rivaldo vs zidane

zidane, without a doubt. rivaldo was more skillful, but his peak years were relatively short. also, zidane could exert his influence on a game more than rivaldo could. don't get me wrong, rivaldo has scored some late clutch goals in his time but his influence on games could wane at times when he opted to go for shots whilst a teammate was open.

But, i think its tough to compare them, based on the different positions they played. rivaldo played further up the pitch, him and raul had some solid la liga rivalry back in the day...i think the thread would make more sense if it were rivaldo vs raul/shevchenko/del piero/ vieri/ crespo etc...and zizou could go against figo for example. but i agree with the general consensus that rivaldo has become sort of underrated in football circles....he was amazing during his time

Dont agree, but lets leave that for another day.

As for the 98 final. Of course Rivaldo was nowhere to be seen...the entire team had collapsed because of the incident involving Ronaldo. We all konw France were a great side and defensively very strong, but the Brazil which showed up in that final were not the same Brazil because of what happened to Ronaldo.

Zidane was very good in 06 vs Brazil, but that Brazil team was a total joke. We all know this. Half the team was finished and there was no balance at all.

Nothing against Zidane, doesnt take anything away from him...but lets not pretend this was Zidane at his best vs the others at their best and he was just too good for them.

Thats horribly superficial.

Also Messi is not better than Cristiano because of what happened head to head, anyone should be able to see Messi is just the superior player and has superior skills.

wait, wait, wait...  half the 2006 team was finished???

Lucio, Kaka, Ronaldinho, Juninho and Ze Roberto were all in their primes.  Cafu and Roberto Carlos were older, but were still considered among the top fullbacks in the game... and rightfully so.  Dida and Juan were very highly rated at the time... not to mention Adriano was in his best year.

That Brazil team was considered the clear favorites for that WC.  The starting XI talent was astounding as was the bench... heck, you had Adriano and Robinho coming in as super-subs.

Also, the 98 brazil team fell apart because Ronaldo was unfit, although he played?  All that showed was their R9 dependence.  He not only scored most of the goals, he set up most of them too...  since he couldn't have that kind of influence, the other guys needed to step up.  None of them did.  People forget that Laurent Blanc, the best defender for France NT and probably the best player for them in the tournament with Barthez and Thuram, was suspended for the Final.  You had Frank Leboeuf fill in, who is nowhere near as good.  But they were able to survive it.  Brazil were favored ffs.

Cafu and Carlos were past their best. They could no longer both function together because they no longer got up and down like they did 4 years earlier. Not finished, but not plus players in the same time.

Ronaldinho was NOT in his prime. Check out the final 2 months at Barca before he went to the WC, awful "form" (which people put down to form) and he carried that not only till the WC but as soon as it was over. The 2 months before the WC was the start of his decline if anyone bothered looking.

Adriano himself had started the downward spiral of drink and depression. As we saw the very next season where he was never fit and never performed.

Dida at no point in life was highly rated, terrible sham of a goalie. Adriano obviously cant fit next to Ronaldo and another 2  high attacking-low defensive work rate players in Kaka and Ronaldinho....of course everyone knew that except those who mattered.

The back 2 and Ze Roberto and Giberto were the best pairing. Juhinho did well when he played but didnt play enough, he was brought in to try and give balance to the team but when you start "the magic square" like they did they always suffered and Juninho had to try and come in to fix it. Anyway, the rest of the team and crucially the star players were on the downside..other than Kaka, who played fairly well but he never played well next to Ronaldinho, even in qualifying that was a big theme.

Yes, the Brazil team were favourites..something like Spain were big favourites this year..though anyone with some actual knowledge could see the failings of the team. The team had talent (which was badly fading) and less balance than Madrid do now.

Yes..the team fell apart because of Ronaldo. Have you heard of the players speak about this since? Because I have...they all speak about how they worried about Ronaldo, on a human level, and were badly distracted. They still credit France for being better but I think its redicilous to claim the Brazil in that final was the same Brazil.

R9 depedance? What a horrible joke sports..I cant believe your saying this.

Rivaldo and Dunga were both named in the team of the tournament and both were excellent. Rivaldo at times was just as good as Ronaldo in that tournament (scored 2 one of them the winning goal) vs Denmark in a 3-2 struggle win and Ronaldo didnt even score). And you just got finished telling me how good Cafu and Carlos were in 06..imagine what they were like in their actual prime.

Why are you so intent on bringing up who was "favourites" when we all know thats total bs and means nothing.

In terms of flash, rivaldo was a lot flashier; rabonas, bicycle kicks, juggling the ball on the play, etc...zizou was the more complete footballer, and i reckon if most people (who saw the two play at their peaks, and not youtube clips) where to start a team and had to choose between them who to start with, zizou would have been first choice. rivaldo was a luxury, zidane a necessity

The Franchise wrote:Dida at no point in life was highly rated, terrible sham of a goalie.

Agree with everything on your post except this. Of course he had some unbelievable oily glove moments but pre-flare Dida was a world class keeper who had no equal when it came to saving penalties. You say he was never highly rated but he was on the 2003 Balon D Or shortlist and he deserved to be there and also won Serie A keeper of the year in 2004.

when in top form, not much difference between them

but when considering longevity, i choose zidane over rivaldo

Lol, some of you guys on here are funny. 1.Now while zidane was probably the better player over time, zidane has never, is not and will never be a top 10 player of all-time on an individual level. 2.zidane even while at his best, never had absolute domination at any point in football like R9, maradona, cruyff, messi, ronaldinho just to name a few. 3.zidane is one of the most inconsistent player of all time if anyone actually watched him play week in week out save for those international tournaments of which he only had a dominant tournament in euro 2000 and wc 2006 only.. 4.zidane world player awards were all very debatable from 1998, 2000, to 2003. Now let me shock you guys, In the 1998 wc zidane didn't even have a great wc, he just had a great final and that was down to the ronaldo seizure incident the day before the final where he almost lost he's life, he's name was even omitted from the squad hours to the final before magically appearing on the field from the hospital due to pressure from nike and from ronaldo himself according to zagallo, and you think that didn't have an effect on the brazilian squad? 5. Zidane is one of those players that people like to love no matter what he did or he's short-comings. One goal from 30yards and people wankfest on it while forgetting he's being crap from the last 10 games. 6.Rivaldo at least had stats and the eye test on his side and while it's poor to judge players on stats sorely, zidane was as poor as they came even far worse than iniesta of today and that says a lot about a supposed goat (some of his best seasons he had like 5 goals and 7 assists in real). 7.Rivaldo suffered what is happening to cr7 today, being born in the ronaldo (R9) era as that severely limited his percieved greatness 8.zidane was born in the luckiest era in the whole of french football history as a group.(taking nothing away from him though, with the 2006 wc being a case in point). 9. Zidanes greatness is only a some total of its parts as his career at the top top level was really long. That i give to him. 10 in zidane's defence, he was a better performer in big games throughout he's career, not that rivaldo was a scrub but zidane's is probably 'more' well documented and more clutch in my eyes. 11.while players like prime R9, maradona, ronaldinho, messi would dominate football today, guys like zizou would struggle to make it into the top 10 to be honest. so imo, zidane is better, but not in the 2-5 levels way some of you are making it seem like,individually they are pretty much on thesame level, rivaldo was more like di maria always on he's best form,while zidane was exactly like ozil (with less assists) but more decisive and more clutch in big games..so, zidane is better yes, but not sorely down to talent, unlike a case of messi and cr7..

Danny the game you speak about against denmark hope you remember that while rivaldo scored two goals, it was ronaldo who gave him the 2 assists in that game and ronaldo was the best player on the pitch (i think he was given the man of the match award, but yeah it was between the two) in that 3-2 win over denmark..i get your point though as you were trying to defend rivaldo in perspective while someone tried to discredit him..it's just that i also wanted to point out a fact so we give everyone their due..#Respect. Meanwhile one very impotant point is that people seem to forget that cause of the failed galactico project in those dreadful 2003 to 2006 years, zidane was probably on his way to obscurity until the wc 2006 happened and cause he's the luckiest football chap ever, that shot he's name to footballing goat levels again and the guy bowed out when the ovation was highest (materazzi's incident regardless)..i'm a psychologist by profession and from the little my mind has gathered, i've come to figure out one thing some don't undestand is that people tend to percieve one's last output\actions as the summary of one's life's endeavour mostly..and thats one thing zidane has in he's favour, like what affected maradona and what will affect ronaldinho's legacy in due time..

M99 wrote:

The Franchise wrote:Dida at no point in life was highly rated, terrible sham of a goalie.

Agree with everything on your post except this. Of course he had some unbelievable oily glove moments but pre-flare Dida  was a world class keeper who had no equal when it came to saving penalties. You say he was never highly rated but he was on the 2003 Balon D Or shortlist and he deserved to be there and also won Serie A keeper of the year in 2004.

Perhaps that harsh. He was great at saving pens, but as a overall I dont think he was world class at all.

Maybe he was highly rated by the masses, but there were also alot of people that didnt rate him.

Bankz wrote:Lol, some of you guys on here are funny. 1.Now while zidane was probably the better player over time, zidane has never, is not and will never be a top 10 player of all-time on an individual level. 2.zidane even while at his best, never had absolute domination at any point in football like R9, maradona, cruyff, messi, ronaldinho just to name a few. 3.zidane is one of the most inconsistent player of all time if anyone actually watched him play week in week out save for those international tournaments of which he only had a dominant tournament in euro 2000 and wc 2006 only.. 4.zidane world player awards were all very debatable from 1998, 2000, to 2003. Now let me shock you guys, In the 1998 wc zidane didn't even have a great wc, he just had a great final and that was down to the ronaldo seizure incident the day before the final where he almost lost he's life, he's name was even omitted from the squad hours to the final before magically appearing on the field from the hospital due to pressure from nike and from ronaldo himself according to zagallo, and you think that didn't have an effect on the brazilian squad? 5. Zidane is one of those players that people like to love no matter what he did or he's short-comings. One goal from 30yards and people wankfest on it while forgetting he's being crap from the last 10 games. 6.Rivaldo at least had stats and the eye test on his side and while it's poor to judge players on stats sorely, zidane was as poor as they came even far worse than iniesta of today and that says a lot about a supposed goat (some of his best seasons he had like 5 goals and 7 assists in real). 7.Rivaldo suffered what is happening to cr7 today, being born in the ronaldo (R9) era as that severely limited his percieved greatness 8.zidane was born in the luckiest era in the whole of french football history as a group.(taking nothing away from him though, with the 2006 wc being a case in point). 9. Zidanes greatness is only a some total of its parts as his career at the top top level was really long. That i give to him. 10 in zidane's defence, he was a better performer in big games throughout he's career, not that rivaldo was a scrub but zidane's is probably 'more' well documented and more clutch in my eyes. 11.while players like prime R9, maradona, ronaldinho, messi would dominate football today, guys like zizou would struggle to make it into the top 10 to be honest. so imo, zidane is better, but not in the 2-5 levels way some of you are making it seem like,individually they are pretty much on thesame level, rivaldo was more like di maria always on he's best form,while zidane was exactly like ozil (with less assists) but more decisive and more clutch in big games..so, zidane is better yes, but not sorely down to talent, unlike a case of messi and cr7..

It is easy to downplay what a person has done once they've retired. at that point we start using terms like "if", "should", "could". i'm not into the top ten debate because its useless in football. goal keepers, defenders are valuable too. even top tens based on positions are difficult to measure over time.

when zidane was playing though, he was a terror, today people complain and say things like "x disappeared in the big games", "y cannot score in clutch moments", "z disappears in tough games", you are critiquing the man for his performances at the grandest of stages? stages where a lot of his peers shrunk and disappeared? talk about a player without stage fright....and your argument that zidane would not be a good player today makes little sense, we have no proof to come to such a conclusion.

Your second point- "zidane didn't have absolute domination". non of those players you mentioned had absolute domination, not even messi, but he's the closest. maradona did NOT have absolute domination, i'm old enough to have seen him play, and when he played the debate was diego, zico, platini or rummenigge...i rank diego higher than anyone i've seen, but his status grew when him and all those guys retired. R9 did NOT have absolute domination, he was a fantastic individual player, won very very little taking into account the talent he had, and besides his years at barcelona and psv, during his inter and madrid years, especially at madrid more strikers came out who may not have had his skill set but were just as effective if not more

Bankz wrote:Danny the game you speak about against denmark hope you remember that while rivaldo scored two goals, it was ronaldo who gave him the 2 assists in that game and ronaldo was the best player on the pitch (i think he was given the man of the match award, but yeah it was between the two) in that 3-2 win over denmark..i get your point though as you were trying to defend rivaldo in perspective while someone tried to discredit him..it's just that i also wanted to point out a fact so we give everyone their due..#Respect.

Thats true, Ronaldo did play his part. He was great the whole tournament minus the final obviously, his performance was nothing short of inspirational in fact. But yes, as you know, I am merely pointing out it was not a 1 man team as shown in that game, other players gave great contributions.

Your point 5- you critique zidane for stepping up in large tournaments and clutch moments, but i bet you have criticized other players who fail to shine in these moments but run rampant against the sheffields, nottinghams, cagliaris and numancias of this world....zidane wasn't a goal scorer, watch old tapes of his, not clips, the man was a midfield general if i ever saw one. nowadays we are spoiled with stats and wikipedia. people look at those and arrive at the conclusion that zidane was inconsistent....rui costa had a season where he scored 1 goal, 1 goal all through for ac milan, when they won the ucl in 03....if you watched him week in week out u know what that man brought to that milan team

i'm not going to talk about balon d'ors- every year there is a major argument why x won and y didn't win...i could care less about such awards that we cannot accurately measure. hell, in 02 many could argue that others where more deserving of balon d'or than el phenomeno

as for the 98 world cup, ronaldo(the original), healthy or not has never beat zidane...zidane's team always bested ronaldo's or played to a draw, even in serie a whilst they were at juve and inter. (i may be wrong on this, inter may have won, but not more than once, that i am sure of). ifs and or buts, what matters is at the 98 final someone scored twice, talk about stepping up in a big game, yet we complain when others don't, but when others do, we look for ways to discredit them.

your next point, if you are referring to zizou's leverkusen volley as people forgetting his previous games in that ucl tournament...he played perfect in that final, was amazing in the semis against barcelona and in the quarter final second leg against effenberg's bayern munich ....rivaldo obviously has the stats, its not rocket science, he was a forward. him and raul were in the running for pichichi for like 2 or 3 straight years. at barcelona he played with kluivert up front until van gaal started plying to move him out wide, which caused their feud

zidane at juve played behind inzaghi and del piero, at one point vieri and del piero, trez and del piero, @ madrid morientes and raul, and later ronaldo and raul where in front of him...rivaldo also took pks and free kicks. zidane was the main set piece taker only in france....he took very few in his times at madrid and juve combined compared to rivaldo at barcelona....its like comparing the stats of van pearsie to xavi/iniesta .....and there's more to a midfielders game than assists....zizou made his teammates better, linked up play, set up and called plays on the pitch; because he didnt give the last pass to the person who scored doesn't mean he wasn't a play maker....anyone who watched him LIVE knows this

rivaldo did NOT suffer from being in r9 era, because it wasn't R9's era....if i'm not mistaken, rivaldo has even won more team trophies(with barcelona and milan, i'm not counting his greek trophies at olympiakos) than ronaldo....so i don't get how he suffered from r9. r9 did NOT dominate the era, he had amazing individual years at psv and barca, but rivaldo even won more competitive league titles than he did...so, stop lying

zidane was born in the luckiest era for french football- every body has their time, not every one takes advantage...argentina currently are in their best era when it comes to strikers, they haven't won shit. the dutch had amazing players in the 90s-00s, they won shit; the dutch had an amazing era with cruyff, they won ZERO. the dutch had van basten, gullit, riijkard, they won a euro cup and didn't go far in any other tournament. argentina had a side that featured batigol, ortega, diego simeone, zanetti, redondo etc, they did well in south america, but ZERO at the world stage. the hungarian team of puskas, kocsis and hidegkuti were lauded as the best during their time, they won ZERO.....not zidane's fault that not only did his team win but he played a major role

and lets not forget, he retired once, and they almost didn't make it to the 06 world cup, until he came back, or have we CONVENIENTLY forgotten about that? where theirry henry said "god is back" upon hearing of zizou's return to les bleus

once again I don't buy into top ten arguments, but zizou would play well in any era; his form of football was not based on speed or physicality. any striker would absolutely have loved to play alongside him...i can imagine this real madrid team with zizou behind cristiano bale and benzema, with carlo ancelotti as coach or even under mourinho's real and u think he would flop? that's just asinine .....the man has paid his dues, and rivaldo for the record was an amazing player too, but as i said before, he was a luxury, zizou a necessity....if most people are starting a team and had to pick between zizou and rivaldo, most, even brazilian fans who called zidane "the wizard" and barcelona fans will go for zizou.....milan fans will definitely go wit zizou. rivaldo was utter garbage over there

@titto where did i bash zidane for being clutch in big games? Didn't i give it to him as a positive? Didn't i admit he was better than rivaldo? What's your problem when i say that 'x' player had absolute domination? When i made that statement, i meant that at that point that they where the absolute best and most talented individually without debates or arguments..are u saying ronaldinho didn't absolutely dominate in he's peak? Are u saying messi didn't dominate in he's peak? Are u saying pre-injury R9 didn't absolutely dominate in he's peak? Cruyff too? Weren't they all football yardsticks? Were they ever debatable? like e.g saying cr7 is the best in the world today and still find numerous players and coaches annonymously saying messi is the best? you say ronaldo (R9) won so little, now, since when has it become the yardstick to judge players based on collective trophies won? Btw, the topic is based on individual talent and genius and of which pre-injury R9 absolutely dominated & it wasn't even close,(till that faithful night in paris) and he still remains one of the best ever strictly on talent and genius holding he's own with maradona,pele,cruyff,and messi ..was r9 in madrid ever in his peak? Did he not just come back from 2 career threatning injuries that lasted almost two years? and didn't that same "one legged, finished" R9 win a world cup while being the top scorer and won the wpoty and ballon d'or as a result? Still, as a result of those injuries, didn't he suffer hypotheroidsm issues from then on? even coming 3rd to henry and zizou the following year? in one of the most debatable wpoty awards since in it's history? And to set the record straight, R9 won every single thing individually for club and country and i mean every single individual award (as thats what this topic is about) for the national team he won every collective trophy bar non and won every and any individual award with the national team..the only thing he never won was the champions league and multiple legue titles...and by your logic we can safely say that ibra is a better club player than henry since he won more for club..like i said, collective trophies are not accurate measurements for measuring player performance, they only tell half the story..u argue inteligently though moreso when u don't make use of insults to prove a point, it shows maturity on your part..

@titto Just praised u 4 not using insults and u go ahead and call me a liar? lol, anyway wether other teams failed to take advantage of their best team is irrelevant, but does it still remove the fact that he was in the best french generation? It doest. he took advantage kudos to him..but where did i tell a lie? Still waiting..if u actually read my post, didn't i acknowledge he dominated the 2006 wc to his credit? Thus, not putting he's entire success on a lucky generation? More so mr titto, there is a difference between the best team "individually" and a talented "group" which zidane played for in he's peak years, sure, being in the best group especially isn't a guaranteed determinant but it sure helps, or does it not?..another thing is, are u in all honesty saying zidane wasn't inconsistent? Lol. Again when i talk about rivaldo and ronaldo i expect the reader to employ common sense to understand that i was talking about the brazilian national team as R9 completely outshined him to no end even if they won almost same trophies, R9 9 out of 10 times took deserved glory even though rivaldo was also vital in his own right too (from copa america 97 to 99 to wc 98 to 2006 to confed cup 97 and down to their wc qualifiers performance 00/01 vs 04/05 and u cant deny that it took much away from he's supposed greatness. doesn't take a genius to figure that one out. Most importantly if u actually read what i wrote you'd notice that i was arguing in the light of those people saying that zidane was 5 levels above rivaldo, which is utterly untrue..and finally,if u really took your time to read what i posted you see the tiny bit where i said that zidane was the superior player, or is it that hard to figure out? Now, if u will say that u read it at all, then what's your argument for? Cause i pretty much covered everything u posted..All i was doing was merely letting some know that zidane had short-comings too

what do you mean by 'dominate'? i said the closest person to dominating out of all those names was messi...i still don't know about r9 dominating. i don't want to get into that cos that's another debate on its own....i personally considered romario better than r9....there's the difference between us. I don't really rate individual awards aside from top scorer awards, and that's because they are measurable, and i only bring those up if the debate is about strikers, not strikers vs midfielders

and i never thought about ibra and henry, but i think i kinda prefer ibra to thierry...haven't really thought about that debate though, maybe another thread

but i watched ronaldo when he just got to europe, beast of a player but i dunno about dominant, if u say he was dominant in 1996, i'll probably say yeah, i understand your logic between team trophies and individual; i also feel sometimes its wrong to rate based on that if they aren't in the same era. but, if they are in the same era, then it is a fair assessment to some degree especially if they are both main men on their teams with similar level of support in terms of teammates ....on an individual i give r9 his props, but i always had my reservations, as i mentioned, i preferred romario. true zidane isn't going to dribble a whole team and score, but there's a lot more to football than that...

i was thinking the thread was who was a better overall footballer between rivaldo and zidane; trophies excluded, i'd still give it to zidane, the skill set zidane had was perfect for the position he played on the pitch. rivaldo was very skillful but let's even look at the BASIC fundamentals; rivaldo's use of the rabona was to make up for his lackluster/weak right foot....zidane was magic with both feet, scored some of his best goals with his left, and hardly took to ground despite not being pacy. he wouldn't do one million step overs, but 1 out of 3 times they'd work (not a bad ratio at all)

as mentioned, i don't care for world player of the year and balon d'ors and i feel they should either ban them or find a reasonable way to select winners and candidates. it is almost a crime that maldini, roberto carlos, steffan effenberg (who had some fantastic years at bayern), just to name a few, have never won any of such awards....i consider balon d'or, wpoty as marketing tools....i don't rate players based on these so called awards

Bankz wrote:@titto Just praised u 4 not using insults and u go ahead and call me a liar? lol, anyway wether other teams failed to take advantage of their best team is irrelevant, but does it still remove the fact that he was in the best french generation? It doest. he took advantage kudos to him..but where did i tell a lie? Still waiting..if u actually read my post, didn't i acknowledge he dominated the 2006 wc to his credit? Thus, not putting he's entire success on a lucky generation? More so mr titto, there is a difference between the best team "individually" and a talented "group" which zidane played for in he's peak years, sure, being in the best group especially isn't a guaranteed determinant but it sure helps, or does it not?..another thing is, are u in all honesty saying zidane wasn't inconsistent? Lol. Again when i talk about rivaldo and ronaldo i expect the reader to employ common sense to understand that i was talking about the brazilian national team as R9 completely outshined him to no end even if they won almost same trophies, R9 9 out of 10 times took deserved glory even though rivaldo was also vital in his own right too (from copa america 97 to 99 to wc 98 to 2006 to confed cup 97 and down to their wc qualifiers performance 00/01 vs 04/05 and u cant deny that it took much away from he's supposed greatness. doesn't take a genius to figure that one out. Most importantly if u actually read what i wrote you'd notice that i was arguing in the light of those people saying that zidane was 5 levels above rivaldo, which is utterly untrue..and finally,if u really took your time to read what i posted you see the tiny bit where i said that zidane was the superior player, or is it that hard to figure out? Now, if u will say that u read it at all, then what's your argument for? Cause i pretty much covered everything u posted..All i was doing was merely letting some know that zidane had short-comings too

lol my apologies about the "stop lying" comment, i know people who try to discredit players by making stuff up, and wrongfully assumed that was your tactic

Mr titto i read your last posts, i found that you use knowledge & objectivity to butress your point, which in all honesty i respect and agree with even if we see things a tiny bit differently..but, titto u do agree with me that some people here try to make it sound like rivaldo was some wilshere level player by saying he's some 5 levels above, which is in itself cringe-worthy and just like u i also do not believe in stats and do not believe that the wpoty is the be all ends all too and while i do not want it to be scrapped, i want a better parameter to be employed in giving the award as opposed to this marketing sham it has become..on topic, zidane is superior to rivaldo but please people while we argue, lets try and keep things accurate regardless of who we take sides with.. (maybe we should really consider an ibra vs henry thread) #big hugs to titto for staying classy too.

Mr titto i read your last posts, i found that you use knowledge & objectivity to butress your point, which in all honesty i respect and agree with even if we see things a tiny bit differently..but, titto u do agree with me that some people here try to make it sound like rivaldo was some wilshere level player by saying he's some 5 levels above, which is in itself cringe-worthy and just like u i also do not believe in stats and do not believe that the wpoty is the be all ends all too and while i do not want it to be scrapped, i want a better parameter to be employed in giving the award as opposed to this marketing sham it has become..on topic, zidane is superior to rivaldo but please people while we argue, lets try and keep things accurate regardless of who we take sides with.. (maybe we should really consider an ibra vs henry thread) #big hugs to titto for staying classy too.

rivaldo was no scrub, in fact he was elite at depor and barcelona but that's how football is...few players define an era, and when players from that era retire, no matter how good they were, fortunately or unfortunately discussions will be limited to an even smaller group of that era....cruyff had kempes, muller, beckenbauer, camacho etc but people focus mainly on cruyff. diego had zico, platini, mathaus, rummenigae, ruud gullit etc but people hardly talk about the others...same with zizou n ronaldo, who had figo vieri rivaldo effenberg, hell even mendieta was absolute world class once upon a time but the focus will be on zizou and ronaldo and the same will probably happen when cristiano and messi retire....although fans of those two will do all they can to downplay the others achievements...comes with the whole territory i guess

just shut it you too .

you basically killed this thread with your boring , unorganized , verbal diarrhea .

Rivaldo.

Fußball wrote:Rivaldo.

you already said that in the first page

.

sportsczy wrote:  Zidane was considered the best from 1997 until 2004.

calmthefxcka bro