Why are most of Real Madrid's CLs not memorable?

Hapless_Hans wrote:

Doc wrote:

Hapless_Hans wrote:and why am I not Madrid hater no. 1?

Mole came first so he is obviously no. 1. What's wrong with 2nd?

Coming 2nd is nothing. Makes me look like a serial loser ffs

well, you are a Bayern fan

I asked my 6 year old nephew if he remembers the 2011 CL final peps Barca and Anderson's united or if he remembers last years CL final more and he said 2011. Moles right, Case closed.

Pepcelona with Xavi, Iniesta and Messi beating the shit out of 40yo Giggs, Carrick, Park and Valencia is really memorable.

I don't know, Ramos banging in that last minute header to equalise with Atleti is pretty memorable.

2014 I believe.

Doc wrote:Mole would have made a valid point for me if it weren't totally based on his own personal point of view. In fact, he does not like Real Madrid so it's difficult to see this as just another expression of his disdain. He didn't provide anything bar saying "every time" and "everyone".

It's made even more concrete when Madrid hater no.2 Hans and kinda Madrid hater Cas agrees with it.

I gave a more detailed opinion about his topic. I don't see where I am wrong.

Don't get me wrong, I do think this Madrid is a memorable team and I'll remember their team down the line especially the one in 2017. BUT if someone suggests that Pep's Barca and Jupp's Bayern are more memorable I can see where they are coming from.

It's because aside from being dominant both in Europe and in their own respective leagues those teams actually impacted the way other teams play football.

I don't think Madrid has done that, so that can have an effect on the way some people view the team. That's all I'm saying. I ain't saying Madrid isn't memorable, no, I think they are, but if someone makes the claim they remember other CL winning teams ahead of this Madrid, I can understand why they might think that.

I don't see where I'm hating by having this stance TBH.

Even if you remove the obvious trolling element of the thread, the logic of the premise is a total disaster. Unless Mole is actually Professor Xavier and hooked into Cerebro, he can't realistically make some of the leaps of faith he's making. I can bet good money that very few casual fans, neutrals, or even lovers of tactics give half a rat's ass about what Bayern did in 2013. The Clowns have won like 2 CLs in more than 40 years and didn't play anything revolutionary.

As for the dutch and Barcelona... The total football element is remembered but again, it's not like all that many neutrals or casual fans probably care all that much as Cule Mole does, and rational analysts will likely appreciate football history and tactics with much more balance and rational than is implied in this thread.

Barca CL's in 1992, 2006, and 2015 are pretty inconsequential, it is the 08-09 and 10/11 trophies which are more remembered and even then people with Brains should know how to analyze it.

This is a garbage thread, and end of really.

The Demon of Carthage wrote:

Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:

guest7 wrote:Please it's going to take another 100 years before we get a 3peat CL winner

Achievement =/= Memorable.

Which a lot of people in this thread don't seem to get. I'm not asking the question of whether Madrid's CLs were not a great achievement.

I'm not that stupid, Nick in the Messi thread argued history remembers the winners.

This thread is case in point as to why history doesn't always remember the winners.

History always remember the winners, and always forget about the runner-ups.

You can keep telling yourself that trophies don't matter, but they are the most important thing in world football.

Carlo's Madrid in 2015 (and specifically in the first half of the season) played some breathtaking football and beat Guardiola's record of successive wins, yet the only thing people remember that year is that Madrid finished trophyless.

Maybe you dislike Madrid so much that you're willing to belittle their achievements to make yourself feel better. I get that. You're free to dislike whoever you want. But that doesn't change the fact that what Madrid has achieved in recent years in the CL is nothing short of miraculous, and you can bet whatever you'd like that it'll forever stay carved in history and remembered by every football fan around the globe.

If that's true, why are Brazil82 and Netherlands74 considered some of the most memorable teams despite winning nothing? Please do tell me.

The Demon of Carthage wrote:

Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:

guest7 wrote:Please it's going to take another 100 years before we get a 3peat CL winner

Achievement =/= Memorable.

Which a lot of people in this thread don't seem to get. I'm not asking the question of whether Madrid's CLs were not a great achievement.

I'm not that stupid, Nick in the Messi thread argued history remembers the winners.

This thread is case in point as to why history doesn't always remember the winners.

History always remember the winners, and always forget about the runner-ups.

You can keep telling yourself that trophies don't matter, but they are the most important thing in world football.

Carlo's Madrid in 2015 (and specifically in the first half of the season) played some breathtaking football and beat Guardiola's record of successive wins, yet the only thing people remember that year is that Madrid finished trophyless.

Maybe you dislike Madrid so much that you're willing to belittle their achievements to make yourself feel better. I get that. You're free to dislike whoever you want. But that doesn't change the fact that what Madrid has achieved in recent years in the CL is nothing short of miraculous, and you can bet whatever you'd like that it'll forever stay carved in history and remembered by every football fan around the globe.

Hungary '54, Netherlands '74, Brazil '82, Baggio missing penalty for Italy '94, Juve unable to win CL Finals since '97, etc.

The thing is, if we didn't win in the CL in 2016 and 2018, that 2017 team would be remembered for being as dominant as Jupp. But we did more, and a 3peat is much more memorable

Casciavit wrote:I don't see where I'm hating by having this stance TBH.

Gonna be legit honest, I literally confused you with another Milan poster. Cruijff I think. My apologies, you're not the kinda Madrid hater I was referring to.

So, to make up for my folly, would put on my serious cap and address (some) your points, bare with it.

I think it has more to do with because the memorable CL sides were incredibly dominant and did it with their own style. It seems like the highly praised CL winners are the ones who won the treble. Additionally, teams who actually impacted football and the way it was played.

For the 2014 victory, Madrid defeated the defending champs with Pep 5-0 on aggregate, a sorta competent Dortmund side and the best Atletico team at the time in almost 20 years that won La Liga before the final. 2016 was shit, we had an ez pz road. 2017, beat Bayern again, beat Atletico again and roflstomped a really good Jjuve side in the final. I don't know, the club played some great sides that weren't really weak.

Pep's Barca created a possession craze like never been seen. The narrative with Heynckes' Bayern is that they ended possession and brought athletic and physical players back into fashion. I think Ancelotti's Madrid also helped with that but not to the degree that the 7-0 did.

The 2009 and 2011 wins were really memorable for Barcelona, that I would never deny. It changed the landscape of football to a huge degree but I really don't see how Bayern's win overshadows anything Madrid did other than 2016. They won and got roflstomped the following year, that's it. At least Barcelona had a sustained period of being dominant, Bayern is still living off that 1 win.

It's those details that can have some effect on how the team is viewed. Those teams had an impact on how football is played. In the grand scheme of things I don't think Zidane's Madrid had a huge effect on football. Even the narrative with them is that they show how important a qualitative advantage is combined with experienced players and a motivating coach who is good at controlling the details in CL knockout rounds.

I would agree, Zidane's Madrid did nothing to really set the imagination running wild. They were pretty standard stuff taking place on the field but I feel the simplicity of things really gets overlooked. The club beat whoever was in front of them and kinda mercilessly too. It ain't Brasil 82 but I am absolutely certain Zico would rather be a winner than a beautiful loser.

So yeah, that's how I see it. I still believe they're a memorable team, especially their 2014 and 2017 team. However, if someone's making the argument that they aren't as memorable as some other teams I can see why they think that. They just haven't changed the way football is played like some other historically great teams.

Does a team need to change how football is played to be memorable? Isn't winning supposed to be that, memorable? Not that I don't like this line, I do and you addressed it pretty well but I kinda disagree with it a bit.

I also like that you kept it to your point of view and not the fabled "people" and "everyone" Mole refers to.

Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:

vanDEEZ wrote:What runners-up are we remembering over the winner exactly?

It's very ironic someone from the Netherlands would say this....

exactly lol

Casciavit wrote:

The Demon of Carthage wrote:

Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:

Achievement =/= Memorable.

Which a lot of people in this thread don't seem to get. I'm not asking the question of whether Madrid's CLs were not a great achievement.

I'm not that stupid, Nick in the Messi thread argued history remembers the winners.

This thread is case in point as to why history doesn't always remember the winners.

History always remember the winners, and always forget about the runner-ups.

You can keep telling yourself that trophies don't matter, but they are the most important thing in world football.

Carlo's Madrid in 2015 (and specifically in the first half of the season) played some breathtaking football and beat Guardiola's record of successive wins, yet the only thing people remember that year is that Madrid finished trophyless.

Maybe you dislike Madrid so much that you're willing to belittle their achievements to make yourself feel better. I get that. You're free to dislike whoever you want. But that doesn't change the fact that what Madrid has achieved in recent years in the CL is nothing short of miraculous, and you can bet whatever you'd like that it'll forever stay carved in history and remembered by every football fan around the globe.

If that's true, why are Brazil82 and Netherlands74 considered some of the most memorable teams despite winning nothing? Please do tell me.

I'm waiting for a response as well. This guy posts nonsesne half the time but because he writes essays noone ever calls him out.

Time and time Casc and Mole have refuted this BS yet morons keep repeating the same cliched line.

all of these are subjective matter

we shall agree to disagree

to me, i rather collecting videos on czech's campaign in euro 2004 than the champion itself

but in case i'm in the nearly impossible situation in my life, greece's 2004 euro campaign can be made as a motivational tool

both cases have their own positive value

(above talking about memorable subject in general)

I'm with Cas and S on this. 2017 was dominant, and people were certainly gushing about them after they won for quite some time (that is until the disastrous start to the next season).

Also, lets just say that Mole wil neverrrrrrr make a thread like this regarding Barca. In fact he has a history of threads like this

http://www.goallegacy.net/t35164-so-are-barca-still-past-it-and-the-worst-barca-in-a-decade-then

Tell me this is not a Barca fan

Galáctico era Madrid made the observer's imagination running wild. You can be a Barça for all I care but you would have appreciated the class of football Madrid played that nobody else did. This is what makes a team memorable. Hence the talk of the Dutch team that never won it, or Guardiola's Barcelona.

Madrid of Ancelotti and Zidane never did any of that. They won CLs but other than that, the football was the football everyone else played, perhaps with better players and a pinch of luck that Guardiola had and Cruyff didn't.

M99 wrote:I'm with Cas and S on this. 2017 was dominant, and people were certainly gushing about them after they won for quite some time (that is until the disastrous start to the next season).

Also, lets just say that Mole wil neverrrrrrr make a thread like this regarding Barca. In fact he has a history of threads like this

http://www.goallegacy.net/t35164-so-are-barca-still-past-it-and-the-worst-barca-in-a-decade-then

Tell me this is not a Barca fan

Some shitty fan I am then, don't know any other fan who would go more than 3 years without watching a game of the team I'm supposed to be a fan of.

Move on ffs, you are living more than 5 years in the past. I could have been considered a fan during the Ronaldinho era and before but I haven't been for a long time.

You'll going to have to come up with something better than herp derp he's a barca fan lol.

You are a bigger Barca fan than I am.

And just like he got under all the guest7 and Valk skins, I got under his

Its so easy, just spit some truth

guest7 wrote:

S wrote:

Casciavit wrote:just read this entire thread ffs

unreal amount of heat, don't think I've ever seen something like this before

you still make a valid point though

Yep. Cant entirely disagree with the premise of Mole's post. He does have a point.

The three CLs are memorable and all the goals & comebacks but this team itself is not. He should have worded it different! IMO

Yes, Mole definitely got under my skin

It's quite sad you think you're under my skin tbh lol, couldn't care less tbh. Just making sure the facts are known so more normie idiots don't get any stupid ideas.

Well to be fair the most memorable night in history of CL for me personally was the night Barca i mean the ref eliminated Chelsea. i was shook.

So Real Madrid's cl wins are as memorable as messi's international career?

w/e helps you sleep at night mole.

Because your attention span is 15 minutes.

But that's life I guess.

While this thread may be pointless, largely based on Mole's uneducated, subjective opinion and impressions, and perhaps also partly sprung into life as a retaliation effort to the recent bashing of Messi, it certainly riled up enough RM fans to warrant it's creation. Something tells me that was his plan, to begin with.

Having benitez as coach of newcastle would suck the life out of anyone. loss of interest in football is only natural.

Mole is just another victim of Benitez's nonsense. Maybe he will recover when Benitez gets the sack. thats a big maybe though.

Clutch wrote:I asked my 6 year old nephew if he remembers the 2011 CL final peps Barca and Anderson's united or if he remembers last years CL final more and he said 2011. Moles right, Case closed.

Thats because Barca played good football while Madrid just got outright lucky, playing meh football with an insansely stacked team

Myesyats wrote:

Clutch wrote:I asked my 6 year old nephew if he remembers the 2011 CL final peps Barca and Anderson's united or if he remembers last years CL final more and he said 2011. Moles right, Case closed.

Thats because Barca played good football while Madrid just got outright lucky, playing meh football with an insansely stacked team