Re: Aurelien Tchouameni

by The Demon of Carthage Wed Jun 01, 2022 9:49 pm

To circle back to Tchou, I like him a lot. I think he has the potential to become world class, but there is no way in hell he's worth €100m or even the initially reported €80m.

If Monaco is adamant to not bring their asking price down to a reasonable amount, Madrid should put an end to the negotiations. Tchouameni then can either wait until 2024 to join Madrid or go to PSG now. Either way, I wish him good luck.

by sportsczy Wed Jun 01, 2022 9:50 pm

We weren't generating our own money either until more recently than you would think lol... state backed loans where we didn't need to provide collateral, pay interest and could renegotiate payment terms whenever we wanted to. What's more there was a "football tax" law in Spain where football-related revenue was in the same tax bracket as places such as Monaco (enormous advantage). This tax advantage was removed in 2015 or something like that.

So please spare me the "We did it fairly" fable.

by The Demon of Carthage Wed Jun 01, 2022 9:58 pm

No matte how hard you try to make it look like it's the same, it is not.

Having an entire state pumping money into your club is not the same as having loans with advantageous interest rates. No matter how you flip it, you are comparing apples to oranges.

So until you realize this, there's no point in pushing this discussion even further.

by sportsczy Wed Jun 01, 2022 10:14 pm

That's the state pumping money into Real Madrid as well... same thing. Just trying to be sneaky about it.

If you want to think it's different, so be it. It's not.

Frankly, I don't see anything wrong with either. I'm not a hypocrite. Western money has more blood on it than any money in the world.

by Clutch Wed Jun 01, 2022 11:30 pm

sportsczy wrote:That's the state pumping money into Real Madrid as well... same thing. Just trying to be sneaky about it.

If you want to think it's different, so be it. It's not.

Frankly, I don't see anything wrong with either. I'm not a hypocrite. Western money has more blood on it than any money in the world.

real madrid never did what PSG did when they got mbappe and neymar the same window. That was insane

by Perucho21 Wed Jun 01, 2022 11:51 pm

Not supporting Sports comments but I'd argue signing Ronaldo and Kaka in the same summer was equally as outrageous.

Real Madrid have done some crazy transfer stuff in the past. But that doesn't mean what PSG is doing right now is a good thing

by Clutch Thu Jun 02, 2022 7:06 am

Perucho21 wrote:Not supporting Sports comments but I'd argue signing Ronaldo and Kaka in the same summer was equally as outrageous.

Real Madrid have done some crazy transfer stuff in the past. But that doesn't mean what PSG is doing right now is a good thing

yeah but they sold a lot of players that summer to get those funds. Whenever real madrid made a big purchase, they sold quite a few players to offload that purchase.

by halamadrid2 Thu Jun 02, 2022 10:44 am

According to Marca our best offer is 60ME + variables and it's now up to Monaco to accept

by The Demon of Carthage Thu Jun 02, 2022 12:09 pm

halamadrid2 wrote:According to Marca our best offer is 60ME + variables and it's now up to Monaco to accept

Good for Madrid for standing firm, €60m seems a fair price. Monaco are free to turn down the offer and sell him to someone else if they want more money ( and if Tchouaméni accepts ).

by sportsczy Thu Jun 02, 2022 2:30 pm

https://www.marca.com/futbol/real-madrid/2022/06/02/62987842268e3e17438b4600.html

Monaco already turned Madrid down per french media. PSG are there... but so is Liverpool at 80 mil. Up to Tchouameni to pick one of the two or stay put at Monaco (he's under contract for another 2 years).

I think Liverpool may take this one. Not media reports... just a sneaky suspicion. I think they were just monitoring the situation and then will put a good final bid. They did the same with Mbappe and Mbappe actually spoke with them.

by halamadrid2 Thu Jun 02, 2022 2:40 pm

If Tchouameni holds firm Monaco won't have a choice. They'll have to accept our proposal or we could get him for half of that next summer. But Tchouameni has previously said he could go to either Pool or RM so if they match Monaco asking price he could be off to Liverpool.

I hope we hold firm. Unlike attackers there aren't shortages of talented midfielders in Europe

by sportsczy Thu Jun 02, 2022 3:12 pm

Nothing about “hold firm”. Monaco promised Tchouameni that he’s free to go where he wants if the minimum price of 80 mil is reached. If not, Monaco may not sell.

He agreed to that (very common oral understanding between player and club since exit clauses are illegal). Nothing surprising here. Madrid needs to either play ball or gtfo and let the real men play.

by halamadrid2 Thu Jun 02, 2022 3:35 pm

Quite telling that Tchouameni wants to join either Liverpool or Real Madrid and not that circus despite being French and in demand. As of now neither look like they'll match that fee. Either they lower that fee or lose him for half of that when he has a year left on his contract.

If rumours are to be believed we asked Tchouameni to wait a season when we were in pursuit of Mpaypal.

Isn't that the sort of agreement Mpaypal had with QSG last summer Laughing

means feck all that's what

by sportsczy Thu Jun 02, 2022 6:22 pm

Oh i get it... Real Madrid tells a player to wait and then get him for cheaper next year. That strategy worked out great recently, right?

Zero chance he stays at Monaco this year. He prefers Real Madrid, but also fine with Liverpool or PSG. Monaco is making best efforts to give Real Madrid time to make the needed offer. If that fails, he'll go somewhere else.

Assuming Liverpool meet the 80 mil pricetag, likely there. If not, then PSG it is unless other options open up.

Reason for the last part is that City is rumored to have jumped in now. Man U wanted to as well, but Tchouameni doesn't want to go there.

As long as there are teams that meet Monaco's pricetag, there is no reason for them to bring it down.

by futbol_bill Fri Jun 03, 2022 1:08 am

I debunked all of Sports theories in another thread yet he moves to another thread repeats the same bullshit or is he just trying to get under our skin trolling us?

futbol_bill wrote:
sportsczy wrote:One has a state (and its financial institutions) overtly funding a club... while the other had a state (and its financial intuitions) covertly funding a club.

Different financial engineering. Same outcome = the clubs had access to quasi-limitless funds via mechanisms provided by the state and the financial institutions of that state.

How is it different from a practical perspective?

Just to remind everyone, FFP was finally passed after Real Madrid bought Kaka, CR, Benzema, etc. by getting €243m of loans by Spanish financial institutions, despite the club being in deep financial shit under Calderon, and Spain basically allowing football clubs and players to have highly beneficial tax treatment (which was illegal btw, read here: https://www.eurosport.com/football/liga/2020-2021/barcelona-and-real-madrid-will-have-to-pay-back-millions-in-taxes-court-says-in-win-for-eu_sto8158811/story.shtml)

So Madrid fans talking shit about other clubs outspending them is the like the pot calling the kettle black.

For christ’s sake, get your facts right! The Beckham law was not put in place for footballers (it’s only called the Beckham law because he was the first foreigner to take advantage of the rule) and the loan you are referring to was not at ridiculous rates and it was paid off within a few years.the financial institutions are privately owed and not under government control. Unlike the Arab state owned teams, the Spanish government has not had any ownership of Real Madrid nor do they direct the bank on what they should do (other than normal federal banking regulations). The tax law you keep referring to wasn’t aimed at footballers, not Real Madrid, it was aimed at foreign workers to help boost tourism. Not that different than the tax incentives and subsidies like in Ireland for example.

And FFP had nothing to do with Real Madrid. It was implemented to prevent European teams from running up huge debt and losses and to be financially prudent, something that has never been the case at Real Madrid. It was meant for teams going literally bankrupt.

you started off your BS by saying decades of Madrid purchases yet the examples you are referring to are at most 15 years ago! And if you look at the past 15 years, Real Madrid is not even in the top 10 in terms of expenditures!

And finally club was not in deep financial shit under Calderon. He was a very poor president no doubt, but he was kicked out for voting irregularities. It certainly was nothing like the current Barcelona situation that you are implying.

Why don’t you just run away to your French fantasy and enjoy your state owned team! Amazing how you ridicule both Juventus and Real Madrid, teams you supported as long as Zidane was with them for practices you falsely state they practiced yet your current team of choice is indeed doing far worse offenses. What a hypocrite you are!

by Doc Fri Jun 03, 2022 1:36 am

I could actually see Liverpool matching the 80 million but after some serious convincing/number crunching. Truthfully though, out of the 3 clubs, Madrid need him the least and interestingly enough, PSG need him the most so his signing should be placed at the tippy top of their transfer list.

I dare say these sort of signings should have been done last season but my low opinion of how PSG do things is not unwarranted at all.

by The Demon of Carthage Fri Jun 03, 2022 8:11 pm

I don't think Liverpool would pay €80m for him either. As long as they have Klopp in charge, they will remain a well-run club and I don't see Klopp being stupid enough to offer €80m for a 22-year old under development.

Only PSG are willing and that's because they don't mind getting double-fisted and fleeced at every turn.

by halamadrid2 Fri Jun 03, 2022 8:23 pm

Well they did spend 60ME on Naby Keita

Monaco has the ability to ask for whatever they want. It's up to the buyers to draw a line under which they won't cross . Ihope we have done that at 60ME

by The Madrid One Sat Jun 04, 2022 4:20 am

Hmmm. I think the fact that he's French, young, tall, physical, and black is part of an arguable overhype behind Tchouameni. I keep watching footage of him and yes he does seem like a great ball winner (maybe even "elite") but his "press resistance" (i.e. agility, nimbleness, ability to turn) and his passing range does not seem as impressive. His profile and versatility as a player also looks more limited in terms of function and zone. I'm not particularly enamored, although I can plausibly see him coming good as a Casemiro profile heir. Was wishing for something a bit more dynamic. If he joins, we'll see.

by Blue Sun Jun 05, 2022 6:22 am

Reminds of Bissouma.

by sportsczy Sun Jun 05, 2022 4:54 pm

https://www.marca.com/en/football/real-madrid/2022/06/05/629cb0bde2704e75b78b45c8.html

So Tchouameni came out in Telefoot today and said he hasn't decided yet. Tells you two thing:

- Madrid's offer isn't good enough and Monaco let him know. Tchouameni knew the 80 mil minimum requirement and is now considering clubs that will meet that price.
- Press should just STFU and act responsibly. You can't assert something to be true when it is not. Just clickbait.

by futbol_bill Sun Jun 05, 2022 6:56 pm

I’m reading the opposite Sports and given your past BS and your statement you are joking 90% of the time I’m inclined to lean towards what I read.

Julien Maynard a French journalist who it states is influential particularly in regards to PSG has gone to twitter saying he believes Tchouameñi has not changed his mind and is waiting for Monaco to agree with Madrid offer.

Your right though seems not no one knows for sure and we all should just wait and see. Whether it’s the media playing games or you, I find it interesting that your are quoting Marca who your normally despise, while I found a French journalist presumably an influential one that you usual put all your stock on.

by sportsczy Sun Jun 05, 2022 7:20 pm

He had an interview today on Telefoot Bill... directly from his mouth. Here are the full quotes from Telefoot:

https://twitter.com/telefoot_TF1/status/1533383503907282947?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1533383503907282947%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.besoccer.com%2Fnew%2Ftchouameni-leaves-madrid-and-psg-wondering-i-haven-t-decided-yet-1147540

If you watch the timeline, Tchouameni made those statements after Maynard asserted that he had chosen Real Madrid (he was just repeating what he had heard last week). This is new info.

They key here is that his preference... is exactly that, a preference. Monaco does not have to sell him and has demanded that 80 million is the minimum fee. Other big clubs have met this number. So at the end of the day, unless Real Madrid pay up or Monaco decide to take less (unlikely), Tchouameni will choose another club.

by futbol_bill Sun Jun 05, 2022 7:45 pm

IF it’s true so much for your previous statements of no exit clauses in France, handshake or not. If is is just a handshake agreement, we know it not enforceable and we now know French do not keep their word.

So enough of this, I’ll wait to see how it turns out!

by sportsczy Sun Jun 05, 2022 8:12 pm

"bon de sortie" is a handshake agreement... it's a way for clubs to attract players and get around the "no exit clause" law in France. Technically, it's unenforceable. But nobody would go to a club if a club agreed to it and then backed out.

Tchouemani has a 80 million handshake agreement with Monaco.

And yeah, Spain is the bastion of ethics and morality... it's known for it :facepalm:

You want a study in "trustability", read this: https://www.ipsos.com/sites/default/files/ct/news/documents/2021-10/Global-trustworthiness-index-2021.pdf

And the illegality of exit clauses is not up for debate: https://wdassocies.com/en/clauses-of-termination-of-football-players-contracts-in-france

by futbol_bill Sun Jun 05, 2022 8:23 pm

What I know is few things about Flo.

1. There is never only one choice.
2. He refuses to overpay to what is a reasonable market price.
3. He is already looking at market for players either out of contract or on their last year of contract. And yes there and at least one midfielder on the list in Fabián plus there is the possibility of keeping Caballos.
4., Carlo already has 5 starting mids that he’ll have to rotate. The 6th one or even 7th doesn’t have to be a starter at least for this year.
5. he is trying to use the Mbappe money wisely not overpaying for not allowing anyone to force the club, at least enough for next season.

There are a couple of other factors this year,
1 the schedule is full, that Carlo has asked Flo for a full squad

2 there is the issue of home grown players and they need at least 2 more to meet the quota.

PS, it must really piss you off that Carlo has influence over signings, something that Zidane never got!

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