The Official Real Madrid 23 - 24 Matchday Thread

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Post by sportsczy Sat Mar 23, 2024 3:27 pm

Impossible to play 2 AMs in the modern game.  He’d have to play a Silva-like role in a 433 on the right.  But that would mean Jude would move back to CM.

Brahim and Guler play the same role too.

I do think RM return to a 433 and Jude plays a more conventional CM role.  So there is an opportunity for Brahim/Guler.  

RM is going to lose a couple of great young players (notably a CM) because there just isn’t enough playing time.

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Post by The Madrid One Sun Mar 24, 2024 9:42 pm

Well, whether a 2 "AMs" thing works depends on a lot of things in the team, the types of fullbacks, the types of deeper midfielders, the types of forwards, the type of pressing and management in different phases, the types of AMs, the formation and according zones, roles, etc.

Bellingham, Brahim, and Guler all could be broadly classified as "AMs" but they have their idiosyncrasies that differentiate them and that differentiate the zones and roles with which they are more optimal at.

I have a special fondness for the 4222 as it was the formation that we used for that one run of games in like October and November of 2014 where Bale was injured and we played the Isco-Kroos-Modric-James midfield quartet. Interestingly enough, I've read a significant amount of people name that side that only lasted a short run of (memorable) games as the Madrid side that played the "best football" in the 21st century. I think I'd place it over even anything we saw in 11/12 or 16/17. Ronaldo and Benzema's movement was incredible across the forward line and so was James' with the overlapping and position interchanging involving Marcelo and Carvajal. We memorably trounced the eventual champions league winners (Barcelona) of that season 3-1 and could have scored more. Bale returning, Modric getting sidelined, and a drop of form starting with a memorably disastrous game against Valencia in January 2015 ended that beautiful side we never really saw again... until kinda sorta this year.

Isco-Kroos-Modric-James

Bellingham-Kroos-Valverde (Tcho/Cama) -Brahim (Valverde)

The best games we've played this year, apart from the Girona game, have been with a 4222, and the last two games against Celta Vigo and Osasuna where we seemed to have perked up a bit since the February/March trough featured the 4222.

I'm not a big fan of when we get AMs, I personally was never a fan or too expectant regarding the likes of Asensio, Odegaard, Kubo. Isco was useful but his player profile was limited by his physique (Bellingham is graced and stands in a stark contrast), Ozil was great but his case and profile serves as a bit of a cautionary tale that has played out time and again since he left, Brahim I did somewhat get intrigued by when we got him because of his acceleration, dribbling, low center of gravity, turning ability, in between the lines and small space control, and how all that gave him forward-like attributes that could make him interesting as we are seeing now, Ceballos disillusioned me early on after it was clear he had mid table passing range and most of his success early on was from advanced AM zones against random u-21 teams, and James...

James was a prodigious talent but he fell apart mentally and the context in Madrid and his life didn't work out. He stood at almost 6 feet tall and had what it took to work in a double pivot or in a 3 man midfield and pull off a deep-lying playmaker ala Kroos sort of thing if he had wanted to imo.

I like about Arda that in his few Madrid appearances he's left small details with his character and actions that have a certain aura to them, or "grandeza" as it is aptly said in Spanish. I also like that he uses his right foot without stuttering often to shoot, pass, and cross, and from footage in his former club he has talents that we still have to see more of.

But generally he seems to be in the "Ozilian" mode akin to James and Odegaard, and I see Brahim providing more interesting variables with his idiosyncrasies and how he can move across the forward and midfield line and do more in the box and with beating opponents and scoring goals. Not sure Arda even has a higher ceiling than Odegaard. We'll see but when I see people hyping him up on Twitter and whatnot I somewhat sneer a bit as I've seen this disgustingly play out before. In any case I don't imagine him being a starter as being something optimal in the future, will probably work best in the ten role or in a RAM role in a 4231 or 4222 rather than a 433 that would facilitate movements appropriate to his idiosyncrasies. He would probably benefit from being loaned out as there's a lot of competition and expectations here.  

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Post by The Madrid One Thu Mar 28, 2024 4:14 pm

Endrick left interesting flashes in the two NT games he played. He seemed a bit erratic with some flagrantly failed dribbles/pass attempts/sequences and a goal attempt he probably should have put in against England, but, particularly in the Spain game, he also showed a noteworthy finish, a couple of noteworthy passes (especially the well placed through ball that Unai Simon attentively came out to clear), and a few turns and movements across the pitch that I hope are indicative of him being able to have markedly good link up play in the future. Based on all the footage I've seen of him, as previously mentioned, he doesn't seem like a set wide player (other than in rotational and in the moment sequences) but rather a mainly central forward. Hope he becomes clean, sharp, refined, and not a messy, selfish, detrimentally flashy player who tries to over dribble outside of his capabilities, which in the dribbling aspect seem functional rather than particularly out of the ordinary.
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Post by futbol_bill Fri Mar 29, 2024 12:51 pm

The next two years are going to very interesting. There is a wealth of talent for every position except RB and possibly CB, although we can expect signing in these two years for those positions.

The team should dominate, however the issue will be there isn’t enough playing time available for all and thus we can expect several departures in a couple of years. Challenge will be to acquire competent backups in place of the departures.
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Post by Cyborg Sun Mar 31, 2024 8:49 pm

I don't like the Kroos Tchouameni double pivot.

A bit too slow when they're together.

Prefer Camavinga in there with Kroos.

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Post by halamadrid2 Sun Mar 31, 2024 10:04 pm

Great win. Without Nico, Bilbao were toothless.

Rodrygo with 2 beautiful goals

Militao is back. Now the million dollar question is whether he'll start against City. Because I don't trust Nacho against Haaland.
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Post by futbol_bill Mon Apr 01, 2024 2:01 pm

Sure he will. He has 9 days to get into playing shape! I think the bigger question is who will start between Kroos and Camavinga!

Carlo was raving about defensive coverage yesterday, which I think means you can expect Tchouameni to start and of course we will see Valverde and Bellingham.
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Post by titosantill Wed Apr 03, 2024 12:13 am

I think Kroos will start. Carlo likes tried and trusted in such games. From a set piece standpoint too, having Kroos around helps. We will need goals from anywhere we can get them, so having Kroos for set pieces at the very least makes sense. Hopefully it doesn't get too physical for him.
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Post by Pedram Wed Apr 03, 2024 10:30 am

titosantill wrote:I think Kroos will start. Carlo likes tried and trusted in such games. From a set piece standpoint too, having Kroos around helps. We will need goals from anywhere we can get them, so having Kroos for set pieces at the very least makes sense. Hopefully it doesn't get too physical for him.


Lack of players with set pieces qualities after Kroos leaving is a real concern tbh. i dont think we have any young players who could even come close to him, maybe Jude needs to work on that aspect, i heard Guler can take freekicks too but it's not clear if he could turn into a starting player any time soon.
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Post by futbol_bill Wed Apr 03, 2024 4:10 pm

and just a year ago, I made a comment about his strength in free kicks (when it seemed everyone was complaining about both him and Modric) and everyone said his kicking ability was very poor!

I'm wondering if Mbappe can make corner kicks. He lacks height to be effective on headers from corner kicks. Who takes them at PSG and with France? I'm also wondering if Davies is effective on headers as he does have the height. On current squad we only have Rudiger, Militao and Tchoumeni, decent on headers.
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Post by sportsczy Thu Apr 04, 2024 3:52 am

futbol_bill wrote:and just a year ago, I made a comment about his strength in free kicks (when it seemed everyone was complaining about both him and Modric) and everyone said his kicking ability  was very poor!

I'm wondering if Mbappe can make corner kicks. He lacks height to be effective on headers from corner kicks. Who takes them at PSG and with France? I'm also wondering if Davies is effective on headers as he does have the height. On current squad we only have Rudiger, Militao and Tchoumeni, decent on headers.

PSG - Dembele, Vitinha, Kang In Lee and Hakimi.  Hakimi takes free kicks a lot, but not corners.
France - Griezmann takes free kicks and corners.  Literally all of them.  He's missed 2 games since 2017 (last 2).  Dembele took them this last time with Clauss and Theo Hernandez.

Mbappe only takes PKs.
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Post by titosantill Fri Apr 05, 2024 11:52 am

Well we still have Alaba when Kroos leaves or retires. Alaba's solid at freekicks. When he gets back he'll have a huge role to play on that front. But I usually like to have a right footer and a left footer to compliment each other from set pieces. So yes, we'll still need someone that can cause trouble with their right after Kroos leaves
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Post by Pedram Tue Apr 09, 2024 6:42 pm



Let's beat Citeh bounce
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Post by halamadrid2 Tue Apr 09, 2024 10:08 pm

Some terrible shots from us. Didn't give up shots from inside the box but unfortunately couldn't do much with 2 of the 3 City goals.
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Post by The Madrid One Tue Apr 09, 2024 11:12 pm



Fuck the Etihad. It's now basically a "final" and what we have to do is just score one more goal than they do.

We're gonna have to rock and roll.

Hopefully the players are physically ready in a week's time. Bellingham looked gassed and Vinicius, despite some fine actions, was not at his best.
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Post by halamadrid2 Yesterday at 5:29 am

We need to stop conceding multiple goals because we don't have Ronaldo anymore to score multiple goals. We shouldn't have to score 4 freaking goals to win a game
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Post by Clutch Yesterday at 5:38 am

Those goals were kind of random. It was a weird game, our goals were fluky too

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Post by the xcx Yesterday at 8:35 pm

I am not very confident on the return leg honestly. Those long distance shots caught us off guard, something that we are very susceptible to, even more annoyingly those shots were very well placed. Thought Vini and Bellingham were just spectators and could have made a bigger impact. We started to get into rhythm as soon as Modric came as a sub and things looked favorable for us. Having no CF certainly does not help either.
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