Is Ronaldo de Lima (R9) considered a Barcelona legend by the Barcelona fans and world football?

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Post by El Kommander Fri Oct 14, 2016 2:05 am

I had a discussion with a friend about the best strikers ever and RDL's name inevitably came up. Now he is listed as a legend on the official Barcelona website despite leaving after one season. My Barcelona friend seemed attached to his great season back then, despite him having more success with Real Madrid. He never ever talks about Barcelona or never plays for them in legend matches while he plays for us yet he is listed as a legend on the official club website.

What is this forums take on it? Thank you in advance.
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Post by Thimmy Fri Oct 14, 2016 2:07 am

Well. He's a legend of the sport, in my opinion. And he happened to play for Barcelona, over the course of his career. I don't think it's odd that he's listed as a legend on their website, although the fans may not consider him as such.
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Post by Great Leader Sprucenuce Fri Oct 14, 2016 2:09 am

Probably because he played for Barcelona for one season. Although an amazing season you can't be a club legend based on one season.
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Post by titosantill Fri Oct 14, 2016 2:15 am

it depends on who you ask....fans of that club, who liked him when he joined there or those who grew up watching him there, may consider him such. its likely that older fans might not. and probably many fans won't. he associates himself more with madrid...i don't know, i don't think their fans really rave about him in such light

then again, i don't even know what we consider "legend" these days. that term is thrown around too loosely. the other day someone called arbeloa a madrid legend. and when they play these "legend" games, i see players who had nothing legendary about them feature. i'll put it this way, he had a legendary season, whether he was a legend, it depends on who you ask, and how long they've been supporting that club

there isn't a uniform answer. if their club lists him as such, then that's what it is...but as i said, that term is thrown around too loosely these days
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Post by Thimmy Fri Oct 14, 2016 3:10 am

Again, he's widely considered a legend of the sport, and I don't think it's terribly odd that he's featured as a legend on Barcelona's club website, although he may not be considered a club legend. I'm sure Messi would've been listed as a legend on, say, Man United's website, if he had decided to play for them for a full season. All it means is that a legendary player once played for them. This is where bias comes into play, and people form all kinds of unreasonable opinions as to why he shouldn't be there Razz I'm more surprised that they opted to include him there, instead of appeasing the fans who think he's a dirty traitor hmm
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Post by The Demon of Carthage Fri Oct 14, 2016 4:25 am

I think in order to reach legendary status for your club, talent alone doesn't cut it. You need another fundamental element to balance that equation, and that's time . You need to stay with the club for a lengthy period of time, become one of them and not just a guy playing for a paycheck, win trophies, go through crises, cry, bleed, fall, rise again, and share their hopes, dreams, joys and sorrows.

R9 had the talent, but he didn't have time. That's why in my humble opinion, he shouldn't be considered a legend of Barça.

He's a legend of the sport though; that is undeniable. One of the best footballers ever to grace a football field.
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Post by Harmonica Fri Oct 14, 2016 8:42 am

Legend? Yes.
Barca legend? No.

Same applies to Maradona.
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Post by Kebab Fri Oct 14, 2016 10:01 am

Even Suarez is not a barca legend yet. You need at least 5 years
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Post by jibers Fri Oct 14, 2016 10:32 am

I actually find it quite strange tbh. I checked the website and he seems to be s barcelona favourite. He always seemed a bit off with them and never talks about them with any fondness and Barça fans get very emotional about him. He ran off to inter for more money iirc

In fact on football manager I remember him being in a group of players disliked by Barça and he hated them as well Laughing


Cummander is this the page?

https://www.fcbarcelona.com/club/history/legends
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Post by El Kommander Sat Oct 15, 2016 12:30 pm

Thank you for the responses. Yes that is the website. You will notice how he is grouped with the likes of Xavi, Puyol etc

What makes it even stranger is that he has never set foot in the Nou Camp since he left, he never ever talks about the club and even seems to hate them! Barcelona fans try to claim him too often.
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Post by BarcaLearning Wed Oct 19, 2016 1:43 am

This is an interesting one, usually a player who moves from on rival to another would be much hated by the former clubs fans, obviously Ronaldo only moved to Real after Inter and the injury so glad to say I think both clubs fans are neutral in that respect.

Despite his years at Real, I dont think he really cemented his legendary status for them, nothing like compared with Raul, Zidane, etc., a mix of reasons for that. In comparison his lone season at Barca was amazing, although I was too young to witness it live back then, we all know how great he was in that season. Such a pity for Barca that they sold him to Inter after just one season.

But definitely hes regarded as a legend in world football and by most Barca fans I think.
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Post by Myesyats Wed Oct 19, 2016 9:31 am

Harmonica wrote:Legend? Yes.
Barca legend? No.

Same applies to Maradona.

This.
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Post by BarrileteCosmico Wed Oct 19, 2016 11:53 am

Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:Probably because he played for Barcelona for one season. Although an amazing season you can't be a club legend based on one season.
And for that season Luis Enrique was chosen as MVP, not R9, so he wasn't even the best player
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Post by sportsczy Wed Oct 19, 2016 12:06 pm

Yes he was.  There were reasons that a first year player wasn't going to be chosen MVP over a beloved local club veteran...  not to mention that R9 wanting to leave wasn't something that happened overnight.  They weren't going to choose someone who was about to leave.

If you went to Barcelona during that season... which I did for work...  the whole place was plastered with R9 marketing.  Heck, you had this massive R9 nike poster that overlooked the city form the port.

Not only was he the best player at Barcelona...  he was the best player in the world easily.  I HATED Barcelona... but i couldn't stop watching their games and then Inter.  He won the BDO in a landslide in 1997 too.  The guy was from another planet.

47 goals in 49 games for Barca in 1996-1997 when that amount of goals was unheard of... very different rules from today.  Not only that...  he played in 20 NT games in 1997 and scored 15 goals.

Completely dominant everywhere... regardless of teammates, competition, etc. He dominated Serie A too, which was BY FAR the toughest league in the world and very defensive. The fouls that wouldn't even draw a card back then are red cards today. He was brutalized and it didn't matter.

Such a crying shame he got injured. I have never seen a central striker like him pre-injury.
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Post by Valkyrja Wed Oct 19, 2016 12:53 pm

As great as he was, a Messi-level footbalelr at his peak, I don't consider him a Barca legend. Too much history. Infact, for Barca I rate Eto'o higher than him.

PS: his top 10 goals that season are out of this world. Keep in mind that he was 20 that season Laughing

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Post by Sushi Master Wed Oct 19, 2016 1:46 pm

Myesyats wrote:
Harmonica wrote:Legend? Yes.
Barca legend? No.

Same applies to Maradona.

This.

Yes, I agree with this too.

My father is a die-hard Napoli and Barca fan (due to Maradona, actually) and I've never heard him speak of Maradona as a Barca legend, but a Napoli legend.

You can't be a club legend after one season, amazing or not.
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Post by titosantill Wed Oct 19, 2016 2:55 pm

what i've noticed is, time changes these things. with the arrival of messi, who people consider at that club might consider a legend changes drastically, because they are seeing messi do what he does live. i don't know about how ronaldo is viewed by their fans generally. i have met fans of barcelona (older ones) who adored romario, and he too was there barely over a season

i personally don't use number of years to associate a player with that status. in the same vein, i don't believe a player is a clubs all time best player because he was there for 24 years. i don't think maldini's milan's best player, i've always separated best player from longest running servant. i don't think zanetti's inter's best player neither.

as far as ronaldo, the dominance of the messi era has overshadowed what he did by leaps and bounds so its understandable that he isn't considered a legend by them. (they don't hate him as much as they do figo, not even close). its a tough question.....as an aside, luis enrique couldn't even walk a mile in ronaldo's shoes that year, NOT even possible. hell, enrique couldn't hold a candle to r9 even at his worst footballing shape. they lost the league when r9 traveled to brazil against hercules, enrique played that game

imo legends should do legendary things, not just be the guy who stayed at one club. that term is very loose these days. i always thought becks was better than scholes n giggs, but because he didn't stay at utd throughout, fans and ferguson sort of changed the narrative
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Post by rincon Wed Oct 19, 2016 3:16 pm

Its not changing any narrative, its just what the words "club legends" mean to different people. Different views, being a legend doesn't have to mean being the best player. For me there is no doubt that the longevity of a player in the club is one of the main factors in them becoming a legend, a skilled mercenary can never be a club legend for me.

Baggio was a better player than Del Piero, he also played 5 seasons at Juve which is very significant. That said, for me he is no way a bigger legend for us than Del Piero (most Juve fans will agree) who played 19 seasons for us as a key player.

Same with Ibra vs Trezeguet for us. 10 years of Trez as a main striker for us is more than anything Ibra did.
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Post by titosantill Wed Oct 19, 2016 4:00 pm

i agree with that, different people have different views. just stated mine, and yes the narrative does change over time. del piero and baggio is understandable, they were both strikingly similar, the distance in talent wasn't wide. (some even say del piero was better, which is why he unseated baggio).

trez and ibra, ibra didn't have a legendary seasons at juve. he was alright, but he wasn't anywhere near the ibra he was at inter. trezeguet's season where he was top scorer, before the 02 world cup, was better than any season ibra had at juve. so you won't be wrong with that claim neither.

and juventus is a special case. a very special one. something fans of most top clubs haven't seen in recent time; being relegated. and to have your stars go down with you....in that situation i can understand the feat of staying (longest running servant). but as you said, fans and clubs have different things they look at....i have mine....i'm not saying ronaldo is one, i'm not a barca fan to make such a case, far from it...just saying with regards the topic, i think the one club man thing gets given too much credit at times
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Post by sportsczy Wed Oct 19, 2016 4:12 pm

Francescoli and Drogba are considered OM legends although they only stayed one year... but they achieved legendary things in that one year.  

OM won Ligue 1 and were CL semifinalists... and Francescoli was magnificent.  Dream stuff.  Starting 11 was great:  Huard, Amoros, Forster, Mozer, Di Meco, Sauzée, Deschamps, Tigana (Germain), Waddle, Papin, Francescoli.

Drogba took OM to the Europa final in 2003-2004 and scored 11 goals in Europe for the club that season.  He had 37 goals and 10 assists or something like that for OM.  He single-handedly carried the club in Europa,

To me, it's about the memories and emotions a player creates.  Some players don't do anything earth shattering in one specific season...  but build up a career that is legendary at a club.  Others have an incredible impact for a season or two...  short, but their stay will never leave the memories of the fans.  Of course, players that do both take the elite legendary status.

So for me, R9 has to be a Barca legend... not like Messi, Iniesta, Xavi, etc obviously... but still a legend.  Barcelona was 2nd in La Liga, won spanish supercup, won Europa and won CDR.  He was BY FAR the best player on the team.  

The shame of it was that Barca replaced R9 with Rivaldo.  Imagine if they had stayed together... good for Madrid but what a team that would have been.

Barca didn't win anything in 1995-1996 btw. 3rd in La Liga, CDR finalist and Europa semis... the year before R9 arrived.
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Post by Doc Wed Oct 19, 2016 4:20 pm

From the names alone, that Marseille team looked like it smelled of good football. No wonder you always "sound" depressed whenever you talk about Marseille these days.

Also, if some Madrid fans can consider Guti a legend, I wouldn't blame any Barca fan, young or old, to consider Ronaldo one. That was a legendary season.
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Post by sportsczy Wed Oct 19, 2016 4:56 pm

When Bernard Tapie was kicked out of Marseille, it was basically the end for us...  btw, that whole thing was a charade.  Tapie was a vocal and very influential backer of the right and the socialists fabricated this nonsense to get him out.  It's amazing that two players blowed the whistle on OM for paying them to lose... and ended up having governmental jobs once they retired...  and they couldn't find a single other thing.  Yet, the hammer falls.  And yeah...  Marseille, the CL contender and winner, needed to bribe players on a last place team to assure themselves a win in Ligue 1 while already having a big lead in the table.  Right.

But I digress.
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Post by rincon Wed Oct 19, 2016 4:57 pm

Here is a good question, who is Ronaldo a bigger legend for? Madrid or Inter.

He seems pretty in tune with Madrid and he played for them later in his career which tends to weigh in a lot. At Inter though, he found some of his greatest successes, a Ballon D'Ors, a world cup, a uefa cup, plus some pre-injury football there. 5 seasons for either club.
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Post by sportsczy Wed Oct 19, 2016 5:03 pm

He got a BdO at Madrid too. 123 goals in 5 seasons despite being obese for a lot of it Laughing

Thing is that nobody blames the players for the debacles once VDB left because Flo was the architect of that. Even a 10 year old could see that those teams just weren't going to win... played some very sexy football now and then though.

Ronaldo played sexy, when healthy, at Madrid and that attack with Zidane, Raul and Guti... with Roberto Carlos and Salgado as fullbacks... was incredibly fun to watch at times. Problem was injuries and NO DEFENSE + NO BALL RECOVERY lol.

Still, if it weren't for R9 going down with injury in 2003-2004 later in the season... I think that team wins everything. That was some of the sexiest club football play i have ever seen. We were on pace to win the treble until injuries hit.
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Post by BarcaLearning Wed Oct 19, 2016 5:13 pm

sportsczy wrote:Francescoli and Drogba are considered OM legends although they only stayed one year... but they achieved legendary things in that one year.  

OM won Ligue 1 and were CL semifinalists... and Francescoli was magnificent.  Dream stuff.  Starting 11 was great:  Huard, Amoros, Forster, Mozer, Di Meco, Sauzée, Deschamps, Tigana (Germain), Waddle, Papin, Francescoli.

Drogba took OM to the Europa final in 2003-2004 and scored 11 goals in Europe for the club that season.  He had 37 goals and 10 assists or something like that for OM.  He single-handedly carried the club in Europa,

To me, it's about the memories and emotions a player creates.  Some players don't do anything earth shattering in one specific season...  but build up a career that is legendary at a club.  Others have an incredible impact for a season or two...  short, but their stay will never leave the memories of the fans.  Of course, players that do both take the elite legendary status.

So for me, R9 has to be a Barca legend... not like Messi, Iniesta, Xavi, etc obviously... but still a legend.  Barcelona was 2nd in La Liga, won spanish supercup, won Europa and won CDR.  He was BY FAR the best player on the team.  

The shame of it was that Barca replaced R9 with Rivaldo.  Imagine if they had stayed together... good for Madrid but what a team that would have been.

Barca didn't win anything in 1995-1996 btw.  3rd in La Liga, CDR finalist and Europa semis... the year before R9 arrived.

I read somewhere that Barca lost the title on the last day of that season too, what bad luck, if they did win it it would have been a perfect season then Very Happy

Must have been amazing to watch him live or even just on TV too.... the way he just seems like an alien playing among little earthlings Very Happy I remember I pretty much only started out watching football in 1997 and only watched EPL supporting Liverpool, La Liga didnt get that much global coverage back then.
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