World Cup: Group B discussion

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Post by Kwanga Wed Jun 18, 2014 4:58 pm

zigra wrote:
1991 wrote:I've said since wc 2010 that Spain were winning inspite of del bosque, i was right.

Agreed.
Which players would you have chosen for the starting formation? I thought something like Cazorla-Villa-Pedro in front of Iniesta-Koke-Alonso (not sure about him though) would've worked far better than what he did.


                                    Martinez Koke
                               Carzola Iniesta Pedro
                                            Villa


Last edited by Kwanga on Wed Jun 18, 2014 4:59 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by Winter is Coming Wed Jun 18, 2014 4:59 pm

Spain left as the last team in the WC10 and now they're leaving as the first team in 2014.
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Post by Ganso Wed Jun 18, 2014 5:00 pm

best team of all time Laughing Laughing Laughing
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Post by M99 Wed Jun 18, 2014 5:01 pm

Netherlands and Chile first teams confirmed for last 16. Spain and Australia first teams to be eliminated from the World Cup.
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Post by RedOranje Wed Jun 18, 2014 5:01 pm

No van Persie for the Dutch in the next match due to yellow cards... Chile favourites to top the group?
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Post by RedOranje Wed Jun 18, 2014 5:02 pm

Ganso wrote:best team of all time Laughing Laughing Laughing

Three consecutive major trophies suggest they deserve to be considered regardless of what happened this tournament. Memories shorter than goldfish for some.  Rolling Eyes 
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Post by zigra Wed Jun 18, 2014 5:05 pm

Hapless_Hans wrote:Koke is on the pitch since halftime.
If Fabregas would'Ve come on everybody would've facepalmed too.

Yep I realised that as soon as I read my post again Laughing
Kwanga wrote:
                                    Martinez Koke
                               Carzola Iniesta Pedro
                                            Villa


Forgot about Martinez. Think that would have worked very well.
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Post by Hapless_Hans Wed Jun 18, 2014 5:07 pm

RedOranje wrote:No van Persie for the Dutch in the next match due to yellow cards... Chile favourites to top the group?


Based on today I'd say yes.

Netherlands to kick out Brazil in the last 16 Laughing
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Post by M99 Wed Jun 18, 2014 5:09 pm

Hapless_Hans wrote:
El Cujo wrote:I think this Spain side is a bit overrated to be honest. The Netherlands could end up topping the group.


lol. How exactly can 'this Spain side' be overrated?!

How can you overrate a team that won the EC, the WC, and then the EC again, all pretty much in a league of their own?

Netherlands are a second or third rate team compared to them. I mean how many players in the Netherlands squad have won the CL - two.
In Spain's side it's more then ten, and the others are the likes of Silva, Koke, Fabregas lol

I don't see how Holland can stand a chance tbh, they will have to try to top Chile for 2nd place


Fußball wrote:Spain is getting weirdly underrated before every tournament for whatever reasons and it's going on for years.
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Post by Ganso Wed Jun 18, 2014 5:10 pm

RedOranje wrote:
Ganso wrote:best team of all time Laughing Laughing Laughing

Three consecutive major trophies suggest they deserve to be considered regardless of what happened this tournament. Memories shorter than goldfish for some.  Rolling Eyes 
looking at how many trophies a team won and saying "this is the best team ever" is just like saying a x player with better stats is better than player y, when it isn't always true.

Even if they won 3 major trophies, this is basically the same team as in prior years and will always carry the "worst champion campaign in a WC" title
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Post by Swanhends Wed Jun 18, 2014 5:11 pm

Swanhends wrote:When Xavi was in his prime, Spain were untouchable
Since Xavi has started to slip, so Spain has followed suit

Time to bow down to the GAWD :bow:


:coffee:

Xavi's WC career ends with him on the bench watching Spain revert to playing as poor as they did before his WC career started


Last edited by Swanhends on Wed Jun 18, 2014 5:13 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post by farfan Wed Jun 18, 2014 5:12 pm

del bosque is the epitome of being " at the right place, at the right time "

dude inherited  a CL winning madrid team that got reinforced with the likes of figo and zidane .
he then inherited a euro winning national team built by aragones and barcelona's midfield ...

the only time he ventured outside of these two jobs , he couldn't last 6 months .

luckiest manager in the history of football.
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Post by Hapless_Hans Wed Jun 18, 2014 5:13 pm

RedOranje wrote:
Ganso wrote:best team of all time Laughing Laughing Laughing

Three consecutive major trophies suggest they deserve to be considered regardless of what happened this tournament.  Memories shorter than goldfish for some.  Rolling Eyes 


surely one of the absolute best international teams of all time, correlating with one of the absolute best club teams of all time, Pep's Barcelona.
 :bow: :bow: 

Both are not with us anymore  cheers
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Post by Bankz Wed Jun 18, 2014 5:13 pm

Netherlands to crash out before u blink an eye lid in the last 16..as usual! you heard it here first.
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Post by Glory Wed Jun 18, 2014 5:14 pm

RedOranje wrote:No van Persie for the Dutch in the next match due to yellow cards... Chile favourites to top the group?


yea obviously.

It will be tough to win against this Chilean side pale who are on a roll right now and who are playing some very beautiful and entertaining football. What a team :bow: what a coach :bow:

But luckily for us (Dutch ) we have that extra GD so a draw might well be enough to top the group.  Smile  But without RvP even that might prove to be difficult pale

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Post by Adit Wed Jun 18, 2014 5:17 pm

It was coming.. not surprise about the result. Golden generation of spain is past it and it's time to pump some young blood into the team. They have win so much that they don't have the hunger anymore.

Busquets and xabi both were terrible all game. Both is then doesn't provide any kind of intensity to the game. Apziculeta simply should not play unless he improve his ball technique... He should at least learn the passing game.
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Post by Hapless_Hans Wed Jun 18, 2014 5:17 pm

M99 wrote:
Hapless_Hans wrote:
El Cujo wrote:I think this Spain side is a bit overrated to be honest. The Netherlands could end up topping the group.


lol. How exactly can 'this Spain side' be overrated?!

How can you overrate a team that won the EC, the WC, and then the EC again, all pretty much in a league of their own?

Netherlands are a second or third rate team compared to them. I mean how many players in the Netherlands squad have won the CL - two.
In Spain's side it's more then ten, and the others are the likes of Silva, Koke, Fabregas lol

I don't see how Holland can stand a chance tbh, they will have to try to top Chile for 2nd place




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Post by RealGunner Wed Jun 18, 2014 5:17 pm

The end of an era.

IMO the problems were apparent all tournament if not the confederations cup. I said it before, Xavi made VDB's(stolen) system work. He was the key in domination from 2008 till 2012. Spain's defending was a non-factor because of his supreme control on games. They used possession to defend and it worked for 4 years.

But we all know Xavi isn't the same player. He doesn't have the mobility to command possession as well as he did before. Now Spain actually have to defend and the defending was atrocious throughout. Not just defending but the pressing was all over the place. If you press, you have to press as a team or don't press. Because bad pressing is as much of a problem as not pressing at all. Spain left huge space all over the pitch because the cohesion wasn't there between the players. The play was lacklustre and lacked sharpness. The passing was stale and without imagination. It just wasn't spain but a parody.

And that's all because VDB still insisted on the same system eventhough it was never going to work. I assume he had to do this because this is who he is. He is a loyalist to his principles. But he is also naive. Or wilful ignorant. I think he knew that costa will not work in this system. Costa isn't a bad player but he was playing in a system that he has never played under and was asked to do things he has never done. The midfield was obviously a problem with the lack of speed. Even Crystal Palace would have countered Spain with the space given and slow players.

Koke and Cazorla both brought in decisiveness in play and quicker transitions. But it was too late.

It's interesting to see how Spain rebuild. It's what I said in one of the other threads. I can't see them win anything anytime soon. The rebuilding process takes time, just look at Italy, Brazil and France.
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Post by McAgger Wed Jun 18, 2014 5:18 pm

farfan wrote:del bosque is the epitome of being " at the right place, at the right time "

dude inherited  a CL winning madrid team that got reinforced with the likes of figo and zidane .
he then inherited a euro winning national team built by aragones and barcelona's midfield ...

the only time he ventured outside of these two jobs , he couldn't last 6 months .

luckiest manager in the history of football.


Proud
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Post by Art Morte Wed Jun 18, 2014 5:20 pm

farfan wrote:del bosque is the epitome of being " at the right place, at the right time "

dude inherited  a CL winning madrid team that got reinforced with the likes of figo and zidane .
he then inherited a euro winning national team built by aragones and barcelona's midfield ...

the only time he ventured outside of these two jobs , he couldn't last 6 months .

luckiest manager in the history of football.


It's kinda true that the first time the Spanish team needed some tactical and personnel innovation, he showed nothing. Definitely some blame lies at his door. But his CV is and always will remain great and that's how the majority judge managers, so no point, really.
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Post by nasir6371 Wed Jun 18, 2014 5:20 pm

McAgger wrote:
farfan wrote:del bosque is the epitome of being " at the right place, at the right time "

dude inherited  a CL winning madrid team that got reinforced with the likes of figo and zidane .
he then inherited a euro winning national team built by aragones and barcelona's midfield ...

the only time he ventured outside of these two jobs , he couldn't last 6 months .

luckiest manager in the history of football.


Proud


That Revisionist History Proud
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Post by farfan Wed Jun 18, 2014 5:26 pm

nasir6371 wrote:
McAgger wrote:
farfan wrote:del bosque is the epitome of being " at the right place, at the right time "

dude inherited  a CL winning madrid team that got reinforced with the likes of figo and zidane .
he then inherited a euro winning national team built by aragones and barcelona's midfield ...

the only time he ventured outside of these two jobs , he couldn't last 6 months .

luckiest manager in the history of football.


Proud


That Revisionist History  Proud


what part of it is revisionist ?
the part where he took over a team a year after they won the CL and just as the free spending galactico era began ?
the part where he took over a euro winning spain ?

or maybe the part where he got fired in a turkey?   it was 9 months , not 6. HOORAY FOR don vicente.


Last edited by farfan on Wed Jun 18, 2014 5:27 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post by Dnmac4 Wed Jun 18, 2014 5:26 pm

Gutted to see Spain out of the World Cup because there is zero doubt in my mind they have the players to represent that country to make another run at the title. Obviously a lot of them were sitting at home on there couch or on the bench but it's just a bad way to end an era you would have thought a world class coach could see what was right in front of his face.

Maybe with this result Puyol will finally get the respect he deserves as one of the top defenders/Captains/leaders of all time.

I always think the core/spine of the team is the most important part of a team and it was one of the reasosns I was and still am bitter we traded in Yaya Toure for Busquets.

IF you look at the Spain team that competed in this tournament there Spine has been gutted. There defensive pairing of Puyol and Pique is done, Casillas (it's almost a sin to say it) seems done, Xavi is done, I've never liked Busquets and this season plus this tournament he was pathetic, and then David Villa is not the same player.

That is the ENTIRE spine of the team.

But again they have the players to build another really solid team, why it took this showing to do it is beyond me but I guess if I had won what VDB did with that group you have to be loyal to your guys.
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Post by Ganso Wed Jun 18, 2014 5:26 pm

I got to admit I'm scared of our R16 opponent.Chile and Netherlands have been amazing.I have no idea who I am going to be cheering for next week.I think I'm going for Chile,they can trouble us with their pressing and 3 man backline + dat support.The dutch are looking like a 2 men team (2 very good men that is lol)
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Post by Art Morte Wed Jun 18, 2014 5:30 pm

Ganso wrote:I got to admit I'm scared of our R16 opponent.Chile and Netherlands have been amazing.I have no idea who I am going to be cheering for next week.I think I'm going for Chile,they can trouble us with their pressing and 3 man backline + dat support.The dutch are looking like a 2 men team (2 very good men that is lol)


Holland were nothing impressive when they came up with a side with a work rate. And you've got the defense to stop their forwards. If I were Brazil, I'd rather face Holland, I think, although it's a bit 50-50.
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Post by Ganso Wed Jun 18, 2014 5:33 pm

Art Morte wrote:
Ganso wrote:I got to admit I'm scared of our R16 opponent.Chile and Netherlands have been amazing.I have no idea who I am going to be cheering for next week.I think I'm going for Chile,they can trouble us with their pressing and 3 man backline + dat support.The dutch are looking like a 2 men team (2 very good men that is lol)


Holland were nothing impressive when they came up with a side with a work rate. And you've got the defense to stop their forwards. If I were Brazil, I'd rather face Holland, I think, although it's a bit 50-50.
Yeah, i think Holland is the ideal opposition because our main weakness is fullbacks, and the dutch play with no wingers and pretty narrow.I just hope Thiago,Gustavo and Luiz deal with RVP,Robben and Sneijder.What a game this could be.
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