Pele is not the best in history [FACTS]

izzy26 wrote:

Lionel Messi wrote:
Saying 'nobody tried to break Messi's legs before' isn't opinion it would be a fact. Opinion would be 'tackles on Messi are not as hard as the ones on Pele back when he played.'

It was a comparison from a poster who made the judgement based on his opinion.

That's not a fact, it's an opinion.

Comparing what and what?

Defenders of the past were basically given a carte blanche to do as they wish on the pitch. Just to think that in Pele's time cards were non-existent. Tackles on the legs were a standard.

In Maradona's era tackles from behind was perfectly legally and utilized indiscriminately. Butcher of Bilbao anyone?

Lionel Messi wrote:

izzy26 wrote:

Lionel Messi wrote:
Saying 'nobody tried to break Messi's legs before' isn't opinion it would be a fact. Opinion would be 'tackles on Messi are not as hard as the ones on Pele back when he played.'

It was a comparison from a poster who made the judgement based on his opinion.

That's not a fact, it's an opinion.

Comparing what and what?

question?

If someone compared this arguement between Pele and R9 would you be arguing your point?

izzy26 wrote:

Lionel Messi wrote:

izzy26 wrote:

Lionel Messi wrote:
Saying 'nobody tried to break Messi's legs before' isn't opinion it would be a fact. Opinion would be 'tackles on Messi are not as hard as the ones on Pele back when he played.'

It was a comparison from a poster who made the judgement based on his opinion.

That's not a fact, it's an opinion.

Comparing what and what?

question?

If someone compared this arguement between Pele and R9 would you be arguing your point?

Probably not since I didn't watch R9 regularly and wouldn't be able to make a comment if he had received a few tackles that were intended to injure.

Basically he's a 2008 Barca bandwagoner...

Gotcha..

Seppuku wrote:Basically he's a 2008 Barca bandwagoner...

Gotcha..

Not really. Kind of unnesscary really.

He's 20 so I guess he starte watching football around the early 2000s. Like 2002 onwards?

I could be wrong. Am I Lionel Messi?

Seppuku wrote:Basically he's a 2008 Barca bandwagoner...

Gotcha..

Whatever you say, just because I didn't watch many of R9's games doesn't mean I didn't see him play. Why would I watch Real Madrid regularly? They aren't the team I support?

Question: Who has played the biggest part on side tracking this thread?

Lionel Messi certainly didn't do it on his own did he?

izzy26 wrote:

Seppuku wrote:Basically he's a 2008 Barca bandwagoner...

Gotcha..

Not really. Kind of unnesscary really.

He's 20 so I guess he starte watching football around the early 2000s. Like 2002 onwards?

I could be wrong. Am I Lionel Messi?

I watched football in 2000-2003 but my interest didn't peak until 2005ish

Irish_Catalan_Scouser wrote:Personally I don't regard Pele as being any better than any top class striker in history.

As some other posters have pointed out: At large times in his career he wasn't even the best Brazilian never mind the best player in the world.

Is it WC wins that puts him above the likes of Pukas, Di Steffano, Romario, Ronaldo, Van Basten etc.

I analyzed strong points on Pele in the first page in the thread but in short:

the whole notion of X being better than Y is flawed, all these player bar Romario (who was not consistent enough IMHO) are Tier 1 players, they are great at what they do and some.

Again, Pele was never sighted at his peak (1960-1968) because he was injured in those two world cups, and even in the games he played, he was an absolute beast.

And why was I negative repped for god's sake
not that I care

Lionel Messi wrote:I watched football in 2000-2003 but my interest didn't peak until 2005ish

What took you so long?

Please don't say Cricket.

izzy26 wrote:

Lionel Messi wrote:I watched football in 2000-2003 but my interest didn't peak until 2005ish

What took you so long?

Please don't say Cricket.

Ive lived in the US most of my life so I'm not as exposed to it as others

omarish wrote:

ChollaVille wrote:Pele never faced defenders like Maldini, Puyol or Vidić

Messi never faced a defender trying to break your leg.

Trust me, most of the modern footballers wouldn't be able to take that shit. Most of them would come out with broken legs.

First this is not thread about Messi, and if you ask me he is not thebest in history, but he is better than Pele was.

And yes... "Messi never faced a defender trying to break your leg."

Whole Real Madrid team + this...

ChollaVille wrote:

omarish wrote:

ChollaVille wrote:Pele never faced defenders like Maldini, Puyol or Vidić

Messi never faced a defender trying to break your leg.

Trust me, most of the modern footballers wouldn't be able to take that shit. Most of them would come out with broken legs.

First this is not thread about Messi, and if you ask me he is not thebest in history, but he is better than Pele was. But you are first class LOOSER, so you are trying to troll on Messi in every comment... LOOSER!!!


And yes... "Messi never faced a defender trying to break your leg."

Whole Real Madrid team + this...

First off, dont insult me like that. It's against the rules.

2nd, once again, no team has genuinly tried to break Messis leg becouse it gives no benefits like in Pele-time were cards didnt exist. None of these can be compared to Pele-time.

IMO, Pele is certainly not the best in history, as in the number 1 undisputed best....but I can understand why some claimed that he is the best since he is good enough to be in contention....However, compared to maradona, cryuff, r9 and de-kaiser (although r9's peak isn't long enough to be in contention) I just felt that he does not have enough magic in him, and imo Puskas and Best is at least on par with him, however best dont have many major trophies to show for it..Garrincha IMO is better than Pele and easily imo in the top 5 of all time

Real Madrid fans, you do not have to attack messi here, I dont see the point of posting insults against us in threads that has nothing to do with barca ...makes some of you look childish if you dont mind me saying....and speaking of messi, he shouldn't be in the equation YET, because his career isn't done

I gotta admit to op that, he had balls to pull this kind of debate up.

omarish wrote:

ChollaVille wrote:

omarish wrote:

ChollaVille wrote:Pele never faced defenders like Maldini, Puyol or Vidić

Messi never faced a defender trying to break your leg.

Trust me, most of the modern footballers wouldn't be able to take that shit. Most of them would come out with broken legs.

First this is not thread about Messi, and if you ask me he is not thebest in history, but he is better than Pele was. But you are first class LOOSER, so you are trying to troll on Messi in every comment... LOOSER!!!


And yes... "Messi never faced a defender trying to break your leg."

Whole Real Madrid team + this...

First off, dont insult me like that. It's against the rules.

2nd, once again, no team has genuinly tried to break Messis leg becouse it gives no benefits like in Pele-time were cards didnt exist. None of these can be compared to Pele-time.

Yellow cards to indicate a caution and red cards to indicate an expulsion were used for the first time in the 1970 FIFA World Cup in Mexico." So Pele won his first "Player of the year" award with CARDS!!!
Third before cards there were verbal cautions equal to suspensions.

THE TRUTH = Pele is not the best in history!!!

Garincha >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Pele
My grand father and every of his firends (they are older than Pele) are saying that!!!
And what I saw, on some videos... Garincha was better, he was one class above Pele.

"First of all, you are looser."
"you are looser."
"looser."


smfh

Since the OP seems to insult me alot, I'm not even gonna bother. Just shows how stupid this thread was from start and how stupid and ignorant his arguments are.

Well my old man's old man said Magico Gonzalez was better than both but what Pele had both those men did not have: Discipline, discipline to actually stay sober for a long period of time...

Doc wrote:Well my old man's old man said Magico Gonzalez was better than both but what Pele had both those men did not have: Discipline, discipline to actually stay sober for a long period of time...

I agree with you. He was first pro football player, Gonzalez and Garinch were not professionals, they were playing football just for fun.

Longitivity... Giggs is great in last 20 years, Ronaldinho was great 3 years, but still Ronaldinho > Giggs.

Pele had 30 years when he was first time official the best on the World. He is great, on of the greatest, but not the greatest. I still rate Maradona as No.1. Maradona was the team, Pele had great players in his team, and that plars won official player of the year award with Pele as team mate. So they were palying with Pele, and they were better than him. If he has the best statistics, he is not the best player.

oh here we are acting as if napoli didnt have quality players back then again

Ciro Ferrara, Careca, De Napoli, Giordano weren't no scrub players though.

dont listen to your grandfather.

just sayin'

worst thread ever

you can tell the op is a barca fan, pele dares say hes better than messi and the bitter hater thread pops up

first, if youre arguing about quaility of leagues, you havent a leg to stand on with la liga

2nd.

how many ballon dors and team of tournaments have xavi been in? yet barca fans claim hes one of the best ever.

3rd.
its all poor logic, modern fanboy reasoning applied to an age where it doesnt apply

every brazilian of that era claims hes the best, every player...but noooooo

team of the year ftw

was team of the year even a big deal back then? its not even a big deal now

jelly op?