Messi, Xavi, Iniesta are all good & God Knows I Love them But Ronaldo deserves the Ballon D'or

teamanarchy wrote:

Senor Penguin wrote:

teamanarchy wrote:But, when comparing him to Messi, it is quite relevant, because when not wearing a Barcelona shirt, he's been pretty average.
Messi stats (not for Barca):
2006-2011:
48 apps, 9 goals. Ratio: 0.18
Ronaldo stats (not for Madrid):
2003-2011:
351 apps, 139 goals. Ratio:0.39

"Not for Madrid" meaning for Portugal and United? Compared to Messi's statistics being for Argentina only basically. Not to mention that Ronaldo is 2 years older than Messi.

Alright, let's look past the point that Messi has never proven himself at another club, in a different league, with a different language, etc.
and let's make this "fair":
Ronaldo (Portugal):
apps 60, goals 21. Ratio: 0.35

Ronaldo being 3 years older makes no difference really. Both have been part of their national teams for a similair period of time.
ANd BTW, this whole thing was simply to illustrate the point of Ronaldo having proved himself in more than 1 jersey. A point which is, to many people, simply a given fact.

"To many people a given fact"? Lol. It's a fact for everyone. For me included. I don't see how it makes Ronaldo more complete than Messi by any means. If he was good at adapting he would've had no trouble going into Clasico matches by now but he still struggles. Poor lad.

ijomer wrote:

Senor Penguin wrote:

teamanarchy wrote:

Senor Penguin wrote:

teamanarchy wrote:Did any of you, who are criticizing him, read what he had to say?

Basically, he said:
1. Messi is amazing, but he does play for what is basically an unstoppable team.
2. Ronaldo is more complete and better in the air.
3. Ronaldo plays for RM, where it is more complicated to play, and thus more difficult to perform.
4. He's also proved himself in England.
5. In 2011, the calendar year Ronaldo's stats are amazing (more goals scored than Messi).

And he has a point there.

Ronaldo is not more complete than Messi. All-around he may have more physical attributes compared to Messi but he's a mentally weak player compared to Messi, who has a much better footballing brain too. And what Messi lacks in the all-around physical department, he compensates for by being unique when it comes to agility, balance, acceleration and close-control.

Callejon is a much better bet for Ballon D'or anyway.

By complete, he basically meant that Ronaldo is two-footed and can head the ball

Ronaldo two-footed? LOL I'd trust more in Messi's ability to use both feet.

good morning Cryuff

Have you ever seen Ronaldo make a proper cross with his left foot? No you haven't. Why? The answer is simple. He is NOT two footed.

I don't know if Ronaldo can cross properly with his left, but I have seen him score some good goals with his left foot.

7amood11 wrote:I don't know if Ronaldo can cross properly with his left, but I have seen him score some good goals with his left foot.

And does this make a player fit the bill of being two-footed?

If it does then that makes Messi a player who is good in air because he scored a header against United in a Champions League final.

Someone who is a proper two-footed player can use both feet successfully consistently. Not once, twice or thrice in a decade.

Penguin

Ronaldo is complete because he is two footed and can score with his head?

Good Lord! Save me from such logic.

Cronaldo fans Always oblivious to the truth and reality, can't take proper criticism of their deity.

Lemme guess Callejon is more complete?

Senor Penguin wrote:

7amood11 wrote:I don't know if Ronaldo can cross properly with his left, but I have seen him score some good goals with his left foot.

And does this make a player fit the bill of being two-footed?

If it does then that makes Messi a player who is good in air because he scored a header against United in a Champions League final.

Someone who is a proper two-footed player can use both feet successfully consistently. Not once, twice or thrice in a decade.

Fair enough then, you do have a point.

kiranr wrote:
Ronaldo is complete because he is two footed and can score with his head?

Good Lord! Save me from such logic.

u mad bro?

I'm not saying it's true... But it's an easy conclusion to come to.

kiranr wrote:
Ronaldo is complete because he is two footed and can score with his head?

Good Lord! Save me from such logic.

What next, C.Ronaldo for president. These Lulz won't stop, we've to try and live with them

Callejon is cheapper at least

teamanarchy wrote:

Senor Penguin wrote:

teamanarchy wrote:But, when comparing him to Messi, it is quite relevant, because when not wearing a Barcelona shirt, he's been pretty average.
Messi stats (not for Barca):
2006-2011:
48 apps, 9 goals. Ratio: 0.18
Ronaldo stats (not for Madrid):
2003-2011:
351 apps, 139 goals. Ratio:0.39

"Not for Madrid" meaning for Portugal and United? Compared to Messi's statistics being for Argentina only basically. Not to mention that Ronaldo is 2 years older than Messi.

Alright, let's look past the point that Messi has never proven himself at another club, in a different league, with a different language, etc.
and let's make this "fair":
Ronaldo (Portugal):
apps 60, goals 21. Ratio: 0.35

Ronaldo being 3 years older makes no difference really. Both have been part of their national teams for a similair period of time.
ANd BTW, this whole thing was simply to illustrate the point of Ronaldo having proved himself in more than 1 jersey. A point which is, to many people, simply a given fact.

Well the difference between their national team set up is that Messi has far more influence for the team as this is also taken into account he plays a deeper role than usual and is mostly if not all the time the best player on the pitch for Argentina.

CR on the other hand has been poor for Portugal for as long as I can remember with his selfish fits on the pitch and being close to anonymous while being outperformed by Nani game after game. His play for Portugal is a shadow of what it is at RM

EarlyPrototype wrote:Lemme guess Callejon is more complete?

No. He just excels, like Messi, at certain attributes that Ronaldo doesn't. Of course not at the same levels as Messi by any means.

Callejon, for example, has a higher passing percentage than Ronaldo, commits less fouls, draws more fouls (see last season where he was fouled more than Messi and Ronaldo), has a better defensive work-rate and is really great at running deep, beating the offside rule. Not to mention he's a very clinical player who doesn't need a lot of chances to convert them into goals.

I like him especially because he plays for the crest and the Madridismo shines from him every time he plays. He's our youth product and a very good one at that.

Senor Penguin wrote:Cronaldo fans Always oblivious to the truth and reality, can't take proper criticism of their deity.

So, you're under the impression that I'm a Ronaldo fan?
Nope. I'm not. I merely acknowledge that he's a fantastic player.
If you can't then you're the one that is under delusions.
In fact, Ronaldo is amongst my least favourite players at Madrid.
But it's clear that he is great, so I endure him.

teamanarchy wrote:

Senor Penguin wrote:Cronaldo fans Always oblivious to the truth and reality, can't take proper criticism of their deity.

So, you're under the impression that I'm a Ronaldo fan?
Nope. I'm not. I merely acknowledge that he's a fantastic player.
If you can't then you're the one that is under delusions.
In fact, Ronaldo is amongst my least favourite players at Madrid.
But it's clear that he is great, so I endure him.

Wasn't directed at you. More at those who are so desperate to assassinate me instead of countering my arguments against Ronaldo.

They're so juvenile lol

Senor Penguin wrote:

EarlyPrototype wrote:Lemme guess Callejon is more complete?

No. He just excels, like Messi, at certain attributes that Ronaldo doesn't. Of course not at the same levels as Messi by any means.

Callejon, for example, has a higher passing percentage than Ronaldo, commits less fouls, draws more fouls (see last season where he was fouled more than Messi and Ronaldo), has a better defensive work-rate and is really great at running deep, beating the offside rule. Not to mention he's a very clinical player who doesn't need a lot of chances to convert them into goals.

I like him especially because he plays for the crest and the Madridismo shines from him every time he plays. He's our youth product and a very good one at that.

Callejon has his uses, but the fact that he beats the offside trap and sometimes grabs a goal is the only thing to his game and he will never be a top player.

Can Messi do that with his right foot?

messi is clearly the better player but he is clearly not tw0- footed.. you may have some personal problem with ronaldo or something but you cant deny that he is quite good with his left foot.. and he is more complete than messi in a way .. messi keeps it simple but whatever he does he does it the best.

teamanarchy wrote:

kiranr wrote:
Ronaldo is complete because he is two footed and can score with his head?

Good Lord! Save me from such logic.

u mad bro?

I'm not saying it's true... But it's an easy conclusion to come to.

Not when there are other attributes that make a player.

CR is hardly a complete player.

EarlyPrototype wrote:

Senor Penguin wrote:

EarlyPrototype wrote:Lemme guess Callejon is more complete?

No. He just excels, like Messi, at certain attributes that Ronaldo doesn't. Of course not at the same levels as Messi by any means.

Callejon, for example, has a higher passing percentage than Ronaldo, commits less fouls, draws more fouls (see last season where he was fouled more than Messi and Ronaldo), has a better defensive work-rate and is really great at running deep, beating the offside rule. Not to mention he's a very clinical player who doesn't need a lot of chances to convert them into goals.

I like him especially because he plays for the crest and the Madridismo shines from him every time he plays. He's our youth product and a very good one at that.

Callejon has his uses, but the fact that he beats the offside trap and sometimes grabs a goal is the only thing to his game and he will never be a top player.

I like how you marginalized the tremendous amount of work he puts in for the club by saying he just "beats the offside trap and grabs a goal".

For me he is already a top player. He is successfully competing with our usual starters for a spot in the starting eleven, he does what is required of him whenever he plays and he's part of one of the biggest clubs in the world.

Mourinho made a perfect choice when he allowed Callejon to take on the challenge of being a player for us.

Swagg_Johnson wrote:

Ok just finished thinking... Huntsman.. You don't know what the hell you're talking about

Arquitecto wrote:

teamanarchy wrote:

Senor Penguin wrote:

teamanarchy wrote:But, when comparing him to Messi, it is quite relevant, because when not wearing a Barcelona shirt, he's been pretty average.
Messi stats (not for Barca):
2006-2011:
48 apps, 9 goals. Ratio: 0.18
Ronaldo stats (not for Madrid):
2003-2011:
351 apps, 139 goals. Ratio:0.39

"Not for Madrid" meaning for Portugal and United? Compared to Messi's statistics being for Argentina only basically. Not to mention that Ronaldo is 2 years older than Messi.

Alright, let's look past the point that Messi has never proven himself at another club, in a different league, with a different language, etc.
and let's make this "fair":
Ronaldo (Portugal):
apps 60, goals 21. Ratio: 0.35

Ronaldo being 3 years older makes no difference really. Both have been part of their national teams for a similair period of time.
ANd BTW, this whole thing was simply to illustrate the point of Ronaldo having proved himself in more than 1 jersey. A point which is, to many people, simply a given fact.

Well the difference between their national team set up is that Messi has far more influence for the team as this is also taken into account he plays a deeper role than usual and is mostly if not all the time the best player on the pitch for Argentina.

CR on the other hand has been poor for Portugal for as long as I can remember with his selfish fits on the pitch and being close to anonymous while being outperformed by Nani game after game. His play for Portugal is a shadow of what it is at RM

At the end of the day... Ronaldo has taken Portugal to a Euro final and a 4th place finish in the World Cup. All after the "golden generation" was past it.

Messi, on the other hand, has done nothing with an Argentinian team with possibly the most gifted set of attackers that ANY team has ever seen.

You may say that Messi is consistently the best player, while Ronaldo seems to be anonymous, but, just like the end result is what really matters in terms of the Barca v Madrid argument, the same holds for National team representation.
Even Argentinians hate Messi, because he just doesn't perform.

Senor Penguin wrote:

EarlyPrototype wrote:

Senor Penguin wrote:

EarlyPrototype wrote:Lemme guess Callejon is more complete?

No. He just excels, like Messi, at certain attributes that Ronaldo doesn't. Of course not at the same levels as Messi by any means.

Callejon, for example, has a higher passing percentage than Ronaldo, commits less fouls, draws more fouls (see last season where he was fouled more than Messi and Ronaldo), has a better defensive work-rate and is really great at running deep, beating the offside rule. Not to mention he's a very clinical player who doesn't need a lot of chances to convert them into goals.

I like him especially because he plays for the crest and the Madridismo shines from him every time he plays. He's our youth product and a very good one at that.

Callejon has his uses, but the fact that he beats the offside trap and sometimes grabs a goal is the only thing to his game and he will never be a top player.

I like how you marginalized the tremendous amount of work he puts in for the club by saying he just "beats the offside trap and grabs a goal".

For me he is already a top player. He is successfully competing with our usual starters for a spot in the starting eleven, he does what is required of him whenever he plays and he's part of one of the biggest clubs in the world.

Mourinho made a perfect choice when he allowed Callejon to take on the challenge of being a player for us.

I like how you make him sound like a better player because he runs more than Ronaldo lol. Just a heads up Di Maria runs twice as much as Callejon and is 3 times the player. You must first dream of Mou benching DI Maria before benching Ronaldo lol.

Senor Penguin wrote:

EarlyPrototype wrote:

Senor Penguin wrote:

EarlyPrototype wrote:Lemme guess Callejon is more complete?

No. He just excels, like Messi, at certain attributes that Ronaldo doesn't. Of course not at the same levels as Messi by any means.

Callejon, for example, has a higher passing percentage than Ronaldo, commits less fouls, draws more fouls (see last season where he was fouled more than Messi and Ronaldo), has a better defensive work-rate and is really great at running deep, beating the offside rule. Not to mention he's a very clinical player who doesn't need a lot of chances to convert them into goals.

I like him especially because he plays for the crest and the Madridismo shines from him every time he plays. He's our youth product and a very good one at that.

Callejon has his uses, but the fact that he beats the offside trap and sometimes grabs a goal is the only thing to his game and he will never be a top player.

I like how you marginalized the tremendous amount of work he puts in for the club by saying he just "beats the offside trap and grabs a goal".

For me he is already a top player. He is successfully competing with our usual starters for a spot in the starting eleven, he does what is required of him whenever he plays and he's part of one of the biggest clubs in the world.

Mourinho made a perfect choice when he allowed Callejon to take on the challenge of being a player for us.

Now, I am a huge fan of Callejon. And frankly, I'm a much bigger fan of his than of Ronaldo's... but Callejon will never be of the same quality as Ronaldo. I do think he'll be awesome, given time and regular minutes. But he'll never be on Ronaldo's level.
Nothing to be ashamed of either.