Catalan independence process

harhar11 wrote:

free_cat wrote:

Some pictures comparing the two demonstrations. What a difference hahaha! And the demonstration for independence could have 10 more pictures like those.

tbf mate, wouldnt the guys who wants independence have a bigger need to go to the demonstration?

free_cat wrote:

harhar11 wrote:

free_cat wrote:

Some pictures comparing the two demonstrations. What a difference hahaha! And the demonstration for independence could have 10 more pictures like those.

tbf mate, wouldnt the guys who wants independence have a bigger need to go to the demonstration?

Maybe, but that doesn't matter.
What we, catalan democrats, ask is simple: let the people decide. Make a referendum and count the votes and act accordingly.
What they, spanish nationalist, want it'hs the opposite: don't let people decide.

Three acts of violence, all of them started by spanish nationalists.
I never saw that coming.

CBarca wrote:So Free_Cat, what would you rate your chances of getting independence at this point in time...as a percentage. 20%, 50%...?

Random memory: I remember last year around this time of the year in my Spanish class, a bunch of Spanish natives came to our school, they were in the US for 2 weeks, but here at my school only for a couple days. Nonetheless, they came into our Spanish class and we were allowed to converse in English/Spanish, and then we asked questions as a group to the Spanish kids. I asked what they thought about Catalan independence, and whether it was possible, what they're chances were, and if it was a realistic goal for the Catalan people.

A couple of them replied that they did not think it was possible. They said they kind of "laugh at them (Catalans)" for it- while that sounds particularly insulting, I think it was because they didn't know how to phrase it in English. They said that it was possible, but that they never expect it to ever happen, and that it is a mere pipe dream for the Catalan people.

free_cat wrote:

I don't know how likely it is. It's not an easy path. We first need a political majority that wants to exercise our right of self-determination. This majority exists and will most likely be confirmed and enlarged in the elections on the 25th of november.

We then need to hold a referendum on creating a catalan state. This will be very difficult as spanish laws don't allow catalan government to make such a referendum without central government permission, and central government will obviously deny it. Our President said yesterday that if Spanish law doesn't allow the referendum, it will be done anyway, which I think it's democratic and makes sense. However, Spain might try to stop the referendum putting our President in jail or closing down the electoral colleges with the policemen. Catalan police should then stop spanish police from doing any of those things.

If we finally can hold a referendum, we must then win it. Poll show a big majority for independence (50% in favour, 25% against, rest undecided or don't care). However, going into the referendum Spain will put all their media trying to scare catalans, and I don't know if it can work.

If we win the referendum, we must then create the catalan state, which will need of some negotiation with Spain and the international community. Spain could also apply the constitution and send the army to catalonia and invade us, but that seems very unlikely.

So it is a hard and difficult path, mostly because of Spain's intransigence and undemocratic culture, but IMO we are in a point of no return, at least when it comes to making a referendum. If we will win it or not, that's another thing, but I'm sure there will be a referendum in the next 4 years at most.

FCBarça wrote:Several subtitled interviews over at The Guardian of people in Spain over the question of Catalan Indepedence...Very revealing, I feel...Few really were able to overcome historic prejudices while some simply pointed out Catalunya wouldn't benefit economically from it - ignoring all the other cultural, social & political reasons why many would want it

I don't know whether the country can benefit better from Independence or not but what I have observed over the last decade (Through friends in Spain and during my visits) is that Catalans suffer from widespread prejudices in the country - particularly from the capital...They deserve better and at the very least respect that they do not receive...Economically, they are absolutely taken advantage of by the capital but Independence would/could isolate them financially, as well

Not a simple question to answer but they certainly have the right to decide for themselves

BarrileteCosmico wrote:How long do you think it'll take for the polls to be counted Free?

The Franchise wrote:So going forward, whats next?

windkick wrote:I know Barca wouldnt leave La Liga, but I am curious..

Can some one name all of the Catalan clubs? And also a separate list with all of the Basque clubs? I wonder what a league of the two would look like (and how La Liga would look)

free_cat wrote:Good selection, didn't even know that Kiko Casillas or Victor Ruiz were catalan!

Verdu has played a couple of times as LW for Catalunya and did great, and as you mention Sergio García becomes a star when playing for Catalonia.

Other players that could be considered:
Angel Range RB -Swansea
Jonathan Soriano - Striker Red Bull Sazlburg
Jordi Gomez CM - Wigan
Ferran Corominas - FW Elche (doing great at 2a).
Albert Crusat - LW Wigan

And probably some other expat who plays in Spain or abroad and don't remember.