Alex Song

BarcaKizz wrote:Throwing around a stat like that is misleading... Here is one for you.

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/4498786/Stars-quit-Arsenal-and-win-44-medals.html

Players who left Arsenal recently... They've won 44 trophies in the time that Arsenal have won 0. So you could also say once Arsenal players are bought they do well. This isn't even including Super Cups etc.

You clearly hate Song. All there is to it. Once a player signs for my team I think positively about it, there's no other way for me. I agree with Free and Mole here.

Same here. I really didn't want Song though after the transfer I feel there is something special coming for this season and the future... I hope I am right...

My new article on Alex Song.
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1315093-alex-song-barcas-new-mr-fix-it

I analyse how Tito could use him. Please leave your thoughts.

spot on article, even though a little "bright".
it sums up everything that is possitive for this transfer, cleverly not mentioning any concerns

free_cat wrote:I don't think a player can really improve much technically when he is over 20ish. On the other hand, you can improve tactically at any age, and IMO Song will do well rapidly tactically. Don't think Mascherano would do any better now at DM than when he signed. It's not a huge improvement, I concede, but I think Song as a CB won't do bad.

I disagree, he's been very good as a DM for Argentina and his ball-skills have improved significantly. His long-passing has especially fluorished, point in case his recent assist to Pedro. I don't think he'll ever be as good as Busquets, but he wouldn't be as bad as when he started.

Also, I'm posting the assist because it's simply a joy to watch:

Song, what a debut! He was outstanding!

We robbed Arsenal

Quality player

Jonathan28 wrote:Song, what a debut! He was outstanding!

We robbed Arsenal

Albiceleste wrote:Quality player

Did we watch the same game?

He had a nice touch and pass for Messi but that was about it. Other than that he looked clueless out there and offered very little defensively... which is probably a priority reason we bought him.

But it was just 20 minutes or so, I'm not going to say it was a great debut but it was just 20 minutes. We'll see as the season goes on.

CBarca wrote:

Jonathan28 wrote:Song, what a debut! He was outstanding!

We robbed Arsenal

Albiceleste wrote:Quality player

Did we watch the same game?

He had a nice touch and pass for Messi but that was about it. Other than that he looked clueless out there and offered very little defensively... which is probably a priority reason we bought him.

But it was just 20 minutes or so, I'm not going to say it was a great debut but it was just 20 minutes. We'll see as the season goes on.

I didn't watch the second half at all, I'm not commenting on his defensive abilities just yet

very good debut IMO.

He was good when he came on.Didnt put a foot wrong and was better than Busquets,although thats not an achievement as he was awful.

I could not judge him for 20 min and when we were badly in need for a goal with a man down. He was leaving his position at times, so that was a bit of defensive concern for me. However, as these were special circumstances, he might have been instructed by Titio to offer a bit more in attack.

One thing i liked though. Some said he chokes under pressure! Though he seamed clueless at times and i even saw Iniesta try to drop and cover his position (though when i think about it - Barca = Total Football anyone???) he never seamed to choke. I thought he looked competent and not scared. I liked that.

In addition, i would love to experiment with him and Bussi holding the mid for the first half when RM press like crazy. With him being physical and a bit taller, i think we can play our possession game (though not so intensely) and avoid exposing the defense so much. Especially when we are a goal + from the previous leg.

He didn't look clueless at all. In fact, he didn't do anything, absolutely anything, wrong. And it was his first game after a week of training.

Tito says he learns fast, and I believe it.

Yep, he looked great last night. Really impressed me.

Made a few good touches though positioning wise didn't know where to go. Constantly thought he was a centreback and Masch had to even tell him once or twice that he had to move further forward because he was getting into the way of him... Obviously he will adapt into his position(s) soon and well enough. Promising signs for this kid!

fcb

Error-free start for Alex Song

The Cameroonian didn’t make a single bad pass at the Santiago Bernabéu in his impressive debut in a Barça shirt

“It was not the result we wanted, but it was a good match for me” he said after the match.

He made 18 passes, and every single one was good. That was as impeccable a start from Alex Song as any FCB fan could have wished for. It was also him who supplied the ball to Leo Messi for the chance that would have won the Spanish Supercup in the final seconds of injury time.

It was not just a matter of statistics. In his 19 minutes on the Bernabéu turf, Alex Song looked remarkably self-assured. His first touch was excellent and he had no trouble connecting with his team-mates when Barça were battling against the clock to find a cup-winning goal.

Song confident about adaptation

“It was not the result we wanted, but it was a good match for me” he said after the match. “We had chances to win, but Casillas made a lot of fine saves … I have felt really good in my first few days here. The players and manager have given me a nice welcome. They’ve given me helpful advice and I think I’ll adapt quickly”.

Tito Vilanova impressed

Tito Vilanova said that Barça’s latest signing “played some good minutes and helped us out”. The Cameroonian came on for Sergio Busquets “because he looked very tired to me. He has played a lot of games with his desire to cover the whole of the pitch”. The Catalan midfielder was thoroughly impressed with the man who took his place. “He’ll bring a lot of joy to Barça because he’s a good player and he had a great game today”.

The FC Barcelona coach hinted that in games where Barça are ahead, Song might also be used in combination with Busquets, meaning Xavi can be rested.

So the experiment i wanted might happen

BTW - No mistake in first debut+clasico!!!!

Yes! Double pivot!

Seriously, if we had used it against Osasuna andd Madrid those games would have gone much more easier. With Song adapting extremely quickly to our style of play I can see it being adopted this weekend against Valencia, the bane of our existence, well, second to Espanyol.

Double pivot would have been awful against Madrid. We was getting raining on the first 20 minutes or so, high tempo and direct with high pressure. Having two deeper players who take longer on the ball than Xavi only gives you less time to escape the pressure. If our famed trio in midfield had trouble escaping the early pressure what do you think would have happened if Xavi was out of position, or worse still, sitting on the bench?

The only reason I would entertain the idea of a double pivot is, its increasing obvious its the only managable solution to Cesc. He clearly cant play midfield like Thiago, Xavi or Iniesta can. Also, It probably suits Song better than the holding role for the time being.

Anyway, on Song. I have a good feeling about him. I think as already said, he's horrible off the ball (both defensively and going forward in terms of movement) but he is pretty slick on the ball. I would rather it be that way around, its easier to learn how to move and where to be than it is to become the passer and dribbler he is, or have his composure. So yeah, nice little cameo and obviously time will tell what will happen but I have a good feeling. A much better feeling than I have about other areas of the pitch.

Well you might be right, and i never said it would work, but i think it might. The problem is that we try play our game all the time and that is good. But when RM are fresh, and we have the lead, like we had from the first leg, i think we should have not pushed that much with defensive line, and if we had two tallish dm's maybe rm's long balls would not be that dangerous.

Dani welcome back man.

Yeah, I agree on the Cesc thing. He has become more of an attacking midfielder having played there for a long while at Arsenal, with his directness his game would be far more suited to him being played behind the main striker.

I don't know what Tito has in mind, but if he decides to go with the double pivot in some games I can see the line up as

-------Busquets-------
-------Xavi/Song------
-Pedro-Iniesta/Cesc-Sanchez/Villa
----------Messi-------

Something like that anyway, with Sanchez/Villa rotating with Messi every so often and Thiago will be a big part of it aswell. I think one reason why people dislike the double pivot is because Spain looked boring because of their constant passes which led nowhere, with Messi and Sanchez that won't be the case though, well, in theory it shouldn't be.

On Song I also agree, he already has the ball skills, which are the hardest part to grasp, just watching a Sunday League game shows you that. His positional sense will come with time.

I thought he had a very good debut debut.Baptism by fire and he did the simply things right.Needs to keep learning.
I dont agree with dani that its easier to learn movement than its to learn passing and dribbling.Dribbling part I agree but I think its easier to improve as a passer than it is to improve movement,especially movement required to play in our midfield.
Cesc and Masch are 2 prime examples of it.Cesc has pathetic movement off the ball,both horizonatlly and vertically and he still looks lost after a year in our system.
Same with Masch who looked clueless in midfield but his passing has come on in leaps and bounds.Another player who comes to mind whose passing improved tremendously was Abidal.

On the double pivot I dont like it particularly and dont think it should be used.

Song should start vs Valencia IMO. Busquets has bad game vs Madrid, rewarding Song for his good cameo with a start at CN should be logical decision. I was surprised how calm he was in his appearance. Keep it up Song

Eh, play Buscuit and if he doesn't preform bring in Song during half time, Valencia isn't some scrub team rather play the reliable force before the test dummy.

eelir wrote:Well you might be right, and i never said it would work, but i think it might. The problem is that we try play our game all the time and that is good. But when RM are fresh, and we have the lead, like we had from the first leg, i think we should have not pushed that much with defensive line, and if we had two tallish dm's maybe rm's long balls would not be that dangerous.

Well perhaps. But I felt that the long balls where a result of the passer having time on the ball (we had one less player so thats normal. Though early on it was a lack of consistent pressing too I felt) and out defenders not having good positions.

Adriano and Mascherano were positionally horrible. I am not quite sure what another tall player midfield could of done about it.

Jonathan28 wrote:Dani welcome back man.

Yeah, I agree on the Cesc thing. He has become more of an attacking midfielder having played there for a long while at Arsenal, with his directness his game would be far more suited to him being played behind the main striker.

I don't know what Tito has in mind, but if he decides to go with the double pivot in some games I can see the line up as

-------Busquets-------
-------Xavi/Song------
-Pedro-Iniesta/Cesc-Sanchez/Villa
----------Messi-------

Something like that anyway, with Sanchez/Villa rotating with Messi every so often and Thiago will be a big part of it aswell. I think one reason why people dislike the double pivot is because Spain looked boring because of their constant passes which led nowhere, with Messi and Sanchez that won't be the case though, well, in theory it shouldn't be.

On Song I also agree, he already has the ball skills, which are the hardest part to grasp, just watching a Sunday League game shows you that. His positional sense will come with time.

Thanks Jon, I dont disagree at all. I would say, my personal dislike for the double pivot of Spain wasnt exactly the lack of action. Though that was of course part of it too. I think you can still be exiciting with the formation if you have the forwards for it.

However, my main object is the double pivot area. I think generally you are using 2 players do the job 1 great player can do. The double pivot's I see make up one player who runs laterally and vertically, both defensively and offensively (think Song, Khedira, Bender, these types) and another who sits deep and plays the majority of the passes (Alonso, Arteta, these types). The reason is, the latter usually doesnt have the mobility with the ball, they are generally static. They play passes and back up play, but dont like to come forward with or without it. Also, nearly none of these types have defensive skills, so they need this other player to make runs both offensively and defensively. The other player generally doesnt have the awareness of space, of players, the passing, the composure and so on to play passes. So, you have two player doing the tasks. However, if you have a player who has composure, passing, vision and so on but dont need anyone defending for them, making the runs for them..you have 1 player doing the job of the other too. I feel in Busquets, we have one of the last remaining players who can actually do that. There arent that many, but he is on.

Simply, we dont need Song next to Busquets at any point because Busquets can do more on his own.

Indeed, if want more defensive protection it makes sense. But personally, I think the better defence is simply having the ball more and controlling the game.

Sorry to ramble but yeah, had to be clear.

alexjanosik wrote:I thought he had a very good debut debut.Baptism by fire and he did the simply things right.Needs to keep learning.
I dont agree with dani that its easier to learn movement than its to learn passing and dribbling.Dribbling part I agree but I think its easier to improve as a passer than it is to improve movement,especially movement required to play in our midfield.
Cesc and Masch are 2 prime examples of it.Cesc has pathetic movement off the ball,both horizonatlly and vertically and he still looks lost after a year in our system.
Same with Masch who looked clueless in midfield but his passing has come on in leaps and bounds.Another player who comes to mind whose passing improved tremendously was Abidal.

On the double pivot I dont like it particularly and dont think it should be used.

Yes but Alex I bet if we move away from just these examples we can find other results. I think we could name more players who improved their movement by some degree than passing. Of course, not young players who naturally get better at everything.

Cesc is a disgrace to be frank. He should already know how to move, he was with us for years. Its simply shocking he doesnt get it.

Of course, at Barca players are going to improve there passing. Thats a given. However, generally speaking it doesnt happen often and my statement was one of generality (is that a word?).

Thing with Barca is they need to stick with what made them successful. I really do think Barca need a tall solid CB to play alongside Pique/Mascherano. Pique needs someone like that next to him. In terms of the fullback positions, it should be Alves and Alba.

Pedro and Villa should be the starting wing forwards, making diagonal runs. Alexis is more of a flashy player who would suit a counter-attacking style better. And yeh I agree Fabregas doesn't suit Barca. He just isn't mobile enough for the midfield and he isn't better than Messi in terms of CF. Someone like Banega would of been a better option in midfield.