2020 US presidential election

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Post by CBarca Fri Nov 06, 2020 10:48 pm

@BarrileteCosmico wrote:A bucket of cold water that Trump got so close to a 2nd term. If he hadn't botched Corona he would've won. If dems run on the same platform in 2 years they will lose the lower house, let's hope victory doesn't get to their head.

Also huge question marks about trump's improved margins with lgbt, white women, black men and Hispanic people. Trump's platform didn't change, so it must be something on the dems side that scared them off. Or maybe it was just his handling of the economy?


For all the talk the "WE NEED TO PUSH LEFT" people put out on here, Biden clearly outperformed Dems everywhere, except maybe Mark Kelly in AZ. A common refrain from people at the polls who generally stayed with Trump (indies, people who lean right) was "we think the Dems have gone too far left"

Now, this is fucking bullshit of course.

But it's something to think of. I think people are not as big of fans of "the squad" or Bernie Sanders as is commonly thought. At the same time, things like $15/hour wage and recreational marijuana were passing, soooo... who knows? It was a weird election. A lot of data needs to come through to help make sense of it.

It's also possible that, while turnout was huge among racists, people despised Trump enough to vote against him while being fine with other R candidates (fuckin Susan Collins? Really?).

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Post by McLewis Fri Nov 06, 2020 11:13 pm

It's perception. The GOP understand that very little needs to be true if they can get voters who are not clued in to perceive Dems as out of step with what's important to them. Once that happens, facts truly don't matter at that point.

It's a direct debunk of the "facts don't care about your feelings" school of thought.
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Post by McLewis Fri Nov 06, 2020 11:13 pm

As for Georgia,

My biggest concern with the recount is that this stretches that senate race out quite a bit now and with control for the Senate so tenuous and firmly in Georgia's hands, that just exacerbates tensions even more.
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Post by Myesyats Fri Nov 06, 2020 11:16 pm

@Warrior wrote:Yes that was very noticeable. It's also the case in Canada. Liberal Party won because the 2 most populated cities voted for them. Rest of people think otherwise.

I assumed it was everywhere like this hmm

Yeah isn't it the case everywhere? Rural areas are usually more conservative and I would assume this is universally true.
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Post by Pedram Sat Nov 07, 2020 12:19 am

Trump Plans to Barricade Himself in the Oval Office and Refuse to Come Out If Biden Wins

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2020/11/donald-trump-no-concession

Vanity Fair but still Laughing
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Post by sportsczy Sat Nov 07, 2020 1:06 am

edit: no need


Last edited by sportsczy on Sat Nov 07, 2020 1:33 am; edited 1 time in total
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Post by elitedam Sat Nov 07, 2020 1:18 am

@CBarca wrote:

For all the talk the "WE NEED TO PUSH LEFT" people put out on here, Biden clearly outperformed Dems everywhere, except maybe Mark Kelly in AZ. A common refrain from people at the polls who generally stayed with Trump (indies, people who lean right) was "we think the Dems have gone too far left"

Now, this is fucking bullshit of course.

But it's something to think of. I think people are not as big of fans of "the squad" or Bernie Sanders as is commonly thought. At the same time, things like $15/hour wage and recreational marijuana were passing, soooo... who knows? It was a weird election. A lot of data needs to come through to help make sense of it.

It's also possible that, while turnout was huge among racists, people despised Trump enough to vote against him while being fine with other R candidates (fuckin Susan Collins? Really?).


How progressive were the senators that ran worse than Biden though? And like you said, some progressive ballot measures easily passed this year. Maybe the problem isn't progressive ideology but instead democratic politicians? I don't know.
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Post by Myesyats Sat Nov 07, 2020 1:26 am

This is narcissism paired with some type of mental disorder. Twitter really ought to delete his account, spreading this drivel toward 88m+ people should be criminal.

On one hand he's saying "we can't allow to silence our voters" but an hour later he tweets to stop the count. Delusional and contradictory claims across the board. Twitter has flagged like half his tweets over the past 2 days which is amazing. I'm loving this incredibly maniacal downward spiral of Trump- the madman. It's everything I have hoped for. It was a nice social experiment but I'm glad it's over.

And regardless of what Betty aka Lil Kaz may or may not have controversially stated, I'm proud of him and the beautiful city of Atlanta as well as other Americans on this board.
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Post by Nishankly Sat Nov 07, 2020 1:53 am

@Myesyats wrote:This is narcissism paired with some type of mental disorder. Twitter really ought to delete his account, spreading this drivel toward 88m+ people should be criminal.



Why? He represents 50% of America and a decent part of Europe who can't distinguish.
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Post by sportsczy Sat Nov 07, 2020 3:47 am

@Nishankly wrote:
@Myesyats wrote:This is narcissism paired with some type of mental disorder. Twitter really ought to delete his account, spreading this drivel toward 88m+ people should be criminal.



Why? He represents 50% of America and a decent part of Europe who can't distinguish.

It's a bit deeper than that.  There are five main constituents in the following:
-  Anti-establishment
-  Revolt against the PC and cancel cultures
-  Disenfranchised white people with declining standards of living who are deathly afraid of losing "their country"
-  Agenda-driven (anti-Iran, pro-Israel, anti-Cuba, etc.)
-  Tea partiers

That's a lot of people.
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Post by Myesyats Sat Nov 07, 2020 10:07 am

@Nishankly wrote:
@Myesyats wrote:This is narcissism paired with some type of mental disorder. Twitter really ought to delete his account, spreading this drivel toward 88m+ people should be criminal.



Why? He represents 50% of America and a decent part of Europe who can't distinguish.

He doesnt represent that many people, he's just good at directing blame and fear which many people are susceptible to.

There is definitely more good than bad people across the board, it's not even close to 50-50. I believe in the goodness of people really, if you go out on the street it's nothing like the media would make it out to be but politics is a different animal and many who identify republican will ride the train forever even though it's going nowhere.

We all know whites don't give a shit about racial issues, they care about what affects them which is generally money. So if someone voted for Trump with the economy in mind (ignoring other issues), I'd say they're just stupid/gullible rather than bad people as a whole. They've been let down by democrats, or at least led to believe that by FOX.

Nonetheless, the simple answer is that Trump has violated enough rules of the platform to warrant a ban. From racial stuff, to hate speech, to spreading misinformation about a multitude of things, inciting violence, glorifying violence, sharing private information, violating rules about civic and election integrity.

The president holds lots of power with what he could or won't say and if he says Jews are the problem, then a sizeable portion of people may believe they are. If McCain hadnt said that Obama is a decent family man when some lady said that she can't trust him because he's an Arab, we might have never had two term Obama.

This makes a whole lot of difference:
"He is a decent family man, a citizen who I just happen to have disagreements with"
vs
"He's a dirty, crooked terrrorist-lover and where the fuck is his birth certificate?'

A lie repeated a thousand times become the truth. Trump is really going verbatim by the nazi playbook.
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Post by VivaStPauli Sat Nov 07, 2020 10:25 am

This isn't a question of political orientation though, the problem is how much he's lying.
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Post by Hapless_Hans Sat Nov 07, 2020 11:40 am

BREAKING NEWS

Biden closes in on presidency, leads in PA
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Post by VivaStPauli Sat Nov 07, 2020 11:42 am

KEY RACE ALERT
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Post by futbol_bill Sat Nov 07, 2020 1:10 pm

@Myesyats wrote:
@Nishankly wrote:
@Myesyats wrote:This is narcissism paired with some type of mental disorder. Twitter really ought to delete his account, spreading this drivel toward 88m+ people should be criminal.



Why? He represents 50% of America and a decent part of Europe who can't distinguish.

He doesnt represent that many people, he's just good at directing blame and fear which many people are susceptible to.

There is definitely more good than bad people across the board, it's not even close to 50-50. I believe in the goodness of people really, if you go out on the street it's nothing like the media would make it out to be but politics is a different animal and many who identify republican will ride the train forever even though it's going nowhere.

We all know whites don't give a shit about racial issues, they care about what affects them which is generally money. So if someone voted for Trump with the economy in mind (ignoring other issues), I'd say they're just stupid/gullible rather than bad people as a whole. They've been let down by democrats, or at least led to believe that by FOX.

Nonetheless, the simple answer is that Trump has violated enough rules of the platform to warrant a ban. From racial stuff, to hate speech, to spreading misinformation about a multitude of things, inciting violence, glorifying violence, sharing private information, violating rules about civic and election integrity.

The president holds lots of power with what he could or won't say and if he says Jews are the problem, then a sizeable portion of people may believe they are. If McCain hadnt said that Obama is a decent family man when some lady said that she can't trust him because he's an Arab, we might have never had two term Obama.

This makes a whole lot of difference:
"He is a decent family man, a citizen who I just happen to have disagreements with"
vs
"He's a dirty, crooked terrrorist-lover and where the fuck is his birth certificate?'

A lie repeated a thousand times become the truth. Trump is really going verbatim by the nazi playbook.


Before we ask if Twitter can ban him, we should ask if he can have his twitter account in jail?

(I firmly believe he is going there. Sure the Dems will be playing with fire if they proceed with any of the numerous federal violations, but the fraud charges in New York are definitely going to proceed.)
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Post by Hapless_Hans Sat Nov 07, 2020 1:25 pm

the last 2 days of US news coverage has been nothing but appeasement of fascism

"Let's not call the race so fast because there's so much uncertainty and pressure, in face of the allegations of fraud we have to be extra careful"...

not a second should have been spent on discussing if there's "fraud", everyone knows there is none

the time should have been used to fight back against the traitors and coupists, because that is what the Republicans are, really

what Trump is attempting is a coup and treason, and the majority of his party along with Fox News are backing him up

meanwhile everyone else is saying they should "present evidence", Jesus fucking Christ

we have all the evidence we need that they are anti-constitutional, lawless, rogue enemies of democracy

these are enemies, not opponents, and unless the Democrats, and all democrats, understand that, we will continue to have our discourses, agendas, and (especially in the case of PoC) our bare lives, dominated and nullified by the unhinged right
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Post by CBarca Sat Nov 07, 2020 1:47 pm

On the bright side, the fraud claims come from Trump and really aren't being parroted too much elsewhere. His circle pretty much believe that he's lost, except for a couple people. The courts haven't taken the bait on any nefarious claims, he's only been able to trot out small victories like getting closer to counting stations.

His supporters believe it and that's why we have to be careful. Can see some lone gunman type situation. But as far as some sort of "coup" goes, Trump is completely unable and nobody would back it.

Networks need to call it though.
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Post by Hapless_Hans Sat Nov 07, 2020 1:51 pm

@CBarca wrote:On the bright side, the fraud claims come from Trump and really aren't being parroted too much elsewhere. His circle pretty much believe that he's lost, except for a couple people. The courts haven't taken the bait on any nefarious claims, he's only been able to trot out small victories like getting closer to counting stations.

His supporters believe it and that's why we have to be careful. Can see some lone gunman type situation. But as far as some sort of "coup" goes, Trump is completely unable and nobody would back it.

Networks need to call it though.

That's true, but a crime is not only a crime if it's successful, or likely to succeed

And I do think it's of vital importance to call out reality.

The speech Guiliani gave the other day was straight, pure, textbook fascism. And it's not some low level plotters we're talking about, we are talking about a sitting president and his team.
In the mythology of western political discourse, the 'most powerful man' on the planet.

And the point is not at all, as I've said above, whether his claims can be proven or connected to reality. They can't. The point is you will have 70 million people who have shown to be dangerously gullible enough to believe that it's dark night when the sun is shining, and these people will have the tohught in their mind that even the most superficially, trivial truth of their political system - that people vote and according to those votes there are people elected - is not true. (I say superficial becacuse we are not even at the point of discussing more complicated issues of what's a democracy like the notion of representation, minority protection vs majority rule, equality of access, level playing field, money and lobby influence, legal intricacies, balance of powers)
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Post by BarrileteCosmico Sat Nov 07, 2020 2:02 pm



This was just 12 yeas ago. Crazy and sad how far the US has fallen.
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Post by Hapless_Hans Sat Nov 07, 2020 2:04 pm

I've recommended Philipp Roth's "plot against America" a few times on here without response, I'll just do it again, it's amazing how much the vibe of the book, which was written 15 years ago and deals with an alternate history of the late 1930s/earl 1940s in US, resonates with the present
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Post by BarrileteCosmico Sat Nov 07, 2020 4:35 pm

Hans it's perpetually on my "to watch later" list

Aaand AP finally calls it. Hopefully the other networks follow through, Trump has no chance to get back in on this, even if Arizona and Georgia end up red.
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Post by Robespierre Sat Nov 07, 2020 4:42 pm

Finally the clown is out, what a beautiful day


Last edited by Robespierre on Sat Nov 07, 2020 4:45 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post by Young Kaz Sat Nov 07, 2020 4:44 pm

Stay MAD!!!! hahahahahahahah


USA IS BACK!
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Post by Hapless_Hans Sat Nov 07, 2020 4:45 pm

@BarrileteCosmico wrote:Hans it's perpetually on my "to watch later" list

Aaand AP finally calls it. Hopefully the other networks follow through, Trump has no chance to get back in on this, even if Arizona and Georgia end up red.


I mean the book, not the series. Haven't watched the series either yet Proud

Anyway, finally called. Molenation

In their credit, the news desk at Fox News too calling Biden president-elect, in contrast to what apparently were the marching orders of messaging etiquette for Fox News hosts, and projecting him to win the Presidency
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Post by Robespierre Sat Nov 07, 2020 4:50 pm

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Post by CBarca Sat Nov 07, 2020 4:51 pm

Let's gooooooo
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