GAME OF THRONES - PART 5 - *NO BOOK TALK - READ THE RULES*

El Messico wrote:I don't understand what growth there was for Sansa personality-wise (being a bad-ass, really??). Besides gaining the courage to smack an impudent kid in the face...

The problem is that RG is a book reader, and as such he can't stop comparing what happens there to what happens in the book. In the books, Sansa is taken by Littlefinger to the Vale, where he shows her how to play the game, and eventually Sansa starts becoming a player rather than a pawn. In the show she is married off to Ramsay (which never happens in the book) and remains a pawn always being passed around but never making decisions of her own.

From what I've seen, though, the people who have only seen the show are disgusted at what happened but not outraged.

El Shaarawy wrote:

El Messico wrote:I don't understand what growth there was for Sansa personality-wise (being a bad-ass, really??). Besides gaining the courage to smack an impudent kid in the face...

But the end of last season insinuated much more, like what RG said. She could've been a much more intriguing character if they took the Dark Sansa route IMO

I won't disagree that a more resolute Sansa arc would've been interesting to follow, but until this point in the show, nothing suggests that her core personality has changed. So her meek behaviour in yesterday's episode is not out of character, which is what seems to be the biggest complaint so far.

Like I said, we don't even know the ramifications of any of the events of last night's episode, so why are people already judging about destroyed characters and plots?

BarrileteCosmico wrote:

El Messico wrote:I don't understand what growth there was for Sansa personality-wise (being a bad-ass, really??). Besides gaining the courage to smack an impudent kid in the face...

The problem is that RG is a book reader, and as such he can't stop comparing what happens there to what happens in the book. In the books, Sansa is taken by Littlefinger to the Vale, where he shows her how to play the game, and eventually Sansa starts becoming a player rather than a pawn. In the show she is married off to Ramsay (which never happens in the book) and remains a pawn always being passed around but never making decisions of her own.

From what I've seen, though, the people who have only seen the show are disgusted at what happened but not outraged.

aah that explains his frustrations. Thanks.

Also, great pickup from reddit: https://imgur.com/a/vT9fF

Just watched. FFS I can't believe the sand snakes were calling out the Martell words as a kind of war chant. Also Oberyn's bastard has to say "I am Oberyn's daughter!", no shit, everyone knows who you are, you're a royal bastard

Sansa scene a lot better than I expected, but I expected the absolute worst. People reacted to this way more strongly than some of the other disgusting things the show has done (stabbing a pregnant person in the belly, for instance).

El Gunner wrote:
Book readers are pos's

Oh please just because we call out D&D for their horrible changes we are pieces of shit? Did you see anyone complaining when they added Hound vs Brienne or had Arya and Tywin interact in season 2 instead of Arya vs Roose? No because those were done well. The Sansa arc was supposed to be her developing into a strong woman, a female Littlefinger but one who had a good heart unlike him but nah let's revert her back to season 2 Sansa and have yet another rape scene.

Opened Twitter. Almost drowned in RG's tears.

You book readers have a tendency to mix up your book information and what happens in the show. Sansa is not the same as in the book, and she's never been an interesting character anyways.

I read the books and thought that endning was epic.


holy shit, shocking stuff

Freeza wrote:Opened Twitter. Almost drowned in RG's tears.

You book readers have a tendency to mix up your book information and what happens in the show. Sansa is not the same as in the book, and she's never been an interesting character anyways.

Sansa is exactly the same in the book up until the moment last episode. A lot of show only people find her interesting too it's not just us. They ruined her character arc.

Shit, what an awful episode.

The whole Dorne arc is boring and badly done. The religious crap with Cersei is really stupid and illogical. Really, you're using the moral highground to go after the Tyrells? And Sansa is back to being a victim. Pathetic. Just so Theon can be redeemed? Ain't nobody give a shit about Reek. Sansa's arc was a whole lot more interesting.

I thought this season started strongly but it has derailed these past few weeks. I guess it was to be expected though. When you rape and kill so many of your leading characters it's bound to turn to shit at some point.

Also, if you are a fan of Ramsey then you should seek immediate psychological help. With the advances in psychology and pharmaceutical psychiatry there is still hope for you yet.

Ganso wrote:I read the books and thought that endning was epic.


holy shit, shocking stuff

I don't know what i like more the show or people's reactions.

I'm still trying to figure out what people are disgusted about, that her character arc is dying or she got rapped.

I don't understand the latter, this has happened multiple times before and the show is depicted with context of the time it is taking place in.

Fair enough if you don't like the way Sansa's character arc is going but for me she has one of the least interesting storylines going.

Don't see whats wrong with Ramsey's character, i don't like his nature but i see the great value someone like him adds to the show.

elitedam wrote:Shit, what an awful episode.

And Sansa is back to being a victim. Pathetic. Just so Theon can be redeemed? Ain't nobody give a shit about Reek. Sansa's arc was a whole lot more interesting.

Wow show only thinks the same too. Thought it was book readers only being pieces of shit...

Seriously the only thing more annoying than the people whining about the smallest change from the books or how the books are far better are the people who act all snide and say "no what the show did was good, book readers crying too much"

M99 wrote:

El Gunner wrote:
Book readers are pos's

Oh please just because we call out D&D for their horrible changes we are pieces of shit? Did you see anyone complaining when they added Hound vs Brienne or had Arya and Tywin interact in season 2 instead of Arya vs Roose? No because those were done well. The Sansa arc was supposed to be her developing into a strong woman, a female Littlefinger but one who had a good heart unlike him but nah let's revert her back to season 2 Sansa and have yet another rape scene.

Hound vs Brienne was poor. Not because it was something new, but because it was just poor. Can't believe people like these crap fights, next you tell me you liked the choreography of the Viper vs the Mountain.
GoT is trying way to hard to make fights/duels look "awesome and cool".

So no one talking about main man mr Eko getting introduced to the show? Guy will steal the show like he did in LOST

And shame there's no Grejoy arc..

Inb4 smoke monster kills him

Lol just give me a brief summary of his arc in Lost again

RealGunner wrote:They could have 100% done the Sansa scene differently.

Last season, the showed us how badass she has become and how she can play the game. Littlefinger has taught her stuff. Now she is back to being season 2 Sansa all of a sudden?

This
I am sure this is the issue most people including me are infuriated about more than the rape itself.

And this is what I suggested in an earlier post yesterday.
That part where Ramsay asked her whether she was a virgin, that was a window for innovation for the writers, But they neglected it outright and made her say Yes. Had she said No, we would have seen Sansa at least trying to play the game.
A minute thing I know, but still it would have given hope for the viewers that something is changing, albeit gradually.

elitedam wrote:Shit, what an awful episode.

The whole Dorne arc is boring and badly done. The religious crap with Cersei is really stupid and illogical. Really, you're using the moral highground to go after the Tyrells? And Sansa is back to being a victim. Pathetic. Just so Theon can be redeemed? Ain't nobody give a shit about Reek. Sansa's arc was a whole lot more interesting.

I thought this season started strongly but it has derailed these past few weeks. I guess it was to be expected though. When you rape and kill so many of your leading characters it's bound to turn to shit at some point.

Also, if you are a fan of Ramsey then you should seek immediate psychological help. With the advances in psychology and pharmaceutical psychiatry there is still hope for you yet.

Agreed apart from the last part, there is no hope for me. Forza Ramsay

People acting like Sansa was some GOAT character

Hope she'd resist and get her throat cut tbh. Her character is like watching paint dry.

Also don't see how the situation could've ended up with anything other than rape after what Ramsey's GF said to her. That he hunted people that bored him.

Yeah she's boring imo, plenty more interesting characters both dead & alive. She's not even a lead character in my eyes. Been the victim since half way through S1 and nothing's changed. She has no agenda we know of, no goal, not much of a personality either.

Tomwin Lannister wrote: Been the victim since half way through S1 and nothing's changed.

She as changing but that all went out of the window last episode...

Meeeh more like being around littlefinger made her 10x more important than she actually is

Her 'change' was so gradual it was barely happening. After all she's seen, all she's been through she was still too stupid to realise that crying and resisting her new obviously deranged husband on their wedding night would never end well.

Tomwin Lannister wrote:Meeeh more like being around littlefinger made her 10x more important than she actually is

Her 'change' was so gradual it was barely happening. After all she's seen, all she's been through she was still too stupid to realise that crying and resisting her new obviously deranged husband on their wedding night would never end well.

Agreed. Her change was nothing, she was as much of a pawn as she'd ever been.

I change more after eating than she has for 5 seasons of a TV show.

Basically an annoying brat pawn.

Which is exactly the problem. Instead of having her grow into a manipulative, cunning, strong woman who actively plays the game of thrones they have her become a victim again. Third rape of a female main character

M99 wrote:Which is exactly the problem. Instead of having her grow into a manipulative, cunning, strong woman who actively plays the game of thrones they have her become a victim again. Third rape of a female main character

The rape is not a freaking problem.

If anything it's more fitting to the overall realism of the show, I can't really see how else it could've turned out for her.

You guys act like the problem came recently, but the fact is Sansa has never been interesting at all.

It's not like she has ever stopped being a victim. She has been a victim of Littlefinger ever since he met up with her. A victim to further his plans.

"Grow into a manipulative, strong woman who plays the game" and Cersei isn't that? So if you get raped you can't be a strong woman again? or even help you on the way to become one?

If anything this rape makes Sansa more of an interesting character and gives the final edge to maybe give her character some characteristics and personality. Now she'll have a burning desire to kill Ramsey instead of just being a piece of wood looking in to the camera with a stoner face.

Maybe it's just the actress' fault... Can't believe GOAT Tye Sheridan has to settle for her in X-men.