Would like to discuss something Tactically to do with Arsenal and Cazorla

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Post by Lex Tue Jan 01, 2013 10:39 pm

So, in other words, you don't think Arteta is good enough because.....you don't like him

Such crucial insight and knowledge is invaluable to the forum. Bravo Would like to discuss something Tactically to do with Arsenal and Cazorla - Page 2 Th_clapping2

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Post by Lex Tue Jan 01, 2013 10:41 pm

I also do not understand the flak big Mert STILL gets, even now

I guess it's just cool to single him out for his lack of pace, despite excelling in every other defensive aspect all season long and becoming one of our best centre backs.
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Post by free_cat Tue Jan 01, 2013 10:42 pm

Lex wrote:So, in other words, you don't think Arteta is good enough because.....you don't like him

Such crucial insight and knowledge is invaluable to the forum. Bravo Would like to discuss something Tactically to do with Arsenal and Cazorla - Page 2 Th_clapping2
Lex wrote:So, in other words, you don't think Arteta is good enough because.....you don't like him

Such crucial insight and knowledge is invaluable to the forum. Bravo Would like to discuss something Tactically to do with Arsenal and Cazorla - Page 2 Th_clapping2

Isn't that the bottom line? either you like a player so you think he is good enough or viceversa?

But I gave plenty of reasons why I don't like him, he can't cope with pressure good enough, isn't good enough defending, loses too many balls considering how uncreative he plays, etc
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Post by Jay29 Tue Jan 01, 2013 10:48 pm

loses too many balls

Arteta's passing stats:

Average passes per game - 85.1
Pass completion rate - 92.6%

Looks good enough to me.

EDIT: And this...

Would like to discuss something Tactically to do with Arsenal and Cazorla - Page 2 A_THjmzCAAAyUC0





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Post by RealGunner Tue Jan 01, 2013 11:13 pm

For me the midfield balance isn't there. The balance was perfect when Diaby was fit but after that it has been hit and miss. Like i said in the Arsenal section, the trio are all extremely talented but they don't compliment each other that well.

Cazorla isn't working as the No 10. He fails to provide creativity and this could be because this is a new system for him or that he needs time to adapt to the PL. He should be moved to the wings and play like Mata does/did. Just to see how it works. In my opinion Wilshere is a better No 10 than him and the sooner he plays there the better. For now he is doing what Diaby did earlier on which has been great but that's not his best.

Maybe with signing new players we will improve but it's not vintage Arsenal atm.
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Post by Mr Nick09 Tue Jan 01, 2013 11:28 pm

it's Gonalons that i am looking at in that list, like wtf Shocked


Last edited by Mr Nick09 on Tue Jan 01, 2013 11:35 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post by RealGunner Tue Jan 01, 2013 11:30 pm

He has been brilliant for lyon this season. One of the best in ligue 1 infact
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Post by Mr Nick09 Tue Jan 01, 2013 11:55 pm

what role exactly is he playing for them?
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Post by RealGunner Wed Jan 02, 2013 12:04 am

Defensive Midfielder/DLP

Kinda like Toulalan did back in the days
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Post by Mr Nick09 Wed Jan 02, 2013 12:11 am

French Busquets RG?
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Post by The Franchise Wed Jan 02, 2013 1:05 am

Honestly, I dont like Arteta either. Actually, I dont like any player who plays in front of the back 4 offensively, but cant defend that area without help. It just makes every midfield combo you have around him limited to an extent.

He is good at what he does, but I just dont like his kind of player.

Anyway on Santi. He strikes me as a floater, a free spirit, not always the easiest to understand about when things are going wrong. Personally it seems like he shoots a little too much, maybe because he score quite a few early on, IDK.

Tactically, he probably isnt Arsenal's biggest issue for me and I would want to see other areas fixed before looking at him and thinking is something is structurally wrong.
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Post by RealGunner Wed Jan 02, 2013 1:06 am

Mr Nick09 wrote:French Busquets RG?

Certainly
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Post by Abramovich Wed Jan 02, 2013 1:21 am

One thing I will add is that Mata kinda has a free role and doesn't really have to track or anything, under Rafa he mainly in the middle and then drifts which is his best imo, kinda the opposite of what you guys want Santi to do. I suppose it helps Mata a great deal having physical presences of Mikel or Luiz etc behind him, something that Arsenal greatly need.
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Post by Lex Wed Jan 02, 2013 1:26 am

Speaking of, is Luiz now officially a midfielder?
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Post by the xcx Wed Jan 02, 2013 1:31 am

Acomplished midfielder tbf. Dont let him near the midfield against the big teams rofl
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Post by Abramovich Wed Jan 02, 2013 1:38 am

No I wouldn't think so personally, its just Romeu is out for the season pretty much. Mikel wasssuspended and injured.

Am a sucker for my ball playing cbs, I don't think his long term future is in midfield but maybeutil the rest of the season you will see him there. The funniest thing is he's a better passer than Mikel and Ramires, especially attacking vision.
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Post by free_cat Wed Jan 02, 2013 10:17 am

Also, Sagna is currently playing terribly. You could add him to my list of useless Arsenal players unless he regains his form.

Never really liked him that much though. I was always baffled when some Arsenal fans rated him as one of the world's best right backs. At the top of his game he is a good defender, but very useless going forward, and IMO FB of top teams need to be at least good going forward or superb defenders as Abidal was.

While Diaby is injured, Arsenal should really play Vermaelen as DM IMO.
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Post by Lex Wed Jan 02, 2013 11:44 am

Now you're just talking bollocks
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Post by sportsczy Wed Jan 02, 2013 11:55 am

Sagna has been out 6 months though and he's only played a couple of games since returning. Same thing happened to him last time... it took him about 3 weeks to get going. The issue is not the injury. It's fitness and recovery. Your body needs to readjust to game speed.
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Post by Great Leader Sprucenuce Wed Jan 02, 2013 12:13 pm

Sagna has been going downhill for last 2 years.....

Before his injuries he was WC FB lets not get it twisted but his form has dropped big time in last 2 years.

Players like Obertan and Hoilett have burned him in last couple of years and that would have never happened before hand.
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Post by Rev Wed Jan 02, 2013 12:36 pm

He sustained 2 leg breaks of the same leg in one year tbf.

The class is still there but it seems it's harder and harder for him to keep a consistent level of performance from game to game. Sad
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Post by juventus101 Wed Jan 02, 2013 12:48 pm

You should plsy like this:

--Sczezny--
--Sagna-- --Mertesacker-- --Koscielny-- --Gibbs--
--Cazorla-- --Arteta-- -- Wilshere-- --Oxlade--
--Podolski-- --Giroud--

Arteta and Wilshere would act similar to Pirlo and Marchisio/Vidal. With Arteta sitting deep spreading passes around, and Wilshere be a hard working b2b that makes thosebuntracked runs into the area. This would also maximize Ox, Podolski, Cazorla, and Girouds potentials. Cazorla would have a free role, where he can drift inside and act as an AM centrally to also help out Wilshere offensively, or can drift out wide and whip in crosses for Giroud. Podolski is best when played centrally as an SS, plus his undertsnaind with Cazorla would be utilized here. Giroud and Ox would povide service for each other, whether its Giroud holding up play for Ox to cut in on his right foot, or Ox sending in crosses for Giroud. This also takes out Vermaelen who i believe is the weak link in defense, though Koscielny could also be called that. Overall, i think this would worl wonders, though the possibility of it happening is slim to none.
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Post by Jay29 Wed Jan 02, 2013 1:02 pm

Sagna, to me, looks like he's lost a bit of turning speed. At his best, he's someone who's very difficult to shake off; even if you managed to knock the ball round him, he'd still turn quickly and get back on you. In the past couple of years, there's been signs that he can't keep up as well as he used to against tricky wingers. Moses, Hoilett and Obertan - hardly the highest quality bunch of wingers - have all gotten the best of him recently.

It's probably down to suffering two leg breaks in just a couple of years. Hopefully we'll see some of the old Sagna before he sods off in the summer.

--Sczezny--
--Sagna-- --Mertesacker-- --Koscielny-- --Gibbs--
--Cazorla-- --Arteta-- -- Wilshere-- --Oxlade--
--Podolski-- --Giroud--

That team would suffer from the same problems our current line-up are. Arteta and Wilshere wouldn't be able to handle the physical pressure from other sides. They would just get overrun too easily.

Also, why does every mock-up Arsenal team I see exclude Walcott? scratch

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Post by sportsczy Wed Jan 02, 2013 1:04 pm

Nah... Sagna was pretty beast the last half of last season. He just needs a bit to get strength and conditioning back. Broken leg is not like a torn ligament... you can get back to 100%. The only places where it becomes complicated is the ankle, wrist, etc... anywhere where you have a lot of small bones. These were clean breaks on a large bone. Should be fine with time.
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Post by free_cat Wed Jan 02, 2013 4:06 pm

Lex wrote:Now you're just talking bollocks

Am I? Ok, seems not everyone thinks so. I'm sorry so many Arsenal players are not good enough, but it's the truth.
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Post by McAgger Wed Jan 02, 2013 4:15 pm

Sagna was a physical beast in his prime and his game was sort of centered around that. He's turning 30 in a month, there's no way Arsenal will be seeing Sagna of old. Players age and they turn to shite, that's just the way of life.
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