OFFTOPIC: Spanish National Team

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Post by Le Samourai Sat Nov 12, 2011 8:44 pm

Look no Kneejerk here..........This loss couldn't really mean less to me but some things need to change.

>Del Bosque needs to man up and pick Enrique. He is one of the best left-backs in the world defensively and I would enjoy at least having him in the squad should we have to face a team with a great winger.

>Del Bosque needs to figure his stuff out tactically.If Fabregas is going to play it needs to be central , wether CM, CAM or CF. Pedro/Navas/Mata should be the only ones occupying that space on the right.

>He needs to experiment with the Busquets- Alonso issue. He did some of that today and Alonso looked very good on his own playing deep, but he should do it more.

>Torres - make him earn it. I think that he will be in the Euro squad but you have to at least make him work for it.

Positives-

>I like Ramos-Pique CB partnership.If Puyol isn't able to play at the highest level anymore I'm very comfortable that this partnership should see us through. Puyol looked a tad slow today but that's minor.

>Silva-Iniesta link up play once they get accustomed to each other is going to be sensational.

>Villa looked a bit short on confidence but reminded me exactly why he is there.Moments of magic are what he produces.


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Post by Khaled Sun Nov 13, 2011 12:09 am

ragbirjosh wrote:Look no Kneejerk here..........This loss couldn't really mean less to me but some things need to change.

>Del Bosque needs to man up and pick Enrique. He is one of the best left-backs in the world defensively and I would enjoy at least having him in the squad should we have to face a team with a great winger.

I think Alba is doing well.. he is solid defensively & great going forward.. (some gd plays between him & Villa)

>Del Bosque needs to figure his stuff out tactically.If Fabregas is going to play it needs to be central , wether CM, CAM or CF. Pedro/Navas/Mata should be the only
ones occupying that space on the right.

Agree.

>He needs to experiment with the Busquets- Alonso issue. He did some of that today and Alonso looked very good on his own playing deep, but he should do it more.

Agree. He should play either Alonso or Busquets ( especially against teams parking the bus), i prefer Busquets cuz he's used to this role!

>Torres - make him earn it. I think that he will be in the Euro squad but you have to at least make him work for it.

Agree.

Positives-

>I like Ramos-Pique CB partnership.If Puyol isn't able to play at the highest level anymore I'm very comfortable that this partnership should see us through. Puyol looked a tad slow today but that's minor.

Puyol was fine.. one of the problems that Spain faced today, Arbeloa provided nothing offensively.. Whenebver Puyol is fit, Del Bosque needs to play with Ramos in the Euro as a RightBack, he is way better than Arbeloa.. Ramos was always a key on the right, especially against teams parking the bus, he gives more solutions, when he goes forward ( played a great World Cup as a RB), so no need to change this now!

Ramos - Pique - Puyol - Alba


>Silva-Iniesta link up play once they get accustomed to each other is going to be sensational.

100%, i liked the way they linked-up, we need to see more of it!

>Villa looked a bit short on confidence but reminded me exactly why he is there.Moments of magic are what he produces.

not his best match, but not bas either!

Conclusion


hope he starts with this line-up on Tuesday!
Casillas
Ramos Pique Puyol Alba
Xavi - Busquets/Alonso - Iniesta
Mata Silva Villa

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Post by futbol_bill Sun Nov 13, 2011 8:23 pm

Khaledbarca wrote:
ragbirjosh wrote:Look no Kneejerk here..........This loss couldn't really mean less to me but some things need to change.

>Del Bosque needs to man up and pick Enrique. He is one of the best left-backs in the world defensively and I would enjoy at least having him in the squad should we have to face a team with a great winger.

I think Alba is doing well.. he is solid defensively & great going forward.. (some gd plays between him & Villa)

>Del Bosque needs to figure his stuff out tactically.If Fabregas is going to play it needs to be central , wether CM, CAM or CF. Pedro/Navas/Mata should be the only
ones occupying that space on the right.

Agree.

>He needs to experiment with the Busquets- Alonso issue. He did some of that today and Alonso looked very good on his own playing deep, but he should do it more.

Agree. He should play either Alonso or Busquets ( especially against teams parking the bus), i prefer Busquets cuz he's used to this role!

>Torres - make him earn it. I think that he will be in the Euro squad but you have to at least make him work for it.

Agree.

Positives-

>I like Ramos-Pique CB partnership.If Puyol isn't able to play at the highest level anymore I'm very comfortable that this partnership should see us through. Puyol looked a tad slow today but that's minor.

Puyol was fine.. one of the problems that Spain faced today, Arbeloa provided nothing offensively.. Whenebver Puyol is fit, Del Bosque needs to play with Ramos in the Euro as a RightBack, he is way better than Arbeloa.. Ramos was always a key on the right, especially against teams parking the bus, he gives more solutions, when he goes forward ( played a great World Cup as a RB), so no need to change this now!

Ramos - Pique - Puyol - Alba


>Silva-Iniesta link up play once they get accustomed to each other is going to be sensational.

100%, i liked the way they linked-up, we need to see more of it!

>Villa looked a bit short on confidence but reminded me exactly why he is there.Moments of magic are what he produces.

not his best match, but not bas either!

Conclusion


hope he starts with this line-up on Tuesday!
Casillas
Ramos Pique Puyol Alba
Xavi - Busquets/Alonso - Iniesta
Mata Silva Villa


We need to play only one deep MF and replace him with true #9, preferably Llorente.

VDB probably use the 6who didn't play yesterday. That means

Valdes in goal (likely 2nd half)
Monreal in at LB
J. Martinez as deep MF (likely for half of game)
Navas as RW (likely for half of game)
Llorente as #9
Albiol in with Puyol (likely for half of game)

Keys are Monreal, Navas and Javi since they need to impress to have chance for Euro.

Interesting twist is if they go to just one deep MF, they don't need Javi on team so he can be ready for Olympic team. That would leave only Mata to serve double duty.
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Post by harhar11 Mon Nov 14, 2011 5:59 pm

alexjanosik wrote:
dostoevsky wrote:I agree with Kizz, I mean how are you meant to justify the comment that Xavi "doesnt give a rats damn about Spain"?

If he's continuing he obviously does and I believe that as such he'd also disapprove of the thought that Spain are "mooching" off of Barcelona's success, as if they both aren't Xavi's team.

I would urge to go review the scenes after Spain won the WC.
The one where Puyol and Xavi were walking around with the Catalan flag and the WC trophy.That tells you all you need to know.That he doesnt give a rats damn about Spain.


The second statement,I cant help but laugh.
'as if they both aren't Xavi's team'
He has just one team and that is Barca.

If that is the only proof you have, then im sorry but you have no case.

Everyone uses the flag of their autonomous community when they are celebrating a trophy.
Sergio ramos celebrated with the flag of andalusia
OFFTOPIC: Spanish National Team - Page 7 Ramos_al
David villa with the flag of Asturias
OFFTOPIC: Spanish National Team - Page 7 17997556834868837b415e76_38364286-6

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Post by futbol_bill Tue Nov 15, 2011 11:17 pm

I'm pissed.

2-2 was the final.

For once we played with only 1 deep MF, but since Llorente was injured and no confidence in Torres, we went with Cesc as a false 9. Although he had chances I don't like him in this position.

They got 2 goals due to defensive errors.

We didn't have our normal possession control, but I don't think it was because of only deep MF.

We didn't look dangerous until end of game when we went with 3 defense.

Navas and Monreal looked OK and will be in running for last 2 or 3 spots on team. I think Enrique is the only one left who needs an audition. Interesting J.martinez didn't get into game. I think maybe they are planning on playing one deep MF and therefore may save Javi for Olympic team and thus creating another spot on team either for a second LB, but more likely for an extra forward (i.e. Navas)
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Post by The Sanchez Wed Nov 16, 2011 6:00 am

Cesc is still adapting to the position. This is his third time playing in that positon. It was worth the risk though I would have had a Silva-Villa-Mata trio.
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Post by Superstone Mariomintsch Wed Nov 16, 2011 6:07 am

Perfectly summed up by ZM http://www.zonalmarking.net/2011/11/14/del-bosque-spain-tactics-false-nine-euro-2012/. Silva-Villa-Mata is a good free-flowing connecting tridente, but it still lack cutting edge, width and run-from-behind which could be key for Spain to win against strong team who knows how to park the bus. They have the best players, they would still be great in 2012 I assume, but if they don't tweak a bit with their losses of the key members, they would not get it easy in 2014.
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Post by BarcaKizz Wed Nov 16, 2011 8:45 am

Futbol_bill, I don't understand why you keep using the phrase "save him for the Olympics". The Euros are 10 times bigger than the Olympics, surely Spain will pick the very best team possible, regardless of the Olympics.

Didn't watch the games but just from looking at the lineup you can tell it wouldn't have worked fantastically. Monreal isn't even top 4 LB my opinion, he's not in form at all. They should either test Enrique or just continue to give Alba experience from now on.

Ramos and Puyol should pretty much never play together. A horrible combination.

Busquets should be the holding midfielder, not Alonso, he's not the same type of player.

Finally, Spain miss Pedro, no need for Mata in my opinion... there's enough finesse in that team if you play 4-3-3 with Villa and Silva, Pedro stretching the field and going in behind is vital.
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Post by Arquitecto Wed Nov 16, 2011 3:02 pm

futbol_bill wrote:I'm pissed.

2-2 was the final.

For once we played with only 1 deep MF, but since Llorente was injured and no confidence in Torres, we went with Cesc as a false 9. Although he had chances I don't like him in this position.

They got 2 goals due to defensive errors.

We didn't have our normal possession control, but I don't think it was because of only deep MF.

We didn't look dangerous until end of game when we went with 3 defense.

Navas and Monreal looked OK and will be in running for last 2 or 3 spots on team. I think Enrique is the only one left who needs an audition. Interesting J.martinez didn't get into game. I think maybe they are planning on playing one deep MF and therefore may save Javi for Olympic team and thus creating another spot on team either for a second LB, but more likely for an extra forward (i.e. Navas)

Real pain watching this yesterday as the atrocious pitch even further infuriated me.

VDB doesn't realize that Xabi isn't a DM and despite the dual pivot being rigid, from a defensive standpoint it works.

Fact is Villa must gain his form back as he is low in confidence while Ramos and Puyi have to find their chemistry.

The Pique Puyol partnership must be restored as the rule is to never break a partnership up while Ramos and Iraola can fight it out for the position in the right. Enrique and Vila must be called up for LB while Arbeloa is just average and doesn't have what we need.

Javi doesn't seemed to be getting a call and nor does Ander but its understandable considering the uphill battle competing with the rest. Arteta should get a look in as well as he defends better then Xabi but I would be fine either way.

Torres once again failed to do anything whatsoever and you know my alternative for him.

I feel Navas who is imo the best natural winger currently must be utilized more and more effectively to provide that width as Mata and Silva don't do that effectively and should be tried more central.

In the end it was the pitch that made us look bad as FIFA really must evaluate the standards.

We showed great character in the end to take it back as Villa proved why is twice the player Raul was for Espana.

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Post by free_cat Wed Nov 16, 2011 4:23 pm

BarcaKizz wrote:I think he does care about playing for Spain... He's said it before, he's not into politics, he's into football. He plays for Spain and its an honour. If he could play for Catalunya instead, he would, but that doesn't mean he won't fight for the Spanish jersey as well.

In terms of from a Barca perspective... yes, protecting our players would be great Very Happy but I like to see them succeed with Spain as well to be honest, and at the end of the day if it makes them happy to keep playing I won't complain.

I agree with Alex and with Kizz. I don't think you are saying anything different. Xavi feels catalan and doesn't care much about spain but as you say he is into football and he likes it a lot. He wants to be at the top level, play the exciting major tournaments and win it all. And he can do that only with Spain, so in this sense he cares for that team, because it is his. It's like when you play amateur football: you mifght go to a Club that you don't have any feelings, but you want it to win because it's your team and you are in it.

However, I would like Xavi and Puyol to retire and would like to see Spain stop winning, but they want to continue and Spain has many upcoming stars, thanks to La Masia.... so about time we become indepedent and can stop nourishing Spain. It's tiring to see them win thanks to catalans in football, basket, Hockey, etc, etc. and spit on us in return.


Last edited by free_cat on Wed Nov 16, 2011 4:59 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post by free_cat Wed Nov 16, 2011 4:26 pm

Arquitecto, I read you say that Busi - Alonso partnership was key to Spain's WC.

Then, how you explain that Spain looked much better and scored most of the knockout goals when Alonso was subbed off and Busi was playing as lone DM?
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Post by futbol_bill Wed Nov 16, 2011 5:01 pm

BarcaKizz wrote:Futbol_bill, I don't understand why you keep using the phrase "save him for the Olympics". The Euros are 10 times bigger than the Olympics, surely Spain will pick the very best team possible, regardless of the Olympics.

Didn't watch the games but just from looking at the lineup you can tell it wouldn't have worked fantastically. Monreal isn't even top 4 LB my opinion, he's not in form at all. They should either test Enrique or just continue to give Alba experience from now on.

Ramos and Puyol should pretty much never play together. A horrible combination.

Busquets should be the holding midfielder, not Alonso, he's not the same type of player.

Finally, Spain miss Pedro, no need for Mata in my opinion... there's enough finesse in that team if you play 4-3-3 with Villa and Silva, Pedro stretching the field and going in behind is vital.


Sure the Euros are more important, but we want both. If a player clearly makes this team, I.e.. Mata, then he will be on Euro team and asked to play double duty if possible. For Javi, he is the third deep back and if they go with a 3 man MF, then they don't need him on Euro team and as a result they can add another forward. Similarly with Thiago. He's on Euro team if Xavi can't go, but other wise he's on Olympic team. These 3 are leaders on the Olympic team.

Re line-up yesterday, it was auditions for Monreal and Navas. Monreal looked OK, but I think Alba is leading for this position. Enrique will likely get his audition for next friendly. There is one spot open (Arbeloa has a lb role as well) and it won't be determined until June. It likely will be between Alba, Monreal and Enrique. Navas is battling with Negredo for last position unless Javi is excluded in which case both will Likely make it. Navas was ok yesterday, but it wasn't good enough to say he is definitely on team.

Re Ramos & Puyol, Puyol needed the playing time (he is still off form a bit) and with Ramos they were seeing how he plays with both Piqué and Puyol. When euro begins, it will be Puyol & Piqué with Ramos at RB and either Arbeloa, Alba or Enrique at LB. Ramos is cover for Cb, Arbeloa for RB.

Yesterday's game was also about VDB listening to critics saying you only need one deep MF. I.e. either Busquets or Alonso. For those of you saying put Busquets in, then VDB has the problem were he wants Alonso as well as Xavi and Iniesta in line-up, so it's either bench Alonso, 4 man MF, or push Iniesta into forward spot.

Plan yesterday was for Llorente to play as #9, but he was injured, Negredo was not on squad due to injury and Torres is still not in form. That's why I think that maybe Euro squad likely will have Negredo (as well as Llorente & Torres) and Navas on squad and not Javi.

And finally re Mata, he has looked very good up to yesterday, both with Chelsea and Seleccion, but I agree, Navas should have started. And yes, Pedro will be on team, but there is room for Mata as well. Leaving him off will help Olympic team, but so far Mata has earned a spot on this team.
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Post by Khaled Wed Nov 16, 2011 9:38 pm

Couldn't watch the whole match, just some minutes especially (last 15 min)..

anyway, like i said before Spain should play with this line-up in the Euro.

Casillas
Ramos Pique Puyol Enrique ( or Alba if Enrique wasn't called)
---------- Busquets------------
Xavi--------------------Iniesta


Upfront?

i would go with:
- Silva Villa Mata/Pedro

& i would like to see this in the next friendlies (see if it works)..
Silva Llorente Villa

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Post by futbol_bill Fri Nov 18, 2011 6:08 pm

I read the article above and agree with it.

I think we should start with
Llorente as #9 (He adds much more than Negredo or Torres) and being strong and tall adds much more to centre Forward than a false 9 such as Cesc can do.
Pedro or Navas on right to give us width.
Keep Villa on left again to give us width.
Although I like the form of Silva, Iniesta, Cesc, Mata when playing forward they all tend to go to centre and thus too many in the middle.
For midfield, I would play just one deep back and I would take Alonso over Busquets. I don't agree with prior statement that Alonso can't be as good defensively as Busquets. Alonso is a better passer, has great vision and matches up with Xavi just as as well as Busquets does. Also he doesn't dive as Busquets is prone to do.
Then I would play Xavi and partner him with either Iniesta or Silva or Cesc. Iniesta gets the nod, but the other two are in very good form. I would be happy with any of them.
On defense I'm hoping Puyol and Pique are healthy and in form. They are our best and also we need Ramos at RB.
Ramos at RB. We need his experience plus his runs, which also helps us with width.
At LB, at this point I prefer Alba over Arbeloa and Monreal. I would like to see an audition of Enrique before this position is settled. Alba like Ramos has better runs than the others, although I feel Arbeloa offers better defense.
Goal still belongs to Casillas.
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Post by harhar11 Fri Nov 18, 2011 9:06 pm

^ I think that Iniestas place on the team is a certainty, because for me he has been the best player on the spanish team since the WC. Against costa rica, when spain were losing, he carried spain on his shoulder and he was the reason why you drew in the end. Same thing against us(chile Sad ), he came on and he won the game for you.

When will you understand that xabi alonso can't play as the lone DM? Why do you think that wherever he has gone, he has always had a partner. Its not that busquets is a better player than alonso, its that he is better as the lone DM han him.

So if you want to play with only 1 DM, which imo you must do, busquets is the guy.

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Post by futbol_bill Fri Nov 18, 2011 9:23 pm

harhar11 wrote:^ I think that Iniestas place on the team is a certainty, because for me he has been the best player on the spanish team since the WC. Against costa rica, when spain were losing, he carried spain on his shoulder and he was the reason why you drew in the end. Same thing against us(chile Sad ), he came on and he won the game for you.

When will you understand that xabi alonso can't play as the lone DM? Why do you think that wherever he has gone, he has always had a partner. Its not that busquets is a better player than alonso, its that he is better as the lone DM han him.

So if you want to play with only 1 DM, which imo you must do, busquets is the guy.

In our system we don't play a DM. We play 1 or 2 deeper than others but we except end-to-end midfielders who initiate the play upfield with quick accurate and good vision passes. The Alonso partner is Xavi. In the last group play game, Alonso and Xavi were on together no Busquets and it worked perfectly. When Alonso first broke into the seleccion he was the lone deep MF. I know you have a bias towards Barca players but in my opinion Alonso is more valuable in the starting line-up than Busquets.
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Post by FennecFox7 Fri Nov 18, 2011 9:41 pm

free_cat wrote:
BarcaKizz wrote:I think he does care about playing for Spain... He's said it before, he's not into politics, he's into football. He plays for Spain and its an honour. If he could play for Catalunya instead, he would, but that doesn't mean he won't fight for the Spanish jersey as well.

In terms of from a Barca perspective... yes, protecting our players would be great Very Happy but I like to see them succeed with Spain as well to be honest, and at the end of the day if it makes them happy to keep playing I won't complain.
Xavi feels catalan and doesn't care much about spain
I disagree strongly with this
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Post by Great Leader Sprucenuce Fri Nov 18, 2011 10:30 pm

Bill i disagree with one thing........

if your going to play 4-3-3 like your saying i honestly believe Busquets is the better option, ok hes not as talented as Alonso and doesnt have the range of passing that Alonso has but he's much better DM and has an almost telepathic understanding with Xaviesta. With Xaviesta or Cesc or Silva infront of him you dont need Alonso's passing because theres more enough playmakers there already. Its just overkill putting Alonso there imo also its sacrifacing defensive steel and awareness for another passer which is not needed.

Enrique should be given a chance imo, he's probably the best LB in the premier league so he deserves his chance in my opinion.
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Post by messixaviesta Sat Nov 19, 2011 11:51 am

matpol wrote:What would be your 23 man squad for Spain? Here is mine:

GK - Casillas, Reina, Valdes
DF - Alba, Albiol, Arbeloa, Ramos, Pique, Puyol
MF - Alonso, Busquets, Cesc, Iniesta, Martinez, Silva, Cazorla, Xavi
FW - Torres, Mata, Villa, Llorente, Navas, Pedro


Nice selection matpol and I think very close to what will actually be selected. My only issue is the number of defenders is low. The area of concern above all is CB. That Albiol has to be guaranteed a place tells the story best.



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Post by harhar11 Sat Nov 19, 2011 11:55 am

futbol_bill wrote:
harhar11 wrote:^ I think that Iniestas place on the team is a certainty, because for me he has been the best player on the spanish team since the WC. Against costa rica, when spain were losing, he carried spain on his shoulder and he was the reason why you drew in the end. Same thing against us(chile Sad ), he came on and he won the game for you.

When will you understand that xabi alonso can't play as the lone DM? Why do you think that wherever he has gone, he has always had a partner. Its not that busquets is a better player than alonso, its that he is better as the lone DM han him.

So if you want to play with only 1 DM, which imo you must do, busquets is the guy.

In our system we don't play a DM. We play 1 or 2 deeper than others but we except end-to-end midfielders who initiate the play upfield with quick accurate and good vision passes. The Alonso partner is Xavi. In the last group play game, Alonso and Xavi were on together no Busquets and it worked perfectly. When Alonso first broke into the seleccion he was the lone deep MF. I know you have a bias towards Barca players but in my opinion Alonso is more valuable in the starting line-up than Busquets.

Then how come you(spain) always seem to struggle when xabi alonso plays there on his own?

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Post by messixaviesta Sat Nov 19, 2011 11:59 am

Arquitecto wrote:
Some greats point Deepak.

I'll explain:

1. Since Barca's tactics are different to VDB's I personally feel Busquets is not ready for a sole holding DM role as while you might disagree and may be correct, my other point and opinion is that Xabi is simply to good to be benched as while Busi may or may not be ready for the sole DM role, their partership which combines distribution and defense is a synergistic effort which is better then what one man can do.

2. I put Villa on the left because he has shown to be world class their as well as while I feel he is better centrally, his position is sacrificed to the left to make way for a proper CF who is solely a central player like Torres or Llorente. Are you saying Silva and Iniesta in the front flank? I mentioned to Khaled that Silva is most effective when he has a the front flank in front of him as while he is great as an inside forward, it would be a waste as others are better in that position along with the fact that his finishing is not to my liking. Same with Iniesta as playing as an inside forward is a waste of such a good player. If you mean in the midfield then I definitely agree. I love Pedro and feel he is very underrated, but would prefer Navas as he is the best true winger in the world imo when on form.

I see you also carry worry on the defensive end which is why I included the Xabi-Busi partnership to anchor the defense and incoming attacks.


Thanks arqui. Great points from you as well.

1. Yes there is definitely some merit in this argument. The defense is becoming weaker all the time Protecting them more might be important. Most teams will anyway play two anchor men for similar reasons. However the problems that arise from this are Xavi not given his best role since he has to push too far forward and a lack of pace and cutting edge in the attack.

2. I can hardly disagree with anythoing here. The lineup as you made it is good but a lack of pace in the attack is worrying.

Overall the truth is we don't have the perfect solution and need to strike a trade off. That's what Del Bosque did at WC 2010. He got a lot of flak for it but what mattered is that he won the world cup.

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Post by messixaviesta Sat Nov 19, 2011 12:09 pm

BarcaKizz wrote:
Xavi? He wants to compete at the highest level. Don't let your bias cloud you Alex, these are Xavi's wishes, he wants to play. He may retire after Euro 2012, but he's said he'd like to play at another WC. Don't be foolish... just because he's pro-Catalan it doesn't mean he doesn't love playing for Spain and playing at big tournaments like the Euro or the WC.

I never get the 'winning it all' argument...its just stupid. If you use that argument to leave things then you lack competitiveness and hunger. If you've won it all, win it all again. Xavi's won it all with Barca? Why doesn't he just leave there too?

kizz, I agree with the first point. So often we have discussed where Xavi should be ranked in an all time list. Major impact in Euro 2012 and WC 2014 will raise his profile even higher among the all time greats.

Your second point is simply brilliant. If this was the attitude then Xavi, Iniesta, Villa and Puyol would simply do a Ronaldinho and lose any interest in the game and the competition but they are simply made of different mettle. Smile

BTW Dunga recently said that if we were to build a dream team, Pirlo would be the first player he would pick. We all know how much Zidane has praised Scholes. I often wonder why doesn't some major football personality offer a compliment of this stature to Xavi some time. After all we here agree without question that while the other two are great in their own right, Xavi is unquestionably the best of the trio.
Maybe like we have often had those posts about all kinds of quotes on Messi, perhaps one of us should write a post detailing all the quotes that have been made by football biggies about Xavi during all these years.

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Post by messixaviesta Sat Nov 19, 2011 12:16 pm

BarcaKizz wrote:I think he does care about playing for Spain... He's said it before, he's not into politics, he's into football. He plays for Spain and its an honour. If he could play for Catalunya instead, he would, but that doesn't mean he won't fight for the Spanish jersey as well.

Yes kizz that's exactly what he said and I think it's the right attitude. Let's not forget that all our players including the Catalans and that means Xavi as well joined the world cup victory celebration which happened in no place other than ... Madrid. What's more is that Xavi even went to the Asturias awards when he was not fit to play for Barca. International football and the world cup victory does mean something to him. Villa even says he saw Xavi and Iniesta weeping uncontrollably in the dressing room after the world cup victory and that shocked him because these are guys who had already won so much. No matter what anyone says I will never undervalue international football and the world cup. A player is forever known as a world cup winner if he does so much as being part of that 23 man squad. Ever heard of a player being referred to as a UCL winner?


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Post by Adit Sat Nov 19, 2011 12:18 pm

BarcaKizz wrote:

@ Adit: Are you convinced they need the two-man protective cushion though?? The Senna-Xavi partnership was always better and in my opinion Xavi played better there. He's played too high up now in my opinion. Busquets is tactically very aware and in particular if they play Arbeloa thats a pretty strong defensive structure. I don't really see Alonso giving enough in defense to justify him being there ahead of someone who gives more in attack.

Tbh though, this is my opinion, and I was always a bigger fan of Aragones' team anyway.

Since their defense is even worse than before due to puyols absence and Pique-Ramos pairing is still in work,they do need that extra protection.Even with that conservative line up casillas faced two one on one with robben in a WC final,what are the possibility a single DM style will work better?

Alonso is a excellent reader of the game,even though he is bit slow he can make interceptions and tackles pretty easily.Also the physical presence required to prevent some National teams who plays with heart *england* *holand in final* etc..

Also alonso wasnt exactly a defensive player in spain,he was excellent with his ball distribution . His partnership with xavi was great throw out the the WC and he performed as good as Xavi in that tournament .
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Post by messixaviesta Sat Nov 19, 2011 12:21 pm

BarcaKizz wrote:Futbol_bill, I don't understand why you keep using the phrase "save him for the Olympics". The Euros are 10 times bigger than the Olympics, surely Spain will pick the very best team possible, regardless of the Olympics.

I am so glad someone mentioned this. The significance of the football in Olympics is at times grossly overrated. If that really mattered why do so many people call Messi an international underperformer?

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Post by Adit Sat Nov 19, 2011 12:25 pm

BarcaKizz wrote:

@ Adit: Are you convinced they need the two-man protective cushion though?? The Senna-Xavi partnership was always better and in my opinion Xavi played better there. He's played too high up now in my opinion. Busquets is tactically very aware and in particular if they play Arbeloa thats a pretty strong defensive structure. I don't really see Alonso giving enough in defense to justify him being there ahead of someone who gives more in attack.

Tbh though, this is my opinion, and I was always a bigger fan of Aragones' team anyway.

Since their defense is even worse than before due to puyols absence and Pique-Ramos pairing is still in work,they do need that extra protection.Even with that conservative line up casillas faced two one on one with robben in a WC final,what are the possibility a single DM style will work better?

Alonso is a excellent reader of the game,even though he is bit slow he can make interceptions and tackles pretty easily.Also the physical presence required to prevent some National teams who plays with heart *england* *holand in final* etc..

Also alonso wasnt exactly a defensive player in spain,he was excellent with his ball distribution . His partnership with xavi was great throw out the the WC and he performed as good as Xavi in that tournament .
Aragones team was certainly more entertaining and deserved winners but they were dangerously direct team ,a good counter attacking team could have defeated them but they also played conservatively when faced counter attacking teams like italy and germany(thnx to aragones's knowledge).

You need little bit of conservative style to win international trophies.spain 2010,italy 2006,greece 2004,even brazil 2002 .
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