Italian Midfield in EURO 2012

He is right, the midfield appears to be the weakest area of Italian football right now.
The defense and attack is stronger (options like Balotelli, Rossi, Cassano, Giovinco going forward).
The defense, I don't even have to list you guys know them by now.

However, if Marchisio and De Rossi keep up their current form and Pirlo stays healthy I wouldn't go that far to say it is a weak area of play.

Sciacca dont get too overexcited, or you ll get banned again.

Take the criticism, as much as I like Prandelli and how he managed to make a decent team out of these (lets face it) untalented players.

Against Top 3 World: Germany, Holland and Spain:

1) Pirlo needs to keep stamina and keep playing like he does now
2) Marchisio to step
3) De Rossi to play as he does now
4) Montolivo to have a form of a lifetime
5) Aquilani to remember Roma days
6) Just to stay decent as he is

justdoit_ wrote:That's why I said competitive match. Jog on.

Who knew players were any diffrerent in any type of fixture. Funny though, you might say they don't play starters, well, let's look at the Germany game shall we? Played all their starters, played at their home, and played with all seriousness just like a typical Italy vs Germany derby. Why because Italy are still undefeated by Germany after 16 years. Oh wait, it looks like we still didn't lose did we? My oh my...

Luca wrote:He is right, the midfield appears to be the weakest area of Italian football right now.
The defense and attack is stronger (options like Balotelli, Rossi, Cassano, Giovinco going forward).
The defense, I don't even have to list you guys know them by now.

However, if Marchisio and De Rossi keep up their current form and Pirlo stays healthy I wouldn't go that far to say it is a weak area of play.

Attack is irrelavent, we have many options in attack and its strong.

Defense? Really is stronger than Midfield? Sure the stats speak for themselves as we only conceded one goal, however it's due to our system of play which is ball possesion in which we dominated in almost all matches in which didn't prevent many chances for the opposition to get. Then again let's compare...

You got fullbacks right now who are not at the top competivty compared to other squads. You got 2 CB's who have a lot of potential, but yet are not starters for their squad. Then you got only Chiellini who is the top defender.

While in midfield... you got Pirlo who is World Class. You got De Rossi who is one of the best CM's in the world. Then you got quality back ups like Montolivo and Aquilani and you got Marchisio and Motta who are great ball winning midfielders and of course better on paper as in their positions than any other play in defense except for Chiellini.

Grande_Milano wrote:Sciacca dont get too overexcited, or you ll get banned again.

Take the criticism, as much as I like Prandelli and how he managed to make a decent team out of these (lets face it) untalented players.

Against Top 3 World: Germany, Holland and Spain:

1) Pirlo needs to keep stamina and keep playing like he does now
2) Marchisio to step
3) De Rossi to play as he does now
4) Montolivo to have a form of a lifetime
5) Aquilani to remember Roma days
6) Just to stay decent as he is

First of all Grande, I was never banned, get your information straight before saying things about me. Second I'm not like your friend Giancarlo who got banned in a few weeks

1) Pirlo does not need stamina for his positions, HE IS A REGISTA! DO YOU KNOW WHAT REGISTA IS? REGISTA'S DON'T NEED TO MOVE AROUND A LOT

2) Marchisio is a step? What about Thiago Motta, both are good enough to handle any squad and break them down at the middle of the park

3) De Rossi is World Class, and is one of the best in the world. He should play like he is now, and I said before why he struggled in the past, it was family problems.

the rest is self explanatory.

1) Thats why Pirlo sucked since 2009. Stamina is vital for every player, he cant be static. In Milan, he worns out in 60 mins, and we quicly become uncreative. Thats why he was sold

2) Marchisio too inconsistent, ve been hailed since 2007, still didnt become great player. I am waiting...

Attack
Midfield
Defense

That is why attack and defense are relevant...
The midfield to me is the weakest link, that is how I am interpreting this topic.
The midfield compared to the attack and defense is currently the weakest part.

The midfield itself isn't weak just if I had to choose one of these three as the weakest area for Italy I would choose the midfield right now.

Camurrìa.Sto.Stronzo wrote:

justdoit_ wrote:That's why I said competitive match. Jog on.

Who knew players were any diffrerent in any type of fixture. Funny though, you might say they don't play starters, well, let's look at the Germany game shall we? Played all their starters, played at their home, and played with all seriousness just like a typical Italy vs Germany derby. Why because Italy are still undefeated by Germany after 16 years. Oh wait, it looks like we still didn't lose did we? My oh my...

Check out Germany's performance in friendlies, a draw against Poland a month ago, drawing against Sweden, a loss to Australia...then compare that to what they actually do in international competition, which needless to say, is miles better than what Italy has managed since '06. That midfield is better by a mile. Sorry to say, mediocrity like Montolivo and Thiago doesn't impress me. Jog on.

Grande_Milano wrote:1) Thats why Pirlo sucked since 2009. Stamina is vital for every player, he cant be static. In Milan, he worns out in 60 mins, and we quicly become uncreative. Thats why he was sold

2) Marchisio too inconsistent, ve been hailed since 2007, still didnt become great player. I am waiting...

Sorry I lol'd for a second.

My... oh my... Pirlo in a 4-2-4 is playing as a regista not using a lot of stamina and yet he seems to be struggling eh? With Italy he seems to be struggling? Sometimes I wonder the logic people come up with... A Deep lying playmaker, does not need stamina.

Well, for Marchisio being inconsistent, I would refer to the old forums as there was a poll and it asked who was the most consistent Midfielder, Marchisio won with a landslide of 87%. So I won't even go in detail with that.

You know what's ridicoulous about you Milanisti? You debate without logic... "Vidal would never go to Juventus, he's linked with Milan, why would he chose a club without Champions"... What happend? He came to Juve...

"Abate is the best RB in Italy" and yet facts show he isn't.

Luca wrote:Attack
Midfield
Defense

That is why attack and defense are relevant...
The midfield to me is the weakest link, that is how I am interpreting this topic.
The midfield compared to the attack and defense is currently the weakest part.

The midfield itself isn't weak just if I had to choose one of these three as the weakest area for Italy I would choose the midfield right now.

Understood.

justdoit_ wrote:

Camurrìa.Sto.Stronzo wrote:

justdoit_ wrote:That's why I said competitive match. Jog on.

Who knew players were any diffrerent in any type of fixture. Funny though, you might say they don't play starters, well, let's look at the Germany game shall we? Played all their starters, played at their home, and played with all seriousness just like a typical Italy vs Germany derby. Why because Italy are still undefeated by Germany after 16 years. Oh wait, it looks like we still didn't lose did we? My oh my...

Check out Germany's performance in friendlies, a draw against Poland a month ago, drawing against Sweden, a loss to Australia...then compare that to what they actually do in international competition, which needless to say, is miles better than what Italy has managed since '06. That midfield is better by a mile. Sorry to say, mediocrity like Montolivo and Thiago doesn't impress me. Jog on.

Actually no, you look at this,



and tell me how superior they are with thier starters. And if your actually denying that Germany didn't take the game seriously with Italy, then one. You are delusional, two, you have not seen the game, and three you basically have no idea what your saying.

Ummm, what's that supposed to demonstrate? That I hope I don't hear that music in a football video ever again? I think you just decided to ignore the damn-near opposite correlation from Germany's friendly results to what they actual accomplish in a competitive situation. Any Aussie on this site could pick out clips of players working their behinds off as well...Point being that I could care less what Italy does in friendlies when they've been spectacularly subpar in their last three competitve settings.

By all means answer this question as honestly as you can; does Italy's diamond have comparable effect compared to the five man setups deployed by Germany, Spain, the Dutch?

Sciacca and Wiggles are more biased than Cyber and Feverpitch

Man, a player that cant run after half a match, no matter which position he plays, is not helping his team. Period.

I stand by my case that Marchisio mixes great games with not so great ones

As crappy the English midfield is.....I think they would do well vs. Italy with this midfield......This game has been long overdue, and im sensing that they will face each other

Gerrard-Wilshere >>>> Pirlo-DeRossi-Marchisio

If Pirlo needs to play centerally then I dont think we can play both him and de rossi because de rossi is awesome when he plays centerally right in front of the two cbs.... and our two cbs arent exactly world class so id rather have him than de rossi.

Motta hasnt been garbage for inter, hes been injured.

@Sci, relax man, here is a saying you might like:

"When someone argues with an idiot, there are two idiots arguing"

justdoit_ wrote:Ummm, what's that supposed to demonstrate? That I hope I don't hear that music in a football video ever again? I think you just decided to ignore the damn-near opposite correlation from Germany's friendly results to what they actual accomplish in a competitive situation. Any Aussie on this site could pick out clips of players working their behinds off as well...Point being that I could care less what Italy does in friendlies when they've been spectacularly subpar in their last three competitve settings.

By all means answer this question as honestly as you can; does Italy's diamond have comparable effect compared to the five man setups deployed by Germany, Spain, the Dutch?

Oh well, I'm sorry... the taste of Music dosen't amuse you, of course it dosen't as you Americans have different tastes. That's the Seven Nation Army remix song, which is used as a chant and as a theme song for Italy.

No I think you're so deluded with the fact that you don't remain to see that Germany actually took that game vs Italy seriously. Once again, that was a serious game, they went out there, AND WANTED TO WIN. They set up all their starters. Obviously you being American, says to me that your knowledge of football is slim in which you don't also realize that Italy and Germany have one of the biggest rivalries in the world, both presently and historically on the international stage. And with Germany not beating Italy for 16 years, they went out all in full force to win the game, and guess what? Unsucessful. Now please, if your going to continue bieing biased, I suggest you go watch the game, before you come up with none sense assumptions.

Once again, Germany didn't suceed, Spain didn't suceed. Since when do we judge teams on paper? I already explained all the way on top of Page 2, how our midfielders are and compared to others, refer to that as your answer, Im not willing to re-explain everything.

Grande_Milano wrote:Sciacca and Wiggles are more biased than Cyber and Feverpitch

Man, a player that cant run after half a match, no matter which position he plays, is not helping his team. Period.

I stand by my case that Marchisio mixes great games with not so great ones

I'm more biased? Me and Wiggles backed up our points, all you do is bring up none sense and don't even know what you're saying.

Let me get this straight, Pirlo who played every pre-season game, friendlies and tournaments, Pirlo who played as a starter in every game for both Italy and Juventus every week, is not able to run after half a match? Grande? Do you even know what you're talking about? Pirlo is physically able to play 2-3 games per week, without any problems, without being tired and without having any stamina problems. He's a Regista for christ sake, put that through your head, Regista's are not required for the last time to run as much as other positions.

Messiakanino wrote:As crappy the English midfield is.....I think they would do well vs. Italy with this midfield......This game has been long overdue, and im sensing that they will face each other

Gerrard-Wilshere >>>> Pirlo-DeRossi-Marchisio

Yes, it is some what crappy, but it's good enough. But when looking at England midfield, I see overhyped and overrated. Gerrard, of course is one of the best in the world, but is fairly overhyped, and Wilshere... oh please. He's one of the most overrated players in this world and in this forum I'd like to add. You look at Italy's and most of is underrated. Pirlo is a World Class player, unlike Gerrard and Whishere, De Rossi is underrated, but is regarded one of the best CDM's in the world and Marchisio is getting there as his potential needs to grow. Anyways, speaking of England and Italy, Italy is miles better, since 2006 up until now.

zarola wrote:If Pirlo needs to play centerally then I dont think we can play both him and de rossi because de rossi is awesome when he plays centerally right in front of the two cbs.... and our two cbs arent exactly world class so id rather have him than de rossi.

Motta hasnt been garbage for inter, hes been injured.

False, why? Because since the Germany game, De Rossi has been used on the sides with Motta covering Pirlo, and De Rossi has been in top form in all those games. Refer to Slovenia's match, our last game ans De Rossi was in fact man of the match. Prandelli's system, requires a Regista, in which Pirlo has no choice to play there. De Rossi is not a regista, in which he can't play there.

A prime example of what I mean.

Italy are not "miles" better than England.

You really shouldn't sensationalize.

I don't think Rannochia right now deserves a spot in Italy's starting 11. Much better to have Barzagli to take his place, since he's been an absolute beast since the beginning of the season.

McLewis wrote:Italy are not "miles" better than England.

You really shouldn't sensationalize.

As I said, since 2006 speaking yes they are.

2006: Won the World Cup
2008: Qualified for the Euro's as England didn't
2010: Both failed
2012: Italy qualified, England not

Mp4krJuventino wrote:I don't think Rannochia right now deserves a spot in Italy's starting 11. Much better to have Barzagli to take his place, since he's been an absolute beast since the beginning of the season.

Ranocchia deserves a spot. Barzagli is old, we're building a new project within youth, not 30 year olds. Pirlo is an exception and so Is Buffon.

Camurrìa.Sto.Stronzo wrote:

Grande_Milano wrote:1) Thats why Pirlo sucked since 2009. Stamina is vital for every player, he cant be static. In Milan, he worns out in 60 mins, and we quicly become uncreative. Thats why he was sold

2) Marchisio too inconsistent, ve been hailed since 2007, still didnt become great player. I am waiting...

Sorry I lol'd for a second.

My... oh my... Pirlo in a 4-2-4 is playing as a regista not using a lot of stamina and yet he seems to be struggling eh? With Italy he seems to be struggling? Sometimes I wonder the logic people come up with... A Deep lying playmaker, does not need stamina.

Well, for Marchisio being inconsistent, I would refer to the old forums as there was a poll and it asked who was the most consistent Midfielder, Marchisio won with a landslide of 87%. So I won't even go in detail with that.

You know what's ridicoulous about you Milanisti? You debate without logic... "Vidal would never go to Juventus, he's linked with Milan, why would he chose a club without Champions"... What happend? He came to Juve...

"Abate is the best RB in Italy" and yet facts show he isn't.

Luca wrote:Attack
Midfield
Defense

That is why attack and defense are relevant...
The midfield to me is the weakest link, that is how I am interpreting this topic.
The midfield compared to the attack and defense is currently the weakest part.

The midfield itself isn't weak just if I had to choose one of these three as the weakest area for Italy I would choose the midfield right now.

Understood.

Are you disputing God?

Potential wrote:Are you disputing God?

In fact I'am, if we proceed to this summer, when RAI came up with the rankings of players. Abate was nominated in the top 5, but not the Best Italian RB. Maggio was, Abate came in third behind Cassani.

But this is not about Abate.

michael1 wrote:

Surag.Blueguy wrote:

michael1 wrote:

Surag.Blueguy wrote:Cassano isnt being deployed as a playmaker for Italy..Thats a bit of a false information..He is recently being played as more of a false 9 alongside Rossi with Montolivo as the trequartista..And i have to say he has fared well..

And i dont see Cassano playing in the hole as he is simply not accustomed for it..Also Pirlo is a must in the lineup..Montolivo is not good enough for the DLP role..

In my opinion a 4-3-2-1 formation with Cassano and Rossi behind Pazzini would be the more viable option to consider..

Fair enough although i never said he was being played there now. I meant i would like to see him there.
Although i do like ur idea only thing i would chane is balotelli leadin the line rather than paz.

Yes i know he is a bit of a risk but if he keeps up his good form and attitude then he has to play in my eyes, balotelli is the kind of player that with his talent can lead us straight to a trophy. The kid has it all just hope he can keep behavin himself as thats his only downfall.

I would love to see pirlo play in all game but at his age i think he is better used as a sub as per my previous comments.

Believe me..Thats what i like to see..Balotelli as a centre forward as i believe he has the ability as evidenced in a few manchester city games i witnessed last season..Cassano-Rossi behind Balotelli is a mouth-watering prospect on paper as Balo is technically very gifted but we have to also understand that the aerial prowess that Pazzini brings to the table is very important as we have quality wingbacks marauding down the flanks..Also he's a lethal finisher and holds up the ball well so we have to take that into consideration as well..

Not saying Balo cant but Balo likes to work with ball often ,he is more of an SS and has the ability to play on the wings as well..There could be a possibility that he could get frustrated knowing his attitude if he is being deployed as a lone striker upfront as he wont be seeing too much the ball..And having Pazzini is better-off in that respect..

But as i said i hope we can see all three together..

As for Pirlo?There is the age factor but i think he is still the best Italian Midfielder at the moment..Monty is good but having watched him at Viola ,i dont think he can do as good as a job as a Pirlo can do imo..Provided he keeps his fitness ,i think he is an undisputed first choice for me..there's no question..there is enough defensive cover with De Rossi and Marchisio..

Hmm good points will have to see how balotellis season turns out i guess before we can really know whether he can be the leader we want him to be signs are encouragin espc on te frustratin front dont know if u watched him this weekend but he had some very close shot that just missed and compared to usual there was no frustration in his face.

I dnt know but he is fav italian right now i thinks it all the talent he has, i just know he can do a ronaldo of 2002 if he puts his mind to it.

Pirlo is def our best midfielder no doubt but the main reason i want to see monti there and pirlo as back up is against quick teams pirlo might get overun but more importantly the 2014 world cup as pirlo will more than likely to retired by then and i see the euros as montis comin of age for italy which will be absolutely invaluable experience for him to brign to the world cup.

Hope u get what im tryin to say there regardin pirlo.

Ps. Thank for a nice civilised and detailed chat doesnt happen a lot on here

Well i get what you're saying but i wasnt talking about his attitude in general..I mean for example i have seen Rooney getting frustrated many times when he does not see the ball often..He clearly likes to work with the ball and take on opposition defenders and Balotelli imo falls in the same category and his attitude just makes it worse although in time he will eventually learn to calm himself down i hope..

Whereas Pazzini is well acquainted with his role as a CF as i have already explained above as he provides the much needed box presence and this right place in the right time mentality something which Balotelli could eventually develop as for me he is a very complete forward..He has all the talent in this world but he just needs to harness it..

And i really hope he sees more game action with Tevez frozen out of the squad also to add dzeko's recent problems with Mancini ,who knows he could become a central figure in Mancio's plans along with Aguero..But its just all speculation i suppose..

Well ,regarding Pirlo ?Definitely can understand where you're coming from..But remember that Azzurri always play a three-man midfield and with the likes of De Rossi and Marchisio i guess there is enough defensive cover..It is similar to the system which was employed under Milan under Ancelotti and also to consider both De Rossi and Marchisio are relatively young and are absolute workhorses..

Also for me Pirlo's sleek passing and vision is ever so important to the team as for me he is the only one player capable of doing in the squad so efficiently..Currently he's hardly showing any signs of age having an effect of his form but hopefully he keeps his fitness in time for the euros..

But like you said Monty could also be tried out in that position for certain games but as of now he is reveling in the TQ role in the qualifiers as well as friendlies i must add..

I'm sure we'll eventually find a replacement for Pirlo but "currently" there is no one who has the ability to perform in the regista role as Pirlo is able to do..I hope you get what i'm saying..

Camurrìa.Sto.Stronzo wrote:

Potential wrote:Are you disputing God?

In fact I'am, if we proceed to this summer, when RAI came up with the rankings of players. Abate was nominated in the top 5, but not the Best Italian RB. Maggio was, Abate came in third behind Cassani.

But this is not about Abate.

Abate is the best 'defensive' RB of the three, Italy plays defensive football, therefore he is the perfect fit for Italy. however for the euros, if Abate didn't improve on his attacking attributes, I believe he will not be called, however his current form makes him the best out of the three, with probably Maggio just a little behind him.

Camurrìa.Sto.Stronzo wrote:

McLewis wrote:Italy are not "miles" better than England.

You really shouldn't sensationalize.

As I said, since 2006 speaking yes they are.

2006: Won the World Cup
2008: Qualified for the Euro's as England didn't
2010: Both failed
2012: Italy qualified, England not

- I will give you Italy 2006 as they were absolute quality. England were just limited.
- 2008 Italy were average at best, but did well against Spain. England were simply shambolic.
- 2010 Italy was ridiculously poor, but at least England made it out of their group, if only to get destroyed by ze Germans.
- 2012 is inconclusive as it hasn't even happened yet.

So you're 2 out of 4.

As I said, Italy are NOT miles better than England.

Stop sensationalizing.

Potential wrote:Abate is the best 'defensive' RB of the three, Italy plays defensive football, therefore he is the perfect fit for Italy. however for the euros, if Abate didn't improve on his attacking attributes, I believe he will not be called, however his current form makes him the best out of the three, with probably Maggio just a little behind him.

False. First of all you are correct on one thing, and Abate is better defensively, but Maggio is up to par and Cassani is some what behind. However a fullback, in Prandelli's system is requried at the out most to push forward and guess what? Abate sucks at it. 1 assist in a season for two years says it all. Now, I can go on and on, but you are false about Italy playing defensive football now because we are not. We are playing a 4-3-1-2, a system in which we use to dominate possesion, most games we average out 65% of possesion in which means we don't use concern our sevles defensively anymore. Now for Abate, who needs him? We conceded only 1 goal this year and have the best defensive record out of all of Europe in the qualfiers. So please, Abate can stay where he belongs, he's not needed. We need fullbacks who can push forward, not only capable of defendinging.

McLewis wrote:

- I will give you Italy 2006 as they were absolute quality. England were just limited.
- 2008 Italy were average at best, but did well against Spain. England were simply shambolic.
- 2010 Italy was ridiculously poor, but at least England made it out of their group, if only to get destroyed by ze Germans.
- 2012 is inconclusive as it hasn't even happened yet.

So you're 2 out of 4.

As I said, Italy are NOT miles better than England.

Stop sensationalizing.

Makes no difference if you ask me, Italy qualfied at the end, while England failed to do so. Which was an embarresement for them. In 2010, fine, we got elminated first, but then again, England were just as poor as Italy per say as they were eliminated early too.

Our squad now speaks for itsself, I'm not claiming we're winning the Euro's which is completely ridiculous, but what I'm saying is, we already qualified as England hasn't. Our defensive and offensive record is better than England.

Miles or not, Italy are currently better.

Camurrìa.Sto.Stronzo wrote:

McLewis wrote:

- I will give you Italy 2006 as they were absolute quality. England were just limited.
- 2008 Italy were average at best, but did well against Spain. England were simply shambolic.
- 2010 Italy was ridiculously poor, but at least England made it out of their group, if only to get destroyed by ze Germans.
- 2012 is inconclusive as it hasn't even happened yet.

So you're 2 out of 4.

As I said, Italy are NOT miles better than England.

Stop sensationalizing.

Makes no difference if you ask me, Italy qualfied at the end, while England failed to do so. Which was an embarresement for them. In 2010, fine, we got elminated first, but then again, England were just as poor as Italy per say as they were eliminated early too.

Our squad now speaks for itsself, I'm not claiming we're winning the Euro's which is completely ridiculous, but what I'm saying is, we already qualified as England hasn't. Our defensive and offensive record is better than England.

Miles or not, Italy are currently better.

So you admit that Italy are not "miles" better. Good.

That's what I was looking for.

Carry on.

Surag.Blueguy wrote:
Well i get what you're saying but i wasnt talking about his attitude in general..I mean for example i have seen Rooney getting frustrated many times when he does not see the ball often..He clearly likes to work with the ball and take on opposition defenders and Balotelli imo falls in the same category and his attitude just makes it worse although in time he will eventually learn to calm himself down i hope..

Whereas Pazzini is well acquainted with his role as a CF as i have already explained above as he provides the much needed box presence and this right place in the right time mentality something which Balotelli could eventually develop as for me he is a very complete forward..He has all the talent in this world but he just needs to harness it..

And i really hope he sees more game action with Tevez frozen out of the squad also to add dzeko's recent problems with Mancini ,who knows he could become a central figure in Mancio's plans along with Aguero..But its just all speculation i suppose..

Well ,regarding Pirlo ?Definitely can understand where you're coming from..But remember that Azzurri always play a three-man midfield and with the likes of De Rossi and Marchisio i guess there is enough defensive cover..It is similar to the system which was employed under Milan under Ancelotti and also to consider both De Rossi and Marchisio are relatively young and are absolute workhorses..

Also for me Pirlo's sleek passing and vision is ever so important to the team as for me he is the only one player capable of doing in the squad so efficiently..Currently he's hardly showing any signs of age having an effect of his form but hopefully he keeps his fitness in time for the euros..

But like you said Monty could also be tried out in that position for certain games but as of now he is reveling in the TQ role in the qualifiers as well as friendlies i must add..

I'm sure we'll eventually find a replacement for Pirlo but "currently" there is no one who has the ability to perform in the regista role as Pirlo is able to do..I hope you get what i'm saying..

Surag you fail to realize that in Prandelli's tactics, our midfield is used in a rotation. So at one point, you will get Montolivo as your regista and Pirlo as your trequartista. Why I'm saying this, because after reading this, I seems to me that you have no idea how our midfield works.