Very Underwhelmed by Everything in our club

by Guest Tue Jul 31, 2012 10:38 pm

Owners
When John Henry came in October 2010, he talked about ambition, winning, and being up there with the best. almost 2 years on, it appears to me that off the pitch success is more important than on the pitch success to FSG. The obsession with trimming down the wage bill, availability of our better players in case of a good offer (see Torres and Meireles, and now rumoured Agger), and our lack of ambition in the transfer market is for all there to see. Fair play to FSG, they spent around 35M net last summer. but don't forget, we saved close to 20M in wages, signed record sponsorship deals, and kit deals, the PL TV money went up considerably, and we signed multiple commercial deals with a lot of companies. So where is the money ??!!! Why do we have to offload Aquilani or Carroll first, before buying another CM or ST. are we back to Sell to Buy that we initially had under H+G ? I hate their PR. Their propaganda (Remember both Torres and Raul saying that there are things the fans don't know?! the pathetic "HANDS IN A TRANSFER REQUEST" before selling a popular player just to tarnish his reputation among the fans. the cringe-worthy Documentary that is to be aired in a month ,and the fact that they are trying hard to milks as much money as possible from BRAND LIVERPOOL, as opposed to making extra pushes to make us successful on the pitch. It reminds me of Lerner in A.Villa. He came in with big promises, spent big in his first season, but MON failed to reach Top 4 and didn't take EL seriously. They fell out, and ever since he's only been selling Villa's best players for top money, replacing them with inferior players and cutting costs. I don't want us to be like that. AND NO STADIUM NEWS after 2 years..
4 weeks left of transfer window, but plenty of question marks regarding FSG....I am very concerned.

Rodgers
I was quite happy with his appointment. I believe Kenny's dismissal, while really sad, had some sort of justification from owners' point of view. We spent quite a bit, the players he signed underperformed, we finished 8th below Everton. you could see the reason behind it. I like Rodgers and his philosphy and the fact that he stood up to Ayre in his first press conference. I was hoping this English revolution would stop by his arrival considering he is obsessed with Spanish football, has meetings with VDB, etc. Now I see Suso and Pacheco have been left out of EL tie, Aquilani told to go....while we'll probably see likes of Adam and Eccleston, Joe Cole and Downing feature. It kills me. I sometimes wonder, whether the shots are issued from upstairs. Pacheco was our second best player in the tour after Shelvey, yet he doesn't make the squad to Belarus. English lads like Sterling and Morgan do. It's sickening. What do we have to earn by playing 30 year old Cole on 90k/week, ahead of a player of similar quality, but 10 years younger and on 25% of Cole's wages. Madness. I really hope his plan is to get the tie done with experienced players in Belarus, and we see likes of Dani and Suso feature at Anfield. I will be patient with Rodgers however. I believe in his plan A. We won't pass the teams off the field over-night, we need to be patient, and especially as we are skint, no one expects top 4 from us, so pressure will be less. But he needs to be ruthless and makes his own decisions and don't play players based on their price tag, nationality, or what the owners may want.

Liverpool FC
We are now a franchise first, a football club second. I long the days that when we sold Xabi to Madrid, it was strengthening our rivals, now even Spurs don't count us as rivals. We've made stupid decision after stupid decision 3-4 years in a row now...and until this goes on, we'll never get back up there. Hope we start soon, because signs aren't looking good at the moment.
Viva Rafa

by Red Alert Tue Jul 31, 2012 11:23 pm

In response to your owners:

I agree with the stadium, but you have to remember where we were a couple of years ago - nearly liquidated and have no more football club. The owners up top have invested... it's not their fault that Kenny / Commolli bought the wrong players. Also, those deals you mention are what they're supposed to do. They have to bring up as much money as possible for the club. Whilst working internally, they have no say on gameday so it's not as if they are the reason we are not performing on the pitch.

On Rodgers:

I'm still happy with him. Not sure if Carroll and Aquilani are forced out, I will be mad if they are, but it's pure speculation at the moment. Suso is under the age of 19, so I'm certain he can still feature in the Europa.

On your last paragraph, f*ck spurs and f*ck everyone else. G+H set us back, Roy Hodgson did too, and to an extent, Kenny and Commolli did too. We need to address the issues before we go out and spend more. Also, we don't need to "sell to buy", Tom Werner has come out and has said that they're not going to rush into any deals.

by RedOranje Wed Aug 01, 2012 12:12 am

Schweini wrote:Owners
When John Henry came in October 2010, he talked about ambition, winning, and being up there with the best. almost 2 years on, it appears to me that off the pitch success is more important than on the pitch success to FSG. The obsession with trimming down the wage bill, availability of our better players in case of a good offer (see Torres and Meireles, and now rumoured Agger), and our lack of ambition in the transfer market is for all there to see. Fair play to FSG, they spent around 35M net last summer. but don't forget, we saved close to 20M in wages, signed record sponsorship deals, and kit deals, the PL TV money went up considerably, and we signed multiple commercial deals with a lot of companies. So where is the money ??!!! Why do we have to offload Aquilani or Carroll first, before buying another CM or ST. are we back to Sell to Buy that we initially had under H+G ? I hate their PR. Their propaganda (Remember both Torres and Raul saying that there are things the fans don't know?! the pathetic "HANDS IN A TRANSFER REQUEST" before selling a popular player just to tarnish his reputation among the fans. the cringe-worthy Documentary that is to be aired in a month ,and the fact that they are trying hard to milks as much money as possible from BRAND LIVERPOOL, as opposed to making extra pushes to make us successful on the pitch. It reminds me of Lerner in A.Villa. He came in with big promises, spent big in his first season, but MON failed to reach Top 4 and didn't take EL seriously. They fell out, and ever since he's only been selling Villa's best players for top money, replacing them with inferior players and cutting costs. I don't want us to be like that. AND NO STADIUM NEWS after 2 years..
4 weeks left of transfer window, but plenty of question marks regarding FSG....I am very concerned.

So in short, you're upset because they're doing exactly what they promised they'd do? Henry specifically stated that the first step in making Liverpool a true footballing power again was to catch up commercially, as the club was lagging far behind it's rivals in that area and therefore had less ability to compete in the transfer market. FSG also made it clear that it would not be bankrolling big spending every summer, but rather would work to make the club more self-sufficient and would only add cash when it was really needed, and they have put cash into the club in multiple areas, including transfers and wages. You are now using Torres, a player who had made several indications of leaving before they arrived, as a measuring stick? This disregarding that FSG and Henry do not have a direct hand in transfers. Would you rather they (they being Dalglish and Comolli, let's be clear) let him go before he handed in a transfer request? Would you rather they (again Dalglish and Comolli) had not held out trying to keep Meireles as well? The players DID hand in transfer requests. Torres, by several accounts more reliable than his own, was referring to promises made with the previous owners when talking about things behind the scenes while Meireles was supposed to get an improved contract that Dalglish and Comolli turned down. The manager didn't rate the player as highly as the player felt he should be, so the player was let go. How is this the fault of the owners? I won't even bother with the Agger comments as it is based purely on rumours from unreliable sources. The documentary you were excited about early on, and have only turned against so that it can support your new-found dislike for the owners. There has been stadium news and indications of progress, but again, it's easier to ignore that to suit your new agenda. The Aston Villa comparisons are nonsense in their totality, other than the fact that both clubs have American owners... but then that was where you started and is really part of the agenda, so I guess it fits. Your entire breakdown here shows a hugely simplified and awry understanding of how football clubs in the modern day are run and how the money moves. You've put the assumed/desired conclusion first and gone back to find the incidences and examples that fit it, rather than the other way around. Confirmation bias.

Schweini wrote:Rodgers
I was quite happy with his appointment. I believe Kenny's dismissal, while really sad, had some sort of justification from owners' point of view. We spent quite a bit, the players he signed underperformed, we finished 8th below Everton. you could see the reason behind it. I like Rodgers and his philosphy and the fact that he stood up to Ayre in his first press conference. I was hoping this English revolution would stop by his arrival considering he is obsessed with Spanish football, has meetings with VDB, etc. Now I see Suso and Pacheco have been left out of EL tie, Aquilani told to go....while we'll probably see likes of Adam and Eccleston, Joe Cole and Downing feature. It kills me. I sometimes wonder, whether the shots are issued from upstairs. Pacheco was our second best player in the tour after Shelvey, yet he doesn't make the squad to Belarus. English lads like Sterling and Morgan do. It's sickening. What do we have to earn by playing 30 year old Cole on 90k/week, ahead of a player of similar quality, but 10 years younger and on 25% of Cole's wages. Madness. I really hope his plan is to get the tie done with experienced players in Belarus, and we see likes of Dani and Suso feature at Anfield. I will be patient with Rodgers however. I believe in his plan A. We won't pass the teams off the field over-night, we need to be patient, and especially as we are skint, no one expects top 4 from us, so pressure will be less. But he needs to be ruthless and makes his own decisions and don't play players based on their price tag, nationality, or what the owners may want.

Upset over the "English revolution" (one that apparently includes Adam, a Scotsman, and Allen, a Welshman, while supposedly driving out Carroll, and Englishman) that you were so in favour of last summer? And so distraught over Downing getting another chance after talking about him being a better signing than Mata last year? And I seem to remember comments about Adam outperforming two certain foreign players as well *cough*Aquilani*cough*Meireles*cough*. So sad to see promising youngsters like Sterling and Morgan feature, I can see why you bring them up as criticisms. I'd be interested to know how you got the inside scoop on Suso's and Pacheco's wages, since neither have gotten news time about it. Couldn't possibly be that you're jumping to conclusions there, could it? And on Suso being left out of the EL tie: might have something to do with the fact that he played in the entire U-19 Euros this summer, don't you think? Also, crying over Carroll supposedly leaving, then talking about how players should be judged by the manager on how they play in the system, and not their price tags? And on a similar note, the manager "should be ruthless" but it's wrong for him to send Aquilani out if he believes he's not the right player for the team? We've already been over the fact that the club have plenty of CMs at the moment, so if one comes in at least one would most likely need to go, so I won't bother repeating myself on that point...

Nice to see blatant, bold faced lies made their way in too.

Schweini wrote:Liverpool FC
We are now a franchise first, a football club second. I long the days that when we sold Xabi to Madrid, it was strengthening our rivals, now even Spurs don't count us as rivals. We've made stupid decision after stupid decision 3-4 years in a row now...and until this goes on, we'll never get back up there. Hope we start soon, because signs aren't looking good at the moment.
Viva Rafa

I'm not even deigning this last paragraph with a full response.

Don't throw Rafa in with this nonsense, as this is exactly the type of fan nonsense that we hear from those in England that bash him.

by stevieg8 Wed Aug 01, 2012 1:53 am

I will say about the owners that it's been disconcerting to see them doing with LFC what has been policy at the Boston Red Sox for 8-9 years now, in that leaving players and staff - regardless of stature with the team - are torn apart on their way out. There's no definitive way to align these stories directly with FSG, as it always occurs through "leaks" and "expose pieces" within the media that are never elaborated on, but it seems almost as though they want people to be afraid to walk away from the team. It's even worse when the management decides it's time for you to go, ala Kenny this time around. They tear the person apart as best they can through third parties, so as to make themselves look better, and it truly is sad to see each and every time. A lot of the Boston fans are sick of it as well, and rightfully so; club legends should be treated with more respect.

by poolsupporter Wed Aug 01, 2012 2:00 am

stevieg8 wrote:I will say about the owners that it's been disconcerting to see them doing with LFC what has been policy at the Boston Red Sox for 8-9 years now, in that leaving players and staff - regardless of stature with the team - are torn apart on their way out. There's no definitive way to align these stories directly with FSG, as it always occurs through "leaks" and "expose pieces" within the media that are never elaborated on, but it seems almost as though they want people to be afraid to walk away from the team. It's even worse when the management decides it's time for you to go, ala Kenny this time around. They tear the person apart as best they can through third parties, so as to make themselves look better, and it truly is sad to see each and every time. A lot of the Boston fans are sick of it as well, and rightfully so; club legends should be treated with more respect.

It must be noted though, that letting go of someone like Kenny is never easy. I for one, give the owners a lot of credit for their business oriented mentality. It's naive to believe that it is unneeded. With the number of clubs going into administration, we could really use some of the commercial moves they've made to help us become more self-sufficient. Unfortunately our history alone is not going to keep us afloat.

The thing fans must do is stand by the team through this period of transition. I understand it's hard and I tend to be rather impatient from time to time myself.

As far as things like transfers go, I've sort of given up on trying to play the blame game. Some say the likes of Henderson and Downing were complete Kenny/Commoli buys, whereas others say they were chosen by FSG simply based on stats. What I will agree with is that a number of the new signings did under perform, as did the manager on a number of occasions. Hopefully we recover and show some improvement this season.

by RedOranje Wed Aug 01, 2012 2:13 am

Comolli was brought in to analyse player's stats and decide whether they were good enough, pending Dalglish's approval. So in that the owners employed Comolli, they're culpable. But in that same vein they've moved to correct their mistakes.

Also, what have FSG done to attack Kenny since letting him go? Anything at all? It was sad to see him go, and I personally would have preferred seeing him get another season to set things right, but they (FSG) have done absolutely nothing to attack him. They've been nothing but complimentary of the man himself throughout things, as far as I'm aware.

by Guest Wed Aug 01, 2012 2:25 am

from RAWK

Thats what's killed me the most this Summer. Complete lack of ambition from top to bottom.

Lets start with the sacking of Kenny. Now, rightly or wrongly, it happened and even the staunchest Kenny fan would say they had a case.

What happened next is what worries me:

Fabio Capello, Louis Van Gaal and Rafael Benitez. 3 of the greatest managers in the history of world football and one of the greatest of this century are all available and reported to be interested in taking the job. What do FSG do? They go for a man with one year's experience in top flight football whose greatest achievement in his career was wining the Champions play off final.

Why? Because he plays nice football and is young? Or because he's not as expensive as the other 3?

Leaving alone the whole mess about changing the strategy of having a DOF/Technical director/manager threepartite comittee to fit the needs of Brendan Rodgers (he of championship play off final winning fame), by ignoring the 3 best names available (and interested) on the market, FSG dispplayed a shocking lack of ambition there and then.

Move on to our transfer targets and what do we see? More lack of ambition. With 2 and half weeks to go till the 1st game of the season, we've let 2 senior players go and bought one in. We have a weaker squad today then we did at the end of last season. We are at a standstill in transfers because it's patently obvious we're *bleep* potless.

And who are targetting? Mid table players like Clint *bleep* Dempsey who no other club aiming for top 4 are chasing. How the *bleep* did the club convince so many fans that likes of Dempsey is the best we can get? How the *bleep* has it come to this?

We self pity so much and set the targets so low when 18 months ago we were 3 points of the bottom of the premier league and went and bought one of the hottest players in Europe in Luis Suarez. There are players like Santi Cazorla at an unstable club who would be absolutely *bleep* perfect for us and we are doing next to *bleep* all to try to entice him to come to us.

Where's the "project"? Where's the *bleep* ambition?
Gerard Houllier spoke a lot of crap but he did say one thing that always stuck in my mind "Aim for the moon and you may hit the stars". It's about having lofty targets, about going for the best, about always trying to improve.

This Summer is so similar to the one in 2010 its scary. New manager comes in from a mid table club off the back of a good season to replace a club legend. Speaks a shitload in press conferences, mostly about himself and his "methods". We aim terribly low in the transfer market, signing players who have played for that manager before and target mid range players. All that's left now is for Agger to pull a Mascherano and *bleep* us off in a couple of weeks.

People say some of us are drama queens. I said in another thread that that was bullshit.

We've finished 7th,6th and 8th in our last 3 seasons.

We've had 4 managers since 2010.

We've missed out on CL qualification for 3 seasons.

We've, since 2009, sold our best or very good players every season (Alonso, Yossi, Mascherano, Torres, Meireles etc...) a couple of times to our direct rivals.

We've been through 2 sets of owners and close to administration.

We've spend a shitload of money on horribly average players and made the most idiotic transfer deals in the history of global sport.

But yeah, we're drama queens.

It's bollocks. On field we are, presently, at the worst state it's been we've 1994. We had, then, come off the back of 3 league seasons where we finished 6th 6th and 8th.

The difference between then and now is how *bleep* rotten this club has become. When Roy Evans came in then, he had strong and experienced men like Ronnie Moran around him to give him strength. Who the *bleep* does Rodgers have now? There's no support group around him for what is one of the toughest management jobs in all of sport. Evans didnt have such a competitive league to compete with. We could still outspend a huge majority of clubs.

One last thing about Rodgers and I know this wont be popular but I have to share it once and pray Im *bleep* wrong: Every part of me says that this guy is a phoney. He's a fake. He's a snake eye salesman. He cant shut the *bleep* up about himself and his methods. That story about his 180 pages book the other day, the constant talk about his way of playing, about his experiences etc...

Im a salesman. Every time I look at Rodgers and hear him speak, I cant help but think what a brilliant bullshitter he is. Hope to *bleep* Im wrong and my instincts are way off the mark on this one, but there you go. That's my feeling at the moment.

But phoney or not, the guy needs help. Theres noone around him. Kenny had Sir Bob and Peter Robinson first time round. Who does Rodgers have? Ian Ayre? A set of owners who know less than a 6 year old about the sport?

There's no structure around the place, there's no plan and there's no ambition. We seem to be limping into the new season crossing our fingers none of our best players will leave rather than bringing in some other people who can become part of our elite group of players.

Anyone that's not, at the very least, mildly worried about where we're headed is deluded.

by RedOranje Wed Aug 01, 2012 2:51 am

So you agree with that, then?

What happened to being patient?

by Guest Wed Aug 01, 2012 2:55 am

^ with 90% of it.

and if we are too patient, the rest of our class players (Reina, Glen, Suarez, Agger, Skrtel, and Lucas) will go elsewhere and we'll find ourselves being Villa.

Harsh reality..but then again, I respect your opinion knowing it's different than mines

by RedOranje Wed Aug 01, 2012 3:00 am

Half that post is about Rodgers either not being good enough for the club or being a complete "phoney" and you agree with 90% of it? Then you say that patience will see us lose the rest of our top players... but in your post earlier in the thread you said you would have patience with the manager.

Well? Which is it?

by Guest Wed Aug 01, 2012 3:09 am

By 90% I meant everything bar the Rodgers paragraph. We can't judge Rodgers until minimum next time this year to see whether we've made progress, or whether he stands up to the owners if they turn fake, etc.

90% was exaggeration....almost every part bar rodgers paragraph that we can't rate yet.

by Guest Wed Aug 01, 2012 4:19 am

Another interesting paragraph IMO. This one is a bit more balanced, and rightly condemn the things thrown at BR in the earlier post.4

First things first, I acknowledge that FSG are not perfect. Not even close either. They have made an almighty arse up of a lot of things since they came in, and I think they would admit that themselves. They've done things right as well though. The importance they continue to place in the Academy is very pleasing to see (although some would say it's just to save them money in the long run), so you can't please 'em all.

The sacking of Kenny, whether you agree with it or not, was always going to be incredibly difficult to handle. The actual sacking they didn't handle all that badly, but their lack of support for Kenny before then re Suarez in particular was unacceptable.

There's other issues to be contested too of course, the stadium being the most obvious one. I'd rather leave that to wiser heads than myself though. Not that there can be any disputing they've twiddled their fingers for way too long. There needs to be a resolution soon, because if there's not then we will continue to be left behind.

I don't agree with Brentie's point regarding the hiring of Rodgers. By all accounts, FSG didn't see Kenny as the long term solution to our managerial position (again, whether you agree or not) I think it's fair to say that was the case. So if Kenny wasn't the long term solution, I fail to see how Fabio Capello was. Or Louis Van Gaal for that matter. Clueless FSG may be, but at least they are trying to lay some foundations for the future with the appointment of Rodgers. With the way the club have prioritized the Academy, to appoint Capello would have been counter productive. Van Gaal much less so, because he's always shown a willingness to throw young players in if some of the senior pro's aren't pulling their weight. Rodgers fits though, and that at least is a good starting point. With Capello there would have been an imbalance. Also, I happen to think Capello lacks the motivation as a coach these days (he's in it for the money, and good luck to him because he's basically done it all).

On the whole 'Rodgers is a phoney' thing. Well where do you start with something like that? First of all I don't properly understand what he means. Is Rodgers working undercover for Chelsea and secretly laughing behind our backs? What is it. He's just through the door, and some of our own fans are calling him a 'phoney' - *bleep* off. Not only is it disrespectful to Rodgers, it's based around nothing more than a 'gut feeling'. I think he's done well myself, and has said all the right things (mostly). The dossier thing is another criticism I don't quite understand. To me it just shows he's dedicated, but then different people will read into things as they will. The arrogance accusation is another thing I don't quite see, and even so it's not a bad trait to have as a manager. You would think he walked into his first press conference and called himself 'the special one'.

The Hodgson comparison, well I don't even know where to begin. I think it's fairly obvious to most people the very basic differences between the two. One is a versatile young manager who has shown a willingness to stick to a philosophy of play, even when the chips are down. The other is someone who's been stuck in his ways for longer than most of us have been born, and went against everything a good Liverpool manager should be. Yes, Rodgers is a mid table manager - up until this point, but the clubs he's managed are just that - mid table outfits. He's done it with a certain style though, and it's clear if he can translate his ideas to better players then he'll go very far in the game. I'm not saying for one second that this is a risk free appointment, because it's not. There's no such thing. Guardiola was a far greater risk than Rodgers when Barcelona appointed him back in '08, but if you're prepared to take a risk on a young manager, it might just pay off. Sure, history is littered with failures in that spectrum, but in recent times there's been more than one example of it working out well. Massimo Allegri, before he was appointed as Milan manager had been a 'mid table' manager, and his appointment was met with great scepticism; twelve months later he was hoisting the Scudetto. Conte - a Serie B manager who went to Juventus and saw out the season unbeaten. I'm not saying Rodgers is going to win the League like those managers did. Clearly the circumstances are much different, but the principle remains the same. It's absolutely vital we as fans allow him the time he needs to get us playing the way he wants us to play. Finally it feels as though we're moving in the right direction, just hold fire and keep an eye out, but for god sake - lets not trample on him before he's even warmed his seat.

by Art Morte Wed Aug 01, 2012 7:50 am

Apart from sacking Dalglish, I am happy with our owners.

And well, the second side of that is that I'm not happy with hiring Brendan Rodgers as our manager. I hope he exceeds my expectations.

And what really pisses me off is Rodgers' willingness to let Carroll leave. Well, "let" is the wrong word as Carroll would like to stay, so it's Rodgers' desire to push Carroll out. I'm just afraid he will stubbornly want to play his own system even when we probably haven't got the players to do that.

Anyway, I'm very much looking forward to the season, but that's because I adore Premier League football and seeing Liverpool play, not because I have got high hopes about our success.

by Red Alert Wed Aug 01, 2012 9:45 am

Great post red.

by Fahim89 Wed Aug 01, 2012 9:53 am

Some of the negativity is depressing . . & some views are so contraditory that i am confused what the point of this thread is . . specially the two RAWK articles are total opposites.

I cannot but express my disappointment but the sad part is i have always hoped & prayed things would turn around sooner then later to answer our CRITICS & HATERS not our FANS. Sad it has come to this . . & specially in FSG & Rodgers rein. :facepalm:

@Red brilliantly put together mate . . fully agreed ! !

by Guest Wed Aug 01, 2012 2:33 pm

You guys know even in the past 3 years, I've been very optimistic at start of every season. Hell even Roy's.

I am just setting my expectations incredibly low this time, so when the inevitable (most likely) happens, I won't be disappointed.

by Le Samourai Wed Aug 01, 2012 3:46 pm

I don't particularly like the signings made, and on a personal level, Comoli's moneyball approach disgusts me, but I don't think there's a lack of ambition.I think they're realistic about their targets and just initially didn't make the best moves, but they seem to be attempting to move in another direction and try something different, if they sign the right players to make it happen, it could mean long term and potentially short term success.

by BeautifulGame Sun Aug 05, 2012 6:02 am

What happened next is what worries me:

Fabio Capello, Louis Van Gaal and Rafael Benitez. 3 of the greatest managers in the history of world football and one of the greatest of this century are all available and reported to be interested in taking the job. What do FSG do? They go for a man with one year's experience in top flight football whose greatest achievement in his career was wining the Champions play off final.

Why? Because he plays nice football and is young? Or because he's not as expensive as the other 3?

Leaving alone the whole mess about changing the strategy of having a DOF/Technical director/manager threepartite comittee to fit the needs of Brendan Rodgers (he of championship play off final winning fame), by ignoring the 3 best names available (and interested) on the market, FSG dispplayed a shocking lack of ambition there and then.

Or we are just being realistic and trying to build from scratch and for that we need a young manager withgood philosophy.And Rodgers fitted that bill perfectly.

And we arent the only club that ignored these "great managers".Every other football club who had a managerial vacancy had ignored them too.So its certainly isnt being lack of ambition rather than being realistic with ur ambition which we definitely need at this moment.

Move on to our transfer targets and what do we see? More lack of ambition. With 2 and half weeks to go till the 1st game of the season, we've let 2 senior players go and bought one in. We have a weaker squad today then we did at the end of last season. We are at a standstill in transfers because it's patently obvious we're *bleep* potless.

We have moved on 2 past his best players who contributed almost nothing to our PL campaign last season and were on huge wages.One has moved onto Turkish league and other has gone onto to Argentine league surely an indicator of their ability at present.And has bought in a young player who was in the squad of Italy and has a very good season in Italy for Roma.Certainly we are better than last season.

And frankly it wont be hard for anyone to better Kuyt's performance last year.

And who are targetting? Mid table players like Clint *bleep* Dempsey who no other club aiming for top 4 are chasing. How the *bleep* did the club convince so many fans that likes of Dempsey is the best we can get? How the *bleep* has it come to this?

We self pity so much and set the targets so low when 18 months ago we were 3 points of the bottom of the premier league and went and bought one of the hottest players in Europe in Luis Suarez. There are players like Santi Cazorla at an unstable club who would be absolutely *bleep* perfect for us and we are doing next to *bleep* all to try to entice him to come to us.

He himself has the answer for this in the latter part of his post.

We've finished 7th,6th and 8th in our last 3 seasons.

We've had 4 managers since 2010.

We've missed out on CL qualification for 3 seasons.

We've, since 2009, sold our best or very good players every season (Alonso, Yossi, Mascherano, Torres, Meireles etc...) a couple of times to our direct rivals.

We've been through 2 sets of owners and close to administration.

We've spend a shitload of money on horribly average players and made the most idiotic transfer deals in the history of global sport.

Why exactly would a player choose us over a Top 4 team if we target players chased by CL teams.

Frankly Spurs Frankly Spurs spent jack all in last 3 seasons yet finished 4th,5th and 4th.For all the criticism fo FSG tell me how many clubs in Europe had a better net spend than us last season?

And finally if we are realistic we should be happy with 5th or 6th but if u are dreaming of 4th after finishing 6th 7th and 8 th in last three seasons then the fault is with unrealistic fans not the manager or team.

What we should aim for this season is stability not a top 4 finish.If we finish 4th then its just an incredible achievement not a realistic target certainly not for this season

by iftikhar Sun Aug 05, 2012 11:34 am

Even if we had signed a 'Great' manager and 'Great' players, would that be any gurantee to success!!! Mou failed in his first year while Pep failed this year. Manc failed in his first while Farg failed this year. Then there are instances of AVB, PSG etc.

While Brendon has got nothing to show for himself as yet, this was excatly the case for most of the 'Great' managers of our times.

Yes we have taken a gamble on Brendon (not to mention it would have been gamble as with the 'Great' managers as well) but lets not forget we did the same with Reina, Agger, Skrtel, Lucas etc.

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Very Underwhelmed by Everything in our club

Very Underwhelmed by Everything in our club

Re: Very Underwhelmed by Everything in our club

Re: Very Underwhelmed by Everything in our club

Re: Very Underwhelmed by Everything in our club

Re: Very Underwhelmed by Everything in our club

Re: Very Underwhelmed by Everything in our club

Re: Very Underwhelmed by Everything in our club

Re: Very Underwhelmed by Everything in our club

Re: Very Underwhelmed by Everything in our club

Re: Very Underwhelmed by Everything in our club

Re: Very Underwhelmed by Everything in our club

Re: Very Underwhelmed by Everything in our club

Re: Very Underwhelmed by Everything in our club

Re: Very Underwhelmed by Everything in our club

Re: Very Underwhelmed by Everything in our club

Re: Very Underwhelmed by Everything in our club

Re: Very Underwhelmed by Everything in our club

Re: Very Underwhelmed by Everything in our club

Re: Very Underwhelmed by Everything in our club

Re: Very Underwhelmed by Everything in our club