Re: The Raheem Sterling Appreciation Thread

[Helmer]

So then he leaves next year for a not really crazy offer..

in whose dreams

your nighmare?

that should be OK if he goes to Madrid, he and Kroos playing together will be treat to the eyes imo

[Lex]

It's kinda cute that you think Sterling would ever get a game at Madrid

[RealGunner]

"There was no permission from the club, it was something that surprised us all to be honest," Rodgers on Sterling's interview.

Could be fined.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/brendan-rodgers-hints-raheem-sterling-5448229?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

[halamadrid2]

Damn Rodgers and Liverpool are too gullible. Players do what they like. There are too many to merely put it down to coincidence

Fine his sorry arse, and make him train with the B team. They are too nice to guys that do this

[RedOranje]

Acquiescing to Sterling's current contract demands would set a dangerously unsustainable precedent that could jeopardize Liverpool's long-term financial viability purely on the basis of "potential." Regardless of how you feel about the current state of football, its fans, its players, its finances, "loyalty," etc, Sterling's demands are extraordinary in several degrees. Even the most conservative estimates of his demands (£150k) would place him second or third in Liverpool's all time wage earners, with only Suarez definitely placing ahead of him. Suarez, let's not forget, was in quite serious contention for being one of the top 3 players in the world at that point and performing in a way that was well and truly extraordinary.

Looking purely at Sterling's performances for the club, he's done nothing to justify the wages being requested. He has absolutely been an important team member and significant contributor this season and last; that is without question. The wage bracket in question, however, is one reserved for absolute stars who not only contribute but do so consistently and do so beyond the rest of the squad inline with wage beyond the established wage structure. Sterling, for all his promise and development, falls short in both categories. He has proven inconsistent and in both full seasons faced notable lulls in form that have lasted that resulted in being removed from the first team (to bench or on break). Even when on form, he has not proven a reliable match winner or game-changer as would be expected of one on near-club record wages. Certainly, these could come in time, but it would be reasonable to expect that the contract follows the performances, rather than precedes them. Undoubtedly, some will suggest that these facets of Sterling's current game are due to his low age, and absolutely you'd have a point.

That point, however, only adds to the case for his current demands being so extraordinary in nature. This isn't his "prime" contract. This is not the deal that would run through his best years and therefore is unlikely to be the peak of his salary. For Liverpool then, there stands the very real possibility that even if they agree to his demands and he signs to a deal running through 2020, he will renew calls for an even more expansive deal magnitudes beyond anything the club has ever paid. Perhaps even worse, there stands the very real possibility that Sterling does NOT fulfill his full potential, and LFC could be stuck with a player on a massive, wage-structure shattering deal that is not worth anywhere near that and that cannot be effectively offloaded as no other club will be willing to meet his demands... another Johnson situation in the extreme.

The knock-on effects must also be considered. Coutinho only recently signed a new deal that established his base salary at £75-80k while Henderson, the heir-apparent to Gerrard as captain, is widely expected to agree a new deal worth between £100-120k in coming months. Both players have proved as crucial to LFC's intended development and style of play as Sterling has but would be looking at notably lower wages overall... Future signings as well will look to the hypothetical Sterling deal as a benchmark, making potential deals both more difficult to complete and more expensive.

Liverpool FC are financially sound and competitive, certainly. They are not, however, at the same level where they can pay the types of wages as ManCity, Real Madrid, Bayern Munich, et al. Lest we forget, Liverpool experienced a very real "near-death" experience less than half-a-decade ago. The club were a day or so from administration and the forced sale of assets like the training complex. It is only thanks to the FSG takeover and subsequent (underrated) work in restructuring the wage bill and rebuilding the commercial side that the club have regained stable footing and moved forward. Shattering that carefully constructed wage structure, setting a precedent for paying near-record-setting wages to players who's overall performances and role in the squad do not justify it, all on the basis of "potential" sets a precedent that could, as demonstrated, very well threaten the club itself.

Absolutely, a club must be ambitious and competitive in the market and wages to compete for major honors regularly. However, a club is still infinitely more likely to compete for and win something when its NOT in administration.

[Hapless_Hans]

What I really wonder though, is how Liverpool can have the 5th highest wage bill in the PL, 132m £ in 13/14, but allegedly their 'wage structure', which you keep referring to, is such that besides Gerrard noone is on more than 100k per week, average probably at 60-70k.
http://www.tsmplug.com/football/liverpool-players-salary-list-2014/

Maybe I'm stupid, but something doesn't add up there.

[RedOranje]

The thing that doesn't add up is the shite source you're using.

[Hapless_Hans]

Fair enough, but is there even a good source for player wages?

Because I don't think so, yet everyone talks like they know how their wage structure looks like, you included.

[RedOranje]

You can use direct numbers or approximations from trusted journalists, direct quotes from the club itself (for instance, Liverpool staff and players have repeatedly brought up the heavily performance-based-incentivized contract structure that relies on a lower base-salary), and general common-sense inference from financial figures and reports.

The page you linked, for instance, provides no actual source links or methodology (and no mention of how incentivized contracts are represented), leaves players out of the list entirely, and compares the 2014/15 wage bill with the 2013/14 financial information. The 2013/14 wage bill would include massive additional figures for Suarez, most notable, which is not found there.


Reports from Balotelli's signing indicate he is on somewhere between £90k and £110 base with incentives which is not included in that report. Sturridge and Coutinho have both signed new deals with marked increases in wages (though by all accounts Coutinho "doubled" his previous wage and is now on £80k, which further undermines that page's numbers).


Short answer: It's not possible to know exactly what the wages are until a time when/if European Leagues decide to follow MLS's example (which will never happen). But reasonable estimations can be made from surrounding information by those most familiar with the club. Total wage bills (especially those for previous seasons) can be misleading and intentionally difficult to analyze.

[RedOranje]

To be clear, I have no problem with Sterling demanding a massive raise.  It's his right in the sport as it is structured.  Liverpool, to the extent that they have offered him a frankly astonishing £100k deal (that was turned down) agree that he deserves a rather dramatic improvement in wages as well.  However, it is not reasonable for the club to meet his (apparent) current demands as it could cause very serious mid-to-long term issues.  Check the difference from the 2013/14 season between Liverpool's wage bill (with Suarez) and those of the top, top spending sides in the PL and abroad... it's a £50, 60, 70+ million difference.  That leaves a lot of room for offering players a bit extra.  Add to that that those clubs have either absurd amounts of cash, or historically have a precedent for paying big salaries compared to LFC's relative dearth and Sterling's demands are even more extraordinary in the club's eyes.


None of what I've said has anything to do with whether Sterling has a right to demand what he has... All I'm commenting on is the ability and potential rationality of Liverpool meeting said demands.  Either a compromise will be reached (if LFC get into the top 4 by season's end I suspect one will... though it may include a release clause) or one won't, in which case Sterling will be sold off for top dollar to a foreign club this summer or will leave in the summer of 2016 when he only has a year left to run.

If it happens, I'll absolutely be disappointed to see such a promising young star leave, and it will almost certainly hurt Liverpool's progress in the immediate future.  However, weighed against the potential long-term damage that could be suffered by bowing to his demands I can't say I'd really fault the club for its decision.

Ultimately, Liverpool is a club and a community and an institution, not a player.  The club has survived the loss of more integral, influential, "bigger" stars than Sterling before and, having nearly lost the club once already, I'd rather take the longer view.

[Nishankly]

The page you linked, for instance, provides no actual source links or methodology (and no mention of how incentivized contracts are represented), leaves players out of the list entirely, and compares the 2014/15 wage bill with the 2013/14 financial information. The 2013/14 wage bill would include massive additional figures for Suarez, most notable, which is not found there.

About the Author:

Formula one fan, blogger, designer and entrepreneur. Knows thing or two about a thing a two of sports, tweak codes, make cool infographs.

lol hans

[Donuts]

do you guys think he wont be able to get a 150k contract somewhere else?

[RedOranje]

On current performances? Its possible, there are clubs with the money and lack of sense... but it's not hugely likely. Entirely beside the point though, as previously explained.

[futbol]

Who is going to pay him that? If we're talking in pounds £ 150k = € 200k = € 10,000,000 p. a. Neymar who is on a different level in terms of both performances and marketability is on confirmed € 7M per year. lol Maybe City would be senseless enough.

[RealGunner]

City definitely. They need English players and they have no wage structure.

[Donuts]

well then if he knows someone else will pay him that much then is he really wrong for asking for it?
greedy? 90% of all footballers are greedy.

[RedOranje]

City, United both tend to throw whatever money is necessary at a player's wages to get the deal done. Madrid certainly have demonstrated the willingness to surprise as well.

The biggest question isn't whether these sides (or Chelsea, Munich, Barca) would be willing to pay such wages... but whether they'd be willing to pay such wages to a player who would NOT be a starter for them right away. Sterling isn't yet at a level where he could reasonably be expected to step right into the starting XI of any of those sides (bar maybe United if they end up selling Di Maria to PSG or something) and £150k for a squad player? Bit silly regardless of the club.

[Donuts]

sure they will..
english players are such huge investments and if they succeed with the hype, they'll easily be worth the price.

[LeBéninois]

They are going to find an agreement and Sterling will get more than 100k a week. No way he's leaving.

[Hapless_Hans]

Who is going to pay him that? If we're talking in pounds £ 150k = € 200k = € 10,000,000 p. a. Neymar who is on a different level in terms of both performances and marketability is on confirmed € 7M per year. lol Maybe City would be senseless enough.

confirmed 7m €? Really? Confirmed where?

I have the feeling those 7m are probably similar to the 57m transfer fee lol.

But on point, yes, even though I played devil's advocate, no way Sterling deserves, or will get, 150k pound a week at any reasonable club.

But why not take him at his word? He just wants to wait until the end of the season, and it's not about money?

[Red Alert]

But why not take him at his word? He just wants to wait until the end of the season, and it's not about money?

Reported.


You don't think this is Sterling's fault?!
You think Sterling has the right to evaluate his career / future goals of wanting to win trophies?
You don't think Liverpool's problems are all because of Raheem Sterling?
Because I can assure you it is, it's all Sterling's fault.
Sterling is ruining the club.
Sterling is good enough to be apart of Bayern Munich but Liverpool is wayyyyy too good for Sterling, so take him Hans. He's just another Owen. Money grabbing whore. Both the club and Sterling have said they'd wait, but I swear that's not the case at all. He wants to leave. And we'll be fine without him you see. We have Brendan Rodgers. He's a commander you see. He's probably bigger than the club right now. He'll replace him with good old Tom Ince, for 20m pounds. Replacement found. All is fine with Liverpool. Don't worry about us.

[Red Alert]

Just for comparison, PL goals this season for selected players:

Sterling 6
Chadli 8
Mane 7
Naismith 7
Ki 6
Agbonlahor 6
Berahino 12

1. He started the season at NINETEEN.
2. He's been played as a utility player this season. He spent a good 2 months trying to adapt to being the most advanced player, only to be used as a player to paper over the cracks after that. (And he was isolated on the wing at the start... only for us to ALWAYS go through the middle. Genius move, that.)
3. He's still OUR top goalscorer.
4. Tom Ince will be the next big thing in England after he moves to the red giants again.

[Art Morte]

^

I agree with what you say, especially the 4th point, but everything you say also backs the fact that he is not worth 100k+ in wages. And that's what I'm only pointing out.

I hope he either signs on the 100k per week that's been offered or leaves this summer.

[BarrileteCosmico]

Somehow I doubt that Fussball is taking into account the 40m signing bonus that Neymar's dad got...

[mr-r34]

Honestly Rodgers is a Fraud, why hasn't he caved into Sterlings demmands, FFS why is Rodgers not paying all our players what they are not worth, FFS why is Rodgers not giving Brad Jones 100k a week, FFs why isn't Rodgers giving Henderson 350k a week, FFs why isn't Rodgers paying Jay spearing 120k a week.

FML what's wrong with Management, don't they remember what shankly said, what he built the Club on.

"The players are bigger than the club, there is no LFC without the players, give them all the money they want"

Now that i think about it, it's all our fans fault, they want cheaper tickets, so *bleep* selfish, don't they know Liverpool was built for the players, by the players, LFC is nothing without teenagers demanding money they aren't *bleep* worth.

Again this goes  back ages ago when someone predicted it in the bible

"thy come a BR who will destroy the club, Change the name to BR FC.

[Hapless_Hans]

The page you linked, for instance, provides no actual source links or methodology (and no mention of how incentivized contracts are represented), leaves players out of the list entirely, and compares the 2014/15 wage bill with the 2013/14 financial information. The 2013/14 wage bill would include massive additional figures for Suarez, most notable, which is not found there.

About the Author:

Formula one fan, blogger, designer and entrepreneur. Knows thing or two about a thing a two of sports, tweak codes, make cool infographs.

lol hans

jesus I just googled liverpool wages and took the first link. It included the explicit disclaimer that while the wage bill is known the salary figures are not, and are therefore to be taken with a grain of salt - which is all I can ask for from a journo really and good enough for me.

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