Is Lugano ignorant or blind?

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Post by rsinatra Fri Jan 13, 2012 12:42 pm

I don't know if this is the right section to post this, but I've just read Lugano's comments on Luis Suarez's situation (http://www.goal.com/en/news/9/england/2012/01/13/2844862/paris-saint-germains-diego-lugano-liverpools-luis-suarez-is), and here's one of the things he said:

"People should understand that racism doesn't exist in South America. We are not suffering from the problems that exist here in Europe.""

I am just stunned at such a statement. Is he really that ignorant? I know we can't expect all football players to actually have a certain degree of intelligence, but it just baffles me. No racism in South America?

Perhaps because he is white he says that. But it just goes to show how deceived people are. I've witnessed various racist moments in Brazil, and not too long ago our good old uruguay4life user was banned from this forum because of a racist offense against another South American.

In the past, there have been countless cases on TV about football players who were victims of racism in Brazil. Sometimes it's not even their color, but which part of Brazil they come from (the same way Argentina has a lot of prejudice against immigrants from Bolivia, Paraguay, etc..). Isn't that the same as racism? Outside of football, "Indians" (Native Brazilians, etc) still suffer from a major lack of understanding and most of them live with a very poor, sometimes miserable lifestyle.

Anyway, I am just creating this thread to show that not all South Americans are this ignorant. We are very aware of the problems in our countries, just like many Europeans, Asians, Africans, etc, are as well. Perhaps our racism is sometimes more discrete, but it's still there, and it's just as bad. And it has to stop, both on and off the pitch!!!!!!!!!
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Post by Dutti Fri Jan 13, 2012 12:45 pm

Oh please everyone is racist by nature even if they don't realize or show it publicly.
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Post by rsinatra Fri Jan 13, 2012 12:53 pm

Dutti wrote:Oh please everyone is racist by nature even if they don't realize or show it publicly.

God? is that you? Suspect
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Post by Dutti Fri Jan 13, 2012 12:56 pm

rsinatra wrote:
Dutti wrote:Oh please everyone is racist by nature even if they don't realize or show it publicly.

God? is that you? Suspect

lol
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Post by 7amood11 Fri Jan 13, 2012 12:58 pm

Dutti wrote:Oh please everyone is racist by nature even if they don't realize or show it publicly.

Suspect
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Post by halamadrid2 Fri Jan 13, 2012 12:59 pm

lol Dutti
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Post by BarrileteCosmico Fri Jan 13, 2012 1:05 pm

I think by "doesn't exist" he means "not nearly to the extent that exists in Europe". Otherwise he's blind.

Anyway, he's right in a way. At least in the Southern Cone there's not that much racial diversity, so the amount of racism here is very low, not because we're incredibly open people but because there are not that many people to discriminate here. To my knowledge, there are like a total of 25,000 blacks in Argentina (population 40M) and I've never read a story of them being racially abused (although I'm sure it happens). The amount of asian people here is a bit more substantial and again, I've never heard of any asian person being discriminated.

You're right some Argentines do use words like "Paraguayan" and "Bolivian" in an insulting or discriminatory way. But this doesn't stem off a desire to keep our white legacy pure, it has a lot more to do with xenophobia. I wouldn't say that it's racially motivated.
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Post by Swanhends Fri Jan 13, 2012 1:07 pm

Lugano is from Uruguay....Racism isnt considered racist in Uruguay
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Post by halamadrid2 Fri Jan 13, 2012 1:10 pm

neither have i here in Birmingham Barilete... but somehow it does exist
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Post by rsinatra Fri Jan 13, 2012 1:25 pm

BarrileteCosmico wrote:I think by "doesn't exist" he means "not nearly to the extent that exists in Europe". Otherwise he's blind.

Anyway, he's right in a way. At least in the Southern Cone there's not that much racial diversity, so the amount of racism here is very low, not because we're incredibly open people but because there are not that many people to discriminate here. To my knowledge, there are like a total of 25,000 blacks in Argentina (population 40M) and I've never read a story of them being racially abused (although I'm sure it happens). The amount of asian people here is a bit more substantial and again, I've never heard of any asian person being discriminated.

You're right some Argentines do use words like "Paraguayan" and "Bolivian" in an insulting or discriminatory way. But this doesn't stem off a desire to keep our white legacy pure, it has a lot more to do with xenophobia. I wouldn't say that it's racially motivated.

Well, but that's the thing isn't it? We think that racism is not as bad as it is in Europe, but I think we might be wrong. It's just disguised, but it's there. I've heard some Brazilians make racist comments without even realizing they were doing so.

Don't forget the racism against Natives. Didn't Maradona himself, who claims to have some Native blood, clam to have suffered a certain type of prejudice?

And to me , xenophobia is as bad as racism!! Especially in countries like ours, that were basically made up of immigrants.
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Post by rsinatra Fri Jan 13, 2012 1:27 pm

bhends wrote:Lugano is from Uruguay....Racism isnt considered racist in Uruguay

lol funny comment... but remember not to generalize too much!! it's the same as some people claiming that all Americans support their wars and invasions and so on. I know some decent, non-racist Uruguayans Smile
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Post by halamadrid2 Fri Jan 13, 2012 1:28 pm

Xenofobia=Rasicm
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Post by kiranr Fri Jan 13, 2012 1:33 pm

bhends wrote:Lugano is from Uruguay....Racism isnt considered racist in Uruguay

lol...

But yeah, maybe it is just an insult there without any racist intention...
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Post by johniet Fri Jan 13, 2012 3:02 pm

BarrileteCosmico wrote:I think by "doesn't exist" he means "not nearly to the extent that exists in Europe". Otherwise he's blind.

Anyway, he's right in a way. At least in the Southern Cone there's not that much racial diversity, so the amount of racism here is very low, not because we're incredibly open people but because there are not that many people to discriminate here. To my knowledge, there are like a total of 25,000 blacks in Argentina (population 40M) and I've never read a story of them being racially abused (although I'm sure it happens). The amount of asian people here is a bit more substantial and again, I've never heard of any asian person being discriminated.

You're right some Argentines do use words like "Paraguayan" and "Bolivian" in an insulting or discriminatory way. But this doesn't stem off a desire to keep our white legacy pure, it has a lot more to do with xenophobia. I wouldn't say that it's racially motivated.

argentinians :facepalm: you are blinder than Lugano
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Post by BarrileteCosmico Fri Jan 13, 2012 3:08 pm

rsinatra wrote:Well, but that's the thing isn't it? We think that racism is not as bad as it is in Europe, but I think we might be wrong. It's just disguised, but it's there. I've heard some Brazilians make racist comments without even realizing they were doing so.

Don't forget the racism against Natives. Didn't Maradona himself, who claims to have some Native blood, clam to have suffered a certain type of prejudice?

And to me , xenophobia is as bad as racism!! Especially in countries like ours, that were basically made up of immigrants.

Not saying it's any better to be a xenophobe than a racist, I'm just noting the difference. It's definitely also a despicable attitude.

Other Argentines in the board may disagree with me, but I don't think it's as big a problem as it is in Europe. There's very little racial tension because almost everyone is white (I don't consider natives to be another race). There are definitely discriminatory problems, but I'm not sure if I would categorize them as "racism".

@Johniet care to explain to me what makes you facepalm rather than insulting me?
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Post by johniet Fri Jan 13, 2012 3:13 pm

BarrileteCosmico wrote:
rsinatra wrote:Well, but that's the thing isn't it? We think that racism is not as bad as it is in Europe, but I think we might be wrong. It's just disguised, but it's there. I've heard some Brazilians make racist comments without even realizing they were doing so.

Don't forget the racism against Natives. Didn't Maradona himself, who claims to have some Native blood, clam to have suffered a certain type of prejudice?

And to me , xenophobia is as bad as racism!! Especially in countries like ours, that were basically made up of immigrants.

did it feel like an insult?? srry for that... scratch , you said "he is right in some way,in Argentina we use "paraguayo" "boliviano" as an insult but that is not racism.

Not saying it's any better to be a xenophobe than a racist, I'm just noting the difference. It's definitely also a despicable attitude.

Other Argentines in the board may disagree with me, but I don't think it's as big a problem as it is in Europe. There's very little racial tension because almost everyone is white (I don't consider natives to be another race). There are definitely discriminatory problems, but I'm not sure if I would categorize them as "racism".

@Johniet care to explain to me what makes you facepalm rather than insulting me?

i have been racially abused online by Argentines several times cheers , and I'm not even black I am just colombian and I'm sure it is the same with the bolivians and paraguayans
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Post by Sushi Master Fri Jan 13, 2012 3:26 pm

Racism exists everywhere. I can hear racist comments from pretty much everywhere. Blacks, native indians, whites, mestizos, sambos etc.

The southern countries (Argentina, Uruguay) have very little racial variety: almost everyone is white. They tend to be the more outspoken, IMO. They might say some racist shit behind my back but if I'm nice to them they won't care what color my skin is.

Here, there are just too much damn race mixture for everyone to get their panties tied. Sure, you can hear racists comments but at the end of the day no one gives a shit and you will not be discriminated against. You'll still be talked to, treated well with respect and he'll still let you marry his daughter.

Racism exists, but as Barrilete said, there's barely any tension and here people are proud to be Bolivian, Brazilian, Chilean or whatever no matter who they share race with.
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Post by Lord Awesome Fri Jan 13, 2012 8:41 pm

The only racism I've seen all over Latin America is always pointed toward the indiginous populations, sadly. The word Indio (more so than Negrito) is actually more often used to degrade someone. Even Hugo Sanchez couldn't escape being called such.
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Post by Shotta Fri Jan 13, 2012 9:17 pm

rsinatra is hilarious. There is way less racism in South American Countries than in Xenophobic Europe.
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Post by rsinatra Sat Jan 14, 2012 11:18 am

Shotta wrote:rsinatra is hilarious. There is way less racism in South American Countries than in Xenophobic Europe.

im sorry, are you south american? because i am, i was born and raised there. i think i am in a better position to talk about it than some bayern munich likely-to-be german fan.
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Post by rsinatra Sat Jan 14, 2012 11:31 am

Sushi Master wrote:Racism exists everywhere. I can hear racist comments from pretty much everywhere. Blacks, native indians, whites, mestizos, sambos etc.

The southern countries (Argentina, Uruguay) have very little racial variety: almost everyone is white. They tend to be the more outspoken, IMO. They might say some racist shit behind my back but if I'm nice to them they won't care what color my skin is.

Here, there are just too much damn race mixture for everyone to get their panties tied. Sure, you can hear racists comments but at the end of the day no one gives a shit and you will not be discriminated against. You'll still be talked to, treated well with respect and he'll still let you marry his daughter.

Racism exists, but as Barrilete said, there's barely any tension and here people are proud to be Bolivian, Brazilian, Chilean or whatever no matter who they share race with.

The difference between South America and USA, is that despite the racism being there, the acceptance on interracial marriage, etc, has always been next to none. Brazil, as racist as any other country that had African slaves in the past, always claimed that pride about being a mixture of many races. Racism is more disguised under "social classes", in which some maids have to have their own bathroom and are seen as dirty by their middle class bosses.

When I lived in USA, I was at some party filled with Brazilians, and I happened to overhear a middle-aged man from Minas Gerais state saying that someone's son was to marry a black woman and many people disliked that idea, but he, as the good man he thought it was, said, "well, if god wants it, then there should be no problem." So, you see? He didn't even realize he was being racist himself. I mean, does god have to say it's okay for a white man to marry this "negrinha" (As he called her)?

I think many whiter South Americans think it's okay and it's no big deal, move on, but let us hear it from the other side. Just back in the 60's, there were still places in Brazil where no blacks were allowed in.


Last edited by rsinatra on Sat Jan 14, 2012 11:35 am; edited 1 time in total
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Post by rsinatra Sat Jan 14, 2012 11:31 am

BarrileteCosmico wrote:
rsinatra wrote:Well, but that's the thing isn't it? We think that racism is not as bad as it is in Europe, but I think we might be wrong. It's just disguised, but it's there. I've heard some Brazilians make racist comments without even realizing they were doing so.

Don't forget the racism against Natives. Didn't Maradona himself, who claims to have some Native blood, clam to have suffered a certain type of prejudice?

And to me , xenophobia is as bad as racism!! Especially in countries like ours, that were basically made up of immigrants.

Not saying it's any better to be a xenophobe than a racist, I'm just noting the difference. It's definitely also a despicable attitude.

Other Argentines in the board may disagree with me, but I don't think it's as big a problem as it is in Europe. There's very little racial tension because almost everyone is white (I don't consider natives to be another race). There are definitely discriminatory problems, but I'm not sure if I would categorize them as "racism".

@Johniet care to explain to me what makes you facepalm rather than insulting me?

That's the thing, you might think there's no problem because you are the majority. Leave it to the minorities to really say what goes on.

In Brazil, the black population is huge, and still they suffer from racism because the white population tends to be the one with the most money.

johniet wrote:

i have been racially abused online by Argentines several times cheers , and I'm not even black I am just colombian and I'm sure it is the same with the bolivians and paraguayans

When Santos play Boca back in the 60's, their fans kept calling Pelé and the others "little monkeys from Brazil". Argentines are famous for being the snobs of South America, but I find this generalization to be just as full of prejudice as any other.

Lord Hispano wrote:The only racism I've seen all over Latin America is always pointed toward the indiginous populations, sadly. The word Indio (more so than Negrito) is actually more often used to degrade someone. Even Hugo Sanchez couldn't escape being called such.

That is pretty interesting. The word "índio" in Portuguese has nothing pejorative in it. It simply is the word we use to call Native Brazilians/Amerindians. THe problem in Brazil is the way we talk about them, stereotyping them and treating them as invaders. Stupid farmers taking their land away!!







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Post by Sushi Master Sat Jan 14, 2012 11:57 am

Didn't know racism in Brazil was that bad, although you guys are pretty much 50% black/white. Here it's a lot more reserved due to most of the population being mestizo. The God thing is due to the highly Catholic background of most SA countries, I don't think it was meant as a racist idea, rather the contrary since God supposedly sees us the same no matter what the skin color.

But yeah, racism still exists, and it's mostly in the whiter populations. In Caracas people are huge snobs here, kinda like Argentines. In my city, we're in wayuu (Ameridian tribe) territory and you constantly hear racist comments, but then again interracial marriages are daily.

Basically, racism exists but in a very laid back sort of way. Lugano's statement was obviously exagerrated.

Negro/negrito is still a very common nickname, in his defense Very Happy
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Post by Ganso Sat Jan 14, 2012 12:06 pm

I'm white and there is some racism here in brazil....I have to admit that most of my family is kind of racist.my grandparents for example would never let me date black chicks.but the younger generations like me arent racist at all
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Post by Sushi Master Sat Jan 14, 2012 12:15 pm

Aren't most of you Brazilians here from recent European backgrounds?
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