Ultimate question: How on earth does Messi and Ronaldo even have thesame Balon D'or wins?

Socur Toxanarosa wrote:

Blue Barrett wrote:What a stupid thread. Ronaldo has 4 because in the years he won it, he achieved more than Messi. Just like in the years Messi won it, he achieved more than Ronaldo.

What? You want Messi to get ballon d'ors every single year for simply rolling out of bed?

No, he should get ballon d'ors every single year because he is the best player in the world(by a country mile) every single year even if Barcelona doesn't win all the time, simple as that.

Give your head a wobble. It's not the "best overall talent" or "best talent over careers" or even a lifetime achievement award. There's one key question in winning the award: "What have you done for me lately?"

You're not winning naught simply because you're more talented even though the next guy has just dragged his team to multiple trophies. Tell me how exactly Messi deserved to win the last won over a CL & Euro winning Ronaldo for example? Come off it!

Yeah but it's not the best player, it never has been.

As I said it's basically an MVP award, it goes to the player who achieves the best season with the most team success.

Or at least it used to be before it became the Messi/Ronaldo stats award.

By this logic Zidane or Ronaldo would have won it every year but they didn't.

Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:Yeah but it's not the best player, it never has been.

As I said it's basically an MVP award, it goes to the player who achieves the best season with the most team success.

Or at least it used to be before it became the Messi/Ronaldo stats award.

By this logic Zidane or Ronaldo would have won it every year but they didn't.

Tbh, apart from Sneijder's shout in 2010, there hasn't really been a year where it wasn't down to just the two of them logically. It's a testament to how well they've performed over a period of 9 years. That's incredible to me.

I'm not saying Messi should win every year only because he is the most talented, but because he didn't have a single not elite season yet, his worst in terms of goals was the last one when he scored 41 in 46 apps. He scored 60 in 50 apps the season Bayern won the CL.

No one is saying he hasn't been elite. But in all the years Ronaldo's won it, it was well deserved for Ronaldo as he achieved better overall. Period.

Blue Barrett wrote:No one is saying he hasn't been elite. But in all the years Ronaldo's won it, it was well deserved for Ronaldo as he achieved better overall. Period.

If the criteria is "most famous guy in the CL winner team", fine.

Socur Toxanarosa wrote:

Blue Barrett wrote:No one is saying he hasn't been elite. But in all the years Ronaldo's won it, it was well deserved for Ronaldo as he achieved better overall. Period.

If the criteria is "most famous guy in the CL winner team", fine.

You're being ridiculous and you know it. Thankfully the people who vote don't think like this. Do you think the years Zidane and co won it were the only years they had elite seasons? Smh.

Blue Barrett wrote:
You're being ridiculous and you know it. Thankfully the people who vote don't think like this. Do you think the years Zidane and co won it were the only years they had elite seasons? Smh.

This.

Just goes to show how overrated Tech players are by normal fans. Football/Soccer isn't just as shallow as controlling the ball with your feet. It's a game were every aspect whether physical, mental, and technical counts. Saying Ronaldo is talentless or is undeserving of Ballon D'Or is a very naive thing to say. Time and again he's proven how influential he has been not only at club level but also for his NT team. He's already a legend of the sport and will be hailed as one of the greatest players ever if not the best.

Lord Awesome wrote:

Blue Barrett wrote:
You're being ridiculous and you know it. Thankfully the people who vote don't think like this. Do you think the years Zidane and co won it were the only years they had elite seasons? Smh.

This.

Just goes to show how overrated Tech players are by normal fans. Football/Soccer isn't just as shallow as controlling the ball with your feet. It's a game were every aspect whether physical, mental, and technical counts. Saying Ronaldo is talentless or is undeserving of Ballon D'Or is a very naive thing to say. Time and again he's proven how influential he has been not only at club level but also for his NT team. He's already a legend of the sport and will be hailed as one of the greatest players ever if not the best.

lol no he isn't and definitely no again.

he is a shit player and will forever have to endure the heartache of being regarded as the best in his safe space with many people in the room raising an eyebrow or not keeping a straight face.

even his own son knows it. he is terrible and has contributed nothing positive for football.

Unbelievable that people still doubt CR. The guy has more goals than games for the past 8 years since he arrived in Spain. Maybe if Messi didn't walk around for half a season he would have 10 straight Ballon d'Or but it is what it is, and CR has performed brilliantly all his career.

BORUSSIA!! wrote:

Lord Awesome wrote:

Blue Barrett wrote:
You're being ridiculous and you know it. Thankfully the people who vote don't think like this. Do you think the years Zidane and co won it were the only years they had elite seasons? Smh.

This.

Just goes to show how overrated Tech players are by normal fans. Football/Soccer isn't just as shallow as controlling the ball with your feet. It's a game were every aspect whether physical, mental, and technical counts. Saying Ronaldo is talentless or is undeserving of Ballon D'Or is a very naive thing to say. Time and again he's proven how influential he has been not only at club level but also for his NT team. He's already a legend of the sport and will be hailed as one of the greatest players ever if not the best.

lol no he isn't and definitely no again.

he is a shit player and will forever have to endure the heartache of being regarded as the best in his safe space with many people in the room raising an eyebrow or not keeping a straight face.

even his own son knows it. he is terrible and has contributed nothing positive for football.

This is exactly how you signal to everyone that you know absolutely nothing about football. Go watch golf mate.

Blue Barrett wrote:

Socur Toxanarosa wrote:

Blue Barrett wrote:No one is saying he hasn't been elite. But in all the years Ronaldo's won it, it was well deserved for Ronaldo as he achieved better overall. Period.

If the criteria is "most famous guy in the CL winner team", fine.

You're being ridiculous and you know it. Thankfully the people who vote don't think like this. Do you think the years Zidane and co won it were the only years they had elite seasons? Smh.

Nonono, thankfully the people who voted for this don't vote for it anymore because they know *bleep* all

I might no agree on the number of BDors CR7 got, but saying he did not deserve any of them is ridiculous. I mean i dislike his tantrums and his character, but you got to admit he has been one of the greatest to play the game. Pity (or luck for us Barca fans) he is in the same generation as Messi who is a *bleep* freak of nature.

Blue Barrett wrote:You're being ridiculous and you know it. Thankfully the people who vote don't think like this. Do you think the years Zidane and co won it were the only years they had elite seasons? Smh.

Zidane never had the kind of consistency Messi has or was the force of nature he is, totally different comparison, actually, you can't compare any player with Messi, he is truly in a league of his own.

Thimmy wrote:I'm starting to understand why you jump on every opportunity to bash C. Ronaldo The Ballon D'or would have no entertainment value whatsoever, if it had worked the way you want it to. It's only purpose would be to rub Messi's ego every year. I don't know how that makes any sense to you.

Cristiano Ronaldo is a great player, the second best of the generation based on his consistency, but he is nowhere close to Messi and this artificial rivalry is ridiculous, it'll damage football history in the future, but it generates money, that's why he keeps winning ballon d'ors.

I don't want ballon d'or/poty to be "entertaining", i want it to be serious and focused only on meritocracy, which won't happen anytime soon.

Socur Toxanarosa wrote:

Blue Barrett wrote:You're being ridiculous and you know it. Thankfully the people who vote don't think like this. Do you think the years Zidane and co won it were the only years they had elite seasons? Smh.

Zidane never had the kind of consistency Messi has or was the force of nature he is, totally different comparison, actually, you can't compare any player with Messi, he is truly in a league of his own.

Is Messi the first player in history to have elite seasons? Or are you just deliberately ignoring logic here?

Blue Barrett wrote:Is Messi the first player in history to have elite seasons? Or are you just deliberately ignoring logic here?

You're missing the point, you're equaling a elite season by Messi with a elite season by another world class player, which are totally different things, Messi is the probably the GOAT and even if he isn't, there isn't any other contender in this generation, the last one was Ronaldo Nazario pre-injury, so while he keeps his standards(and he kept it every season since he started his domination), no one comes close.

Every Ballon d'or Cristiano has won is totally deserved. Should've won more imo.

Guy has literally pushed himself to the limit despite not being as talented as his closest footballing rival. Unmatched consistency and a perfect role model for kids growing up.
It's commendable from Cristiano that even at 32, he has that same hunger and determination to be the best.
Only a dumb fool would have to hate him or criticise him at this point imo. It's like still hating on Cena after all he gave to the WWE.

I don't criticise him and haven't for a long time but no he doesn't deserve every one he's got just like Messi doesn't.

The year Bayern won the treble, Madrid went trophyless and he did nothing in the games that decided that were trophyless.

The message there is basically that trophies don't matter and neither does the matches that decide said trophies if you score loads of goals against irrelevant teams.

Just like Messi winning it in the year Inter wins the treble and Spain wins the WC is completely stupid and why i don't take the award seriously.

It's the Messi/Ronaldo stat off and won't change till their decline.

S wrote:perfect role model for kids growing up

I'm convinced now.

Ronaldo should not have won it in 2013, that was Ribery's to win. If Balon D Or and FIFA WPOTY were not combined, Sneijder and Ribery would have actually won the Balon D Or (journalists vote) in 2010 and 2013.

Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:I don't criticise him and haven't for a long time but no he doesn't deserve every one he's got just like Messi doesn't.

The year Bayern won the treble, Madrid went trophyless and he did nothing in the games that decided that were trophyless.

The message there is basically that trophies don't matter and neither does the matches that decide said trophies if you score loads of goals against irrelevant teams.

Just like Messi winning it in the year Inter wins the treble and Spain wins the WC is completely stupid and why i don't take the award seriously.

It's the Messi/Ronaldo stat off and won't change till their decline.

Trophies DO matter. Which is something @Socur Toxanarosa doesn't seem to understand as he want Messi to be given the award every year until he retires apparently.

2010 and 2013 were the only real years you could argue that the award could have gone to someone else but I can understand either Messi or Ronaldo winning the award over someone who's won trophies if they performed far and beyond that player individually.

For example, in 2012, Messi scored 91 goals (*bleep* insane). Even if Barca won nothing that calendar year, giving the award to someone else would have been highway robbery. I can understand ignoring lack of (or smaller) trophies if the individual has had a truly incredible season surpassing the individual contribution of the other player in the argument by a significant margin. That said, I think Sneijder had a much better case for winning over Messi than Ribery had over Ronaldo.

@blue barret. Then what do u have to say about Ronaldo wpoty win in 96 and dinho's in 2004 where they won it with no trophies, no super teams (yes, barca wasnt all that back then) and playing in no elite competition. Something that would never happen today. Hell, El fenomeno won the uefa mvp playing in the uefa cup in 1997 ffs and everyone bowed to his supremacy and dinho won a balon d'or after being eliminated in the cl second round by chelsea and no one seem to have disagreed or bated an eye lid even if others scored more, won more, assited more etb. So why cant it be applicable to messi.

@toxanarosa my point exactly. If those guys did it without any controversy, why in the world has that changed to a goal scoring contest? When with or without goals, messi has been far and away the superior player for the past 8 years.

Ronaldo deserves golden shoe not the best player award. As a player he is average. If team doesnt create chances he does nothing. Modric Isco Marcelo Kroos are better players. You cant say it about messi or neymar. They are best at every position and responsible to create chances or score themselves even tough there are world class playmekers like iniesta busquets and rakitic. Messi and Neymar are soo good that they outperform those playmakers at their job. This is what i call Best Player.
Not the Tapin master.

Blue Barrett wrote:Trophies DO matter. Which is something @Socur Toxanarosa doesn't seem to understand as he want Messi to be given the award every year until he retires apparently.

This trophy nonsense has to stop, we are rewarding players, not teams, the CONTEXT must be analyzed, if the player was crucial for his team, winning championships, better, but last year Cristiano Ronaldo won the CL and Euro being bad/average in both competitions, why the *bleep* does he deserve the credits?

Why should he win over Messi when the latter won the league and the cup actually being the best performer, Copa America runner up CARRYING Argentina and is overall a much better player? But no, Eder goal clearly makes Cristiano Ronaldo the best player of the season

Bankz wrote:@toxanarosa my point exactly. If those guys did it without any controversy, why in the world has that changed to a goal scoring contest? When with or without goals, messi has been far and away the superior player for the past 8 years.

It's not even a goal scoring contest, it's a straight up popularity contest, CR could score half the goals and would win anyway just by being the biggest name for Real Madrid and Portugal.