Pep Guardiola - King of the Carabao Club

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Post by halamadrid2 Wed May 04, 2022 11:08 pm

He only needs another billion

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Post by BarcaLearning Wed May 04, 2022 11:09 pm

Poor Pep, I actually feel sorry for him after this... actually often ppl rate him the best in general or ppl think so he gets overrated n then when he fails ppl jump on it... always say his game has too big flaws n weaknesses n thats why he fails to win often. I guess either u like his style of football or u dont... cant expect his teams that plays with big flaws to win all the time basically.
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Post by futbol_bill Wed May 04, 2022 11:13 pm

BarcaLearning wrote:Poor Pep, I actually feel sorry for him after this... actually often ppl rate him the best in general or ppl think so he gets overrated n then when he fails ppl jump on it... always say his game has too big flaws n weaknesses n thats why he fails to win often. I guess either u like his style of football or u dont... cant expect his teams that plays with big flaws to win all the time basically.


What a clown fanboy!
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Post by Lord Spencer Wed May 04, 2022 11:18 pm

futbol_bill wrote:
BarcaLearning wrote:Poor Pep, I actually feel sorry for him after this... actually often ppl rate him the best in general or ppl think so he gets overrated n then when he fails ppl jump on it... always say his game has too big flaws n weaknesses n thats why he fails to win often. I guess either u like his style of football or u dont... cant expect his teams that plays with big flaws to win all the time basically.


What a clown fanboy!


There is nothing clownish about that take.

It's clear that people don't think not look at Pep objectively. Neither in this site or elsewhere.

(All coaches are victims of this hyperbole tbf).
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Post by Pedram Wed May 04, 2022 11:21 pm

Lord Spencer wrote:
futbol_bill wrote:
BarcaLearning wrote:Poor Pep, I actually feel sorry for him after this... actually often ppl rate him the best in general or ppl think so he gets overrated n then when he fails ppl jump on it... always say his game has too big flaws n weaknesses n thats why he fails to win often. I guess either u like his style of football or u dont... cant expect his teams that plays with big flaws to win all the time basically.


What a clown fanboy!


There is nothing clownish about that take.

It's clear that people don't think not look at Pep objectively. Neither in this site or elsewhere.

(All coaches are victims of this hyperbole tbf).


He's right, Barcalearning is so insufferable lol. seeing him eat crow time after time is one of my favorite past time. Laughing
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Post by Turok_TTZ Wed May 04, 2022 11:28 pm

BarcaLearning wrote:Poor Pep, I actually feel sorry for him after this... actually often ppl rate him the best in general or ppl think so he gets overrated n then when he fails ppl jump on it... always say his game has too big flaws n weaknesses n thats why he fails to win often. I guess either u like his style of football or u dont... cant expect his teams that plays with big flaws to win all the time basically.
If he weren't such a hipster he would've won a cl without Messi by now. His hipster ways cost him time and again.

It also doesn't help that since leaving Barcelona, he has been handed a blank check and the keys at every club he's been in. Imagine what Carlo or Klopp could create with the monopoly money he gets to burn. 150m on fullbacks alone in one summer with more than enough cash to spare for a forward or 2... Only to win league titles.

I'd massacre him the same I would that idiot Mourinho if he burned the same amount. and I have.
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Post by Lord Awesome Wed May 04, 2022 11:37 pm

It's true about the overating of Pep. It's not really his game that makes him him great. He's only as great as the players he has at his disposal. But as Lord Spencer said he aint the only victim of it either.

Yeah he can make a team play beautifully no doubt about that but when it's time to be defensive his flaw shows everytime. Cant do that whole diving tactic to keep the ball longer or win a penalty with the introduction of VAR anymore and even tho City is a great team atm it still pales compare to that Barca. I think Barca were fortunate (Ovrebo messing up vital calls) to even get their 1st CL and Pep has lived off that for a good while now. It's his 6th year not winning CL now and I think, or at least I hope, even Pep's most diehard fans start seeing him for what Pep really is. My opinion of him hasnt changed much. I thought his dominance in the Prem was actually impressive. He shut me up a bit there but in the end Pep has yet to mimic his previous success at Barca and will continue to fall short until he changes his gamplan when his team is off the ball.


Last edited by Lord Awesome on Wed May 04, 2022 11:40 pm; edited 3 times in total
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Post by Lord Spencer Wed May 04, 2022 11:37 pm

Let's not forget that Carlo lost semi-final against Deportiovo and a final after being 3-0 up with one of the best teams in the 2000's. In fact, it could be argued that he massively underachieved with that team of legends.

Later, he messed up with Chelsea, PSG, and Bayern....

It would be ridiculous to measure him using that selective memory, just as it is consistently ridiculous to do the same with Pep.

The fact is only one team, one coach, out of 10 elite teams and coaches that win these trophies every year, and its ridiculous to discount the majority of their work due to singular matches that are often the margins between victory and defeat.

Its clear that Pep, like Carlo, is one of the best coaches in Europe in the past 20 years.

In my opinion, Pep's greatest weakness is that his football is so systematic that it works wonders when it works. However, it robs his players from the freedom to express themselves when the chips are down, and hence they lack a certain spark or grinta which is very important in the CL as we have seen with this Madrid team.
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Post by farfan Wed May 04, 2022 11:46 pm

It's the same story every year:

Carte blanche in the transfer market, unlimited budget, unconditional backing from ownership, fans wanking over some new "innovative" formation...> CL elimination.
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Post by Myesyats Wed May 04, 2022 11:51 pm

Turok_TTZ wrote:Imagine what Carlo or Klopp could create with the monopoly money he gets to burn. 150m on fullbacks alone in one summer with more than enough cash to spare for a forward or 2... Only to win league titles

If only burning through a billion euros meant you instantly win everything.

Remember you can spend 500 million on Dembele, Coutinho, Griezmann/Hazard, Grealish and Maguire and win fucking shit. Sometimes half the price gets you 2x the player.
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Post by Doc Thu May 05, 2022 12:03 am

Casciavit wrote:Players let him down this time.
You know, the way he set up his team, they really had no business losing this one. None. So I can genuinely see your thought pattern on this one.

However, I'm a firm believer in the same way we give credit, we can criticize and Pep should not be an exception. His team choked and did it way better than PSG could ever dream of.
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Post by farfan Thu May 05, 2022 12:12 am

What do you think next year's tactical innovation is going to be? hmm Defensive midfielders converted to 10s so that they can win the ball higher up the pitch? Aggressive central midfielders that drift wide most of the game so that both wingers and full backs can tuck inside?

Can't wait!
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Post by Doc Thu May 05, 2022 12:16 am

He might fine tune Carlo's central midfielder false nine strategy.
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Post by Casciavit Thu May 05, 2022 12:31 am

Doc wrote:
Casciavit wrote:Players let him down this time.
You know, the way he set up his team, they really had no business losing this one. None. So I can genuinely see your thought pattern on this one.

However, I'm a firm believer in the same way we give credit, we can criticize and Pep should not be an exception. His team choked and did it way better than PSG could ever dream of.


End of the day coaches are responsible for getting their team to the box. City were the better team, created more chances and conceded fewer chances. I didn’t see anything questionable tactically. There was no retarded experimenting and the substitutions were very logical and pragmatic.

That doesn’t mean they dominated the tie. No team dominates full 180 minute CL matches. Knockout football has so much variance and they’re dictated by momentum swings. Madrid fans hate seeing Modric and Kroos start but the impact the kids have when they come on has a greater impact on match momentum than if they start.

It was a chaotic match with both teams having swings of momentum it’s just that City had two key moments to kill the tie. One was in the first 30 minutes in the first leg and the other was the Grealish chances at the end. They couldn’t do it. If roles were reversed Madrid would’ve killed the tie in the first leg. City had a two goal advantage FOUR times this tie. They have no one to blame but themselves.

Now taking advantage of those momentum swings is something City has never been good at. Their forwards aren’t clinical and their goalie doesn’t ever come up with big saves. Their system doesn’t help. I’ve mentioned it before but when everything is rehearsed and robotic the moment your players are under pressure they can sometimes lack the ingenuity to deal with those situations. It’s also one thing to play for the shirt and another to play for the system. Laughing

So no I don’t blame this loss on any specific tactics made by him. A lot of it came down to luck and fine margins. The criticism has more so to do with the recruitment and the system. He signs attacking midfielders and wingers who are shitty finishers and they’re the ones starting in forward positions. So they need 5 chances to score one goal. The robotic nature of the system isn’t conductive to knockout football but it is for league football. City can spend another billion and it won’t change anything if those two fundamental problems aren’t treated.
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Post by Casciavit Thu May 05, 2022 12:52 am

I just don’t think he set up his team to fail. No amount of trolling will change that.

Chelsea, Lyon, first leg against Spurs, and first leg against Liverpool all had weird tactical decisions. This loss wasn’t like that at all. A lot of intangible factors came into play.
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Post by sportsczy Thu May 05, 2022 1:02 am

I think it's his choice in terms of player profiles for defense that did him in.  He puts a premium on skills with both defenders and goalkeepers as opposed to defense.  That allows them to control the ball like they do.  But once the defenders have to defend... you have average defenders and goalkeeper.

It's a compromise he makes, and pays for in these types of situations.
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Post by Casciavit Thu May 05, 2022 1:16 am

At the same time though City is very good at seeing out games. I can rarely remember moments where they had a one goal lead and lost it in the last 5 minutes.

I do agree with the gist of your comment though. Cancelo, Laporte, and Zinchenko aren’t pure defenders at all. Ederson is an average shot stopper too.
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Post by The Madrid One Thu May 05, 2022 3:56 am

Around this time of season when we have CL semis I reminisce about past seasons and I spent the last couple of days reminiscing about the 11/12 Real Madrid and how the CL semi we lost that year was in some ways the death of "The Special One," his harshest defeat (La Decima, particularly with the Barcelona context of the time, would have crowned him as a god) and the last time he'd come so close to winning another CL. Everything else in his career was downhill from that moment onward.

Having failed to win the CL in 3 seasons looks harsh for Mourinho and in a way he never fully bounced back but Guardiola has been failing for years with Bayern and with City and I don't feel the same sense of a blight on his career.

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10 years on, a different type of iconic moment in the Santiago Bernabeu.
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Post by El Gunner Thu May 05, 2022 7:44 am

so i went to bed at 89th minute thinking that it's all sealed for City... BarcaLearning and Casciavit were all happy in the match thread.

I turn on my YouTube this morning and the first thing i see is the highlights of the game with a thumbnail of Real Madrid players celebrating... and i'm thinking, "this can't be right?" So anyway I click on the video, and low behold, Man City really did fuck it all up in stoppage time. Unbelievable scenes.

I always thought that "Bald Fraud" phrase was fun exaggerated slander from his haters, but honestly how can you defend that?? You can't even blame his players because year after year in the CL his team is one of the favourites and he always crashes out in devastating fashion.

Bald Fraud!
Nothing without Messi and big budgets.
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Post by Kaladin Thu May 05, 2022 8:59 am

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Post by BarrileteCosmico Thu May 05, 2022 3:41 pm

I get that people hate pep and relish at him losing, but honestly don't know how you can blame yesterday on him
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Post by Kaladin Thu May 05, 2022 3:48 pm

City fans (not you) would sooner blame Yaya's shamans than Pep, but Baldie took off de Bruyne and Mahrez yesterday like they were 5-0 up at home against Burnley.

Even more so, i'm seeing City fans blaming the squad's lack of depth for a natural LB, a non-38yr old DM and lack of striker. My brothers in Islam, do i have to list out Carlo's subs yesterday?

Asensio
Vazquez
Ceballos
Vallejo
Vazquez
Rodrygo
Camavinga

Freeza would be in the ER if he saw this, good grief.
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Post by halamadrid2 Thu May 05, 2022 3:56 pm

De Bruyne was just a passenger for the whole game so subbing Gundogan on was the right call. Mahrez you could probably have let stay on eventhough he was exhausted as Mendy offers very little offensively and City had done well to contain Vini before that

Foden is the one who should've been hooked who was anonymous for the duration of the game

Subbing Jesus out though was the right call. Only indisputable right call he made with his subs
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Post by Perucho21 Thu May 05, 2022 3:58 pm

Never rated Pep, but perhaps he might not be the one to blame for yesterday. However, I was genuinely shocked he took off KDB. At this point I felt we were going to come back, but Gundogan did well I believe

And yeah, he has no excuses for his bench. I would kill to have a player like Gundogan Sterling Grealish come off the bench for us. Other than Rodrygo and Camavinga, the other subs arent exactly game changers but they work hard, other than Asensio.

City fans complaining about their bench is hilarious when they can easily spend 500m on back ups alone. We hope on old guards who dont want to leave because they are on high wage contracts.
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Post by farfan Thu May 05, 2022 4:43 pm

I'm pretty much tactically illiterate but I'm still gonna go ahead and blame him for losing in extra time. The game was tied, why were City wide open all of a sudden? Just look at the space that Camavinga bolted through just before Benzema's penalty. Evidently Pep's adjustments made things worse.
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Post by titosantill Thu May 05, 2022 5:49 pm

I'm far from pep's biggest advocate or apologist, but yesterday was not on him. Had more to do with our players and their character than anything else. Even tactically, Carlo made the right subs but it wasn't some tactical turn around. Guys just kept fighting and after the equalizer Benz just had to get his name on the sheet for it to be complete. While two things can be true, in this case it's more of don't blame pep, praise madrid
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