Re: Messi wins golden shoe 11-12.

by eelir Wed May 16, 2012 2:25 pm

Nah, the rest of the team is not useless, we had trouble with injuries and form dropping in front line. Only Messi was worthy to start up front this season for Barca. Therefore, he carried out the attack, and had so many goals compared to the rest of the team as the other attackers were not on par (or constantly injured) with the rest of the team.

by Khaled Wed May 16, 2012 2:56 pm

billionmillion wrote:Yeah as if opening goals equaling goals are not important as winners

imagine if madrid fans had messi in their team. what would they do? they would say messi created football

This

by the xcx Wed May 16, 2012 3:07 pm

Khaled wrote:
billionmillion wrote:Yeah as if opening goals equaling goals are not important as winners

imagine if madrid fans had messi in their team. what would they do? they would say messi created football

This

no, we wouldnt.

by harhar11 Wed May 16, 2012 3:25 pm

I dont know if anyone has brought this up but Messi,with Özil, finished as the top assister of La Liga :bow:

But i'm really worried about our dependence on messi in the final 3rd..

by Mr Nick09 Wed May 16, 2012 3:41 pm

harhar11 wrote:I dont know if anyone has brought this up but Messi,with Özil, finished as the top assister of La Liga

But i'm really worried about our dependence on messi in the final 3rd..

top assists men in Europe as well :bow:

by Harmonica Wed May 16, 2012 4:05 pm

I think these fit here also

Goals:

Messi 50 (10 penalty)
Cronaldo 46 (12 penalty)

Accuracy:

Messi 5.5 shots/ goal
Cronaldo 6.9 shots/ goal

Individuality of goals:

Messi, 22/50 or 44% were directly assisted.
Cronaldo, 35/46 or 80% were directly assisted.

Assists:

Messi 20
Cronaldo 12

Creativity:

Messi 56 throughballs, 92 key passes
Cronaldo 19 throughballs, 60 key passes

Build up play

Messi 176 dribbless
Cronaldo 73 dribbless

Lost posession

Messi 96 dispossessed + 61 turnovers = 157 times
Cronaldo 79 dispossessed + 86 turnovers = 165 times

Impotance of stats:

Here is La Liga 11-12 without Messi's and Cronaldo's goals, and assists:

Messi wins golden shoe 11-12. - Page 4 MessiCronoLaLiga

Messi wins golden shoe 11-12. - Page 4 MessiCronoLaLiga

Messi got points for the team in 15 games, 35 overall.
Cronaldo got points for the team in 11 games, 25 overall.

by Onyx Wed May 16, 2012 4:16 pm

Messi is the better player overall, with or without the stats.

by Potential Wed May 16, 2012 4:24 pm

You can't measure creativity by throughballs, and neither you can calculate accuracy as shots are taken from a different places. "Individuality of goals" cannot be calculated by percentage of assisted as you can get the ball from a pass, dribble past the whole team and still be assisted however I would agree on it if you calculated assists by three or four touches before shooting.

by Harmonica Wed May 16, 2012 4:30 pm

Potential wrote:You can't measure creativity by throughballs, and neither you can calculate accuracy as shots are taken from a different places. "Individuality of goals" cannot be calculated by percentage of assisted as you can get the ball from a pass, dribble past the whole team and still be assisted however I would agree on it if you calculated assists by three or four touches before shooting.

Of course you can, throughballs are the best, most thoughest and most awarding way of creating a goal scoring situation. Same goes for accuracy, what does it matter where you make the shot? It's your choice? When you shoot off, you loose possession.

Direct pass here means no part in build up play, basically you receive the ball from the teammate, for the first time and make a goal from it.

by Potential Wed May 16, 2012 4:55 pm

jiopsi wrote:
Potential wrote:You can't measure creativity by throughballs, and neither you can calculate accuracy as shots are taken from a different places. "Individuality of goals" cannot be calculated by percentage of assisted as you can get the ball from a pass, dribble past the whole team and still be assisted however I would agree on it if you calculated assists by three or four touches before shooting.
Of course you can, throughballs are the best, most thoughest and most awarding way of creating a goal scoring situation. Same goes for accuracy, what does it matter where you make the shot? It's your choice? When you shoot off, you loose possession.

Direct pass here means no part in build up play, basically you receive the ball from the teammate, for the first time and make a goal from it.

I agree on the most toughest and the most awarding, but using throughballs alone is not enough as creativity isn't all about passing, accuracy is probably easiest calculated using shots on target / total shots but if you want to be accurate measuring it more accurately is by using an equation, the simplest of them is and this one is more accurate than yours is (meters to target*sin angle), but it's not accurate enough.

Cassano has 11 accurate through balls and 10 assists, but then you have Seedorf who has seven through balls but only one assist, it's incredibly inaccurate.

On the last note, you're probably correct but doesn't that make Ronaldo the better team player?

by Zealous Wed May 16, 2012 4:56 pm

"Messi's goals were worthless" - Jose Mourinho

:coffee:

by Harmonica Wed May 16, 2012 4:58 pm

Zealous wrote:"Messi's goals were worthless" - Jose Mourinho

"Mourinho's words are worthless" - Javier "no you see it, now you don't" Mascherano

:coffee:

by Harmonica Wed May 16, 2012 5:01 pm

Potential wrote:
jiopsi wrote:
Potential wrote:You can't measure creativity by throughballs, and neither you can calculate accuracy as shots are taken from a different places. "Individuality of goals" cannot be calculated by percentage of assisted as you can get the ball from a pass, dribble past the whole team and still be assisted however I would agree on it if you calculated assists by three or four touches before shooting.
Of course you can, throughballs are the best, most thoughest and most awarding way of creating a goal scoring situation. Same goes for accuracy, what does it matter where you make the shot? It's your choice? When you shoot off, you loose possession.

Direct pass here means no part in build up play, basically you receive the ball from the teammate, for the first time and make a goal from it.

I agree on the most toughest and the most awarding, but using throughballs alone is not enough as creativity isn't all about passing, accuracy is probably easiest calculated using shots on target / total shots but if you want to be accurate measuring it more accurately is by using an equation, the simplest of them is and this one is more accurate than yours is (meters to target*sin angle), but it's not accurate enough.

Cassano has 11 accurate through balls and 10 assists, but then you have Seedorf who has seven through balls but only one assist, it's incredibly inaccurate.

On the last note, you're probably correct but doesn't that make Ronaldo the better team player?

There is also the key passes (pass that led to a shot) in the creativity part. Also you could add successfull dribbles to it.

Better team player? I don't know how.

by Zealous Wed May 16, 2012 5:02 pm

Jose Mourinho will be remembered in football history.

Javier "Now I see Cristiano, now I don't" Mascherano will play his retirement match against some Argentine team and never be mentioned ever again.

by kiranr Wed May 16, 2012 5:03 pm

Zealous wrote:Jose Mourinho will be remembered in football history.

So is Pele :coffee:

by Harmonica Wed May 16, 2012 5:06 pm

Zealous wrote:Jose Mourinho will be remembered in football history.

Yes, as the ultimate douchebag and a liar.

by Harmonica Wed May 16, 2012 5:07 pm

kiranr wrote:
Zealous wrote:Jose Mourinho will be remembered in football history.

So is Pele

Exactly.

by Mr Nick09 Wed May 16, 2012 5:08 pm

Mourinho will be remembered for many things, one of my favorites will the "the man that ran Pep out of barcelona" Very Happy

by kiranr Wed May 16, 2012 5:10 pm

Mr Nick09 wrote:Mourinho will be remembered for many things, one of my favorites will the "the man that ran Pep out of barcelona"

Your fertile imagination will do you well when you have to dream about all the trophies you could have won in the future :coffee:

by Zealous Wed May 16, 2012 5:17 pm

jiopsi wrote:
Zealous wrote:Jose Mourinho will be remembered in football history.
Yes, as the ultimate winner and trophy collector.

by Zealous Wed May 16, 2012 5:18 pm

jiopsi wrote:
kiranr wrote:
Zealous wrote:Jose Mourinho will be remembered in football history.

So is Pele
Exactly.

Exactly what?

It's not even remotely the same. One is remembered as a great player, the other as a great manager who understands the game.

by Harmonica Wed May 16, 2012 5:20 pm

Zealous wrote:
jiopsi wrote:
Zealous wrote:Jose Mourinho will be remembered in football history.
Yes, as the ultimate douchbag and a liar.

by Potential Wed May 16, 2012 5:22 pm

Zealous wrote:
jiopsi wrote:
kiranr wrote:
Zealous wrote:Jose Mourinho will be remembered in football history.

So is Pele
Exactly.

Exactly what?

It's not even remotely the same. One is remembered as a great player, the other as a great manager who understands the game.

Both don't know what they're talking about :coffee:

by Harmonica Wed May 16, 2012 5:22 pm

Zealous wrote:
jiopsi wrote:
kiranr wrote:
Zealous wrote:Jose Mourinho will be remembered in football history.

So is Pele
Exactly.

Exactly what?

It's not even remotely the same. One is remembered as a great player, the other as a great manager who understands the game.

Nobody cares what Mourinho has to say, he has burned all the bridges, lost his honor, and also demolished Madrids reputation with it, like for ever.

by Lord Awesome Wed May 16, 2012 5:23 pm

Mou dosen't have to say anything.

His cups seem to do most of the talking anyway.

by Harmonica Wed May 16, 2012 5:26 pm

Lord Hispano wrote:Mou dosen't have to say anything.

His cups seem to do most of the talking anyway.

You should tell that to him.

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