are juventus the most unlucky team in CL?

are juventus the most unlucky team in CL?

from contender who can challenge real madrid as "the club with the highest CL trophies" to "the club that managed only 2 CL trophies" equivalent porto, nottingham forest & benfica

why is like that? because of lack of top notch stars? or super confidence? or Divine intervention?

the list of club that suffered a similar fate (include juventus):

1) juventus; runners-up:
1973, 1983, 1997, 1998, 2003, 2015
6 times

2)(a) bayern munich; runners-up:
1982, 1987, 1999, 2010, 2012
5 times

2)(b) benfica; runners-up:
1963, 1965, 1968, 1988, 1990
5 times

3) ac milan; runners-up:
1958, 1993, 1995, 2005
4 times

4)(a) real madrid; runners-up:
1962, 1964, 1981
3 times

4)(b) barcelona; runners-up:
1961, 1986, 1994
3 times

I'm not going to speculate on why teams have won/lost games over the best part of the last 70 years. Nor can I judge Juve's luck (or lack of it) based on the number of times they have finished runners-up in the Champions League / European Cup.

What I can say is that Juve have lost more finals than they have won and that their win/loss ratio in finals is not good. Basically, for every 4 finals Juve play, they will only win 1.

If you look at the teams on the list in the OP:

Juve - 2W, 6L
Bayern - 5W, 5L
Benfica - 2W, 5L
Milan - 7W, 4L
R. Madrid - 10W, 3L
Barca - 5W, 3L

Forza wrote:I'm not going to speculate on why teams have won/lost games over the best part of the last 70 years. Nor can I judge Juve's luck (or lack of it) based on the number of times they have finished runners-up in the Champions League / European Cup.

What I can say is that Juve have lost more finals than they have won and that their win/loss ratio in finals is not good. Basically, for every 4 finals Juve play, they will only win 1.

If you look at the teams on the list in the OP:

Juve - 2W, 6L
Bayern - 5W, 5L
Benfica - 2W, 5L
Milan - 7W, 4L
R. Madrid - 10W, 3L
Barca - 5W, 3L

based on ratio, yes, the worst from the list

Obviously this means little, considering that there are some teams (Arsenal, Sampdoria, Roma, Fiorentina, Leverkusen, etc.) who have been "unlucky" enough to be in only 1 CL final and lose the game. But then there are the "ultra-unlucky" Atletico, Reims, and Valencia - each participated in 2 finals with 0 wins. No team has lost 3 CL finals without winning at least 1 CL final.

based on history, juventus despite with all stars team unlucky not to win it in 1997 & 1998

they can be considered favourite at that time vs dortmund in 1997 & real madrid in 1998

2003 also can be considered unlucky when they lose their best player (nedved) through suspension

Unlucky not the right term

Robespierre wrote:Unlucky not the right term

Yes, I think he meant 'ungood'.

Art Morte wrote:

Robespierre wrote:Unlucky not the right term

Yes, I think he meant 'ungood'.

maybe in 2015 final juventus was not good enough, but not in other 5 finals, perhaps

surely its just a matter of coincidence. I dont think you can suggest that juventus lack some kind of winning mentality which leases them short in the final, when they are all very different squads.

Just depends on who they are up again, some teams have an easier run than others to get into the final in the first place. Sometimes there is a vacuum of quality in players in top teams (relative of course)

This Barca team is just ridiculous, to beat real madrid in the semis and then barca in the final is a massive ask.

If Bayern managed to beat Barca, theyd have had a higher chance of winning. Juve held their own in this final, Barca just brought their A game and when they do, no one can beat them.

guest_07 wrote:

Art Morte wrote:

Robespierre wrote:Unlucky not the right term

Yes, I think he meant 'ungood'.

maybe in 2015 final juventus was not good enough, but not in other 5 finals, perhaps

Too much guess work i guess ?


Every match is unique and has its own conditions at those moment. We cant compare two different Finals on the basis of win-lose.

Lets take this Final for example ? Does this comes under unlucky or ungood ? We have to take all the finals , including the time when they won. In order to see their win was lucky or not.

Juve lost 6 finals,  just in 1973 and 2015 wasn't the favorite team on paper.
1983 is rated as the the mother of all defeats, it is rated as the massive disappointment for Juve fans, Juve was definitely much better than Hamburg and all  , Juve fans and not Juve fans, expected their victory.
1997 is after it , Borussia was composed by some Serie A rejects and this increased further good expectations in Juve fans
Even in 1998 against Real , the Juve was rated as the favorite,just a little of optimism less because the name Real Madrid is not exactly Hamburg and Dortmund for tradition , but I remind very well Juve was quoted as the favorite team by boomakers ( even Mijatovic reminded him Real wasn't the favorite team , and i't s happened rarely in Real history ) , trhey had just won a controversial league against Inter of Ronaldo (while Real 2nd) but apart this ... they were simply a batter team than Real Madrid   on paper tbh.
Real hadn't players close to Del Piero ( it was prime Del Piero, then he ' ll got injured in following league because of a serious injury and he won't be exactly same thing anymore) and Zidane that year. But Mijatovic ( scored 0 goals before of that final , just to make idea further about unpredictability of a CL final...) scored
2003 ... Juve was favorite but less than 1983,1997 and 1998 though.
Juve was better on paper etc but this because it was a final entirely Italian and the " derbies" are always a " particular match" and besides Nedved missed and he was basically unplayable that year. It created some sort of pessimism in Juve fans considering their preceding finals.

Because yes, I think  there is some connection among these finals.

The tradition is important because losing many finals and expecting a final victory as an obsession , it makes everything much more complicated. Even for this reason Mourinho got a masterpiece in 2010 with us.

Robespierre wrote:Juve lost 6 finals,  just in 1973 and 2015 wasn't the favorite team on paper.
1983 is rated as the the mother of all defeats, it is rated as the massive disappointment for Juve fans, Juve was definitely much better than Hamburg and all  , Juve fans and not Juve fans, expected their victory.
1997 is after it , Borussia was composed by some Serie A rejects and this increased further good expectations in Juve fans
Even in 1998 against Real , the Juve was rated as the favorite,just a little of optimism less because the name Real Madrid is not exactly Hamburg and Dortmund for tradition , but I remind very well Juve was quoted as the favorite team by boomakers ( even Mijatovic reminded him Real wasn't the favorite team , and i't s happened rarely in Real history ) , trhey had just won a controversial league against Inter of Ronaldo (while Real 2nd) but apart this ... they were simply a batter team than Real Madrid   on paper tbh.
Real hadn't players close to Del Piero ( it was prime Del Piero, then he ' ll got injured in following league because of a serious injury and he won't be exactly same thing anymore) and Zidane that year. But Mijatovic ( scored 0 goals before of that final , just to make idea further about unpredictability of a CL final...) scored
2003 ... Juve was favorite but less than 1983,1997 and 1998 though.
Juve was better on paper etc but this because it was a final entirely Italian and the " derbies" are always a " particular match" and besides Nedved missed and he was basically unplayable that year. It created some sort of pessimism in Juve fans considering their preceding finals.

Because yes, I think  there is some connection among these finals.

The tradition is important because losing many finals and expecting a final victory as an obsession , it makes everything much more complicated. Even for this reason Mourinho got a masterpiece in 2010 with us.

great info from serie a expert, Robespierre

thank you very much