Re: OFFICIAL: FIFA Ballon d'or 2013 - Voting extended

by FennecFox7 Wed 4 Dec - 3:57:15

S wrote:Ronaldo winning it in what was basically a zero year for Madrid

Even the Brazilian Ronaldo when he won it,had won UEFA Cup with Inter.

If i'm wet then you're acting like you got your dick ripped off

and I don't understand. Why do you guys make things up to make your argument better? CR didn't flop against athletico or barca this season.

by Pip Wed 4 Dec - 5:53:31

Giggity5313 wrote:CR didn't flop against athletico or barca this season.

He was terrible against Atlético.

by FennecFox7 Wed 4 Dec - 6:05:34

Pippo wrote:
Giggity5313 wrote:CR didn't flop against athletico or barca this season.
He was terrible against Atlético.

I meant in the copa del rey match.. he was our most dangerous player.

I don't see people dissing messi because he was wearing an invisibility cloak against madrid this season. But, its CR, he sucks

by BarrileteCosmico Wed 4 Dec - 6:45:30

Are you suggesting Cristiano was any less invisible than Messi in that match? scratch

by LeBéninois Wed 4 Dec - 6:59:33

It's funny that Cr7 destroying Sweden ( but still, finished 2nd behind Russia) have had more impact in some people's mind than Messi's performances with Argentina through the year . Messi lead his contry to the n1 place whereas Portugal kinda struggled.

The way players play towards the end of the year has too much impact on the ballon d'or vote because at the end of the day it's usually about the best player from August to August .( one season, not a real year )

by LeBéninois Wed 4 Dec - 7:03:11

At the end of the day , i don't mind who win it this year. 3 terrific players even if Ribéry is out .

by FennecFox7 Wed 4 Dec - 7:30:29

BarrileteCosmico wrote:Are you suggesting Cristiano was any less invisible than Messi in that match?

He had an assist and his team was on the back foot the whole game....

by windkick Wed 4 Dec - 7:56:40

M99 wrote:
El Chelsea Fuerte wrote:I can tell you one thing, based on the reaction here so far, there's going to be much bitterness regardless of who wins it
The reaction will be best if Ronaldo wins it. Everyone saying 'LOL IMAGINE THE FACES WHEN MESSI WINS' I really want too see their faces if Ronaldo wins. Getting tired of the Ronaldo haters now.

I can't see why anybody would be shocked if Ronaldo, Ribery or Messi were to win. All 3 are deserving in there own way. Only people who would blindly object to these 3 guys not winning is an idioit, so who cares how they react

I would personally put Messi behind both Ribery and CR7 in my vote (as mentioned earlier in this thread)

by Pip Wed 4 Dec - 8:04:07

Giggity5313 wrote:
Pippo wrote:
Giggity5313 wrote:CR didn't flop against athletico or barca this season.
He was terrible against Atlético.
I meant in the copa del rey match.. he was our most dangerous player.

I don't see people dissing messi because he was wearing an invisibility cloak against madrid this season. But, its CR, he sucks

But Messi was not invisible against Real Madrid this season, so I don't understand your point. If Cristiano performs poorly against a team, he will rightfully be called out for it, just like Messi.

by windkick Wed 4 Dec - 8:15:54

Messi was not invincible vs R Madrid this season. That said, it's ridiculous to base a YEARS award on one matches argument (seems Ronaldo got his sway of votes for his performance vs Sweden). He's still to lift a trophy in 2013. Ribery on the other hand got a treble and could be picking up Club World Cup by years end. That's more impressive to me, as I feel the best player will help his team win trophies. Messi has been out of form by his standards all year due to injuries so I find it ridiculous if he were to win again as I feel for this year Ribery or Ronaldo should get it.
How I see it

1 Ribery
2 Ronaldo
3 Messi

But I feel it will end like this, which is totally acceptable as well as he's been on fire since Messi went down

1. Ronaldo
2. Messi
3. Ribery

by Harmonica Wed 4 Dec - 10:50:29

windkick wrote:Messi was not invincible vs R Madrid this season. That said, it's ridiculous to base a YEARS award on one matches argument (seems Ronaldo got his sway of votes for his performance vs Sweden). He's still to lift a trophy in 2013. Ribery on the other hand got a treble and could be picking up Club World Cup by years end. That's more impressive to me, as I feel the best player will help his team win trophies. Messi has been out of form by his standards all year due to injuries so I find it ridiculous if he were to win again as I feel for this year Ribery or Ronaldo should get it.
How I see it

1 Ribery
2 Ronaldo
3 Messi

But I feel it will end like this, which is totally acceptable as well as he's been on fire since Messi went down

1. Ronaldo
2. Messi
3. Ribery

Perfect example how Barcelona is full of Messi haters nowadays. Not only you are not acknowledging how Messi carried Barcelona to record league win, you associate Ribery to helping his team to treble when his individual share of example league win was less than 4th of Messi. I also think this is exactly why there is these rumors to exit, he doesn't feel appreciated by the fans anymore, and if that's true, that's really is the end of it.

by harhar11 Wed 4 Dec - 12:59:29

Giggity5313 wrote:
BarrileteCosmico wrote:Are you suggesting Cristiano was any less invisible than Messi in that match?
He had an assist and his team was on the back foot the whole game....

Well, according the the official highlight from Real Madrid, it was Barca who was on the back foot the whole game :coffee:

But seriously, the only thing that C.Ronaldo did that whole game was that assist and that penalty shout. But otherwise he was just as invisible as Messi, who himself was probably the player that defended the best(recovered the most balls in the game)

Harmonica wrote:
windkick wrote:Messi was not invincible vs R Madrid this season. That said, it's ridiculous to base a YEARS award on one matches argument (seems Ronaldo got his sway of votes for his performance vs Sweden). He's still to lift a trophy in 2013. Ribery on the other hand got a treble and could be picking up Club World Cup by years end. That's more impressive to me, as I feel the best player will help his team win trophies. Messi has been out of form by his standards all year due to injuries so I find it ridiculous if he were to win again as I feel for this year Ribery or Ronaldo should get it.
How I see it

1 Ribery
2 Ronaldo
3 Messi

But I feel it will end like this, which is totally acceptable as well as he's been on fire since Messi went down

1. Ronaldo
2. Messi
3. Ribery
Perfect example how Barcelona is full of Messi haters nowadays. Not only you are not acknowledging how Messi carried Barcelona to record league win, you associate Ribery to helping his team to treble when his individual share of example league win was less than 4th of Messi. I also think this is exactly why there is these rumors to exit, he doesn't feel appreciated by the fans anymore, and if that's true, that's really is the end of it.

See Hapless_Hans, Messi fan, not a Barca fan.

There exist no hate towards Messi in Barcelona. If anything, there is more hate towards Xavi and Iniesta because of their form. But Messi? Come one. And no, Messi didn't carry Barca to the league last season. He played a huge part and was the main reason why we won, but Iniesta, for example, was just as vital. Now the CL that's a whole other story. That was the competition where he carried us.

The only thing that I disagree with what Wind said was that Messi has been out of form the entire year and that C.Ronaldo played better these year. None of that is true. Messi was much better the first half of this year and he started this season better as well. It was only after his injury against Almeria that he started to play "bad". But I agree with the rest of his post.

by Hapless_Hans Wed 4 Dec - 13:12:54

well I sincerely hope that there is no 'hate' whatsoever towards any of the likes of Xavi, Iniesta, not to talk of Messi etc. among Barca supporters.
That would be ridiculous, considering the supernatural things these guys have achieve. Eternal legends.

Even if they started scoring own goals deliberately that would still stands.
And they're still incredible, it's just that you CANNOT possibly expect them to eternally perform with the same ambition and will after winning everything OVER AND OVER AGAIN.
Even if they themselves try their hardest, which they're doing, things just come to an end, period.

by harhar11 Wed 4 Dec - 13:21:29

Hapless_Hans wrote:well I sincerely hope that there is no 'hate' whatsoever towards any of the likes of Xavi, Iniesta, not to talk of Messi etc. among Barca supporters.
That would be ridiculous, considering the supernatural things these guys have achieve. Eternal legends.

Even if they started scoring own goals deliberately that would still stands.
And they're still incredible, it's just that you CANNOT possibly expect them to eternally perform with the same ambition and will after winning everything OVER AND OVER AGAIN.
Even if they themselves try their hardest, which they're doing, things just come to an end, period.

Sadly there is, atleast that's what I get reading spanish forums. As you know, football fans are very fickle. One day Xavi and Iniesta plays a great game, and they are the greatest evah! next day they play a bad game, and we should sell them because they are sh#te. :facepalm:

There are some that even say that Iniesta was has been bad an entire year, which is false. Atleast when it comes to Iniesta.

Spanish fans are very, VERY fickle.

by Hapless_Hans Wed 4 Dec - 13:55:25

harhar11 wrote:
Hapless_Hans wrote:well I sincerely hope that there is no 'hate' whatsoever towards any of the likes of Xavi, Iniesta, not to talk of Messi etc. among Barca supporters.
That would be ridiculous, considering the supernatural things these guys have achieve. Eternal legends.

Even if they started scoring own goals deliberately that would still stands.
And they're still incredible, it's just that you CANNOT possibly expect them to eternally perform with the same ambition and will after winning everything OVER AND OVER AGAIN.
Even if they themselves try their hardest, which they're doing, things just come to an end, period.
Sadly there is, atleast that's what I get reading spanish forums. As you know, football fans are very fickle. One day Xavi and Iniesta plays a great game, and they are the greatest evah! next day they play a bad game, and we should sell them because they are sh#te. :facepalm:There are some that even say that Iniesta was has been bad an entire year, which is false. Atleast when it comes to Iniesta.

Spanish fans are very, VERY fickle.

Well, maybe there's an argument to be made that at some point some of your players who used to be pillars should be sold or benched (whatever is considered more honorable), in order to renew the team and move on.
That doesn't mean AT ALL people should be hating on them though.

by Valkyrja Wed 4 Dec - 14:16:11

harhar11 wrote:
Giggity5313 wrote:
BarrileteCosmico wrote:Are you suggesting Cristiano was any less invisible than Messi in that match?
He had an assist and his team was on the back foot the whole game....
Well, according the the official highlight from Real Madrid, it was Barca who was on the back foot the whole game

But seriously, the only thing that C.Ronaldo did that whole game was that assist and that penalty shout. But otherwise he was just as invisible as Messi, who himself was probably the player that defended the best(recovered the most balls in the game)
Harmonica wrote:
windkick wrote:Messi was not invincible vs R Madrid this season. That said, it's ridiculous to base a YEARS award on one matches argument (seems Ronaldo got his sway of votes for his performance vs Sweden). He's still to lift a trophy in 2013. Ribery on the other hand got a treble and could be picking up Club World Cup by years end. That's more impressive to me, as I feel the best player will help his team win trophies. Messi has been out of form by his standards all year due to injuries so I find it ridiculous if he were to win again as I feel for this year Ribery or Ronaldo should get it.
How I see it

1 Ribery
2 Ronaldo
3 Messi

But I feel it will end like this, which is totally acceptable as well as he's been on fire since Messi went down

1. Ronaldo
2. Messi
3. Ribery
Perfect example how Barcelona is full of Messi haters nowadays. Not only you are not acknowledging how Messi carried Barcelona to record league win, you associate Ribery to helping his team to treble when his individual share of example league win was less than 4th of Messi. I also think this is exactly why there is these rumors to exit, he doesn't feel appreciated by the fans anymore, and if that's true, that's really is the end of it.
See Hapless_Hans, Messi fan, not a Barca fan.

There exist no hate towards Messi in Barcelona. If anything, there is more hate towards Xavi and Iniesta because of their form. But Messi? Come one. And no, Messi didn't carry Barca to the league last season. He played a huge part and was the main reason why we won, but Iniesta, for example, was just as vital. Now the CL that's a whole other story. That was the competition where he carried us.

The only thing that I disagree with what Wind said was that Messi has been out of form the entire year and that C.Ronaldo played better these year. None of that is true. Messi was much better the first half of this year and he started this season better as well. It was only after his injury against Almeria that he started to play "bad". But I agree with the rest of his post.

that doesn't outshine Ronaldo's out of the world performances

by harhar11 Wed 4 Dec - 14:29:39

Valkyrja wrote:that doesn't outshine Ronaldo's out of the world performances

So C.Ronaldo being much better these last 2 months means that we should forget that Messi was much better for the rest of the year? Even though C.Ronaldo had scored more goals than Messi this year even before his injury against Almeria, there was a pretty big difference in their performances in favour of Messi.

Hapless_Hans wrote:
Well, maybe there's an argument to be made that at some point some of your players who used to be pillars should be sold or benched (whatever is considered more honorable), in order to renew the team and move on.
That doesn't mean AT ALL people should be hating on them though..

Bench, ok I agree but sold? Just because Iniesta has been out of form these last 3 months does not mean that we should sell him immiedietly. And the hate that they receive..

by Hapless_Hans Wed 4 Dec - 14:52:23

harhar11 wrote:
Hapless_Hans wrote:
Well, maybe there's an argument to be made that at some point some of your players who used to be pillars should be sold or benched (whatever is considered more honorable), in order to renew the team and move on.
That doesn't mean AT ALL people should be hating on them though..
Bench, ok I agree but sold? Just because Iniesta has been out of form these last 3 months does not mean that we should sell him immiedietly. And the hate that they receive..

No, don't get me wrong, I'm not saying what should happen (who am I to tell Barca that). I'm just saying that after the dominance of a great generation, there still has to be a overhaul at some point, and the more legendary the players are, the trickier it is in a way.
Maybe some player will want to go to a different club to find a new challenge, maybe some player will just play less and be comfortable with that.
And yes, maybe you''ll have to sell some to get money for new players that are needed.

Of course, Xavi at some point could be like Lampard at Chelsea, still bringing all his class onto the field regularly, just not playing that central of a role for the structure of the starting line-up (for example).

The point is though, either way the younger players will NEED to get significantly more playing time, that's the managers job of course...

(sorry for off topic)

by harhar11 Wed 4 Dec - 15:16:57

Hapless_Hans wrote:
harhar11 wrote:
Hapless_Hans wrote:
Well, maybe there's an argument to be made that at some point some of your players who used to be pillars should be sold or benched (whatever is considered more honorable), in order to renew the team and move on.
That doesn't mean AT ALL people should be hating on them though..
Bench, ok I agree but sold? Just because Iniesta has been out of form these last 3 months does not mean that we should sell him immiedietly. And the hate that they receive..
No, don't get me wrong, I'm not saying what should happen (who am I to tell Barca that). I'm just saying that after the dominance of a great generation, there still has to be a overhaul at some point, and the more legendary the players are, the trickier it is in a way.
Maybe some player will want to go to a different club to find a new challenge, maybe some player will just play less and be comfortable with that.
And yes, maybe you''ll have to sell some to get money for new players that are needed.

Of course, Xavi at some point could be like Lampard at Chelsea, still bringing all his class onto the field regularly, just not playing that central of a role for the structure of the starting line-up (for example).

The point is though, either way the younger players will NEED to get significantly more playing time, that's the managers job of course...

(sorry for off topic)

No, I agree with everything you said. It's just that some people are over exaggerating.

by jibers Wed 4 Dec - 15:36:47

Every great team has changed the guard. Milan did it and had sustained success, Juve did it, United did it, Barcelona are no excpetion. Tiny squad, overplayed players, accumulated fatigue and evidently shocking pre season is coming home to roost. Xavi should be slowly phased out, it's common sense. He's not the same player he was even 2 seasons ago. Barcelona's sporting director is a disgrace tbh, the guy has done sod all and Tata is playing a style that doesn't really suit his team but noone was brought in. The club looks like it has no direction atm.

by Hapless_Hans Wed 4 Dec - 16:26:46

jibers wrote:Every great team has changed the guard. Milan did it and had sustained success, Juve did it, United did it, Barcelona are no excpetion. Tiny squad, overplayed players, accumulated fatigue and evidently shocking pre season is coming home to roost. Xavi should be slowly phased out, it's common sense. He's not the same player he was even 2 seasons ago. Barcelona's sporting director is a disgrace tbh, the guy has done sod all and Tata is playing a style that doesn't really suit his team but noone was brought in. The club looks like it has no direction atm.

Was there at all any signing after/in accordance with the arrival of Tata?

by white_star Wed 4 Dec - 19:42:01

Giggity5313 wrote:
S wrote:Ronaldo winning it in what was basically a zero year for Madrid

Even the Brazilian Ronaldo when he won it,had won UEFA Cup with Inter.
If i'm wet then you're acting like you got your dick ripped off

and I don't understand. Why do you guys make things up to make your argument better? CR didn't flop against athletico or barca this season.

Why do you get so angry about anything that has to do with cr7? You are way too disrespectful for your age. No point of being an internet warrior.

by Mr Nick09 Wed 4 Dec - 19:49:03

why do you guys keep bringing the fact that madrid won no trophy as an argument against CR?

if i recall, Ribery didnt win those trophies playing 1 vs 11 did he? he had a better team, which he enhanced by his performances among others, mainly robben when it mattered, and he (they) all got rewarded with the CL, bundi and cup.

Ballon d'or is an individual trophy, it's about rewarding the best individual in the sports right? sure winning team trophies is important to be eligible, but that doesnt make Ribery more deserving of it than CR.

Is Ribery the better player on this year? no he is not. that's it really.

by Hapless_Hans Wed 4 Dec - 19:59:58

but how do you really judge an individual player in a team sport? merely based on certain numbers?

If Ronaldo doesn't defend properly against Dortmund in the CL semi so you get kicked out, while Ribery works his ass off, does that factor into your calculation?
If you say we had the better team, isn't that also because our superstars have become more team players than other superstars?

by Mr Nick09 Wed 4 Dec - 20:29:50

but ronaldo defending or not isnt the single difference between winning or losing for madrid is it? Pepe doesnt get raped by lewandowski and the outcome might be different. Higuain doesnt choke up his chances in the return game and the outcome might be different. And It's not like CR was playing for a midtable team and didnt play the CL last season.

Like i said, Ribery working his arse off helped his team achieved a team trophy, i am sure he has a replica on top of the fire place already.

that doesnt mean that he was the world single best player last year. DRose winning the MVP few years back didnt make him NBA champion, did it?

by Hapless_Hans Wed 4 Dec - 20:34:01

No I get your point.
Ronaldo can have it, I'm absolutely fine with that.

It's just that some qualities that are not so spectacular always are underrated in awards like these.

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