Another International Break...

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Post by Iceman Fri Oct 07, 2011 7:20 pm

...and it seems like it's another 2 weeks where we see our players perform well, individually. Park already scored a brace, Chamberlain scored a hattrick, Coquelin (apparently) had a very good performance for the U21, Walcott got an assisted with a very good cross (Shocker)...
This is shaping up to be like the last international break, and we'll see each player do well for his country only to come back here and start messing up again.

So, my theory is that the whole problem is in the tactics, not the players. I'd like to see what tactics you guys think we should implement, instead of the ones that we're currently using. Not to say that this will make any difference with what Wenger will do (or not do, rather), but it'd be an interesting thread.

Personally, I'd like to see us line up like this (If we take into account all the injuries):

-------------------------------Szczesny------------------------------------
-Jenkinson------Koscielny---------Meretsacker-------Gibbs/Santos
----------------------------Song--Arteta------------------------------------
--------Walcott----------------------------------------Gervinho-------------
-------------------------Rvp-------Chamakh/Park------------------------------

With RVP and Chamakh/Park given the liberty to roam around all over the pitch and run the channels.


Last edited by Iceman on Sat Oct 08, 2011 8:02 am; edited 1 time in total
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Post by lenear1030 Fri Oct 07, 2011 7:31 pm

i'll just say that every time we switch to 442 it works (which have been brief periods). people say that the system doesnt work, but 433/4231 dont either.


i'd also like to see that lineup for a few games too iceman. we dont need to be starting ramsey or rosicky.
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Post by Emaharg Fri Oct 07, 2011 10:22 pm

I think Ramsey suits the 4-4-2 better due to his work rate and tackling ability.
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Post by Sina Sat Oct 08, 2011 12:14 am

i dunno im confused sometimes i think about 4-4-2 or 4-2-2-2

this dream team
--------------szcz--------------
bac---------per--------verm-----gibbs
----------song-------jack-------
--------goetze--------hazard
--------rvp---------theo
but with current players
as for switching to 4-4-2
isnt the problem that everyone just knows the key is no 10 so they mark him outta game and.......
we would get out-numbered in the midlle of the pitch
with current mids even with 3 we struggle to dominate the midlle of the pitch :facepalm:
that was in the past and oppenents were playin different systems that it could work but now?.........
arent gervs and theo type of wingers(more of a wide forwards) more suited to 4-3-3 to play more advanced on the pitch and cut inside?
+ our youth teams are learning 4-1-2-3/4-2-3-1
etc.
im not saying we should stick with 4-3-3/4-2-3-1 but not sure abt 4-4-2 being the solution
so im just confused
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Post by Iceman Sat Oct 08, 2011 12:42 am

Well, for me, I want this formation so that we'd get rid of "dominating the middle of the pitch", passing the ball around pointlessly and "dominating possession". For me, this formation means that we won't be trying to pass our way through the midfield, but we'll be forced to play more directly because we have more forwards now. Walcott providing width, Gervinho making runs and RVP and Chamakh/Park dropping in and out of midfield for whatever reasons.
Less reliance on the midfield, which has been the issue really. Instead, we're relying more on link up play and runs made by the front 4. This will also help with set pieces as we will have two forwards that can go back and help defend corners and such.

That's how I'd like to see it implemented anyway.


Last edited by Iceman on Sat Oct 08, 2011 8:18 am; edited 1 time in total
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Post by Sina Sat Oct 08, 2011 12:54 am

i agree about more direct football
but then most of these players are brain-washed to play this tippy-tappy football and are they flexible to play in different systems/roles?
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Post by Jay29 Sat Oct 08, 2011 1:00 am

I pretty much want the same thing, except I'd like to try Walcott through the middle with van Persie given a free role akin to the one he plays for the Netherlands. Chamakh should not be in the first team and Park is still something of an unknown quantity at this point.

For the flanks, I'd take my chances on Chamberlain or Benayoun over Arshavin, simply because they have better work rate (Benayoun especially). Chamberlain is more like a traditional winger, too, so he'd give more balance to the side.


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Post by BeautifulGame Sat Oct 08, 2011 8:19 am

Iceman wrote:
Personally, I'd like to see us line up like this (If we take into account all the injuries):

-------------------------------Szczesny------------------------------------
-Jenkinson------Koscielny---------Meretsacker-------Gibbs/Santos
----------------------------Song--Arteta------------------------------------
--------Walcott----------------------------------------Gervinho-------------
-------------------------Rvp-------Chamakh/Park------------------------------

With RVP and Chamakh/Park given the liberty to roam around all over the pitch and run the channels.

The problem for Wenger implementing that formation will be that Arsenal will struggle defensively even worse imo.They will likely be dominated in midfield of 2 as well will be very vulnerable through wings due to lack of cover with 4-4-2.

I mean RVP Chamakh or Gervinho have relatively poor workrate and doesnt provide much cover for defensive.And Arteta has weak tackling abilities to play through the middle in a 4-4-2.Defence isnt the strong ponit of Gibbs/Santos and Jenkinson is inexperienced.This coupled with the low confidence of Arsenal defenders 4-4-2 will be hugely risky.4-3-3 givies defenders some sort of cover usually which the 4-4-2 doesnt provide.

Maybe against teams that park the bus at Emirates it will work but against even decent teams its a huge risk imo.But i suppose there is nothing wrong in giving it a try.
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Post by usman111 Sat Oct 08, 2011 5:22 pm

the only way you can break tight defences is with fast counters that means walcott and chambers on wings, a striker like rvp upfront with a playmaker behind him.

-------------------------------Szczesny------------------------------------

-Jenkinson------Koscielny---------Meretsacker-------Gibbs/Santos

----------------------------Song--Arteta------------------------------------

--------Walcott----------------------------------------------Chamberlain-------

------------------Gervinho/Arshavin/Ramsey------------------------------

--------------------------------------RVP------------------------------

*walcott and chamberlain must track back
*rb and lb should also take care
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Post by Iceman Sun Oct 09, 2011 9:26 pm

I actually wrote a long, detailed reply, but my browser froze and it all went to waste.
Anyway, with a full XI it can be easily pulled off. Sagna and Wilshere both fit the exact type of players that are needed. Work-rate is something that the whole team could do with working on, not just certain players; so until we improve on that (even further than we have so far) then we won't see any noticeable improvements.

The current formation isn't working without Fabregas; neither defensively nor offensively, so I see little point in persisting with it tbh.

And as I type this, Chamakh scores for Morocco. Another player doing well on the international level only to come back and fail at the club level due to the tactics applied
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Post by EL Patron Sun Oct 09, 2011 9:31 pm

If only we had decent wingers in this team then at least we could play a 4-5-1 but this team doesn't even have quality wingers :brickwall:
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Post by usman111 Tue Oct 11, 2011 8:27 pm

Iceman wrote:I actually wrote a long, detailed reply, but my browser froze and it all went to waste.
Anyway, with a full XI it can be easily pulled off. Sagna and Wilshere both fit the exact type of players that are needed. Work-rate is something that the whole team could do with working on, not just certain players; so until we improve on that (even further than we have so far) then we won't see any noticeable improvements.

The current formation isn't working without Fabregas; neither defensively nor offensively, so I see little point in persisting with it tbh.

And as I type this, Chamakh scores for Morocco. Another player doing well on the international level only to come back and fail at the club level due to the tactics applied

chamack best performances came while playing alone upfront. all of our forwards are a bit slow except park. if we play two strikers one should be quick and good finisher. one should be unselfish.
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