World Cup: Group B discussion

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Post by Ganso Tue Jun 10, 2014 3:54 pm

Sitting back and countering isn't enough.the secret (not sure it's a secret anymore) is to press and counter.high tempo and fast players are key.Netherlands are playing with one less midfielder/forward in a 5-3-2 and Robben,Sneijder and RVP upfront, who i can't see doing a good job at pressing

I can see something like France vs Spain in euro 2012 happening when Blanc decided to play with a 3 man backline.

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Post by Madvillain Tue Jun 10, 2014 4:11 pm

Yes, that's obvious. Especially since I've seen all season how Barça have been coping badly with teams that have been pressing high up the pitch. Even though I haven't seen Spain play much this last year, it is only logical to assume that the same goes for the Barça players in the Spain squad. IF the players in our back line don't have too many brainfarts (mainly Veltman and BMI) and IF we don't give too much room between defence and midfield (which we mostly did in the friendlies), it will be hard for them to break us down. I'm expecting either a bad game to watch with little chances and a small win for us (or a draw)... or a massacre.
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Post by Onyx Tue Jun 10, 2014 9:19 pm

del Bosque apparently tried out Busquets on his own (in training?) without Alonso, according to AS.

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Post by Forza Wed Jun 11, 2014 3:00 am

Madvillain wrote:I read that Vidal is almost certainly out of the picture. I heard something about a new system too? I'm still worried about their pressing and energetic play, but it's good news. The game against Spain worries me less. I'm not saying that it's in the bag or anything, just that I think the 5-3-2 will be a pain for them to deal with.

Vidal is almost certain to be out of the 1st game, but it means that if he does feature, he probably won't be at full fitness.
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Post by M99 Wed Jun 11, 2014 4:08 am

Forza wrote:
Madvillain wrote:I read that Vidal is almost certainly out of the picture. I heard something about a new system too? I'm still worried about their pressing and energetic play, but it's good news. The game against Spain worries me less. I'm not saying that it's in the bag or anything, just that I think the 5-3-2 will be a pain for them to deal with.

Vidal is almost certain to be out of the 1st game, but it means that if he does feature, he probably won't be at full fitness.


He should not be risked vs Australia. Let his rest for Spain and Netherlands.
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Post by Curtinho Wed Jun 11, 2014 9:26 am

I think this Spain side is a bit overrated to be honest. The Netherlands could end up topping the group.
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Post by Art Morte Wed Jun 11, 2014 9:36 am

El Cujo wrote:I think this Spain side is a bit overrated to be honest. The Netherlands could end up topping the group.


It's so difficult to know... or even guess, lol.

The more I look at the Netherland's squad, the more I think they've got the quality in places they need it and the inexperienced players are able to fill in the gaps.

Spain's squad looks too homogeneous, too many players who provide the same thing. Then again, almost all of them are top-class at what they offer, so it could be enough to even win the whole thing again.

And Chile's squad looks the worst on paper, yet they've been playing well and many people fancy their chances.

It's impossible to tell, really.
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Post by Forza Wed Jun 11, 2014 9:38 am

Inb4 Australia wins.
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Post by messixaviesta Wed Jun 11, 2014 1:59 pm

Yohan Modric wrote:del Bosque apparently tried out Busquets on his own (in training?) without Alonso, according to AS.

I am not surprised since from the Confed onwards that is the route he has been taking more often.


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Post by messixaviesta Wed Jun 11, 2014 2:01 pm

El Cujo wrote:I think this Spain side is a bit overrated to be honest.

Overrated??? A team which has won the last three major international tournaments has three people predicting they will win the trophy with several teams including even England getting more votes than them and some many more.

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Post by Hapless_Hans Wed Jun 11, 2014 2:07 pm

El Cujo wrote:I think this Spain side is a bit overrated to be honest. The Netherlands could end up topping the group.


lol. How exactly can 'this Spain side' be overrated?!

How can you overrate a team that won the EC, the WC, and then the EC again, all pretty much in a league of their own?

Netherlands are a second or third rate team compared to them. I mean how many players in the Netherlands squad have won the CL - two.
In Spain's side it's more then ten, and the others are the likes of Silva, Koke, Fabregas lol

I don't see how Holland can stand a chance tbh, they will have to try to top Chile for 2nd place
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Post by futbol Wed Jun 11, 2014 2:26 pm

Spain is getting weirdly underrated before every tournament for whatever reasons and it's going on for years.

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Post by Hapless_Hans Wed Jun 11, 2014 2:30 pm

The depressing fact is that Spain are head and shoulders above anyone else.
If they don't win it, it will be about who manages to beat them and the only ones I can really imagine to do that are Argentina.
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Post by Art Morte Wed Jun 11, 2014 2:34 pm

I'm in the boat that thinks Spain won't do that well.

They lack proper wide players and I don't know if their strikers suit their style. Also some of their stars are past their peak and may lack the hunger to work their socks off in the Brasil heat.
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Post by futbol Wed Jun 11, 2014 2:57 pm

Art Morte wrote:I'm in the boat that thinks Spain won't do that well.

They lack proper wide players and I don't know if their strikers suit their style. Also some of their stars are past their peak and may lack the hunger to work their socks off in the Brasil heat.

I don't get posts like this. They are playing a deliberate narrow formation with Iniesta and Silva as false wingers since 2008. It's what they are and it isn't new.

I don't think they are past their peak either. Alba, Pique, Ramos, Azpi, Busquets, Iniesta, Silva, Fabregas, Koke, Costa, Pedro aren't past their peak. They are actually all in their prime years. Laughing Xabi is 32 which is a great age. Just 2 months ago he played the game of his life against Bayern. Not a has-been yet. Question marks over Xavi as he's 34 now but he'll do fine in a handful of games. He's had 2 months of rest now. People talk like they are Brazil 2006 or something where Ronaldo was playing with a belly, Cafu was about 45 and Roberto Carlos was tying his shoes during a freekick.

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Post by El Gunner Wed Jun 11, 2014 3:15 pm

Yohan Modric wrote:del Bosque apparently tried out Busquets on his own (in training?) without Alonso, according to AS.
I like
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Post by Art Morte Wed Jun 11, 2014 3:28 pm

Fußball wrote:
Art Morte wrote:I'm in the boat that thinks Spain won't do that well.

They lack proper wide players and I don't know if their strikers suit their style. Also some of their stars are past their peak and may lack the hunger to work their socks off in the Brasil heat.

I don't get posts like this. They are playing a deliberate narrow formation with Iniesta and Silva as false wingers since 2008. It's what they are and it isn't new.

I don't think they are past their peak either. Alba, Pique, Ramos, Azpi, Busquets, Iniesta, Silva, Fabregas, Koke, Costa, Pedro aren't past their peak. They are actually all in their prime years. Laughing Xabi is 32 which is a great age. Just 2 months ago he played the game of his life against Bayern. Not a has-been yet. Question marks over Xavi as he's 34 now but he'll do fine in a handful of games. He's had 2 months of rest now. People talk like they are Brazil 2006 or something where Ronaldo was playing with a belly, Cafu was about 45 and Roberto Carlos was tying his shoes during a freekick.


I guess there's a bigger chance that I'm wrong than right, but let's wait and see hmm
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Post by BusterLfc Wed Jun 11, 2014 5:43 pm

Chile is by no means the worst team on the paper here. Netherlands will probably see their way out in the group stages.
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Post by messixaviesta Wed Jun 11, 2014 11:03 pm

Spain 2014 is not as good (especially in terms of players' fitness and form) as Spain 2010 but it's still not Italy 2010 either.


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Post by Onyx Thu Jun 12, 2014 6:30 pm

Apparently this lineup was confirmed by van Gaal to play Spain tomorrow.

Spoiler:

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Post by futbol Thu Jun 12, 2014 6:32 pm

Not this 5 man backline shit. It's going to ruin the game. World Cup: Group B discussion - Page 4 Fifafp12

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Post by RedOranje Thu Jun 12, 2014 7:06 pm

Given that it's the Netherlands and van Gaal, that could just as easily be a 3-man backline with attacking wingbacks. That would make perfect sense against a very narrow Spain side.
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Post by futbol Thu Jun 12, 2014 7:13 pm

RedOranje wrote:Given that it's the Netherlands and van Gaal, that could just as easily be a 3-man backline with attacking wingbacks. That would make perfect sense against a very narrow Spain side.


Spain will have the ball about 75 % of the time. Which means without the ball Netherlands will essentially have a 5 man backline shape. Those 3 man backlines quickly turn into full on "park the bus" formations more often than not. And although that might give Netherlands a better chance for success it will probably also make it a boring game. But who knows, Italy vs. Spain in the group stages 2 years ago was entertaining.

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Post by The Franchise Thu Jun 12, 2014 7:17 pm

Maybe im just being hopeful. But I dont believe Holland are just going to sit there and let them have the ball, I have a feeling they will go and put pressure.

What that leads to down the other end is another question, but I just got a feeling they going to try and apply pressure.
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Post by Adit Thu Jun 12, 2014 7:22 pm

In the friendlies I watched Holland doesn't press at all in oppositions half.I doubt they will change it tomorrow.
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Post by futbol Thu Jun 12, 2014 7:22 pm

The Franchise wrote:Maybe im just being hopeful. But I dont believe Holland are just going to sit there and let them have the ball, I have a feeling they will go and put pressure.

What that leads to down the other end is another question, but I just got a feeling they going to try and apply pressure.


With RvP, Robben and Sneijder upfront? That looks like desaster waiting to happen tbh.

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