the Muslims, who worship in peace, in a difficult position with all the hate directed towards us for sheer ignorance.

False. Every single "non-believer" has to bring this up - enjoy reading this, but please don't make generalisations based on a minority: http://asadullahali.files.wordpress.com/2010/09/the_quran.pdf

On a different note, I am Libyan and I am shocked that this happened. I can understand the bitter taste and hatred the film brought about, however, that does not, in any shape or form, mean that we can suddenly condone violence, which some articles that have alluded to.

You would think our people (and people in general) would learn, but some things just never change...
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Post by vivabarca38 Fri Sep 14, 2012 7:32 am

Really,Really?So now people are blaming Egypt for attacking the US rather than the filmmaker and the people who helped him!?!?What about in 2001 after the attacks when US and the whole world attacked Islamic people when only El-Qaeda was responsible for the attacks...That man attacked Islam and Muhammad.As usual they started this.Jewish fundamentalists make a propaganda video promoted by Christian fundamentalists to provoke Muslim fundamentalists into acting like the violent thugs the Jewish and Christian fundies say they are.
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Post by McLewis Fri Sep 14, 2012 9:23 am

It was just a movie, man.

There was no need to go on a rampage, shooting up shit and killing innocent people.

That is indefensible and inexcusable.
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Post by Highburied Fri Sep 14, 2012 9:43 am

@McLewis wrote:It was just a movie, man.

There was no need to go on a rampage, shooting up shit and killing innocent people.

That is indefensible and inexcusable.

I dont remember a movie made from Muslims making fun of Jesus or christians.

Please remind me.

I understand Muslims are being upset but what protesters dont understand is they are victims of some organizations who are taking advantage of this.

Im Muslim and I hate when people make fun of religion but I have no power to stop them, just like in football, Arsenal jokes are everywhere from rival fans but it would be a waste of time to go ahead and shoot everyone of them.

We live in a world where people are being used for personal profits.
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Post by Mamad Fri Sep 14, 2012 10:30 am

I don't think this rage is all about the film.
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Post by Potential Fri Sep 14, 2012 11:02 am

It's funny how religious people on this forum believe that their holy book mean what they understand but not what it says.

The movie was in retaliation of the christian who live in fear everyday of their life after the elections in egypt, I am wondering why this hasn't been mentioned! Everyday christians die and are prosecuted by islamic extremist.
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Post by Potential Fri Sep 14, 2012 11:06 am

@RealGunner wrote:
@Potential wrote: what however stands to be cleared: the christian society is very peaceful in Jerusalem whereas the muslim society still suffers from hatery toward jews.

Funny that.

Most of my friends in Arab48 Feels the complete Opposite of that.

I am just stating what I see on day to day bases, most christians seemed to understand that Israel is here to stay while (at least most) muslims still call it Palastine and still want all the jews out, although not all of the people agree.

I am glad jews are in charge of holy places, this lessen the interaction of muslims and christians therefore jews act as 'nuclear barrier' therefore they must stay imo.
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Post by Highburied Fri Sep 14, 2012 12:16 pm

@Potential wrote:It's funny how religious people on this forum believe that their holy book mean what they understand but not what it says.

The movie was in retaliation of the christian who live in fear everyday of their life after the elections in egypt, I am wondering why this hasn't been mentioned! Everyday christians die and are prosecuted by islamic extremist.

Make million movies for all I care and since movies are made from professionals, they need to understand some principles in religion.

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Post by McLewis Fri Sep 14, 2012 1:55 pm

So you're saying that insulting religions should be out of bounds for filmmakers? Even when those filmmakers made that movie in a country that protects their right to free speech?

I repeat, it's just a movie.
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Post by Highburied Fri Sep 14, 2012 2:12 pm

Insulting religion is not a free speech sir.

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Post by Potential Fri Sep 14, 2012 2:47 pm

@highburied wrote:Insulting religion is not a free speech sir.


Why? What gives religion that special right? Why should we treat it differently? It's stupid to give anything that immunity!
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Post by Highburied Fri Sep 14, 2012 2:52 pm

@Potential wrote:
@highburied wrote:Insulting religion is not a free speech sir.


Why? What gives religion that special right? Why should we treat it differently? It's stupid to give anything that immunity!

You dont have to treat it differently, just be respectful, thats all. If thats too hard for you then we have nothing to discuss.

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Post by Adit Fri Sep 14, 2012 3:17 pm

Poor from the religious extremists. Killing innocents in the name of a stupid movie.Like 'Legend' said they strongly do believe it is their duty to attack any one who insult Islam and are overly sensitive when it comes to their believe.

In a recent incident in my country some islamic extremists chopped a professors hand of for writing a book in which a ''mad man'' name was given as 'Muhamad' . So it is not just a isolated incidence, for a religion of peace it does have many very uneducated and misread followers.

Although i dont think any Religion is immune of criticism.why should they ?

Regarding USA and their foreign policy lol.

Do people strongly believe USA supports Israel because israel is more democratic ?Laughing

Why did they support Pakistan who is a islamic fundementalist against both wars against India ( largest democratic system in the world ) in the history ?

why do they support UAE ? lmao democracy ? please..


USA has history of doing things which benefit them in the immediate future. What they care about is the benefit,that is all.

They used Osama in the war against USSR. They supported Saddham in the Iran-Iraq war, Kenal Gadhaffi was once very good friend of USA. What happened to all of them?

USA is a fox,a godamn big one.
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Post by che Fri Sep 14, 2012 3:18 pm

@Potential wrote:

Why? What gives religion that special right? Why should we treat it differently? It's stupid to give anything that immunity!

if religion could be openly questioned and ridiculed more religious people would give it up, so to avoid that the adults are filling children's heads with this "you can't question religion" crap... then instead of questioning their beliefs they get a hate-boner for the people who do question it... this mentality then gets passed onto the next generation, and the next, and the next...

it's a self-perpetuating circle of stupidity
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Post by Spider Fri Sep 14, 2012 3:25 pm

@Potential wrote:I am just stating what I see on day to day bases, most christians seemed to understand that Israel is here to stay while (at least most) muslims still call it Palastine and still want all the jews out, although not all of the people agree.

It will always be Palastine not I***** =)

Anyway on topic , Egyptians should have acted in a different way i agree on that , After all Prophet Muhammad ( s.a.a.w) told us to meet abuse with good ,

+ " freedom of speech " can kiss my @ss it's just a cover made by the media to say attack anyone you want , you can't just curse someone and then say " hey heeeeey it's just freedom of speech i can say what i want "


@Potential wrote:It's funny how religious people on this forum believe that their holy book mean what they understand but not what it says.

The movie was in retaliation of the christian who live in fear everyday of their life after the elections in egypt, I am wondering why this hasn't been mentioned! Everyday christians die and are prosecuted by islamic extremist.

" Christian who live in fear everyday of their life after the elections in egypt"
"Everyday christians die and are prosecuted by islamic extremist "

Everyday :facepalm: rofl dude show me evidence and i will start debating with you , other than that you can't just make things up lol
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Post by II Capitano Fri Sep 14, 2012 3:26 pm

@McLewis wrote:So you're saying that insulting religions should be out of bounds for filmmakers? Even when those filmmakers made that movie in a country that protects their right to free speech?

I repeat, it's just a movie.
Exactly.

Whilst the film maker has shown little respect towards the Muslim faith by portraying a figure that we don't know how he looked like, we shouldn't justify these killings by using this excuse. Of course it led to the killings, however, it sends out the wrong message (take a look at one of the articles on The Guardian).

This is just sickening (in the film) but at the same time, freedom of speech, which is why I don't get the attack(s):

The film portrays Muhammad as a pathetic fraud, a child molester. He is an unwanted bastard at birth, and only gains his self-confidence after an older woman summons the cringing young man to her tent and pushes his head under her skirts where he nuzzles her crotch. When he emerges, he has seen visions.

The dialogue reminds me of a Jack Chick comic. In one scene Muhammad tells a noble Jewish elder, "Pay the extortion or go to Palestine". The elder spits at his feet and walks off.

The mother of one of Muhammad's wives weeps and calls him "a child molester". He is shown running his hands over a silently protesting pubescent girl. Then he pushes her on to her back, kneels between her legs, and says, "For you, I am cancelling the adoption. Islamic nation forbids the adoption for Zeinab. That is the next verse in the Qur'an."
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Post by che Fri Sep 14, 2012 3:28 pm

@Spider wrote:

+ " freedom of speech " can kiss my @ss it's just a cover made by the media to say attack anyone you want , you can't just curse someone and then say " hey heeeeey it's just freedom of speech i can say what i want "

it actually is, though... you can say whatever the hell you want so long as it doesn't threaten anyone

should it be illegal to call fat people fat because it hurts their feelings?
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Post by Spider Fri Sep 14, 2012 3:34 pm

@che wrote:
@Spider wrote:

+ " freedom of speech " can kiss my @ss it's just a cover made by the media to say attack anyone you want , you can't just curse someone and then say " hey heeeeey it's just freedom of speech i can say what i want "

it actually is, though... you can say whatever the hell you want so long as it doesn't threaten anyone

should it be illegal to call fat people fat because it hurts their feelings?

That's right that is surly right , but i was talking when you use that to curse and abuse other people

about the the last part of course not , but it should be illegal when you say it in an abusive way towards fat people
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Post by Highburied Fri Sep 14, 2012 3:39 pm

@che wrote:
@Spider wrote:

+ " freedom of speech " can kiss my @ss it's just a cover made by the media to say attack anyone you want , you can't just curse someone and then say " hey heeeeey it's just freedom of speech i can say what i want "

it actually is, though... you can say whatever the hell you want so long as it doesn't threaten anyone

should it be illegal to call fat people fat because it hurts their feelings?

What an absolute ignorant post.

Comparing fat people with religion just for the sake of argument. :facepalm:

What do you know about the value ?

Religion to majority of people is too valuable and should not be insulted.

Or a simple question... What dont you watch your own business and life since you seem like a 'cool' guy who doesnt care??

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Post by Highburied Fri Sep 14, 2012 3:42 pm

@che

A better question... What you know about Spartak Trnava FC??

My cousin had a trial last week.
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Post by TalkingReckless Fri Sep 14, 2012 3:47 pm

@Potential wrote:
@RealGunner wrote:
@Potential wrote: what however stands to be cleared: the christian society is very peaceful in Jerusalem whereas the muslim society still suffers from hatery toward jews.

Funny that.

Most of my friends in Arab48 Feels the complete Opposite of that.

I am just stating what I see on day to day bases, most christians seemed to understand that Israel is here to stay while (at least most) muslims still call it Palastine and still want all the jews out, although not all of the people agree.

I am glad jews are in charge of holy places, this lessen the interaction of muslims and christians therefore jews act as 'nuclear barrier' therefore they must stay imo.

Another BS thing about you

Jews, Christians and Muslims have lived in the Area now Palestine and Israel for many centuries.

All of them lived in Peace until the state of Israel was created and a influx of so called "God's given right" Jews started pouring into that area. I have met alot of Jewish people who don't give a dam about Israel and openly say that they have no right to call it their own land.

According to Alexander Scholch, the population of Palestine in 1850 had about 350,000 inhabitants, 30% of whom lived in 13 towns; roughly 85% were Muslims, 11% were Christians and 4% Jews

By 1948, the population had risen to 1,900,000, of whom 68% were Arabs, and 32% were Jews (UNSCOP report, including bedouin).
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Post by RealGunner Fri Sep 14, 2012 3:55 pm

@Potential wrote:It's funny how religious people on this forum believe that their holy book mean what they understand but not what it says.

The movie was in retaliation of the christian who live in fear everyday of their life after the elections in egypt, I am wondering why this hasn't been mentioned! Everyday christians die and are prosecuted by islamic extremist.

And it's still funny you pretending to understand it

They movie is by a man who think's Islam is a cancer to this world and his objective was to bring out a reaction from the Muslims so he can prove his point. A disgusting tactic but the "freedom of speech" protects him so he couldn't care less.

I don't think the movie is real in any case.
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