Inter is now after Caceres

zarola wrote:

Luca wrote:Chiellini is the only world class defender that Juventus possesses and he is well worth the hype.

honestly I dont feel that way at all. I was a big fan of chiellini after euro and he was dominating a couple of years after that. Fact is though, in the world cup he was at fault for too many goals, last year he didnt do anything of significance and this year he is being outshined by barzagli (who i dont understand why he gets no praise), and he has been at fault for too many juve goals and hes missed header sitters . Not saying hes a bad defender (would want him over inter defenders atm). Even with italy imo most games he has been outperformed by ranocchia (not saying r>c , just his italia performances have been more convincing)

I hope he can recover his form from 3 years ago bur i honestly dont consider him world class nor do i consider him juve's best.

Barzagli gets plenty of praise, about as much as he should. Sometimes you guys (generally) make no sense. Chiellini has been playing at a high level for many seasons, Barzagli has ressurected his career but really this half a season has been notable. Just like you get upset when people rate Marchisio or Vidal based on half a season, how, by the same logic, can Barzagli possibly be rated on the same timeline?

I would also disagree about him being at fault for many of Juventus' goals, thats a pretty bold post. Off the top of my head I remember Bologna's goal.
Chiellini has been consistently the best defender for Juventus for a while now.

If were going off of world cup 2010 performances for Italy, my God, I don't even know who I would rate... Quagliarella and thats all I guess.

Luca wrote:

zarola wrote:

Luca wrote:Chiellini is the only world class defender that Juventus possesses and he is well worth the hype.

honestly I dont feel that way at all. I was a big fan of chiellini after euro and he was dominating a couple of years after that. Fact is though, in the world cup he was at fault for too many goals, last year he didnt do anything of significance and this year he is being outshined by barzagli (who i dont understand why he gets no praise), and he has been at fault for too many juve goals and hes missed header sitters . Not saying hes a bad defender (would want him over inter defenders atm). Even with italy imo most games he has been outperformed by ranocchia (not saying r>c , just his italia performances have been more convincing)

I hope he can recover his form from 3 years ago bur i honestly dont consider him world class nor do i consider him juve's best.

Barzagli gets plenty of praise, about as much as he should. Sometimes you guys (generally) make no sense. Chiellini has been playing at a high level for many seasons, Barzagli has ressurected his career but really this half a season has been notable. Just like you get upset when people rate Marchisio or Vidal based on half a season, how, by the same logic, can Barzagli possibly be rated on the same timeline?

I would also disagree about him being at fault for many of Juventus' goals, thats a pretty bold post. Off the top of my head I remember Bologna's goal.
Chiellini has been consistently the best defender for Juventus for a while now.

If were going off of world cup 2010 performances for Italy, my God, I don't even know who I would rate... Quagliarella and thats all I guess.

heres the difference between barzagli and marchisio. Barzagli is a world cup champion at around bonucci's age. Bonucci has a lot of promise, no? Imagine him now going off to germany, having success and 4 years later and returning to serie A. Wouldnt you expect him to be a much more mature player with less mistakes, and wouldnt you be anxious to see how he has matured? This is me with barzagli. He was a young italian defender and a bit clumsy but now hes at a prime age. Last year I saw him play the little amount he did and he was beasting it up and I was wondering why the hell he wasnt playing over bonucci. This year he was given the chance and hes consistently beasting.

Marchisio on the otherhand has been hyped over and over again and has failed to impress until this year. but even this season he has had games where he has gone quiet... this is why im unsure about him atm.

Criscito, De Rossi (for the most part), montolivo, quagliarella.. even zambrotta one could argue were good at the world cup. even if you disagree, surely u must agree quags was good, so if one person does good why cant another? thats no excuse for chiellini.

Fair enough but I would argue about Barzagli's success in Germany, especially his ending.
He may have shown promise last season but it was too little and too late for Juventus.
Giorgio has always been there, emerged as a focal point of the squad upon returning from serie b and never looked back.

Either way, you cannot possibly be rating Barzagli based on what he showed you last season- and you really cannot rate him when he was in Germany because he came in January for a mere 500k, for the simple reason that he was benched.

Which means you are rating Barzagli on the same timeline that we are rating Marchisio.
Zaccardo was also on that world cup squad, he disappeared just the same. Hell, even Iaquinta cannot get a minute at Juventus and he is a world champion as well. Rating people on being on the 2006 squad is equal to rating people based on the world cup 2010 performance in my opinion.

Not to mention there are plenty of examples of players who play completely different with club than country- not that Chiellini fits this build but I agree it wasn't a great world cup for him but it wasn't a great season for Juventus going into it and that surely matters.

In conclusion, since I've rambled on now.. you really cannot argue for Barzagli to be rated based on being a member of the 2006 world cup squad and having a great half season with Juventus. He resurrected his career with this move but don't forget he was a bench player 12 months ago.

you have made me question my thoughts on Barzagli now // really thought he would be a real leader for Italy and a solution to my cb worries...

I get your view on chiellini but it's biased. Hes loyal, had a tonne of promise, a hardworker, funny and smart. He destroyed top teams at a promising age.

fact is now though is hes stopped getting better, dipped in form as of lately and the whole positional change constantly isnt helping him improve. hes not getting any younger

zarola wrote:

Luca wrote:Chiellini is the only world class defender that Juventus possesses and he is well worth the hype.

honestly I dont feel that way at all. I was a big fan of chiellini after euro and he was dominating a couple of years after that. Fact is though, in the world cup he was at fault for too many goals, last year he didnt do anything of significance and this year he is being outshined by barzagli (who i dont understand why he gets no praise), and he has been at fault for too many juve goals and hes missed header sitters . Not saying hes a bad defender (would want him over inter defenders atm). Even with italy imo most games he has been outperformed by ranocchia (not saying r>c , just his italia performances have been more convincing)

I hope he can recover his form from 3 years ago bur i honestly dont consider him world class nor do i consider him juve's best.

I actually agree here! I don't understand why many label Chiellini as world class because I honestly do not think he is. I love him and he is a dedicated player to this team and our best defender but he is by no means world class. All his high points were in Serie A and he is yet to really shine in CL/International stage. Good player? Yes World Class? Still needs to prove himself. This again is because of how loosely players are labeled world class. The only world class players Juve possess imo are Buffon and Pirlo and they slowly getting past that part of there career. Marchisio and Chiellini have the potential to be world class but they by no means should be considered world class YET. They still have much to prove imo. And I feel as Marchiso has progressed Chiellini has in a way plateaued. This could be because of his constant use on the left but I still do not believe he has done enough to label himself World Class.

Chiellini is a good LB.

Chiellini is a class CB.

Dont Judge Chiellini on this season. Hes is sacrificing for the team.

zarola wrote:you have made me question my thoughts on Barzagli now // really thought he would be a real leader for Italy and a solution to my cb worries...

I get your view on chiellini but it's biased. Hes loyal, had a tonne of promise, a hardworker, funny and smart. He destroyed top teams at a promising age.

fact is now though is hes stopped getting better, dipped in form as of lately and the whole positional change constantly isnt helping him improve. hes not getting any younger

success
and I am definitely biased, Chiellini is one of my favourite defenders ever, behind Cannavaro (the real one, not the Napoli wanna be)