Can Someone Tell Me What's the point of Religion?

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Post by Peccadillo January 8th 2015, 23:20

VivaStPauli wrote:
DuringTheWar wrote:So the comparison with socialism is even more accurate? Certain people collecting others money and deciding what to spend it on Very Happy


With what is colloquially called Socialism, yes. The "communist" regimes from the 50s to the 90s. Their unreflective, ideological approach to all issues is very similar to being a religion. In that evidence is not considered, and a central idea is placed above all reason, and all evidence to the contrary.
Same thing happened in fascism, too. I know they're both often used of examples of atheism gone wrong, but frankly, I think to a proper skeptic, they're basically the same shit from a different asshole.


sorry but surely your definition of religion has broadened too far in the context of this discussion.

In this context, it is a prerequisite for "religion" to include a belief in a "supernatural" higher entity.. or a god.

I understand that you can "follow your football club religiously" - but lets be frank in saying we are not talking about that kind of 'religion' here. Or are we to include secular regimes and the casualties they inflicted, despite being antithetical to religion in the traditional use of the word, in the millions that have "died at the hand of religion".

Jonathan read thread title before posting.

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Post by VivaStPauli January 8th 2015, 23:57

I was just making the point that, from the point of a proper skeptic, the problem is blindly following ideology, and Religion being the most wide spread ideology.
Religion is it's own animal, and whether Socialism could be called a religion is a whole different discussion.

I digress again, my point should be: following ideologies unsupported by facts is questionable.
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Post by sportsczy January 9th 2015, 00:18

problem with religion is not the message of the prophets or the religion itself... it's the institutions that rise to power in the name of the religion.  They tend to manipulate the text to fit their agenda and to maintain their power.  

When i read religious text, i take into consideration historical context because it is intended to be relevant to the people of the time.  As humanity evolves, the context becomes different... so the meaning of the text should also evolve to take this into consideration.  But it never does.  The different clergy are obstinate in keeping things literal and unyielding.  I just don't buy into that.

So personally, i tend to appreciate and generally agree with the messages that all the prophets are trying to get across...  but i do not rely on someone else to interpret the text for me.  I figure it out for myself.

My mothers would probably have a heart attack if she read this.  But so what.  I've never liked being sheep.
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Post by Peccadillo January 9th 2015, 00:48

VivaStPauli wrote:I was just making the point that, from the point of a proper skeptic, the problem is blindly following ideology, and Religion being the most wide spread ideology.
Religion is it's own animal, and whether Socialism could be called a religion is a whole different discussion.

I digress again, my point should be: following ideologies unsupported by facts is questionable.


intellectually questionable, maybe.. but also harmless in most cases. to then say "what's the point" as per thread title, surely that can be based on empirical evidence for the individual in terms of any benefits they feel it brings to their life and well-being.

I get your point though, and sports of course agree again, blindly following anything on the whims or interpretations of others has clear risks. and yes all ancient religious scripture are subject to cultural and historical relativism.
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Post by DeletedUser#1 January 9th 2015, 03:56

To religious people on here. Can I ask a question ?

In your life...what benefit have you gained? How exactly those beliefs enhanced your life as a human being that you're so sensitive about it?

What good have Jesus,Muhammed,Moses,etc done for you that you'd defend them to such hilt more than your family members and loved ones?

All of us get into fights and arguments with our loved ones at one point, we dare to criticize them...but how come criticizing those so called sacred is so frowned upon despite the fact that they haven't provided 1/100000 of what our loved ones have for us ?

I'm really curious to know.

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Post by mr-r34 January 9th 2015, 04:19

What do you mean Sepi god created me, his done everything, i owe him everything. Laughing
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Post by VivaStPauli January 9th 2015, 16:36

He also created everything you hate, though. That douche.
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Post by DuringTheWar January 9th 2015, 22:08

There is no point in having a religion debate without being tactful. Comparing religion to aids and saying other disrespectful things is just 100% going to harden the other person's shell, and that is what happens in these debates where absolutely no progress gets made. In fact I don't quite understand what mockery adds to any civilized discourse in general.
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Post by DuringTheWar February 11th 2015, 22:24

Muslim family gunned down by antitheist. Police along with the perps wife claim it was not a hatred of religion but in fact rented condominiums that guided his actions

http://www.charlotteobserver.com/2015/02/11/5508217/victims-father-says-chapel-hill.html#.VNvF0Uc76rW
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Post by rwo power February 11th 2015, 22:33

DuringTheWar wrote:Muslim family gunned down by antitheist. Police along with the perps wife claim it was not a hatred of religion but in fact rented condominiums that guided his actions
Looks like this crosses over to the gun control problem in the US. If that bigot criminal wouldn't have had easy access to weapons and wouldn't have been able to run around carrying them openly ("he talked with them with his gun in his belt"), it very likely wouldn't have come to these outright horrible murders.
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Post by Cruijf February 12th 2015, 00:54

Since the subject of the Charlotte Hill shooting was brought up, I should add the following was very nice to see:

Cranford, NJ—The staff of American Atheists is saddened by the deaths of Yusor Mohammad, Razan Mohammad Abu-Salha, and Deah Barakat, who were killed on Tuesday, in Chapel Hill, North Carolina. We mourn with their families, their friends, and with everyone touched by this tragedy.
American Atheists condemns violence in any form, including violence against people of faith,” said American Atheists President David Silverman. “No person should be a victim of violence because of their religion. Anyone who would attack a person because of their religious beliefs, or lack thereof, attacks the very foundation of freedom. We must work to understand one another as people and recognize that our differences are an important part of our shared humanity.

http://news.atheists.org/2015/02/11/chapel-hill/

Someone seems to have taken notice that had the roles been reversed people would be crying out for something like this.
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Post by RED February 13th 2015, 02:31

As per usual, no f__ks given by the major news outlets due to the victims being Muslims and the terrorist being white. Doesn't fit their narrative that Muslims are the "evil" people.

It was the fact that the killings recieved major attention on Twitter and Facebook that forced the news outlets to cover it.

Had there been no social media, no one would have known about this despicable atrocity other than the community.

And they have the nerve to run with the story that it was over a "parking dispute". Absolute BS!

This was an act of terrorism and was a hate crime. Because everyone knows had this been a Muslim man that committed this crime, it would have been plastered over every front page in the western newspaper and labeled a terrorist act. The coverage would have gone into overdrive.

My heart and condolences go out to the families and friends of these 3 beautiful, kind and wonderful young adults who were killed because of their beliefs.

R.I.P Deah Shaddy Barakat, and his wife, Yusor Mohammad, and her sister, Razan Mohammad Abu-Salha Sad

The amount of prejudice, bias, racism and double standard I see from the so called major news networks absolutely disgust me. So painfully obvious.

Thank God for social media.
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Post by El Gunner February 13th 2015, 07:56

Thank God for social media.
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Post by McLewis February 13th 2015, 17:15

RED wrote:As per usual, no f__ks given by the major news outlets due to the victims being Muslims and the terrorist being white. Doesn't fit their narrative that Muslims are the "evil" people.

It was the fact that the killings recieved major attention on Twitter and Facebook that forced the news outlets to cover it.

Had there been no social media, no one would have known about this despicable atrocity other than the community.

And they have the nerve to run with the story that it was over a "parking dispute". Absolute BS!

This was an act of terrorism and was a hate crime. Because everyone knows had this been a Muslim man that committed this crime, it would have been plastered over every front page in the western newspaper and labeled a terrorist act. The coverage would have gone into overdrive.

My heart and condolences go out to the families and friends of these 3 beautiful, kind and wonderful young adults who were killed because of their beliefs.

R.I.P Deah Shaddy Barakat, and his wife, Yusor Mohammad, and her sister, Razan Mohammad Abu-Salha Sad

The amount of prejudice, bias, racism and double standard I see from the so called major news networks absolutely disgust me. So painfully obvious.

Thank God for social media.


Been all over the news here in the States. Extremely high profile.
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Post by Unique February 15th 2015, 17:08

when religious nut jobs kill people. they say you cant blame it on religion. when a man shoots 4-5 people everyone blames it on the guns. funny that.
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Post by izzy February 15th 2015, 17:27

MR BOND wrote:when religious nut jobs kill people. they say you cant blame it on religion. when a man shoots 4-5 people everyone blames it on the guns. funny that.


Suspect

Did you just compare "Guns" to "Religion"?
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Post by Unique February 15th 2015, 17:34

izzy wrote:
MR BOND wrote:when religious nut jobs kill people. they say you cant blame it on religion. when a man shoots 4-5 people everyone blames it on the guns. funny that.


Suspect

Did you just compare "Guns" to "Religion"?

no. guns are just pices of metal and are harmless and do not brain wash people. religion on the other hand...
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Post by Freeza February 15th 2015, 17:37

So you're saying NRA doesn't brainwash. Yeah okay.
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Post by Unique February 15th 2015, 17:43

Freeza wrote:So you're saying NRA doesn't brainwash. Yeah okay.

does the NRA try to convince people to burn people alive and call them witches. does the NRA try to convince people to fly planes into buildings no. I don't think so. but my point is no matter how many people get blown up or killed in the name of religion people will allways say religion has nothing to do with it. someone gets shot and its ban the guns.
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Post by rwo power February 15th 2015, 17:58

Well, obviously the religion of gun worship in certain areas of the US works very similar to certain other religions. Their church is called NRA and they worship at gun fairs. Doesn't look too different from other kinds of worship. :coffee:
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Post by Peccadillo February 16th 2015, 01:11

Only athiests can turn this attack into a religious problem.. atheist kills muslims due to his religious NRA worship. oh rwo you make me lol sometimes.
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Post by RedOranje February 16th 2015, 08:32

There's never any lack of irony or overabundance of self-awareness in this forum, is there?
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Post by sportsczy February 16th 2015, 09:02

The 2nd amendment of the US Constitution gives people the right to bear arms in the United States.  It's not unlimited and does not prohibit regulation...  but people who qualify have the right to bear weapons.  It has nothing to do with religion or anything else.

The NRA is the same thing as the tabacco lobby a couple of decades back... an organization defending the livelihood of a multi-billion dollar industry in the US:  31.8 billion per year.  Nothing to do with religion or anything else.

As much as people make a fuss about it (and i personally find no need to own weapons in most places)...  deaths that occur due to legally owned weapons (the 31.8 bil number is legal only) is miniscule.  There's roughly 30k deaths by firearms a year...  17k suicide, 12k homicide and 1k accidental.  Of the homicides, less than 5% are with legally owned firearms.  So when you actually look at the numbers, less than 600 homicides a year are caused by legally owned firearms.  That's nothing for a population of 320 million.

This is one of the main reasons that gun control hasn't really gone anywhere... the numbers don't support the outrage/politics.

Personally, i think this problem is a non-problem and i don't own a gun.
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Post by neuro11 February 16th 2015, 14:56

Natalie Portman wrote:To religious people on here. Can I ask a question ?

In your life...what benefit have you gained? How exactly those beliefs enhanced your life as a human being that you're so sensitive about it?

What good have Jesus,Muhammed,Moses,etc done for you that you'd defend them to such hilt more than your family members and loved ones?

All of us get into fights and arguments with our loved ones at one point, we dare to criticize them...but how come criticizing those so called sacred is so frowned upon despite the fact that they haven't provided 1/100000 of what our loved ones have for us ?

I'm really curious to know.


curious to know or to troll :coffee: you started it for the sake of trolling. most probably did not read half of the posts. coming back every now and then to add new kind of trolling... Laughing

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Post by Ganso February 16th 2015, 16:47

Phritz wrote:The point of religion is to comfort and relieve people of the fear and anxiety of death.

A lot of people have answered this, and idk , I don't think this is a good answer. I'm religious (or at least believe in God), and I have no fear of death at all. I mean, it is going to happen eventually...

I personally hate discussing religion, simply because there is NO logic behind it, it's just a thing 100% based on faith really. Although, I do hate when people keep bashing on religion. There are idiots and bad people in every type of community, the religious community is no different. Now, because 10% (I have no idea what the actual number is, but I'm sure it is very small) of the religious population are extremists, and cause war and deaths, religion became a bad thing. I totally respect atheists and I understand their side of the coin, but I think the thought that religion is a bad thing should just go away because it is a generalization of the entire religious community.

Also, in some way answering that Sepi question and to the posters talking about how everyone would know what the morally good choices would be without religion, I can't speak for the entire humanity, but I for one throughout my life, specially during my childhood, made the morally good decision because of religion. I'm sure I would have lied and screwed a lot of people over during my life if I wasn't religious. Again, this is just my personal experience.
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Post by sportsczy February 17th 2015, 16:40

It's true... religion, if observed properly, gives people a moral/ethical compass and a support system. Not everyone is blessed with parents or guardians who brought them up the right way. Being religious and feeling that you will answer for wrongdoings to a higher power stops these from making mistakes and going down the wrong path...

So if religion is a positive influence 90% of the time and a negative one 10% of the time... i'm all for it. My philosophy is simple: You should use whatever helps you improve yourself, make the right decisions, live an honorable life, etc.
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