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Post by Unique on Wed Feb 19, 2020 8:12 pm

@McLewis wrote:
@Unique wrote:
@McLewis wrote:I had planned to take a trip to Greece a couple years back to cross seeing it off my bucket list. Then I read the news story about Bakari Henderson, a black American student, getting beat to death outside a restaurant. All over him taking a selfie with the waitress, who is Serbian. This apparently pissed off 7 Serb guys, 1 Greek and a British guy of Serbian descent who reportedly quipped "Why take the selfie with the black guy when there's all these Serbs here?" . One of them hit Henderson and he fought back. He then fled the restaurant, was chased by a mob of these guys, and was beaten to death in 30 seconds. Videos captured them celebrating the beating with high-fives.

All 9 were acquitted of murder and instead got lighter sentences with the longest being 15 years. All of them claimed that they didn't intend to kill Henderson. The judge apparently believed them.

I love Greek history and Greek mythology, but not enough to risk my life for either.

EDIT: Apparently as of January, a 2nd trial might happen, a rarity in Greek law I'm gathering. 3 of the 9 were completely acquitted and won't be retried, but 6 will be. I hope they get it right this time.
you live in one of the most dangerous citys on earth europe is a cake walk. Very Happy


Detroit has a lot of crime due to robberies, theft and murder with guns. Getting beat to death in public by a mob is unheard of here. It's unheard of in virtually all American cities. Having lived in this area for almost 10 years, I know where I can go in this area to avoid trouble. When tourists come to the city, it's pretty easy to see where the no-go zones are. That is not the case in Greece, which is an archipelago. So this guy likely didn't know that the Greek island he was on had a reputation for hooliganism, hard-partying and fighting. And even if he had, no one should be getting away with racially motivated mob beatings. The 5 years most of those guys got was nothing. It's no real secret that Eastern Europeans have a tendency towards viewing the "other" with hostility. Serbia, Croatia, Bosnia & Herzegovina, Montenegro, Kosovo....these are some super homogeneous countries. Racism is to be expected as a result.

That man's family deserve more justice than that. Surely you can agree with that, can't you?
i agree with all of that but thats not the point im making. my point is you have 50 times more chance of getting killed where you live now than you do going to a tourist area in europe. what im trying to say is black americans getting beaten to death in europe is very very rare so dont be put off or scared to come to europe by storys like that.

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Post by The Demon of Carthage on Wed Feb 19, 2020 8:15 pm

@McLewis wrote:All 9 were acquitted of murder and instead got lighter sentences with the longest being 15 years. All of them claimed that they didn't intend to kill Henderson. The judge apparently believed them.

I never heard of this case until you mentioned it. The sentences that were handed down are absolutely laughable.

You beat a person to death in the street and then you walk away with a jail time that doesn't in any way do justice to the severity of the crime that was committed?!

Bravo to the judge, really impeccable ruling here.

As for the guys who killed the poor kid, I hope they receive the same treatment when they visit a foreign country and decide to take a selfie with a local girl (although, looking at their faces, I'm pretty sure no girl would ever agree to that).

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Post by McLewis on Wed Feb 19, 2020 10:11 pm

@Unique wrote:
@McLewis wrote:
@Unique wrote:
@McLewis wrote:I had planned to take a trip to Greece a couple years back to cross seeing it off my bucket list. Then I read the news story about Bakari Henderson, a black American student, getting beat to death outside a restaurant. All over him taking a selfie with the waitress, who is Serbian. This apparently pissed off 7 Serb guys, 1 Greek and a British guy of Serbian descent who reportedly quipped "Why take the selfie with the black guy when there's all these Serbs here?" . One of them hit Henderson and he fought back. He then fled the restaurant, was chased by a mob of these guys, and was beaten to death in 30 seconds. Videos captured them celebrating the beating with high-fives.

All 9 were acquitted of murder and instead got lighter sentences with the longest being 15 years. All of them claimed that they didn't intend to kill Henderson. The judge apparently believed them.

I love Greek history and Greek mythology, but not enough to risk my life for either.

EDIT: Apparently as of January, a 2nd trial might happen, a rarity in Greek law I'm gathering. 3 of the 9 were completely acquitted and won't be retried, but 6 will be. I hope they get it right this time.
you live in one of the most dangerous citys on earth europe is a cake walk. Very Happy


Detroit has a lot of crime due to robberies, theft and murder with guns. Getting beat to death in public by a mob is unheard of here. It's unheard of in virtually all American cities. Having lived in this area for almost 10 years, I know where I can go in this area to avoid trouble. When tourists come to the city, it's pretty easy to see where the no-go zones are. That is not the case in Greece, which is an archipelago. So this guy likely didn't know that the Greek island he was on had a reputation for hooliganism, hard-partying and fighting. And even if he had, no one should be getting away with racially motivated mob beatings. The 5 years most of those guys got was nothing. It's no real secret that Eastern Europeans have a tendency towards viewing the "other" with hostility. Serbia, Croatia, Bosnia & Herzegovina, Montenegro, Kosovo....these are some super homogeneous countries. Racism is to be expected as a result.

That man's family deserve more justice than that. Surely you can agree with that, can't you?
i agree with all of that but thats not the point im making. my point is you have 50 times more chance of getting killed where you live now than you do going to a tourist area in europe. what im trying to say is black americans getting beaten to death in europe is very very rare so dont be put off or scared to come to europe by storys like that.


I would agree if we were talking about gun violence. Since we're talking solely about hand to hand violence, those statistics don't work.

It's all well and good to not be put off by such things and more power to the black guys that head to super white places like Russia, Poland, Serbia, Croatia, etc. They are braver than I will probably ever be.  If I do come to Europe, I'll stick to countries that have more diversity like the UK, France, Germany, etc.
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Post by McLewis on Wed Feb 19, 2020 10:16 pm

@The Demon of Carthage wrote:
@McLewis wrote:All 9 were acquitted of murder and instead got lighter sentences with the longest being 15 years. All of them claimed that they didn't intend to kill Henderson. The judge apparently believed them.

I never heard of this case until you mentioned it. The sentences that were handed down are absolutely laughable.

You beat a person to death in the street and then you walk away with a jail time that doesn't in any way do justice to the severity of the crime that was committed?!

Bravo to the judge, really impeccable ruling here.

As for the guys who killed the poor kid, I hope they receive the same treatment when they visit a foreign country and decide to take a selfie with a local girl (although, looking at their faces, I'm pretty sure no girl would ever agree to that).


It was a pretty big story for a few days here. There's a video of it out there too. It's a pretty brutal watch. Won't post it here though out of respect for the man's family.
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Post by Unique on Wed Feb 19, 2020 11:11 pm

@McLewis wrote:
@Unique wrote:
@McLewis wrote:


Detroit has a lot of crime due to robberies, theft and murder with guns. Getting beat to death in public by a mob is unheard of here. It's unheard of in virtually all American cities. Having lived in this area for almost 10 years, I know where I can go in this area to avoid trouble. When tourists come to the city, it's pretty easy to see where the no-go zones are. That is not the case in Greece, which is an archipelago. So this guy likely didn't know that the Greek island he was on had a reputation for hooliganism, hard-partying and fighting. And even if he had, no one should be getting away with racially motivated mob beatings. The 5 years most of those guys got was nothing. It's no real secret that Eastern Europeans have a tendency towards viewing the "other" with hostility. Serbia, Croatia, Bosnia & Herzegovina, Montenegro, Kosovo....these are some super homogeneous countries. Racism is to be expected as a result.

That man's family deserve more justice than that. Surely you can agree with that, can't you?
i agree with all of that but thats not the point im making. my point is you have 50 times more chance of getting killed where you live now than you do going to a tourist area in europe. what im trying to say is black americans getting beaten to death in europe is very very rare so dont be put off or scared to come to europe by storys like that.


I would agree if we were talking about gun violence. Since we're talking solely about hand to hand violence, those statistics don't work.

It's all well and good to not be put off by such things and more power to the black guys that head to super white places like Russia, Poland, Serbia, Croatia, etc. They are braver than I will probably ever be.  If I do come to Europe, I'll stick to countries that have more diversity like the UK, France, Germany, etc.
how you get killed is not really the problem though because being dead is being dead. some places in europe are not as safe as others i agree but greece and croatia should be fine i have black mates that has been to croatia on holiday for the last 3 years and they love it there.

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Post by Myesyats on Wed Feb 19, 2020 11:24 pm

Eastern Europe isnt any less safe than white US states like New Hampshire imo. It gets a bad rep for no reason,. The case that's been brought up sounds extremely rare, never heard of sth like that in the last 10 years at least or ever (in Poland at least)
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Post by VivaStPauli on Thu Feb 20, 2020 2:11 am

It made the news because stuff like that is super rare. It's a shame it does ever happen, but you're 20 times more likely to die in a robbery in the US than you are being murdered for shits and giggles in Europe.
(The 20 times number is obviously made up, but still - if you go by violent crime statistics, most parts of Europe are safer)

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Post by McLewis on Thu Feb 20, 2020 2:20 pm

Apparently there were 2 shootings at Shisha bars in Hanau, Germany just last night. 43-year old German citizen with xenophobic far-right leanings shot up 2 bars, killing 8 people. He then killed his mother and himself.

Unsurprisingly, the shooter was a white guy and his victims appear to have been of Middle Eastern descent.

Awful stuff.
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Post by Unique on Thu Feb 20, 2020 3:37 pm

Yeah this shit is getting out of hand. The brown people are blowing up the white people. The white people are shooting the brown people when will it ever stop. Another story in the news today about more men gang raping young girls in Britain. Unsurprisingly the men are Muslims. All you hear now is bad news.

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Post by Myesyats on Thu Feb 20, 2020 3:55 pm

@Unique wrote:All you hear now is bad news.

Because that's what's only ever reported. Every time you open the newspaper there is 1 nice story and 10 shocking/sad ones and they do it on purpose because that's what sells. And the bad stories always take up most space on news websites.

There've been 3 far-right shootings in Germany in the past year, it's bad but not worse than in any other point in time i think.
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Post by VivaStPauli on Thu Feb 20, 2020 6:52 pm

@Myesyats wrote:There've been 3 far-right shootings in Germany in the past year, it's bad but not worse than in any other point in time i think.


No it sadly is actually getting worse. Because those guys feel emboldened by the Politicians who peddle in populist xenophobic stereotypes, you have the fringe guys feeling like society will approve of their acts of terrorism. It's also why I'm so strongly opposed to the likes of Boris Johnson or Donald Trump, even if they don't start any fires, they do supply a lot of oil.
Merkel herself is pretty blameless in this, but her party has been subtly harping the songs of xenophobia for decades now, and her dedicated successor, Friedrich Merz, is nothing if not a closeted bigot with overtly anti-muslim bias, and I strongly suspect an accompanying disdain for brown people. And poor people.
That's why I disagree with unique when he says nothing changes. Words do matter. If right-wing domestic terrorists listen to Trump, Johnson, or Merz long enough they will end up convinced what they're doing is right and just, even if it's not legal. And this is why we have to talk about implicit racism as well as explicit racism.

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Post by Unique on Thu Feb 20, 2020 7:33 pm

I find it crazy how people blame the likes of trump and Johnson for right wing terrorist saying the things they say affect the actions of right wing terrorist and then say Islam and the Quran has nothing to do with Islamic terrorism when it clearly states in the Quran that you should murder and commit terrorist acts under the right circumstances. I mean the Quran directly tells people it's ok to to murder when has anyone seen trump or Johnson tell people it's ok to murder. It's truly unreal how much the religion of Islam gets away with. People all the time picking up on any little word Jonson or trump says so people can call them bad men and racist and they should not be allowed to lead a country. The Quran says it's ok to have sex with children. It's ok to kill gay people. It's ok to beat women. It's ok to cut a child's hand off for stealing food. It's ok to cut the head off your enemy and rape his wife if he don't submit to Islam. It's ok to commit terrorist acts. Now just for one second imagine if Johnson or trump said all of that stuff was ok. But because it's the quran and people don't want to be called racist they just look the other way on that and spend all there time talking about how many Muslims will die because Johnson the racist said a Muslim women looked like a bank robber one 6 years ago. If promoting hate is something we need to wipe out then wipe it all out from where ever it comes from be that a racist politician or a religious books but don't just pick and choose who has to go and who can stay.


Last edited by Unique on Thu Feb 20, 2020 7:46 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by VivaStPauli on Thu Feb 20, 2020 7:39 pm

Come on, I explicitly said that they make people feel like it's okay, even when they're not telling them so directly. Please for once in your life answer to an argument someone actually made instead of a straw man from your imagination.

That being said, of course the Quran got tons to do with muslim willingness to murder nonbelievers, but that doesn't mean all muslims want to murder nonbelievers. The bible also got tons to do with terrorist groups like the KKK but I don't see Trump putting Evangelicals on no-fly lists.

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Post by Unique on Thu Feb 20, 2020 7:56 pm

@VivaStPauli wrote:Come on, I explicitly said that they make people feel like it's okay, even when they're not telling them so directly. Please for once in your life answer to an argument someone actually made instead of a straw man from your imagination.

That being said, of course the Quran got tons to do with muslim willingness to murder nonbelievers, but that doesn't mean all muslims want to murder nonbelievers. The bible also got tons to do with terrorist groups like the KKK but I don't see Trump putting Evangelicals on no-fly lists.
people like Tommy Robinson has been taken off every social media platform in the world because they say his hate speech is a danger and could compel people to commit violence so they ended the guy. Robinson has never told people it's ok to kill. He has never told anyone it's ok to commit terrorist acts. He has never told anyone it's ok to rape the wife of your enemy if he don't submit to your beliefs. The Quran says all of that yet no one says that stuff has to be removed from the book. Why not. If it's hate speech you want to wipe out then why not wipe it out where ever it is found. That's what pisses me off. They ban people like Robinson because people could miss interpret what he says yet we have a book that literally says you can kill people and nothing is done. How is that.

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Post by VivaStPauli on Thu Feb 20, 2020 7:58 pm

That's lovely whataboutism, but 9 people were just killed 20km from where I grew up, and we've had decades of right-wing politicians telling us right-wing terrorism wasn't an issue, but they fucking keep killing people, and it pisses me off.

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Post by Unique on Thu Feb 20, 2020 8:08 pm

Look at it this way how many people will get killed in the next 30 years for anything Johnson or trump has said in the past. And how many people will die in the next 30 years because someone has read the Quran and done what it says in the book. I'm guessing the numbers are not even worth comparing. Now as you have said we need to get rid of people like Johnson and trump because some of the things they say could make people turn to violence. So now tell me what should be done about the quran?

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Post by Unique on Thu Feb 20, 2020 8:13 pm

@VivaStPauli wrote:That's lovely whataboutism, but 9 people were just killed 20km from where I grew up, and we've had decades of right-wing politicians telling us right-wing terrorism wasn't an issue, but they fucking keep killing people, and it pisses me off.
right wing terrorism is a big problem and even one person dying at the hands of a right wing terrorist is to many but again the amount of people dying from Islamic terrorism compared to right wing terrorism is not even in the same ball park. But you think getting rid of people like trump and Boris will go a long way to stopping right wing terror groups so do you also think getting rid of the quran or making them change what the book says will go a long way to stopping Islamic terrorism.

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Post by VivaStPauli on Thu Feb 20, 2020 8:14 pm

But I can't vote against the Prophet Mohammed in the next election, yet I can vote against Friedrich Merz, and you could've voted against Johnson.

About Quran, the same thing should be done as is about the bible: educate people. Nobody with an actual grasp on logic believes in those fairy tales, and you know as well as I do that all religious people are basically crazy, sure, most of them are harmlessly crazy, and they compartmentalize and their craziness doesn't influence their everyday lives much, but they're still crazy, and some of them will turn to violence because crazy ideas lead to crazy actions.

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Post by VivaStPauli on Thu Feb 20, 2020 8:14 pm

@Unique wrote:
@VivaStPauli wrote:That's lovely whataboutism, but 9 people were just killed 20km from where I grew up, and we've had decades of right-wing politicians telling us right-wing terrorism wasn't an issue, but they fucking keep killing people, and it pisses me off.
right wing terrorism is a big problem and even one person dying at the hands of a right wing terrorist is to many but again the amount of people dying from Islamic terrorism compared to right wing terrorism is not even in the same ball park. But you think getting rid of people like trump and Boris will go a long way to stopping right wing terror groups so do you also think getting rid of the quran or making them change what the book says will go a long way to stopping Islamic terrorism.


I would honestly be fine with getting rid of both, I just feel we should be fair about it and throw out all the bibles together with all the qurans. Let Trump and Johnson build a fort out of Bibles and Qurans on a remote island, where they can't hurt anyone. Put the house of Saud and Kim Jong Un and all the other wackadoodles on there as well.

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Post by Unique on Thu Feb 20, 2020 8:19 pm

@VivaStPauli wrote:But I can't vote against the Prophet Mohammed in the next election, yet I can vote against Friedrich Merz, and you could've voted against Johnson.

About Quran, the same thing should be done as is about the bible: educate people. Nobody with an actual grasp on logic believes in those fairy tales, and you know as well as I do that all religious people are basically crazy, sure, most of them are harmlessly crazy, and they compartmentalize and their craziness doesn't influence their everyday lives much, but they're still crazy, and some of them will turn to violence because crazy ideas lead to crazy actions.
yes I do agree with you that religious people are a little crazy and it's not a good idea to give crazy people a book that tells them it's ok to kill.

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Post by VivaStPauli on Thu Feb 20, 2020 8:22 pm

TBH religion is the one topic where we probably agree to like 90%, it's everything else I got issues with.

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Post by Young Kaz on Thu Feb 20, 2020 11:48 pm

@Unique wrote:
@McLewis wrote:
@Unique wrote:
i agree with all of that but thats not the point im making. my point is you have 50 times more chance of getting killed where you live now than you do going to a tourist area in europe. what im trying to say is black americans getting beaten to death in europe is very very rare so dont be put off or scared to come to europe by storys like that.


I would agree if we were talking about gun violence. Since we're talking solely about hand to hand violence, those statistics don't work.

It's all well and good to not be put off by such things and more power to the black guys that head to super white places like Russia, Poland, Serbia, Croatia, etc. They are braver than I will probably ever be.  If I do come to Europe, I'll stick to countries that have more diversity like the UK, France, Germany, etc.
how you get killed is not really the problem though because being dead is being dead. some places in europe are not as safe as others i agree but greece and croatia should be fine i have black mates that has been to croatia on holiday for the last 3 years and they love it there.


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Post by Young Kaz on Fri Feb 21, 2020 5:01 pm

@McLewis wrote:
@Unique wrote:
@McLewis wrote:


Detroit has a lot of crime due to robberies, theft and murder with guns. Getting beat to death in public by a mob is unheard of here. It's unheard of in virtually all American cities. Having lived in this area for almost 10 years, I know where I can go in this area to avoid trouble. When tourists come to the city, it's pretty easy to see where the no-go zones are. That is not the case in Greece, which is an archipelago. So this guy likely didn't know that the Greek island he was on had a reputation for hooliganism, hard-partying and fighting. And even if he had, no one should be getting away with racially motivated mob beatings. The 5 years most of those guys got was nothing. It's no real secret that Eastern Europeans have a tendency towards viewing the "other" with hostility. Serbia, Croatia, Bosnia & Herzegovina, Montenegro, Kosovo....these are some super homogeneous countries. Racism is to be expected as a result.

That man's family deserve more justice than that. Surely you can agree with that, can't you?
i agree with all of that but thats not the point im making. my point is you have 50 times more chance of getting killed where you live now than you do going to a tourist area in europe. what im trying to say is black americans getting beaten to death in europe is very very rare so dont be put off or scared to come to europe by storys like that.


I would agree if we were talking about gun violence. Since we're talking solely about hand to hand violence, those statistics don't work.

It's all well and good to not be put off by such things and more power to the black guys that head to super white places like Russia, Poland, Serbia, Croatia, etc. They are braver than I will probably ever be.  If I do come to Europe, I'll stick to countries that have more diversity like the UK, France, Germany, etc.


I wouldnt trust france. This was in "diverse" Paris:


If I can find some more I can probably convince my girlfriend not to push for a france trip this year.
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Post by Myesyats on Fri Feb 21, 2020 5:19 pm

The owners probably did it themselves to create free advertisement lol
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Post by Unique on Fri Feb 21, 2020 5:35 pm

@Young Kaz wrote:
@McLewis wrote:
@Unique wrote:
i agree with all of that but thats not the point im making. my point is you have 50 times more chance of getting killed where you live now than you do going to a tourist area in europe. what im trying to say is black americans getting beaten to death in europe is very very rare so dont be put off or scared to come to europe by storys like that.


I would agree if we were talking about gun violence. Since we're talking solely about hand to hand violence, those statistics don't work.

It's all well and good to not be put off by such things and more power to the black guys that head to super white places like Russia, Poland, Serbia, Croatia, etc. They are braver than I will probably ever be.  If I do come to Europe, I'll stick to countries that have more diversity like the UK, France, Germany, etc.


I wouldnt trust france. This was in "diverse" Paris:


If I can find some more I can probably convince my girlfriend not to push for a france trip this year.
dont worry mate if you get attacked your girlfriend can save you because it sounds like she is the one with the balls anyway. Thumbs up

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Post by Unique on Fri Feb 21, 2020 5:40 pm

Emmanuel Macron vows to 'win the battle' against Muslims creating separate communities in France

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8016455/Emmanuel-Macron-vows-win-battle-against-Muslims-creating-separate-communities-France.html


ow shit. he will regret that Neutral

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