Xavi Complains

Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:

M99 wrote:I hate to say it but that Inter side is one of the greatest Italian teams of all time. It's up there with Herrera's Inter, Rocco's Milan, Liedholm's Roma, Trappatoni's Juve etc.

And I would say the first and so far only Italian treble is a pretty big legacy.

Agreed but they are not remembered as such.... maybe to GL and fans of similar hardcore support they are but in the grand scheme of things they aint....

Also its funny you mention Herrera because in the grand scheme of things he's not either.... heck i didn't even know who he was till i joined GL.

Arquitescu wrote:I love Xavi, but I am growing tired and weary of this crock of shit that he continues to bring up as his frequent jibes are not justified by any tangible inference.

Where I come from, a brimstone pot of footballing culture; we all remember the Champions League wins of Mourinho's Inter and even Roberto Di Matteo's Chelsea.

-We remember how poor Inter were in the group stages followed by the unconcealed chortles on the thought of them usurping Barca after narrowly scraping through Ancelotti's Chelsea.

David vs Goliath

-We remember the absolute tactical masterclass that was the 1st leg vs Barca in the San Siro, thoroughly and comprehensively outwitting a prime Guardiola team 3-1 and bringing them to their knees.

David vs Goliath

-We remember a 10 man Inter in Camp Nou (result of a poor call) surviving in one of the most disciplined and organized phalanx's ever conjured after an onslaught of possession tiki-taka to which proved a miracle in the end as Mourinho and the Interisti players could not fathom that they survived such an aggressive incursion. It was a miracle.

David vs Goliath

-We remember one of the finest tactical displays in Champions League Final history when Mourinho thoroughly and utterly dismantled an arrogant LvG's Bayern to which was quite literally the perfect match from Inter, Milito's brilliant brace a mere compliment to the tactical finesse on display.


Chelsea?

-Who does not remember this 7th place Chelsea going down 10 men in Camp Nou, raising further convictions that a victory would be merely impossible within that moment? We remember Messi's failed penalty, Chelsea surviving all odds and Torres' shocking round-up goal vs Valdes to seal Barca's fate. It was polarities on expectations to the finest degree. 12 men conquered a 100k+ Cules

David vs Goliath

-Who does not remember Bayern's advantage of their team, form and playing the Champions League Final in their own home? Followed by Didier Drogba's flash in the pan header to power through the Bavarian momentum in the final minutes of the clock?

David vs Goliath

Who remembers when the mental odds stacked against Chelsea when the English were known to falter in penalties while the Germans known to succeed in them, let alone the record of English teams vs Germans? Who remembers Chelsea outclassing the Bavarians right in front of their raucous fans?  

I certainly do.

Football is not only remembered on the basis of aesthetics and dimensions of subjective play, yet based on the moments achieved against the grain, the inertia of odds and expectations that weigh down David as the philistines laugh at his audacity.

Xavi will never realize that until he experiences what the Chelsea and Inter unison faced nor will he understand what has brought the Blue and Nerrazzuri fans together; through the mutual emotions experienced in such an unforeseeable victory over such improbability.

He does not know it.

They do.

Hence why this is effectively a redundant debate.

Lord Spencer wrote:

Yohan Modric wrote:No one's really going to remember Inter/Chelsea winning the CL because they won it playing generic football. However people are going to remember Barcelona winning it due to the spectacular football they played and because they were one of the best teams in history.

What people usually "remember" first are teams that defined decades of football. This is the case for this Barca team.

However, people still remember teams that won the CL 25 years ago if they are football fans. Certainly if they are fans of the team and/or the league.

Case in point MUnited vs. Bayern, which would be something someone cries about because of "anti-football" but will be remembered as one of the most dramatic victories in the CL.

Yohan Modric wrote:

Lord Spencer wrote:

Yohan Modric wrote:No one's really going to remember Inter/Chelsea winning the CL because they won it playing generic football. However people are going to remember Barcelona winning it due to the spectacular football they played and because they were one of the best teams in history.

What people usually "remember" first are teams that defined decades of football. This is the case for this Barca team.

However, people still remember teams that won the CL 25 years ago if they are football fans. Certainly if they are fans of the team and/or the league.

Case in point MUnited vs. Bayern, which would be something someone cries about because of "anti-football" but will be remembered as one of the most dramatic victories in the CL.

Yeh that and Istanbul they'll remember due to the final being dramatic and entertaining. However I don't see what was special about Inter/Chelsea winning it.

harhar11 wrote:

Arquitescu wrote:I love Xavi, but I am growing tired and weary of this crock of shit that he continues to bring up as his frequent jibes are not justified by any tangible inference.

Where I come from, a brimstone pot of footballing culture; we all remember the Champions League wins of Mourinho's Inter and even Roberto Di Matteo's Chelsea.

-We remember how poor Inter were in the group stages followed by the unconcealed chortles on the thought of them usurping Barca after narrowly scraping through Ancelotti's Chelsea.

David vs Goliath

-We remember the absolute tactical masterclass that was the 1st leg vs Barca in the San Siro, thoroughly and comprehensively outwitting a prime Guardiola team 3-1 and bringing them to their knees.

David vs Goliath

-We remember a 10 man Inter in Camp Nou (result of a poor call) surviving in one of the most disciplined and organized phalanx's ever conjured after an onslaught of possession tiki-taka to which proved a miracle in the end as Mourinho and the Interisti players could not fathom that they survived such an aggressive incursion. It was a miracle.

David vs Goliath

-We remember one of the finest tactical displays in Champions League Final history when Mourinho thoroughly and utterly dismantled an arrogant LvG's Bayern to which was quite literally the perfect match from Inter, Milito's brilliant brace a mere compliment to the tactical finesse on display.


Chelsea?

-Who does not remember this 7th place Chelsea going down 10 men in Camp Nou, raising further convictions that a victory would be merely impossible within that moment? We remember Messi's failed penalty, Chelsea surviving all odds and Torres' shocking round-up goal vs Valdes to seal Barca's fate. It was polarities on expectations to the finest degree. 12 men conquered a 100k+ Cules

David vs Goliath

-Who does not remember Bayern's advantage of their team, form and playing the Champions League Final in their own home? Followed by Didier Drogba's flash in the pan header to power through the Bavarian momentum in the final minutes of the clock?

David vs Goliath

Who remembers when the mental odds stacked against Chelsea when the English were known to falter in penalties while the Germans known to succeed in them, let alone the record of English teams vs Germans? Who remembers Chelsea outclassing the Bavarians right in front of their raucous fans?  

I certainly do.

Football is not only remembered on the basis of aesthetics and dimensions of subjective play, yet based on the moments achieved against the grain, the inertia of odds and expectations that weigh down David as the philistines laugh at his audacity.

Xavi will never realize that until he experiences what the Chelsea and Inter unison faced nor will he understand what has brought the Blue and Nerrazzuri fans together; through the mutual emotions experienced in such an unforeseeable victory over such improbability.

He does not know it.

They do.

Hence why this is effectively a redundant debate.

It's not really a David and Goliath thing. Inter had won the Serie A for 4 years in row, no(?), and were almost always one of the favourites to win the CL, while Chelsea is almost always one of the top team that spend the most money in transfer, year after year. You can't really call that a David vs Goliath.

A David and Goliath is Porto, with Mou, winning the CL or Greece winning the Euro. Not two of the top teams in the world winning the CL..

The only way that Chelsea's CL win will be remembered is that it will be considered one of the flukiest CL win ever. Not even they know how they won. Every game they were outplayed. Every game the opposite created more than a dozen chances to score and yet failed to capitalize. Every game Chelsea created 1 chance and score 2.

Inter's will be remember more, because unlike Chelsea, they actually defended well. But even then, thanks to how bad they have done after the treble, it feels like alot of people have already forgotten that they won the treble. Heck, they will almost be more remembered for their spectacular fall from the top.

--

And also, bro, if you are going to mention Inter going down to 10 men by a bad call, then maybe you should mention all of the bad calls? Like in the first leg Milito being called offside when he wasn't, later scoring a goal in a offside position and then Barca probably should have had a penalty and then in the 2nd leg, Barca should have had to penalties(one of them so clear that you only had to see Ibra's shirt to know that it was a penalty), Pique arguably scoring in an offside position and Bojan getting a goal wrongly disallowed.

Lord Spencer wrote:
What was special about Madrid winning it in 2002? Zidane's volley
What was special about United winning it in 2009? Terry slipping and Lampard ping pong esque goal
What was special about BVB winning in 1997?Beating that Juventus side
What was special about Barca winning it in 2006? Dinho in his majestic prime
What was special about Juve winning it in 1996? Really can't remember much about that but I'm sure a Juve fan would tell us

Doc wrote:

Lord Spencer wrote:
What was special about Madrid winning it in 2002? Zidane's volley
What was special about United winning it in 2009? Terry slipping and Lampard ping pong esque goal
What was special about BVB winning in 1997?Beating that Juventus side
What was special about Barca winning it in 2006? Dinho in his majestic prime
What was special about Juve winning it in 1996? Really can't remember much about that but I'm sure a Juve fan would tell us

All attempted humour aside, MT is confusing being fondly remembered with just being remembered with the former being a subjective feeling. Even by that standards, the Inter side would be very fondly remembered by more than just Inter fans.

BarrileteCosmico wrote:“Mourinho is a coach who only cares about the result and lives for that… He says that he is ‘the Special One’ because he has won this and that in so many countries. But I don’t like the way his teams play. Who remembers his Inter team that won the Champions League? For me he hasn’t left a legacy, unlike Cruyff’s Holland team. Di Matteo won the Champions League, but in my view his team offered nothing.”

I just wanted to highlight how he presents this as his own opinion rather than a moral one as some users are trying to paint him.

Lord Spencer wrote:

I remember those CL champions for the exact reason as you do Doc

With the exception of 1996, because, how can you remember BVB beating that Juve team when you don't remember that the same exact team won in 1996 and lost in both 1997 and 1998.

Abramovich wrote:I like mt I really do, but I wish that guy was normal.

p.s. RDM isn't a defensive coach.

Shed wrote:Saying he doesn't like a particular style or prefers a specific one over other/s is of little controversy. It's everything he else he adds to it that isn't. When you insinuate, as he more or less did, that the style a team plays is in some way determinant of that team's integrity, that a certain style of football is somehow morally superior to any, or even all, others, or that the legitimacy of the accomplishments of a team that played 'his' way is higher than or superior to that of a team playing any other way (ex. 'my team's CL win > Inter's CL win because we played preeetty and they didn't', etc.), that's when he comes off as a bitter and arrogant brat.

Arquitescu wrote:I love Xavi, but I am growing tired and weary of this crock of shit that he continues to bring up as his frequent jibes are not justified by any tangible inference.

Where I come from, a brimstone pot of footballing culture; we all remember the Champions League wins of Mourinho's Inter and even Roberto Di Matteo's Chelsea.

-We remember how poor Inter were in the group stages followed by the unconcealed chortles on the thought of them usurping Barca after narrowly scraping through Ancelotti's Chelsea.

David vs Goliath

-We remember the absolute tactical masterclass that was the 1st leg vs Barca in the San Siro, thoroughly and comprehensively outwitting a prime Guardiola team 3-1 and bringing them to their knees.

David vs Goliath

-We remember a 10 man Inter in Camp Nou (result of a poor call) surviving in one of the most disciplined and organized phalanx's ever conjured after an onslaught of possession tiki-taka to which proved a miracle in the end as Mourinho and the Interisti players could not fathom that they survived such an aggressive incursion. It was a miracle.

David vs Goliath

-We remember one of the finest tactical displays in Champions League Final history when Mourinho thoroughly and utterly dismantled an arrogant LvG's Bayern to which was quite literally the perfect match from Inter, Milito's brilliant brace a mere compliment to the tactical finesse on display.


Chelsea?

-Who does not remember this 7th place Chelsea going down 10 men in Camp Nou, raising further convictions that a victory would be merely impossible within that moment? We remember Messi's failed penalty, Chelsea surviving all odds and Torres' shocking round-up goal vs Valdes to seal Barca's fate. It was polarities on expectations to the finest degree. 11 men conquered a 100k+ Cules

David vs Goliath

-Who does not remember Bayern's advantage of their team, form and playing the Champions League Final in their own home? Followed by Didier Drogba's flash in the pan header to power through the Bavarian momentum in the final minutes of the clock?

David vs Goliath

Who remembers when the mental odds stacked against Chelsea when the English were known to falter in penalties while the Germans known to succeed in them, let alone the record of English teams vs Germans? Who remembers Chelsea outclassing the Bavarians right in front of their raucous fans?  

I certainly do.

Football is not only remembered on the basis of aesthetics and dimensions of subjective play, yet based on the moments achieved against the grain, the inertia of odds and expectations that weigh down David as the philistines laugh at his audacity.

Xavi will never realize that until he experiences what the Chelsea and Inter unison faced nor will he understand what has brought the Blue and Nerrazzuri fans together; through the mutual emotions experienced in such an unforeseeable victory over such improbability.

He does not know it.

They do.

Hence why this is effectively a redundant debate.

Lord Spencer wrote:

Yohan Modric wrote:

Lord Spencer wrote:

What people usually "remember" first are teams that defined decades of football. This is the case for this Barca team.

However, people still remember teams that won the CL 25 years ago if they are football fans. Certainly if they are fans of the team and/or the league.

Case in point MUnited vs. Bayern, which would be something someone cries about because of "anti-football" but will be remembered as one of the most dramatic victories in the CL.

Yeh that and Istanbul they'll remember due to the final being dramatic and entertaining. However I don't see what was special about Inter/Chelsea winning it.

What was special about Madrid winning it in 2002?
What was special about United winning it in 2009?
What was special about BVB winning in 1997?
What was special about Barca winning it in 2006?
What was special about Juve winning it in 1996?

Arquitescu wrote:Mourinho's Porto win was considerably overrated if you count the path they faced towards the Champions League final. It consisted of an easy group of a weak Real Madrid as the only notable team, then facing the decades weakest Manchester United in their form and squad, followed by Deportivo and then the already exhausted and out of their depth Monaco; who quite frankly faced higher odds.


Inter winning Serie A under Mancini then Mourinho never counted them as favourites given that Serie A was on its knee during that time, the weakest point in its calibre about Calciopoli.

Inter looked awful within the Champions League group stage, being outplayed 2-0 by Barca (for one) while scraping through all their victories; though also overcoming odds against Premier League winners, in Chelsea.

Greece? Good example.

I respect teams who take their chances under the onslaught of domination as 'flukes' and luck are merely callous to the teams who bank on being clinical when presented to the few but precious chances given to them. In the end, Barca had their chances and failed vs Chelsea; the latter capitalized perfectly.

I won't debate on the calls between Inter-Barca as some of them are subjective while the collective calls favoured both sides, thus Inter's win was justified in the end. Believe me, as a Milan fan I wasn't quite happy either.

Treble? That would be true if Mourinho continued with that side yet its decline came in the form of Benitez' attempts to change it to a possession side, the mass infliction of injuries and the decline due to the players who tumbled down their peak as we both know Mourinho mounts his CL challenges with players on their absolute peak.

sree999 wrote:chelsea under mouthrinho management has been one of the dullest teams to watch . how many of you remember the thuggery of his teams

2006 UCL QF



few minutes after that the prick del horno again went for messi and got  red .

mouthrinho opened his septic tank mouth and told messi was acting . hmm   

what is common to all morinho teams ? Dull defensive football and aggressiveness.

His teams are characterized by clogging , shirt pulling , aggressive challenges  ( sometimes mental esp pepe ramos terry )  , highly opportunistic  direct football  , a preference to athleticism over skill .

how many of his players won wpy ?

it was ronaldhino and arsenal that kept my passion for football alive those days .

only exception was real where he had to play good football (real dosent like bulldog mentality)  and didnt have the set of players who could play his brand of defensive football ( esp ronaldo)

what do neutral fans all over world want to see => joga bonito . that the reason why brazil is revered all round the world and unlike european "dull" teams .

fact of matter chelsea win is one flukiest win of all time . its as simple as that .

ya bayern was humilation . but they played stunning football and won . so no complaints .

i hope in future the south american economy gets stronger and their star players stay in there and develop .so that non of them have to come to  european teams coached by mourinhoesque managers .






l

izzy wrote:

harhar11 wrote:Why is he a bitch?

Was Klopp a bitch for saying that he doesnt like barcas style? Was Mou a bitch for criticizing spains style in the last euro? Or are the english bitches for criticizing the italians back in the days and now criticizing spain?

He's a bitch because he's complaining about another persons legacy.
He's a bitch because he's complaining about teams that BEAT him on route to winning trophies.
He's bitch because that's some elitist shit and no one wants to hear that shit.

Did Klopp question Barcas legacy?
Did Mou question Spains legacy?
Did the English question Italys legacy?

Xavi Hernandez is a bitch.

Lord Spencer wrote:

BarrileteCosmico wrote:“Mourinho is a coach who only cares about the result and lives for that… He says that he is ‘the Special One’ because he has won this and that in so many countries. But I don’t like the way his teams play. Who remembers his Inter team that won the Champions League? For me he hasn’t left a legacy, unlike Cruyff’s Holland team. Di Matteo won the Champions League, but in my view his team offered nothing.”

I just wanted to highlight how he presents this as his own opinion rather than a moral one as some users are trying to paint him.

I think what most people have problem with is the line in red.
Xavi is basically saying that Mou did not leave any legacy, which is bound to anger not only Chelsea fans, but also Porto, Inter, Serie A, and EPL fans as well.

I mean, no matter how you cut it in regards to Mou, he has left a legacy, and the fact that Xavi has his pants on a bunch because of him is legacy enough as it is.