Juventus Post Pogba... So what's next??

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Post by S Wed Jul 20, 2016 1:51 pm

rincon wrote:As an example, If Pogba's money turns into Pjanic(32mill), Benatia(21mill) and Icardi(60mill) then It would probably end up being a great move.


I think the Higuain deal is happening....

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Post by S Wed Jul 20, 2016 1:54 pm

rincon wrote:Im almost sure that Pjanic will be our LCM this season.

Pjanic-Marchisio-Khedira

Asamoah-Lemina-Sturaro

+Mandragora

That's not so short. Still, we probably should bring another mid. James would be awesome, then we could switch to 4-3-1-2. Verratti needs to come home Smile

What about Bernardeschi? That would be sweet, the kid can basically play all positions except DM. IMO that could be the perfect rotation player for the mid, could rotate with Pjanic and Khedira plus the forward positions. His role in Fiore was mostly RM, but also player RW and LW. I'd take 25-30 mill to Fiore and bring him. I think Della Valle would negotiate with us for a price like that.


We just bought Pjaca. Why on earth do we need another winger ?

And no Fiorentina wouldnt negotiate with us. Certainly not for that price which is pittance these days. We just bought a talent from the Croatian league for 25M. If Berardi remains another year at Sassuolo , then we're betting on him to be a Juve player for next year.
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Post by juvealbanian Wed Jul 20, 2016 1:59 pm

I want this saga to end ASAP and since Pogba didn't put an end to a whole month of rumours means he is not ready to stay longer with Juve like our legends Del Piero and Buffon.
I'm OK with that as long as we get a massive cash in our hands.

Pogba is quality overall.To replace him with a similar quality and age player we need nothing less than one between Atletico Madrid midfielders : Koké and Saul Niguez.
Preferably Koke.We can throw around 60 mln € for him and we wont even feel Pogba has left.

Then we would be left with 40-50 mln from Pogba cash which we can use to get a striker.
If we offload Pereyra and Zaza we could take that sum to around 80 mln €.
Higuain clause let us pay 47 mln € this year and 47 mln next year,so we can afford both Koke and Higuain this year.

If we find a total of 94 mln € for Higuain too much we can get 2 younger and promising strikers.

I'd go with 55-60 mln € for Icardi and 20-22 for Gabigol.

Pjaca is also coming so we would definetly have a much stronger team overall.


...................Higuain - Dybala

.............Koke....Marchisio....Pjanic

Sandro...Chielini...Bonucci...Barzagli...Alves

............................Buffon




......................Icardi- Dybala

.............Koke....Marchisio....Pjanic

Sandro...Chielini...Bonucci...Barzagli...Alves

............................Buffon



OUT : Pogba,Pereyra,Zaza

IN : Koke,Higuain + CM backup or Koke,Icardi,Gabigol + CM backup
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Post by S Wed Jul 20, 2016 2:03 pm

Koke, James, Verratti.. None of this is happening.
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Post by rincon Wed Jul 20, 2016 2:09 pm

S wrote:
rincon wrote:Im almost sure that Pjanic will be our LCM this season.

Pjanic-Marchisio-Khedira

Asamoah-Lemina-Sturaro

+Mandragora

That's not so short. Still, we probably should bring another mid. James would be awesome, then we could switch to 4-3-1-2. Verratti needs to come home Smile

What about Bernardeschi? That would be sweet, the kid can basically play all positions except DM. IMO that could be the perfect rotation player for the mid, could rotate with Pjanic and Khedira plus the forward positions. His role in Fiore was mostly RM, but also player RW and LW. I'd take 25-30 mill to Fiore and bring him. I think Della Valle would negotiate with us for a price like that.


We just bought Pjaca. Why on earth do we need another winger ?

And no Fiorentina wouldnt negotiate with us. Certainly not for that price which is pittance these days. We just bought a talent from the Croatian league for 25M. If Berardi remains another year at Sassuolo , then we're betting on him to be a Juve player for next year.


Pjaca is a left winger, Bernardeschi is a right mid. He played the odd game on the wings because he can play where needed, but he was not part of the Fiore's front 3 this season, he played in the mid. He can definitely rotate with Pjanic and Khedira with a quality our bench CMs dont have. Fiorentina is already negotiating with Inter and Zenit (supposedly) and we both know that Inter wouldn't bid more than ~25mill so that is his price.

Berardi should absolutely come next year, Im just not sure if thats gonna happen. It seems to be the plan, If Berardi does come then yeah, Bernardeschi shouldn't.


S wrote:

I think the Higuain deal is happening....


I really don't think we are gonna pay his release clause, its 94mill...


Last edited by rincon on Wed Jul 20, 2016 2:11 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post by Andrew Wed Jul 20, 2016 2:10 pm

I'd love to have Matuidi to be honest.

I don't know if PSG would negotiate with us though.

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Post by rincon Wed Jul 20, 2016 2:14 pm

S wrote:Koke, James, Verratti.. None of this is happening.


Koke and James are cheaper and more available than Higuain
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Post by S Wed Jul 20, 2016 2:20 pm

rincon wrote:Pjaca is a left winger, Bernardeschi is a right mid. He played the odd game on the wings because he can play where needed, but he was not part of the Fiore's front 3 this season, he played in the mid. He can definitely rotate with Pjanic and Khedira with a quality our bench CMs dont have. Fiorentina is already negotiating with Inter and Zenit (supposedly) and we both know that Inter wouldn't bid more than ~25mill so that is his price.

If Inter are negotiating a 25M price for him, doesnt mean Juventus can get him at that price. You should know this.

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Post by S Wed Jul 20, 2016 2:26 pm

rincon wrote:
S wrote:Koke, James, Verratti.. None of this is happening.


Koke and James are cheaper and more available than Higuain


Realistically, yes but i dont know, i'm just going by the rumors. Entire Italian media were reporting we were 'ready' to pay the clause as its payable in 2 installments. I dont think its realistic either but there could be some hint of truth in this particular rumor and i do hope we dont end up paying 94M. Higuain rumors havent died down by any means. We're just waiting to see if Higuain forces a move out of Napoli.

As for Koke and James, i am always skeptical about getting high profile players from abroad leagues. Koke is Atletico's youth product while James looks like a guy who'd want to play in the PL. I just dont see them as realistic moves.

Buy the best within the league is probably our plan and we have the leverage for it too.
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Post by rincon Wed Jul 20, 2016 2:30 pm

You talk about signing Higuain for 94mill but think that Fiore wouldn't take 30mill for Bernardeschi.

30mill is big money for Fiore, they let go of Cuadrado and Jovetic for that money. Inter won't pay 30mill, we easily can.
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Post by rincon Wed Jul 20, 2016 2:32 pm

Yeah we have no link for Koke or James but no doubt we could get them. James is so far out of Madrid's plan, no doubt they would take money for him if someone pays big.

Serie A is also huge in Colombia (and south america in general). SA players don't particularly love the EPL.
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Post by S Wed Jul 20, 2016 2:38 pm

rincon wrote:You talk about signing Higuain for 94mill but think that Fiore wouldn't take 30mill for Bernardeschi.

30mill is big money for Fiore, they let go of Cuadrado and Jovetic for that money. Inter won't pay 30mill, we easily can.


Fiorentina will try and milk as much as they can because its Juventus so i'm certain its not happening for 30M. They sold Cuadrado to Chelsea for 35M in 2015 Jan and Jovetic for 30M in 2013.

30M in 2016 is peanuts dude.

And Bernardeschi is not the type i would want to go for, now that Pogba's gone. A more established midfielder would be desirable.

Regarding Higuain, even if that price sounds just pure fantasy, i dont know, i just have a hunch this will happen. This eerily reminds me of the Pjanic scenario.


Last edited by S on Wed Jul 20, 2016 2:39 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post by lucianomoggi Wed Jul 20, 2016 2:38 pm

A player who is worth 100 million sure will be missed

But the idea is that you reinvest the money on more important positions

For example why do i care about having a 80 million worth side back , when i can invest that money on a 80 million worth striker

So is a 100 million side back will be missed? Sure but when you have a 100 million striker who do the most important role you dont regret it logically

Bonuci is 60 million worth and he sure adds important qualities but if i had to choose between nedved or bonuci i would choose nedved

So the idea is that first you have to improve the attack, you can defend good enough with guys like benatia, chiellini, evra, rugani,
But you cannot attack good enough without nedved so it is a logical to choose guys like nedved and higuain ahead of bonuci and pogba who are more defensive minded

The best would be to have them all that is why top clubs want all of best players

But if you have to choose between you better improve the attack

I believe bonuci and pogba both add important qualities and i am happy to have them but i dont believe we will regret it if we reinvest the money to improve the attack on guyw like higuain, pjaca, pjanic

When you have good strikers opponents fear to attack you because you damage on counter attacks ,

No matter how good your defenders are, if roberto carlos, maldini still opponents dont fear to attack you if you have forwards like mandzukic, zaza, matri, quaglarela, lorente

Because guys like sergio ramos can handle them , but they cannot handle guys like messi, higuain , so they are forced to play more defensive minded or they lose the game

There is no such ging as we dont need pogba or bonuci because everyone needs good players but the most important is to have an attack that fears the opponent ,

On ucl final against barcelona they did not have better line back, and our midfield was better and more versatile

But it was their strikers messi, suarez, neymar, extreme dangerous that you could never stop pay attention to those and so it damages your tactics


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Post by S Wed Jul 20, 2016 2:43 pm

rincon wrote:Yeah we have no link for Koke or James but no doubt we could get them. James is so far out of Madrid's plan, no doubt they would take money for him if someone pays big.

Serie A is also huge in Colombia (and south america in general). SA players don't particularly love the EPL.


We could but i'm just skeptical.

I'm somewhat more certain of getting talent within the league.

SA players play where the money is right.
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Post by rincon Wed Jul 20, 2016 2:59 pm

The EPL is not reflective of Serie A in financial matters. 30mill is huge for every club in Serie A except Juve. Fiore have never spent more than 30mill net in any transfer season ever. They are not Napoli or Roma and much less Inter or Milan. Fiore has a much smaller backing, financially and in fans. Thats why the Berbatov saga was so important for them, in the end, who in Juve really remembers or cares about Berbatov? but in Fiore it was a big moment.

Anyway that doesn't matter.

About SA. You are underestimating the following of Serie A and La Liga there when compared to the EPL. Nobody actually watches the EPL there, its entirely about Italy and Spain. Of course, money talks, but a player's will factors heavily. Im completely sure James would agree to come to Juve. Just remember Higuain's move.
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Post by S Wed Jul 20, 2016 3:40 pm

When a player from the Croatian league costs 25M, then its a reflection on the inflation of the entire transfer market, not just the EPL. When supply increases , demand becomes larger. 30M is nothing these days.  And Fiorentina are the kind of a team that would sell their players anybody on the planet than to Juventus. So taking inflation into account and taking into consideration that Juventus are the team that wants negotiate thats an extra 20M on top of his original price if Fioentina are even willing to negotiate with us that is.

Della Valle's forge a really bad relationship with Elkann. There is bad blood between both so i feel they wont negotiate with us in any circumstances or we'd have to massively overpay.

As far as Napoli's players go, we were negotiating with them for Hamsik last year and we eventually opted out in the end. Unlike Fiorentina's owners, we dont have a bad relationship with ADL. I still maintain Higuain is unrealistic but i just have a hunch it might happen, that is all. 94M for him definitely fantasy.

Also, i am not underestimating there's a huge SA audience for Serie A and i'm sure if Italian teams were loaded, most South Americans would prefer to play in Italy but i was talking about James in particular so i'm not really sure we'd cave in to Madrid's demands which would be no less than 80M. Bringing in someone like him would also mean a permanent shift to 4-3-1-2 so i dont know if Allegri would necessarily fancy that considering he's relied on 3-5-2 for so long.
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Post by lucianomoggi Wed Jul 20, 2016 3:49 pm

Juventus is no club without ideas what to do

POGBA is a versatile player that can never be substituted but we can bring players like VIDAL if possible,

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Post by rincon Wed Jul 20, 2016 3:57 pm

"30mill is nothing these days"
Thats why Italians think Juve fans are arrogant.
Look around Serie A and count the players that clubs have spent 30mill on excluding Juventus.

Higuain, Bacca, Kondogbia and... anyone else I'm forgetting? thats 3 30mill players in 19 clubs.

Napoli, Milan, Inter thats all for 30mill

clubs can't afford to spend 30mill on random players, clubs can't even afford to pay 30mill for ANY player outside of Napoli, Roma, Milan and Inter. And even the milanese clubs have to sell players for funds.
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Post by lucianomoggi Wed Jul 20, 2016 4:01 pm

Juventus is not exactly spending money but reinvesting the money

they got money from MORATA and reinvested on PJANIC

they got money from guys like VIDAL, COMAN and more

they did not really invest 30 million,

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Post by S Wed Jul 20, 2016 4:04 pm

30M is nothing these days because clubs can now afford to ask for more because of the rising inflation in the transfer market.

How did that go from 'Serie A teams cant afford to buy 30M players' i dont know when i was making a different point altogether.

Why havent Valencia sold Gomes yet for example ? Because they are holding out for the highest fee possible otherwise his move to Juventus would be long done by now.

Its not arrogance, its reality. I dont have to cite the Croatian league as an example again and again but somehow you've twisted the point i was trying to make and turned it into a different discussion.
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Post by rincon Wed Jul 20, 2016 4:14 pm

30mill gets you any of fiorentina's except maybe Kalinic. That was the point. They cannot refuse 30mill without higher bidding, which they don't have for Bernardeschi. a huge profit for them.

Valencia haven't sold Gomez because he gathers a lot of interest from foreign clubs + Madrid, something no fiore player does, including Bernardeschi.
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Post by rincon Wed Jul 20, 2016 4:15 pm

30mill goes a long long way to get you most of Seria A players, but somehow "its nothing"...
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Post by S Wed Jul 20, 2016 4:20 pm

rincon wrote:30mill gets you any of fiorentina's except maybe Kalinic. That was the point. They cannot refuse 30mill without higher bidding, which they don't have for Bernardeschi. a huge profit for them.

Valencia haven't sold Gomez because he gathers a lot of interest from foreign clubs + Madrid, something no fiore player does, including Bernardeschi.


No, not if you are Juventus, thats my point. They can demand more because its Juventus thats the team in question, their most hated rival.

Besides i dont know why i am having this argument over an irrelevant player like Bernardeschi who's not what we need right now anyway.
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Post by Vlad the Impaler Wed Jul 20, 2016 4:23 pm

We don't know that Pogba will leave Juventus. He will probably not leave Juve; it's all speculation over the web; no clear evidence of this transfer, right? Shouldn't you make plans only if it's something concrete? hmm

Last summer there were many rumours regarding De Gea's move to Real Madrid since July. Pursuant to what the web and media said, he was Real Madrid's player since August. Finally, we found out that Real Madrid didn't even make an offer for him until the last days of the summer transfer window.
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Post by S Wed Jul 20, 2016 4:28 pm

Vlad the Impaler wrote:We don't know that Pogba will leave Juventus. He will probably not leave Juve; it's all speculation over the web; no clear evidence of this transfer, right? Shouldn't you make plans only if it's something concrete? hmm

Last summer there were many rumours regarding De Gea's move to Real Madrid since July. Pursuant to what the web and media said, he was Real Madrid's player since August. Finally, we found out that Real Madrid didn't even make an offer for him until the last days of the summer transfer window.


He has asked to leave. His transfer to United will be completed shortly.
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Post by lucianomoggi Wed Jul 20, 2016 4:31 pm

Vlad the Impaler wrote:We don't know that Pogba will leave Juventus. He will probably not leave Juve; it's all speculation over the web; no clear evidence of this transfer, right? Shouldn't you make plans only if it's something concrete? hmm

Last summer there were many rumours regarding De Gea's move to Real Madrid since July. Pursuant to what the web and media said, he was Real Madrid's player since August. Finally, we found out that Real Madrid didn't even make an offer for him until the last days of the summer transfer window.


this one will not fail trust me

JUVENTUS want HIGUAIN
MAN UNITED want POGBA

the price is not expensive it is reasonable, the negotiations has their own ways but it will be around 100 million


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