Re: City choking vs Utd

by Gil Sun Aug 07, 2011 5:04 pm

Anyway I have to say Welbeck's workrate throughout the match was fantastic. Reminded me of Rooney in his younger days.

by Iceman Sun Aug 07, 2011 5:06 pm

Immaculate_Mole wrote:
He can play it effectively and he did consistently last year but what is he suppose to do with the opposition is dominating possession?

He is a playmaker in the final third, he is suppose to create for the forwards not to win or keep possession and when the people who are suppose to do that dont do it what more can he do?

City are severely lacking a Sahin type imo.

He can start by spraying the ball around, or actually creating chances. Like I said, today he was only interested in playing a give-and-go sorta pass. Once that play got figured out, he didn't try and change things up. Not to mention, to play such a game you need very technical players who know how to pass with ease. Dzeko, for example, doesn't really fit the bill. Not to mention, he doesn't drop deep so it makes that sort of play even harder.

by Great Leader Sprucenuce Sun Aug 07, 2011 5:12 pm

Iceman wrote:
Immaculate_Mole wrote:
He can play it effectively and he did consistently last year but what is he suppose to do with the opposition is dominating possession?

He is a playmaker in the final third, he is suppose to create for the forwards not to win or keep possession and when the people who are suppose to do that dont do it what more can he do?

City are severely lacking a Sahin type imo.

He can start by spraying the ball around, or actually creating chances. Like I said, today he was only interested in playing a give-and-go sorta pass. Once that play got figured out, he didn't try and change things up. Not to mention, to play such a game you need very technical players who know how to pass with ease. Dzeko, for example, doesn't really fit the bill. Not to mention, he doesn't drop deep so it makes that sort of play even harder.

Well yes that's true but when you have Toure, Barry, De-Jong and Dzeko around you its not exactly easy to do what are you saying i would'nt put the blame on Silva for this as there was practically no movement and technical ability around him.

Also you said he is overrated dont you think one poor performance which was'nt really his fought is a bit of a kneejerk?

by Gil Sun Aug 07, 2011 5:12 pm

Iceman wrote:
Gil wrote:Seems like I'm still the only one who doesn't get the hype that surrounds City.

They're really not all that despite the circle jerking among the English press.

I agree with you to an extent.
Like I just said, they don't have much variety in their play. When you compare the different types of players at City with the ones at Chelsea or Arsenal for example, there's a huge difference.
I also think their squad depth is misinterpreted as "quality". While its great to have depth, only 11 players can actually start. They keep on buying players that can only replace players in the first XI, not add any sort of variety and that is a big downfall imo.
For example, only one of Tevez or Aguero can actually start (If he is to play well, anyway). But people automatically say: "OMG, City have Aguero now...they are so gonna win the EPL title!". They fail to see that the purchase of Aguero will only actually make a difference if Tevez is injured, and even then...we already saw how City played with Tevez more or less always fit so its not like they are going to improve in any way over that.
Had they bough Sneijder; however, then we can talk about improvement

Yeah I agree with this. For all of David Silva's talent he really isn't someone you want to be building your team around. Isn't productive enough to be the teams main playmaker.

You can see why Mancini desperately wants another midfielder.

They're still distinctively average in defense as well which is one of the main reasons I think Mancini goes overly defensive at times. Richards, Kolarov, Clichy and Lescott aren't good enough. Hart is a fantastic shot stopper, one of the best in the game but his handling and distribution have always been shocking.

Kompany is top class though. Top 5 CB in the EPL, Top 10 in the World.

by kiranr Sun Aug 07, 2011 5:15 pm

The Franchise wrote:
kiranr wrote:
The Franchise wrote:
kiranr wrote:Putting on Barry is okay. He got Johnson on too.

He could have use Barry to spray ball wide to Johnson and Clichy from the midfield. But City just kept playing too narrow upfront. Wasteful by Mancini!

Barry cant do those things though, he hasnt got particularly great passing range and accuracy and its not like he can carry the ball skillfully into better areas to make the passes easier.

I agree, although Xavi seems to rate him a bit. Anyway, does Mancini have anyone that has a good passing range in the midfield? If he is playing Dzeko, isn't it always better to feed him crosses into the box?

Silva can play final balls, but Dzeko is too slow and has poor movement. He and City look much better with Tevez and so would they will Aguero. Dzeko ruins more then half of the attacking moves in the final 1/3

But getting into the final third was half the problem today, probably more then half. No connecting player, they need a number 8 in my opinion because they dont have anyone.

Dzeko is slow isn't he. He would drop deep and ruin it for everybody.

Silva could play that role. But that means he has to play deeper. However, when Aguero starts playing, i am hoping that wouldn't be much of a problem. Aguero and Balotelli upfront could really be a dangerous combo for City.

by kiranr Sun Aug 07, 2011 5:17 pm

Gil wrote:
Iceman wrote:
Gil wrote:Seems like I'm still the only one who doesn't get the hype that surrounds City.

They're really not all that despite the circle jerking among the English press.

I agree with you to an extent.
Like I just said, they don't have much variety in their play. When you compare the different types of players at City with the ones at Chelsea or Arsenal for example, there's a huge difference.
I also think their squad depth is misinterpreted as "quality". While its great to have depth, only 11 players can actually start. They keep on buying players that can only replace players in the first XI, not add any sort of variety and that is a big downfall imo.
For example, only one of Tevez or Aguero can actually start (If he is to play well, anyway). But people automatically say: "OMG, City have Aguero now...they are so gonna win the EPL title!". They fail to see that the purchase of Aguero will only actually make a difference if Tevez is injured, and even then...we already saw how City played with Tevez more or less always fit so its not like they are going to improve in any way over that.
Had they bough Sneijder; however, then we can talk about improvement

Yeah I agree with this. For all of David Silva's talent he really isn't someone you want to be building your team around. Isn't productive enough to be the teams main playmaker.

You can see why Mancini desperately wants another midfielder.

They're still distinctively average in defense as well which is one of the main reasons I think Mancini goes overly defensive at times. Richards, Kolarov, Clichy and Lescott aren't good enough. Hart is a fantastic shot stopper, one of the best in the game but his handling and distribution have always been shocking.

Kompany is top class though. Top 5 CB in the EPL, Top 10 in the World.

I think Silva and Aguero could really combine well together. In any case, Yaya Toure should dfeinitely play deeper. Silva in Yaya's role today could have been a lot more productive.

by Albiceleste Sun Aug 07, 2011 5:19 pm

Gil wrote:
Iceman wrote:
Gil wrote:Seems like I'm still the only one who doesn't get the hype that surrounds City.

They're really not all that despite the circle jerking among the English press.

I agree with you to an extent.
Like I just said, they don't have much variety in their play. When you compare the different types of players at City with the ones at Chelsea or Arsenal for example, there's a huge difference.
I also think their squad depth is misinterpreted as "quality". While its great to have depth, only 11 players can actually start. They keep on buying players that can only replace players in the first XI, not add any sort of variety and that is a big downfall imo.
For example, only one of Tevez or Aguero can actually start (If he is to play well, anyway). But people automatically say: "OMG, City have Aguero now...they are so gonna win the EPL title!". They fail to see that the purchase of Aguero will only actually make a difference if Tevez is injured, and even then...we already saw how City played with Tevez more or less always fit so its not like they are going to improve in any way over that.
Had they bough Sneijder; however, then we can talk about improvement

Yeah I agree with this. For all of David Silva's talent he really isn't someone you want to be building your team around. Isn't productive enough to be the teams main playmaker.

You can see why Mancini desperately wants another midfielder.

They're still distinctively average in defense as well which is one of the main reasons I think Mancini goes overly defensive at times. Richards, Kolarov, Clichy and Lescott aren't good enough. Hart is a fantastic shot stopper, one of the best in the game but his handling and distribution have always been shocking.

Kompany is top class though. Top 5 CB in the EPL, Top 10 in the World.

I agree, I admire Kompany, great player and athlete.

by Gil Sun Aug 07, 2011 5:20 pm

Still don't buy the Yaya hype personally.

Yet to see why people think he would make a good DM.

by kiranr Sun Aug 07, 2011 5:23 pm

Gil wrote:Still don't buy the Yaya hype personally.

Yet to see why people think he would make a good DM.

Doesn't necessarily have to be a DM. He could partner De Jong to form a double pivot!

by xabi Sun Aug 07, 2011 5:30 pm

kiranr wrote:
Gil wrote:Still don't buy the Yaya hype personally.

Yet to see why people think he would make a good DM.

Doesn't necessarily have to be a DM. He could partner De Jong to form a double pivot!

City choking vs Utd - Page 7 Slide2-100x100

by Iceman Sun Aug 07, 2011 5:33 pm

Immaculate_Mole wrote:
Iceman wrote:
Immaculate_Mole wrote:
He can play it effectively and he did consistently last year but what is he suppose to do with the opposition is dominating possession?

He is a playmaker in the final third, he is suppose to create for the forwards not to win or keep possession and when the people who are suppose to do that dont do it what more can he do?

City are severely lacking a Sahin type imo.

He can start by spraying the ball around, or actually creating chances. Like I said, today he was only interested in playing a give-and-go sorta pass. Once that play got figured out, he didn't try and change things up. Not to mention, to play such a game you need very technical players who know how to pass with ease. Dzeko, for example, doesn't really fit the bill. Not to mention, he doesn't drop deep so it makes that sort of play even harder.

Well yes that's true but when you have Toure, Barry, De-Jong and Dzeko around you its not exactly easy to do what are you saying i would'nt put the blame on Silva for this as there was practically no movement and technical ability around him.

Also you said he is overrated dont you think one poor performance which was'nt really his fought is a bit of a kneejerk?

Just because I believe that he is overrated, doesn't that I consider him to be "bad". Hey, I'd actually take him over Nasri at this point because Nasri has been trash in the pre-season, as well as the second half of last season. Thats too long of a "dry" spell for my liking.

Silva failed to adapt to the game, as well as the players around him. If the players around you aren't technical enough to play that sort of game, then perhaps he should have tried a different approach? City have good wingers who love to run, and their formation allows the fullbacks to act almost like wingers too. Perhaps utilizing the wings more would have been a better option today. I saw several instances of players completely free on the wing, but Silva still tried to force the move through the middle, and usually the ball was intercepted after 2 or 3 passes.

Plus, I thought that Toure was such a great player? Where are all the people that were slating me for saying that Wilshere was a better passer and dribbler? If Toure was half the passer Wilshere was, we might have seen something different from City today

by Gil Sun Aug 07, 2011 5:34 pm

by Lex Sun Aug 07, 2011 5:36 pm

Without reading through 11 pages of Serie A fans defending Manchester City because Balotelli is there, i'd personally like to thank Manchester United for showing up Real Madrid Lite and forcing everyone who keeps kissing City's arse to eat a big, giant, stinky crow, freshly plucked off the tree of fail

by Lex Sun Aug 07, 2011 5:37 pm

Gil wrote:

Awesome goal, torn to shreds they were

by Iceman Sun Aug 07, 2011 5:37 pm

If you think about it, City, Chelsea and United are all looking for the same kind of player. The difference between the latter two and City is that their youth/young players, as well as their whole squad, offers more in terms of passing and creativity than City's squad does.

by Dnmac4 Sun Aug 07, 2011 5:40 pm

WOW, I like City but you have to be scared by what you saw in the second half today. They couldn't even get the ball past midfield.

I guess there are two ways you can look at the game,

1. They were one minute away and a mistake by one of the best defenders in Europe from going to PK's with the 2 or 3rd best team on the planet.

2. A monumental CHOKE job and manager was clearly out coached.

I would have to go with option two. I think with Mancini at the helm, United will always have there number and City will always play second fiddle as long as SAF is there.

Also for those of you blaming Silva, today was not his fault. Yes he could have played better, but there ball winners got bossed like I have never seen before in the second half. He needs the ball to be effective, and in the second half United didn't let him touch it.

Some posters on this thread were also commenting about City's depth and how it's not helping as they can only play 11 players. This is true, but I think when winter rolls around and injuries and multiple competitions kick in City is better apt to handle it then any other team in Europe, bar Madrid and that's when you will see them make there move in the league.

by Iceman Sun Aug 07, 2011 5:47 pm

Not necessarily talking about depth as much as I'm talking about variety.

Example: See how Silva sticks out like a sore thumb in that midfield? Thats exactly City's problem.

by kiranr Sun Aug 07, 2011 5:47 pm

Iceman wrote:If you think about it, City, Chelsea and United are all looking for the same kind of player. The difference between the latter two and City is that their youth/young players, as well as their whole squad, offers more in terms of passing and creativity than City's squad does.

This is so true!

by Dnmac4 Sun Aug 07, 2011 5:49 pm

Gil wrote:Still don't buy the Yaya hype personally.

Yet to see why people think he would make a good DM.

He is kind of a hybrid AM and DM. He needs to be around other creative players to maximize his potential. When you play him with 1 or 2 other DM's he lets them do the dirty work and plays as an AM, and that is not what he is best at. He is best when he is playing as the sole DM and you get his attacking qualities as a bonus.

His quality is unmistakable. I mean he won the FA Cup for City almost by himself. He scored the only goal in the semi final and the only goal in the final, against United and Stoke, that is class.

by Busby Babe Sun Aug 07, 2011 5:52 pm

Average age was just 22 in the 2nd half Cool

by Dnmac4 Sun Aug 07, 2011 5:59 pm

Iceman wrote:Not necessarily talking about depth as much as I'm talking about variety.

Example: See how Silva sticks out like a sore thumb in that midfield? Thats exactly City's problem.

I see what your saying, but Xavi would stick out like a sore thumb too if Barca couldn't win the ball and keep posession. Silva in my mind is a great player but his game is still adapting to EPL and it is obvious because other players in the EPL learn how to be effective w/o the ball and he is still learning that, but he will get there.

As far as different depth, your right in midfield they have a bunch of DM's and one one AM and one quality Winger. Milner was a waste of money as Johnson is way better then him and they could use another creative player (probably why they want Nasri or Wesley).

I think in attack and defense they have quality and different depth. Yes Tevez and Kun are similar but then Balotelli and Dzeko and way different from each other and Kun and Tevez. And in Defense they just have a bunch of good players they just have to find the right fit.

Mancini's biggest fault is that he STILL hasn't found his best 11. HE changes his back 4 too often and it hurts them.

by RealGunner Sun Aug 07, 2011 6:00 pm

"Best midfield in the PL" vs the likes of Cleverley, anderson, carrick

guess who came out on top...

by Gil Sun Aug 07, 2011 6:05 pm

Won't stop people from overrating them though. If Wenger would actually wise up for once and sign a LB, CB and a Backup ST (Should have signed Sturridge when he had the chance IMO).

They'd battle it out with Liverpool & Sp*rs for fourth.

by Mr Nick09 Sun Aug 07, 2011 6:05 pm

RealGunner wrote:"Best midfield in the PL" vs the likes of Cleverley, anderson, carrick

guess who came out on top...

i lol'd

by Dnmac4 Sun Aug 07, 2011 6:06 pm

RealGunner wrote:"Best midfield in the PL" vs the likes of Cleverley, anderson, carrick

guess who came out on top...

Your best midfield just lost leads to Boca, Red Bulls, and Benefica. Just stop trolling, City lost to the 2nd best team in the world and were 1 minute away from penalties, get real man.

by RealGunner Sun Aug 07, 2011 6:07 pm

Gil wrote:Won't stop people from overrating them though. If Wenger would actually wise up for once and sign a LB, CB and a Backup ST (Should have signed Sturridge when he had the chance IMO).

They'd battle it out with Liverpool & Sp*rs for fourth.

wait... we will battle for 4th after signing those players or before lol ?

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