Lahm defensively solid?

MindGames7 wrote:Well, in my opinion, risks are not worth it. If I was a manger, I'd set up a very low-risk team and put a lot of emphasis on possession and patience. That's just me.

There's no way that we could tell which tactic works best unless we were both managers or had a game of FIFA or something. But I don't have a playstation or anything so...

The only people who think like you are Relegation Threatened view. Again I dont mean to come accross as rude but its in general according to me a very un-intelligent way of thinking. Play no pass which has an element of creativity or risk in it??

Just maintain possession on & on for 90 minutes. Even it sounds rubbish. Aimless non-practical even unrealistic in Fifa kind of football. Sorry to say but your basic ideas about football are even worse than our Resident Troll Idriozet Messiah.

The only way anyone would even consider doing something like this if we had 11 Rafael's & Phil Jones' against the likes of Messi,Thiago Silva,Iniesta,Ronaldo & so on.

MindGames7 wrote:I think the only good point you made there was the fact that Lahm plays further forward than Abidal.

I would argue that Abidal's sensibleness makes up for his lack of attacking contribution. Him staying back allows all the other players to get forward. If he went forward as well then their defence would fall apart and they wouldn't win the ball back as quickly, which was evident when he didn't play much last season.

Don't get me wrong, I rate Lahm very highly, but Abidal is something else.

However I feel that Lahm should be played further forward in Champions League games, as he's simply not good enough defensively to play at left back at the highest level.

This is what I feel is another Garbage point of view because you are heavily biased. Since Abidal has 0 attacking ability he will obviously stay back. You are making it sound like he is Dani Alves but stays back because he has to take care of others. That is not the truth.

That is a massive limitation. Him being 0 in attack as a Modern Day Full-Back automatically makes himself mediocre. Just like Jordi Alba being a 0 in defense makes him mediocre.

Lahm at LB is not as good as RB. Despite that fact I think there are fewer LB's in the world who are better than him defensively. We have a VERY High Standard for Lahm where he has to primarily DEFENSIVELY be the No.1 RB in the world or thereabout & have big offensive contributions.

At LB who is better than Lahm?? Marcelo,Criscito?Cole?? All of them are in the same level. None of them are great attackers & great defenders together & play at a high level week in & out. None. As a LB I would say Lahm is one of the best in the world.

That is the reason Barca wanted him to replace Abidal last winter when Abidal was nearing full fitness because Lahm is way better than say Alves defensively.

Again Lahm might not be the undisputed best FB in the world at LB like he is at RB but I cant see a lot of LB's who are better than him. I mean Cole had bad games & got raped by Valencia too.

Kingofeverythingclassy wrote:The only people who think like you are Relegation Threatened view. Again I dont mean to come accross as rude but its in general according to me a very un-intelligent way of thinking. Play no pass which has an element of creativity or risk in it??

Just maintain possession on & on for 90 minutes. Even it sounds rubbish. Aimless non-practical even unrealistic in Fifa kind of football. Sorry to say but your basic ideas about football are even worse than our Resident Troll Idriozet Messiah.

The only way anyone would even consider doing something like this if we had 11 Rafael's & Phil Jones' against the likes of Messi,Thiago Silva,Iniesta,Ronaldo & so on.

I don't mean just passing it around aimlessly for 90 minutes, did you really think I would be that stupid?

I mean simple things like, for example, I would tell my striker to always look to lay the ball off to the attacking midfielder more often than turning and running at the defence because the midfielder would be in a better position to see the runs being made ahead of the striker, and would be in a better position to play a pass, so none of the forward momentum would be lost. Turning and running at the defence slows the attack down and it gives the defenders a chance to catch up, plus the chances of you making something from it is much lower than if you keep possession and wait for a better opportunity to play a through ball to appear.

And please cut out the rudeness, you're acting like I've said something to offend you.

No wonder this guy thinks a traffic cone like Carrick is a world-class player, he seems to think just sitting there and holding the ball is the best thing in the game.


My worth in the football world is probably less than 50cent, but I can just sit down there as well like a traffic cone like Carrick and keep possession I bet mindass will think I am better than Kroos.

MindGames7 wrote:I think the only good point you made there was the fact that Lahm plays further forward than Abidal.

I would argue that Abidal's sensibleness makes up for his lack of attacking contribution. Him staying back allows all the other players to get forward. If he went forward as well then their defence would fall apart and they wouldn't win the ball back as quickly, which was evident when he didn't play much last season.

Don't get me wrong, I rate Lahm very highly, but Abidal is something else.

However I feel that Lahm should be played further forward in Champions League games, as he's simply not good enough defensively to play at left back at the highest level.

TO add to my existing point. We played Kroos Schweni,2 guys who dont defend a lot. A guy like Alaba who is more of a winger & Lahm at RB supported by RObben who is defensively meh.

BUT it happened & went well. I think it is about the defensive capability of the player. Lahm for example IMO is a better tackler & faster than Abidal & his last ditch sliders are much better than Abidal IMO. Which is why he can come back,recover & bail out the defense.

You can argue Abidal is taller,stronger,maybe has more of a positional idea(disputable) or the rest but if he as a FB sits with his a** near the touchline all the time that is not really that difficult.

The Messiah wrote:No wonder this guy thinks a traffic cone like Carrick is a world-class player, he seems to think just sitting there and holding the ball is the best thing in the game.


My worth in the football world is probably less than 50cent, but I can just sit down there as well like a traffic cone like Carrick and keep possession I bet mindass will think I am better than Kroos.

Carrick is not a bad player for say a mid or low level team like Sunderland.

I have never seen him call Carrick World Class. Personally I feel Carrick has 0 value in Top Grade football. Carrick's & Park's are junk grade football because they are average in everything but not great in anything.

Creatively or Defensively they just dont stand out. Maybe as Depth Player but if you want a Great Team you need Great Players.

I mean if you want lazy possession players who sit with their a** in front of defense & make few ridiculous safe passes then anybody could do it.

Our so-called youth prodigy Emre Can who is defensively average & has like 0 Creativity can do that role.

Kingofeverythingclassy wrote:This is what I feel is another Garbage point of view because you are heavily biased. Since Abidal has 0 attacking ability he will obviously stay back. You are making it sound like he is Dani Alves but stays back because he has to take care of others. That is not the truth.

That is a massive limitation. Him being 0 in attack as a Modern Day Full-Back automatically makes himself mediocre. Just like Jordi Alba being a 0 in defense makes him mediocre.

Lahm at LB is not as good as RB. Despite that fact I think there are fewer LB's in the world who are better than him defensively. We have a VERY High Standard for Lahm where he has to primarily DEFENSIVELY be the No.1 RB in the world or thereabout & have big offensive contributions.

At LB who is better than Lahm?? Marcelo,Criscito?Cole?? All of them are in the same level. None of them are great attackers & great defenders together & play at a high level week in & out. None. As a LB I would say Lahm is one of the best in the world.

That is the reason Barca wanted him to replace Abidal last winter when Abidal was nearing full fitness because Lahm is way better than say Alves defensively.

Again Lahm might not be the undisputed best FB in the world at LB like he is at RB but I cant see a lot of LB's who are better than him. I mean Cole had bad games & got raped by Valencia too.

I can only reiterate the point that I made before. You can't have too many attack minded players in your team, you have to have a balance. Barcelona's tactic is not to play down the wings and cross the ball. The purpose of Abidal is to provide width and stretch out the opponents defence, and then play it back into the creative midfield talents so they can do their thing.

With Bayern, they have Schweinsteiger and Tymoshchuk/Kroos/whoever who sit deep, so it's ok if their full-backs bomb forward. It's the same with Manchester United. Carrick and Scholes/Fletcher/whoever sit deep and so it's fine that their full-backs bomb forward. With Barcelona however, only Busquets sits back, so only one of their full-backs can bomb forward. At least, this was the case up until the last season or so when they lost Abidal. Now, they have Xavi sitting deeper and making more of a defensive contribution, to allow both full-backs to get forward.

Does that make sense to you now?

Idris,King and MindGames debating with each other..A true trollers' paradise

Kingofeverythingclassy wrote:Carrick is not a bad player for say a mid or low level team like Sunderland.

I have never seen him call Carrick World Class. Personally I feel Carrick has 0 value in Top Grade football. Carrick's & Park's are junk grade football because they are average in everything but not great in anything.

Creatively or Defensively they just dont stand out. Maybe as Depth Player but if you want a Great Team you need Great Players.

I mean if you want lazy possession players who sit with their a** in front of defense & make few ridiculous safe passes then anybody could do it.

Our so-called youth prodigy Emre Can who is defensively average & has like 0 Creativity can do that role.

Not just anyone can do what Carrick does. You have to be very clever with your timing and your positioning, and not many players can pass as well as he can either. He has been an integral part of our success in recent years, and just because you find him boring to watch doesn't make him a bad player - in fact it makes him a very good player, because it means that he does his job so well that you don't even notice that he's doing it, which is exactly what you want from a defensive minded player - he makes it look EASY.

Surag wrote:Idris,King and MindGames debating with each other..A true trollers' paradise

Explain how I'm a troll please?

Edit: oh sorry, did you mean we're the ones that fall for the bait?

Surag wrote:Idris,King and MindGames debating with each other..A true trollers' paradise

I'm not a troller, I have already told him what I think and my terms of debating topics like this before we enter into this debate and he gladly accepted my terms, King is not a troller as well, he debate smartly and most people here can not stand him because he his very smart and choose his word and point wisely.


Anyways I don't know about mindgames though, he seems like one and his name suggest it.

The Messiah wrote:

Surag wrote:Idris,King and MindGames debating with each other..A true trollers' paradise

I'm not a troller, I have already told him what I think and my terms of debating topics like this before we enter into this debate and he gladly accepted my terms, King is not a troller as well, he debate smartly and most people here can not stand him because he his very smart and choose his word and point wisely.


Anyways I don't know about mindgames though, he seems like one and his name suggest it.

Troll - noun - posting on the Internet intended to provoke an indignant response in the reader.

You had insulted United's players with no evidence to back you up, you have claimed that Bayern is a supersquad and that you feel sorry for me as a United fan, you have repeated a load of overused cliches about United which simply aren't true, insulted my intelligence and have generally made a lot of efforts to try and wind me up.

I on the other hand have provided perfectly logical arguments, with evidence, the flaws of which have been identified and addressed. I have never strayed off topic.

So which one of us has been intending to provoke an indignant response in the reader? Obviously you.

Can't believe I fell for it. You win, troll.

Saying Lahm losses the ball and useless in defense is not way of provoking Bayern Munich fans, I never said anything that had not been said before about those United players before. Evra people call him Thus and Mediocre, Carrick some United fan call him a traffic cone, Howard I was not the first to call him a united fan, Fergie time is real and I was not the one who invented it.


You are the only one, probably in this world that seems to think Lahm is not good defending and losses the ball, isn't that evidence of an ancient grandmaster troll, who has master minded the art of trolling and probably have a PHd in the act....?

The Messiah wrote:Saying Lahm losses the ball and useless in defense is not way of provoking Bayern Munich fans, I never said anything that have not been said about those United players before.


You are the only one, probably in this world that seems to think Lahm is not good defending and losses the ball, isn't that evidence of an ancient grandmaster troll, who have master minded the art of trolling....?

I did not say that Lahm loses the ball a lot or is useless in defence.

I said he loses the ball less than Eric Abidal and is worse in defence than Eric Abidal, and I think I provided evidence for both of those things.

Lahm is very good at defending and very good at passing. Abidal is just better, in my opinion.

MindGames7 wrote:

The Messiah wrote:Saying Lahm losses the ball and useless in defense is not way of provoking Bayern Munich fans, I never said anything that have not been said about those United players before.


You are the only one, probably in this world that seems to think Lahm is not good defending and losses the ball, isn't that evidence of an ancient grandmaster troll, who have master minded the art of trolling....?

I did not say that Lahm loses the ball a lot or is useless in defence.

I said he loses the ball less than Eric Abidal and is worse in defence than Eric Abidal, and I think I provided evidence for both of those things.

Lahm is very good at defending and very good at passing. Abidal is just better, in my opinion.

I take that as an insult in my opinion, this thread is about Lahm being defensive solid and how he had started all games for Bayern since 2009, it had nothing to do with comparison until you brought it up. we could have posted it on right-back section if that was the purpose and intention, we are supposed to post his video and talk about his match performance not comparison

I remember I told you to go away, you just had to troll, didn't you..?

The Messiah wrote:I take that as an insult in my opinion, this thread is about Lahm being defensive solid and how he had started all games for Bayern since 2009, it had nothing to do with comparison until you brought it up. we could have posted it on right-back section if that was the purpose and intention, we are supposed to post his video and talk about his match performance not comparison

I remember I told you to go away, you just had to troll, didn't you..?

And so we've come full circle. I replied to this point hours ago.

I've done it. I've replied to every point you can make. I'm so happy.

Nice talking to you, I'm done now.

MindGames7 wrote:

The Messiah wrote:Saying Lahm losses the ball and useless in defense is not way of provoking Bayern Munich fans, I never said anything that have not been said about those United players before.


You are the only one, probably in this world that seems to think Lahm is not good defending and losses the ball, isn't that evidence of an ancient grandmaster troll, who have master minded the art of trolling....?

I did not say that Lahm loses the ball a lot or is useless in defence.

I said he loses the ball less than Eric Abidal and is worse in defence than Eric Abidal, and I think I provided evidence for both of those things.

Lahm is very good at defending and very good at passing. Abidal is just better, in my opinion.

Again. You proved nothing. Those are garbage stats. According to those stats Nigel De Jong is offensively better than Iniesta & Xavi. So there you have it,those stats mean sh** man.

Honestly you have to be pretty ridiculous with argue with something as lame as passing percentage or percentage of passes successful

MindGames7 wrote:

Kingofeverythingclassy wrote:This is what I feel is another Garbage point of view because you are heavily biased. Since Abidal has 0 attacking ability he will obviously stay back. You are making it sound like he is Dani Alves but stays back because he has to take care of others. That is not the truth.

That is a massive limitation. Him being 0 in attack as a Modern Day Full-Back automatically makes himself mediocre. Just like Jordi Alba being a 0 in defense makes him mediocre.

Lahm at LB is not as good as RB. Despite that fact I think there are fewer LB's in the world who are better than him defensively. We have a VERY High Standard for Lahm where he has to primarily DEFENSIVELY be the No.1 RB in the world or thereabout & have big offensive contributions.

At LB who is better than Lahm?? Marcelo,Criscito?Cole?? All of them are in the same level. None of them are great attackers & great defenders together & play at a high level week in & out. None. As a LB I would say Lahm is one of the best in the world.

That is the reason Barca wanted him to replace Abidal last winter when Abidal was nearing full fitness because Lahm is way better than say Alves defensively.

Again Lahm might not be the undisputed best FB in the world at LB like he is at RB but I cant see a lot of LB's who are better than him. I mean Cole had bad games & got raped by Valencia too.

I can only reiterate the point that I made before. You can't have too many attack minded players in your team, you have to have a balance. Barcelona's tactic is not to play down the wings and cross the ball. The purpose of Abidal is to provide width and stretch out the opponents defence, and then play it back into the creative midfield talents so they can do their thing.

With Bayern, they have Schweinsteiger and Tymoshchuk/Kroos/whoever who sit deep, so it's ok if their full-backs bomb forward. It's the same with Manchester United. Carrick and Scholes/Fletcher/whoever sit deep and so it's fine that their full-backs bomb forward. With Barcelona however, only Busquets sits back, so only one of their full-backs can bomb forward. At least, this was the case up until the last season or so when they lost Abidal. Now, they have Xavi sitting deeper and making more of a defensive contribution, to allow both full-backs to get forward.

Does that make sense to you now?

NO. We have 0 guys who stay behind. Both Kroos & Piggy are forward minded players. When we have Gustavo,he stays behind sometimes. That is it. We have never had 2 guys staying behind,sometimes 1,sometimes 0.

Atleast Barca has Biscuits. Lets face it. Abidal's offensive ability is rubbish which is why he stays behind. If he Alves' attacking ability he would go forward. Lahm goes forward becomes he can come back & cover it. We dont need anyone to cover for Lahm.

As for the Carrick post, again he does nothing. And if you wanna be happy with you main midfield maestro invisible then sure. I guess being outplayed by Basel,Benfica & Bilbao have obviously lowered your standards a lot. So you can be happy with your invisible players.

MindGames7 wrote:

Kingofeverythingclassy wrote:The only people who think like you are Relegation Threatened view. Again I dont mean to come accross as rude but its in general according to me a very un-intelligent way of thinking. Play no pass which has an element of creativity or risk in it??

Just maintain possession on & on for 90 minutes. Even it sounds rubbish. Aimless non-practical even unrealistic in Fifa kind of football. Sorry to say but your basic ideas about football are even worse than our Resident Troll Idriozet Messiah.

The only way anyone would even consider doing something like this if we had 11 Rafael's & Phil Jones' against the likes of Messi,Thiago Silva,Iniesta,Ronaldo & so on.

I don't mean just passing it around aimlessly for 90 minutes, did you really think I would be that stupid?

I mean simple things like, for example, I would tell my striker to always look to lay the ball off to the attacking midfielder more often than turning and running at the defence because the midfielder would be in a better position to see the runs being made ahead of the striker, and would be in a better position to play a pass, so none of the forward momentum would be lost. Turning and running at the defence slows the attack down and it gives the defenders a chance to catch up, plus the chances of you making something from it is much lower than if you keep possession and wait for a better opportunity to play a through ball to appear.

And please cut out the rudeness, you're acting like I've said something to offend you.

I think you should have a debate with Idriozet. You & him suit each other because you make 0 sense & keep on mumbling.

Your ST turning & giving the ball to the No.10 whenever he can & medios seeing runs of ST's & so on.

What on earth has this to do with Lahm?? The concept of playing stupid safe diagonal passes or cross or play creative risky passes to unlock a defense.

Nothing. You are mumbling nothing. WEIRD INCORRIGLE STUFF. Just writing for the sake of writing. Have fun explaing to Idriozet.