To what extent does our European campaign depend on the Barcelona games?

Personally, I think these games will be much more than the decider for the top of the Champions league group. I forsee these games as either making or breaking our European season, not just because we will probably play an easier team if we win, but also because of the massive confidence it will give our squad.

What do you guys think?

Forza Rossoneri wrote:Personally, I think these games will be much more than the decider for the top of the Champions league group. I forsee these games as either making or breaking our European season, not just because we will probably play an easier team if we win, but also because of the massive confidence it will give our squad.

What do you guys think?

It's just a group game ... and I much prefer we loose these games rather than win ...

pUsHa wrote:

Forza Rossoneri wrote:Personally, I think these games will be much more than the decider for the top of the Champions league group. I forsee these games as either making or breaking our European season, not just because we will probably play an easier team if we win, but also because of the massive confidence it will give our squad.

What do you guys think?

It's just a group game ... and I much prefer we loose these games rather than win ...

What! Why?

Forza Rossoneri wrote:

pUsHa wrote:

Forza Rossoneri wrote:Personally, I think these games will be much more than the decider for the top of the Champions league group. I forsee these games as either making or breaking our European season, not just because we will probably play an easier team if we win, but also because of the massive confidence it will give our squad.

What do you guys think?

It's just a group game ... and I much prefer we loose these games rather than win ...

What! Why?

Let them think they are superior ....last time i checked Inter were sh1t against them in the groups but they beat them in the play-offs .... so I wont give much of a heart about these group games ....

I think they're more important as a learning curve than in defining our season in Europe. You can plan how to defeat Barcelona, however to get it right the first time is rare and we've been given two priceless opportunities to learn against them. We shouldn't be defeatist and I would never go out to lose a game, however I am approaching these with a very flexible perspective.

Inter Milan didn't look like Treble champions when they parked a sky bus at the San Siro during the group stages and were up against the wall with Dynamo Kiev and Rubin Kazan, however it reinforces the sometimes cruel but special nature of this tournament.

Beating Barcelona brings confidence and pride to the squad, however it doesn't bring us close to the trophy, because it won't eliminate them, short of heroic efforts from BATE Borisov, which we frankly shouldn't want lest it hurt us as well.

We might get an easier team if we win our group, however to my mind it will make little difference. Firstly, consider the sorts of teams who might be finishing second. Manchester City, Valencia, Lille, Villarreal are teams we're capable of beating, however they're still very tricky opponents who could potentially ruin our campaign.

Secondly if we are to be close to successful in Europe, we're going to need to learn to beat the best when it matters in the knock-out stages, like Inter did when they knocked out the English, Russian, Spanish and German champions. If we get a tough team in the knock-out rounds that is fine by me, because from that very first knock-out leg is when we need to start performing regardless of our opposition.

When we beat Barcelona, I want it to mean that we're past them and we can forget the threat they pose, not to simply enrage them and alert Pep. Could we snatch a victory in the group stages? With their injuries, it's possible though I still think a draw will be our best result. Could we back it up with two or three victories over the next season? I'm all for belief and I have faith in the power of a strong defensive performance, however there are far easier ways to attack Europe. Someone else could always knock them out for us and it is very difficult to win back to back trophies, however United got to the final two years in a row, whilst Barcelona have reached the semis three years in a row, winning twice in that time. We can't rely on history and probability to do the job for us, assuming we are serious about Europe. I'm only looking for a promising campaign, not a triumphant one, however I believe my points are still relevant.

We should still give these games our best shot, I'm sick of "being the best team apart from Barca" stuff. I want Milan to be "the best team" and that's it. It's a tall order, however, we are a club that has a history of being up to the task 7 times.

We'll give these games our best shot, however we'll be ill prepared and also to an extent uncertain about who will perform under the intense pressure we'll be under and who can effectively attack the weaknesses that Barcelona have. We'll find out who the true men are, then later in the competition we'll see the real fight which defines who the best are.

However until that final test comes, let's just focus on getting out of the group then taking each team as they come. I definitely agree with your sentiments though.

I just hope we don't get killed in this game.
other then that I think it's a good learning experience and will be useful when we meet them again in the final

european campaign!, what european campaign???, i'll be very happy if we can make it to 1/4 finals........

we're no match for the likes of barca, madrid and man utd......

now that our transfer market has ended suddenly this gave me a bit of a fright that barca will annihilate us..... god help us..

JespSwe wrote:now that our transfer market has ended suddenly this gave me a bit of a fright that barca will annihilate us..... god help us..

worst part is allegri already talking big about how we're going to stop barca and make things difficult for them despite the fact that we all know that we should be very happy if we got out with a point from these games.......

Well these games will definitely have a major impact on our CL campaign. They won't be crucial however; and the fact that we are unlikely to win, especially in the first game, will not be too detrimental to our Cl hopes.

It will however be a valuable opportunity as Dostoe said. Allegri I imagine will be overjoyed to have 2 chances to pit our squad against the best of the best.

Fadi wrote:

JespSwe wrote:now that our transfer market has ended suddenly this gave me a bit of a fright that barca will annihilate us..... god help us..

worst part is allegri already talking big about how we're going to stop barca and make things difficult for them despite the fact that we all know that we should be very happy if we got out with a point from these games.......

maybe allegri said that to encourage our players but he should have said that in training camp and not infront of media lol... or just have kept quiet and work on the pitch on how he feels about it.

ACMRox wrote:Well these games will definitely have a major impact on our CL campaign. They won't be crucial however; and the fact that we are unlikely to win, especially in the first game, will not be too detrimental to our Cl hopes.

It will however be a valuable opportunity as Dostoe said. Allegri I imagine will be overjoyed to have 2 chances to pit our squad against the best of the best.

like i said in another topic, if we were to loose i hope loose with some dignity by playing some good football. the worst thing ever is that taiwo is iinjured and antonini would be fielded against the best player in the universe in messi... wtf..

ya man... though this game like everyone said would be a valuable lesson ,a learning curve. allegri is in a way good at that.

you arent ready to become european champions.

if you think you are then prove it.

of course barcelona vs milan means something.. it means youre taking it seriously if you manage a good tie and evade embarassement.

if you dont even try then what does that say of your campaign.

i as a coach would not be making such questions as the op because its pretty obvious that we have to take it seriously. even though this sounds cliche and obvious i would tell them to go out there and win, and also make it possible and input what i can aswell.

its your choice here. make or break in a sense... is ac milan back? will be the question you guys have to answer.

doenst mean you have to beat them.. you have to compete with what youve got guys.

dostoevsky wrote:I think they're more important as a learning curve than in defining our season in Europe. You can plan how to defeat Barcelona, however to get it right the first time is rare and we've been given two priceless opportunities to learn against them. We shouldn't be defeatist and I would never go out to lose a game, however I am approaching these with a very flexible perspective.

Inter Milan didn't look like Treble champions when they parked a sky bus at the San Siro during the group stages and were up against the wall with Dynamo Kiev and Rubin Kazan, however it reinforces the sometimes cruel but special nature of this tournament.

Beating Barcelona brings confidence and pride to the squad, however it doesn't bring us close to the trophy, because it won't eliminate them, short of heroic efforts from BATE Borisov, which we frankly shouldn't want lest it hurt us as well.

We might get an easier team if we win our group, however to my mind it will make little difference. Firstly, consider the sorts of teams who might be finishing second. Manchester City, Valencia, Lille, Villarreal are teams we're capable of beating, however they're still very tricky opponents who could potentially ruin our campaign.

Secondly if we are to be close to successful in Europe, we're going to need to learn to beat the best when it matters in the knock-out stages, like Inter did when they knocked out the English, Russian, Spanish and German champions. If we get a tough team in the knock-out rounds that is fine by me, because from that very first knock-out leg is when we need to start performing regardless of our opposition.

When we beat Barcelona, I want it to mean that we're past them and we can forget the threat they pose, not to simply enrage them and alert Pep. Could we snatch a victory in the group stages? With their injuries, it's possible though I still think a draw will be our best result. Could we back it up with two or three victories over the next season? I'm all for belief and I have faith in the power of a strong defensive performance, however there are far easier ways to attack Europe. Someone else could always knock them out for us and it is very difficult to win back to back trophies, however United got to the final two years in a row, whilst Barcelona have reached the semis three years in a row, winning twice in that time. We can't rely on history and probability to do the job for us, assuming we are serious about Europe. I'm only looking for a promising campaign, not a triumphant one, however I believe my points are still relevant.

ya well written, when you say "when we beat barcelona i want it to mean that we're past them and we can forget the threat they pose" i woudlnt put it that way.. you always have to respect their danger, but if you mean it in a psychological aspect then ok.

as i said there are about 3 teams that are up there with big possibilities to win. and then theres the other tier that has to build like ac milan,bayer munich, chelsea, manchester city, and show what they have by being serious.

Well fought QF exit at the least would be great.

"When we beat Barcelona I want it to mean that we're past them and we can forget the threat they pose," was meant in the sense that they would be quite literally out of the competition, ending the threat they pose to us this season.

dostoevsky wrote:"When we beat Barcelona I want it to mean that we're past them and we can forget the threat they pose," was meant in the sense that they would be quite literally out of the competition, ending the threat they pose to us this season.

that is simply put a bit... unrealistic for such a situation to happen mate, you an italian team, hence you should defensively be put, if you can bring that to the table and effectively show the good football milan plays then you should get closer and closer to the big guys, but instead of imagining how youre going to "blow barcelona" which really is unrealistic to completely blow.. find a way to play to your strengths.

now talking literally.. that seems like fear of encountering them ahead.. supposing you mean that you hope someone else takes care of them..

I am giving a comparison to the very games you have in your signature.

Beating Barcelona in the group stages doesn't advance our cause, beating them once when it matters in a knock-out round is all that counts.

I never once said "blow" Barcelona, the entire post was about using the first games as a learning curve so that we can play to our strengths.

I think that we are a 'decent' chance of winning this game. I don't think that's such a delusional idea as some have suggested. Yes, we will have to play a tactical game, and yes we may have to play defensively or on the counter at times, but we do have strengths, and we can use them to our advantage.

I'll admit, we are outmatched in certain positions:

Messi - Abate will have to produce a miracle
Xavi - We will have to play a destroyer to 'tag' him the whole game (V. Bommel would be 1st choice)
Iniesta - In career best form, another DM needs to play on him (Gattuso is out, so I suspect that Ambrosini or Nocerino will get the nod)
Fabregas- maybe Boateng will have to run with him.
Pique-Puyol - Barca's wall at CB. Not sure if they're fit or not though.

In other positions, Barca have some weaknesses:

V. Valdez - A good player, but certainly not on par with the world's elite goalkeepers.
S. Busquets - He's coasting in this Barca team due to the good work of those in front of him. If we get enough supply, we should be able to bypass him a few times.
Abidal- A solid LB, but not really fast and doesn't get too far forward often.
Alves- A superb wing-back, not exactly a 'weakness', but he is defensively suspect and we could get players in behind him if we are creative enough.

Our strengths:

Ibra- Will they be able to deal with him? Unlikely. Can we get enough supply to him? That's another question.
Pato- Needs to have a good game though, if he's anonymous we might as well put him down as a weakness.
Cassano- A great asset to our team. Will he be fit enough to pull the moves on their defence though?
Robinho- It's all about the finishing here.
Nesta-Silva - A wall as strong as Pique-Puyol. Hopefully neither of them are injured.
Abbiati- Had his best season last year.

Our weaknesses:

MIDFIELD- Need to be in sync to defend against their tricky passing as well as having the creativity to get the ball forward and keep possession.

Abate's unlikely to come into a direct confrontation with Messi, he'll be mostly contending with Villa and Iniesta. Messi drifts everywhere, however it's more than likely that he'll spend the majority of his time contending with Silva, Van Bommel and I'm guessing Zambrotta. It's a team effort though and everyone is going to need to work hard, particularly our box-to-box midfielders.

As for their weaknesses, I disagree with Busquets being a weakness. Positionally he's majestic and he's cool in possession, our main channel of attack on Sergio would be through a player capable of slipping past him in a one-on-one confrontation, but importantly a player with pace. We're giving too much to do to Pato if he's asked to drop this deep, not to mention it's preferable to use a player with superior vision than Pato. If Robinho brings his dancing shoes it's a possibility however is Allegri really going to trust him in midfield? Aquilani and Boateng are unlikely heroes if we're trying to simply channel ourselves through one weakness.

Pique and Puyol are unlikely to play however, and this is Barcelona's true weakness. Abidal and particularly Mascherano must be harassed in possession in order to break their stranglehold on the ball and turn the pressure back on Barcelona. Mascherano in particular, who is almost certain to play in some position, is our best hope for snatching a goal through a quick turnover.

In order to put the impetus on Mascherano to attempt to play the ball out of defence, we also need to ensure that Dani Alves' passing routes are shut down, allowing no open options, crowding his side of the field and encouraging Barcelona to switch across their back four. Another note on Dani Alves should be the occasional use of Robinho or Pato to not track back but instead occupy the space which Alves leaves open when he does attack. It may force Pep to pull him out of the attack lest he risk opening the left channel for us to strike or might allow us to face a back-line not holding its perfect shape.

This all really depends on whether Busquets plays at centre-back or defensive midfield, however our attacking midfielder is likely going to be required to give Xavi as little time as possible and to at the very least prevent him from having time to look forward.

With a full squad I'm not yet sure that Fabregas will start, however he's an unbelievable pair of fresh legs to have on the bench.

I do believe that we could put up the defensive performance to stop Barcelona, however whilst Barcelona aren't at full fitness yet we're far from it as well, and it will show more for us.

i am not sure the first match will be that important,regarding our season after. '

Don't get me wrong, it will be as important as it gets , it's Milan-Barcelona afterall , 2 big teams with great players in the CL. We will see our weaknesses and how big or small these are. Apart from this , i am pretty sure we all know what Milan is capable of , pretty much.. I am not saying we will win , far from it , but we will make them sweat big time if they want to defeat us.

In the end , i think these matches won't refine our season , but they will , in a way , create a certain picture of Milan as a team, at least for the following matches..

Dante13 wrote:i am not sure the first match will be that important,regarding our season after. '

Don't get me wrong, it will be as important as it gets , it's Milan-Barcelona afterall , 2 big teams with great players in the CL. We will see our weaknesses and how big or small these are. Apart from this , i am pretty sure we all know what Milan is capable of , pretty much.. I am not saying we will win , far from it , but we will make them sweat big time if they want to defeat us.

In the end , i think these matches won't refine our season , but they will , in a way , create a certain picture of Milan as a team, at least for the following matches..

i like that phrase. this game is like creating an image of our team as a whole

If we lose in first game against Barcelona it will not affect us much. It will only give us clue how to play them at Sansiro. But if we won, that will give our players much boost for rest of a season.