Re: USA Gun Violence & Police Brutality Thread

[BarcaLearning]

It basically became too much of a norm almost too long ago already, I wonder whats the total count of these types of shootings over the yrs, n yet nothing will be done about it...

[Hapless_Hans]

America doesn't value their people's lives. Only the $.

It's not going to get better, it is only going to get worse.

[Myesyats]

also this wtf

A vehicle involved in a car crash in Los Angeles gets looted on the street. When the driver attempts to drive away, he hits another car and is then dragged into the street by the looters. pic.twitter.com/b9kCVTNEvg

— Andy Ngô  (@MrAndyNgo) May 25, 2022

[McLewis]

I'm 100% done with Republicans, Conservatives and the right-wing in general. I want no civil discourse with them. I want no compromise with them. I want no understanding with them. There can be none of that with them when they knowingly obstruct any attempt to stop these massacres from happening. They fight with everything in them to protect children before they're born only to allow them to be torn apart by weapons of war. Not only is that nonsensical. It is pure malevolence. . They can dress this up anyway they want, but their actions speak so much louder. Just look at the tweets from all of the Republicans. These are the same ones who take thousands and millions from the NRA, who have actively suppressed any attempt at tougher gun measures in this country. That type of malfeasance is unworthy of civil discourse.

They have made it clear that they are willing to sacrifice the lives of anyone (including children) in order to keep weapons of war that they don't need. This is not about need. It's about want. They want these guns because the 2A says they can have them. That's it. The "government tyranny" bullshit is a cover. It's gaslighting. It's manipulation. It's a smokescreen so that they can stockpile weapons for the fuck of it. All because they can.

They believe that arming teachers would prevent these shootings from happening. There were people at the school armed with guns. They couldn't stop this guy. The police couldn't stop this guy. It took 1 hour for better armed units to stop him. 1 hour the shooter had to commit obcene amounts of carnage on kids. I've been sitting with that all morning. It's a damning indictment on law enforcement considering how much money is pumped into police departments every year. Uvalde is a very small town so their police force are likely unequipped for something like this, but that should make the need to prevent 18 year olds (who are legally too young to drink) from purchasing guns and body armor all the more. And yet these fucking ghouls in the GOP double-down and make it easier. No background checks on private sales, no psych exams, no permits, no training. It would be surreal if it wasn't so goddamn stupid.

[Harmonica]

I think the best solution is to arm everybody, including the children.

[Warrior]

Arming teachers, what a joke. My mom is a teacher, the thought of her holding a weapon is so absurd my mind can barely process. How disconnected from reality guntards can be.

And yeah for the sake of "liberty" they are willing to have +10000% school shootings in the country. Gun restriction is not a miracle solution but it helps a lot. I don't know how those NRA guntards can look at themselves in the mirror.

[BarrileteCosmico]

I guarantee if you put a gun in every classroom school shootings will go up 100x. It's not a solution, it's a distraction.

@mclewis it's this talk of never compromising that will ensure this keeps happening. An attempt of meeting some of the more reasonable ones half-ways through is the best we can hope for at this stage. Whatever deal they can come up with before the elections will be better than after dems lose. And should a miracle happen and the dems win then they can pass a bill with what they really want.

Same thing goes for all the other deals they tried, and failed, to pass because they let good be the enemy of perfect.

[RealGunner]

At this point, not even elementary school shooting shocks anyone anymore. Sandy Hook was not an one off but basically an invitation to anyone out there that you can shoot up schools if you really want to and there is nothing that is going to change. Will this incident change anything? You know the answer to that yourself and if you read the reaction from conservatives in America, not a single one of them have spoken out against the reason this happens nor how gun law is broken. And they are roughly 50% of the American population if not more.

I mean USA is the only country in the world where this happens. The last school shooting in the UK was nearly 30 years ago and when that happened, gun laws were passed literally days after and there hasn't been a single incident since then. But America is an entirely different story. It's an epitome of a failed first world country. Where people treat these amendments written 100 of years ago as gospel and are not willing to change and never will.

If America is serious about preventing these shootings then there has to be a cultural reset which is unlikely and improbable. So just wait out till the next one.

[El Gunner]

the societal structure and moral standards of America are well and truly cooked, i think we can agree on that. It's basically just a corporate conglomeration masquerading as a democratic country.

[Myesyats]

A cultural/mindset change will take generations and isn’t even guaranteed to succeed tbh. Especially with such resistance from conservative media etc.

Passing a few bills on gun control or assault rifle ban seems way easier and within reach.

[The Demon of Carthage]

Passing a few bills on gun control or assault rifle ban seems way easier and within reach.

Not sure if it's easier, mate.

There have been many bills submitted to close certain loopholes like the Charleston loophole, but the problem is that they can't pass the Senate.

[El Gunner]

A cultural/mindset change will take generations and isn’t even guaranteed to succeed tbh. Especially with such resistance from conservative media etc.

Passing a few bills on gun control or assault rifle ban seems way easier and within reach.

the cultural change will come after practical change, usually that's how it happens

but yea like Demon said, Senate is the problem... Steve Kerr, coach of the Golden State Warriors, basically also brought up that point as being the main issue at the moment concerning the topic of gun laws in his emotional speech/rant yesterday in his pre-game interview

[McLewis]

@mclewis it's this talk of never compromising that will ensure this keeps happening. An attempt of meeting some of the more reasonable ones half-ways through is the best we can hope for at this stage. Whatever deal they can come up with before the elections will be better than after dems lose. And should a miracle happen and the dems win then they can pass a bill with what they really want.

It's all so tiring. I keep hearing that we need to compromise with a side that aren't interested in it. Where are these moderate Republicans knocking down Chris Murphy's door to get something done? Where's Romney, Murkowski, and Collins? He begged all of them, on the Senate floor, to help end this crisis. Crickets. I don't really understand why anyone would continue to extend a hand to a side that continually scoffs at it and then does everything in their power to make us regret ever extending it in the first place.

I mean, did you see what Schumer said today?

SCHUMER signals NO gun bill imminent

Americans can make a choice, Schumer says. “Americans can cast their vote in November” based on how people stand on guns.

SCHUMER says Republicans can work with Democrats now to craft a bill. He’s skeptical. “Unlikely, burnt in the past”

— Jake Sherman (@JakeSherman) May 25, 2022

That's not compromise. That's a capitulation masquerading as a hail mary.

It's sickening.

[BarrileteCosmico]

Yeah they're not interested. Wasn't expecting anything else. Just saying that you can't shut that door from the get go and you have to be willing to try to engage.

[FennecFox7]

When it comes to partisan issues, republicans are extremely non-compromising. I don’t know why they pretend to be the opposite.

[McLewis]

Yeah they're not interested. Wasn't expecting anything else. Just saying that you can't shut that door from the get go and you have to be willing to try to engage.

If they're not interested, why engage with them?

[McLewis]

Joe Garcia, the husband of Irma Garcia, one of two teachers shot and killed in Uvalde, TX on Tuesday, has reportedly suffered a fatal heart attack. Joe and Irma were high school sweethearts and married 24 years. They leave behind four children. pic.twitter.com/Rlk0M2B8nR

— Ernie Zuniga (@Ernie_Zuniga) May 26, 2022

His heart literally broke. Takototsubo cardiomyopathy (Broken Heart Syndrome) is a real thing.

This is despairingly tragic.

[BarrileteCosmico]

Man that's so sad...

@mclewis I think the thing to realize is that the senate only has 48 dems (if we don't count the 2 DINOs, which i don't), so the choice is make the attempt with a 10% success rate or grandstand with a 0% success rate. That's just the cold math of trying to govern with a minority in congress. It would likely he futile, but it's the only choice available.

You would think that given that 9/10 Americans believe in background checks that's at least something that could get enough support. You would think.

[Myesyats]

No windows and only one entrance/exit with armed guards is the conservative solution to this problem Make sure everyone tramples over each other with one way to escape, nice!

And the worst thing about it is these people won't go to hell because we're already in hell, this is hell

[BarcaLearning]

The whole setup of the US whats the word elections n the Senate/House, etc. is outdated n no fair n should be change/updated? Seems to be the case for so long but obviously the ppl controling things at the top arent gonna ever do that cos they wanna keep their power?

[McLewis]

Man that's so sad...

@mclewis I think the thing to realize is that the senate only has 48 dems (if we don't count the 2 DINOs, which i don't), so the choice is make the attempt with a 10% success rate or grandstand with a 0% success rate. That's just the cold math of trying to govern with a minority in congress. It would likely he futile, but it's the only choice available.

You would think that given that 9/10 Americans believe in background checks that's at least something that could get enough support. You would think.

I understand what you're saying. Somewhere deep down, I probably even agree. 10% is better than 0%. That's what logic tells me, as a critical thinker. Emotionally, as a parent, I find that unacceptable though. I find it unfathomable that we think this way when children are dying.

The reality that I keep coming back to is the time to act was after Sandy Hook. Nothing happening after that massacre doomed those kids in Uvalde ultimately. Some of them weren't even born when Sandy Hook occurred. Their lives were on borrowed time from birth due to the failure to act.

You want to know what pisses me off the most about Republicans and Conservatives though? The defeatism. The lack of critical thinking. They either have no solutions at all because they don't believe this problem can be solved or the solutions they do have are so ridiculously delusional and lazily constructed that it makes the fervent belief they have in them almost sympathetic. Almost.

[Warrior]

Could the easiest solution be the creation a third party

The current setup of american democracy seems a blatant attempt to maintain status quo on ancient laws. If Trump made it... anybody with a bit of rep and money can do it

[CBarca]

Republicans are an extreme radical right wing, antidemocratic, near authoritarian party with a thinly veiled hatred for the republic, and the more we sugarcoat that, the more we enable them.

With that being said, this shooting won't change shit, and I'm just going to repeat the same things as always. It's the institutions. Incremental progress on "gun legislation" and "the gun lobby" is, like, nice...but until we abolish the Senate and go to something unicameral or parliamentary with proportional representation, we will continue to be held hostage by a political party (terrorist group?) who has rigged the antimajoritarian aspects of our democracy for their own gain.

Obviously I hate Dems too, but they're so far away from being the problem in American politics that it's absolutely fucking laughable when anyone makes a comparison*

*To be sure, Dems are part of the problem. What I mean to say is they aren't part of The Problem. And The Problem is the blatant disregard for democracy in any way shape or form

[CBarca]

Anyway, on a personal level...although the chances of this happening to me are *obviously* very very slim to the point where it makes no real factor in my decision making...it's another reason why I'm finishing out my last week teaching either this week or next year at this time. Fuck this

[CBarca]

Could the easiest solution be the creation a third party

The current setup of american democracy seems a blatant attempt to maintain status quo on ancient laws. If Trump made it... anybody with a bit of rep and money can do it

A third party is not possible in American politics. Even if this wasn't a studied phenomenon in politics, it's pretty obvious on the face -- why would Dems or Republican voters hurt their own party by voting for anyone else? Especially when the electoral consequences are so dire?

Dems have lost abortion rights and the supreme Court is coming for much more all due to a few thousand votes in a couple states. Republicans lost the opportunity to install a dictator over a few thousand votes in a couple states

[Warrior]

Sorry to insist... but you didn't give any details on why it's impossible

Reading your post above you seem like someone who would vote for a third party, because the other 2 are shit. If there are so many swing states it means a lot of people are not definite republicans or definite democrats, they just vote for the least worst candidate.

In Canada when we don't have a majority government, the third party is very important as it holds the balance of power. How many people have voted republican in 2016-2020 by default because they hate Clinton/Biden but they support abortion rights ? And vice versa for those who hate Trump ? I bet a lot of them don't abide strictly by the philosophy of the party they voted for.

Republican 40%
Democrat 40%
Third party 20%... assuming this third party is on the side of reason it could be a big problem for the republicans

Idk exactly how it works down south but i read you guys about how nothing can change, so i assume the binary system is the main culprit. Makes no sense to divide 300 millions americans in 2 political clans.

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