Can we all quit comparing Messi to Maradona?

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Can we all quit comparing Messi to Maradona? - Page 2 Empty Re: Can we all quit comparing Messi to Maradona?

Post by DuringTheWar Wed Jul 16, 2014 7:53 pm

And jiopsi those newspapers did not claim those players to be better than maradona that season, they assigned an average score from all their match ratings over the season, which guess what in a really defensive league the game by game ratings favoured defenders, as they are in an environment easy to excel consistently every game. All those players rated higher were defenders or defensive oriented midfielders. Maradona was their highest rated attacker

And what about the onze d'or? Maradona won it in 87, where were his teammates?

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Post by harhar11 Wed Jul 16, 2014 8:54 pm

Ah, if Burruchaga would have missed while Higuain would have scored, Maradona would have been known as they guy who chocked in 2 WC final while Messi would have been thought as the GOAT..

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Post by DuringTheWar Wed Jul 16, 2014 9:04 pm

harhar11 wrote:Ah, if Burruchaga would have missed while Higuain would have scored, Maradona would have been known as they guy who chocked in 2 WC final while Messi would have been thought as the GOAT..


Choked? Did you think ronaldo "choked" in the 98 final? Or did baggio choke in the 94 final? (Excluding his penalty)

That would have been a more convincing argument if it were messi that assisted higuain with an excellent pass
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Post by harhar11 Wed Jul 16, 2014 9:10 pm

DuringTheWar wrote:
harhar11 wrote:Ah, if Burruchaga would have missed while Higuain would have scored, Maradona would have been known as they guy who chocked in 2 WC final while Messi would have been thought as the GOAT..


Choked? Did you think ronaldo "choked" in the 98 final? Or did baggio choke in the 94 final? (Excluding his penalty)

That would have been a more convincing argument if it were messi that assisted higuain with an excellent pass


First of all, you are a maradona fanboy so I am stupid by just responding to you.

Anyway, its well documented that pass was the only thing that Maradona did in the final, and if Burruchaga would have missed, then everyone would say that Maradona flopped just like they are doing with Messi, eventhough he was dangerous everytime he had the ball. But because none of his action ended up in goal, most think that he sucked..

Thats the difference between Argentina 86 with 2014. Argentina 86 still had players who could finish, where as in 2014, Messi was the only player from Argentina to score more than 1 goal..

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Post by harhar11 Wed Jul 16, 2014 9:24 pm

VivaStPauli wrote:If Maradona played for the FOTM club Barcelona in the age of Twitter and Youtube, he'd rake up those numbers as well.


And Maradona would be more scrutinized. But because he didnt live in todays world, people seems to think that he was great in every game at the 86 WC or never had a bad game during his career..

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Post by DuringTheWar Wed Jul 16, 2014 9:25 pm

harhar11 wrote:
DuringTheWar wrote:
harhar11 wrote:Ah, if Burruchaga would have missed while Higuain would have scored, Maradona would have been known as they guy who chocked in 2 WC final while Messi would have been thought as the GOAT..


Choked? Did you think ronaldo "choked" in the 98 final? Or did baggio choke in the 94 final? (Excluding his penalty)

That would have been a more convincing argument if it were messi that assisted higuain with an excellent pass


First of all, you are a maradona fanboy so I am stupid by just responding to you.

Anyway, its well documented that pass was the only thing that Maradona did in the final, and if Burruchaga would have missed, then everyone would say that Maradona flopped just like they are doing with Messi, eventhough he was dangerous everytime he had the ball. But because none of his action ended up in goal, most think that he sucked..

Thats the difference between Argentina 86 with 2014. Argentina 86 still had players who could finish, where as in 2014, Messi was the only player from Argentina to score more than 1 goal..


First line of your post you call me a fanboy, and call yourself stupid. Calm down a bit yeah? There is no need to be so combative, and I have not said messi flopped in the final. And no that pass was not the only thing he did.
Anyway you did not get my point, you are insinuating maradona flopped in 1990. Like ronaldo in 98 who had a fit before the final, like baggio who could hardly move in 94 with his hamstring gone, maradona had a myriad of injuries that stopped him even being able to train with his teammates and could hardly move in the final. I think it's false to say any one of them choked given the reasons for their performances.
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Post by harhar11 Wed Jul 16, 2014 9:32 pm

DuringTheWar wrote:
harhar11 wrote:
DuringTheWar wrote:


Choked? Did you think ronaldo "choked" in the 98 final? Or did baggio choke in the 94 final? (Excluding his penalty)

That would have been a more convincing argument if it were messi that assisted higuain with an excellent pass


First of all, you are a maradona fanboy so I am stupid by just responding to you.

Anyway, its well documented that pass was the only thing that Maradona did in the final, and if Burruchaga would have missed, then everyone would say that Maradona flopped just like they are doing with Messi, eventhough he was dangerous everytime he had the ball. But because none of his action ended up in goal, most think that he sucked..

Thats the difference between Argentina 86 with 2014. Argentina 86 still had players who could finish, where as in 2014, Messi was the only player from Argentina to score more than 1 goal..


First line of your post you call me a fanboy, and call yourself stupid. Calm down a bit yeah? There is no need to be so combative, and I have not said messi flopped in the final. And no that pass was not the only thing he did.
Anyway you did not get my point, you are insinuating maradona flopped in 1990. Like ronaldo in 98 who had a fit before the final, like baggio who could hardly move in 94 with his hamstring gone, maradona had a myriad of injuries that stopped him even being able to train with his teammates and could hardly move in the final. I think it's false to say any one of them choked given the reasons for their performances.


I said that Marado flopped because apparently the only way not to flop is to win the tournament. I mean, if Messi would have been any other player, no one would be saying that its a scandal that he won the MVP or that he flopped in the WC, yet simply because he is Messi he flopped...

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Post by junkyard Fri Jul 18, 2014 9:40 am

@harmonica, can you please explain the "Player Points" from your chart?
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Post by Harmonica Fri Jul 18, 2014 1:55 pm

junkyard wrote:@harmonica, can you please explain the "Player Points" from your chart?
How many points, player goals and assists gave to the team, method simply remove them and compare results.

Next somebody will claim that you can't take them out just like that because the affect can be different in some situations. But in larger sample size like this it averages itself out.
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Post by sportsczy Sat Jul 19, 2014 10:50 am

So much fail in this thread lol. Harmonica leading the charge of course Laughing
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Post by Zizou Sat Jul 19, 2014 12:25 pm

Is it just me or does anyone else get the faint impression that maradonna would neither have the physical nor mental fitness to comete in todays much faster paced games?

Seriously, I have said that before, it is pointless comparing Messi to maradonna, since football has changed so much since maradonna was an active player.

It is unfair to Messi - and quite pointless imo...
loke comparing Klose to Fritz walter just because the both played for  FCKaiserslautern would be ridicoulous.

imho.
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Post by DuringTheWar Sat Jul 19, 2014 4:34 pm

Zizou wrote:Is it just me or does anyone else get the faint impression that maradonna would neither have the physical nor mental fitness to comete in todays much faster paced games?


Huh? Do you think maradona wouldn't even make it in today's game? Absurd, he was a far greater athlete than many today, iniesta for example
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Post by Valkyrja Sat Jul 19, 2014 4:36 pm

DuringTheWar wrote:
Zizou wrote:Is it just me or does anyone else get the faint impression that maradonna would neither have the physical nor mental fitness to comete in todays much faster paced games?


Huh? Do you think maradona wouldn't even make it in today's game? Absurd, he was a far greater athlete than many today, iniesta for example


he would have adapted to today's conditions.
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Post by UnitedInRed Tue Jul 22, 2014 8:12 pm

Maradona is the GOAT. Messi isn't.
The comparisons are unfair but people won't stop unless they stop calling Messi the GOAT.
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Post by Maliyye Tue Jul 22, 2014 11:03 pm

This fast Messi is better than Maradona. Nobody had the chance against this crazy Messi in Ballon dors



He was really tireless

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Post by FilthyLuca Fri Jan 30, 2015 4:44 pm

Maradonna was the unquestionable star of the biggest league in the world, and perhaps the most competitive league in history (serie A in the 80s).
They would've broke messi in the 80s, plus all that growth hormone shit didn't exist so he might not have even made it on the field.
on the other hand, could you imagine messi playing on coke?

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Post by VivaStPauli Fri Jan 30, 2015 5:41 pm

I'm pretty sure if the '80s had a drug that was moderately hard to detect, Diego would've taken it. That guy, despite being kind of genius, a great footballer, and entertainingly insane has the ethical compass of a Pol Pot.
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Post by Harmonica Fri Jan 30, 2015 5:59 pm

FilthyLuca wrote:Maradonna was the unquestionable star of the biggest league in the world, and perhaps the most competitive league in history (serie A in the 80s).
They would've broke messi in the 80s, plus all that growth hormone shit didn't exist so he might not have even made it on the field.
on the other hand, could you imagine messi playing on coke?
Myth of Maradonapoli.

Napoli transfered in 7 players in 84-85 season including Bagni and Maradona, 7 players in 85-86 season including Renica and Giordano, 7 players in 86-87 including Sola, De Napoli, Volpecina, Muro and Carnevale, who then were the foundation of Napoli. Almost all players bought after 1983-84. Bagni actually was later rated higher than Maradona by still respected Gazetta dello Sport in Napoli's first scudetto.

Can we all quit comparing Messi to Maradona? - Page 2 Xcmotam

So Maradona wasn't at the helm of original and second rate Napoli, he was at the helm of ManC's of the 80's. Just like Aguero is at the helm of ManC of the 10's.

Here's the previous lenghty post addressing it even more:

1. Maradona wasn't even considered the best player of Napoli in their first Scudetto by many. Gazzetta dello Sport gave Ferrara and Bagni the better ratings than Maradona, La Rebubblica Ferrara, Renica, and Romano.

2. The fact is that Napoli was the biggest spending team in the Europe at the time, kind of like ManC of today and guess what? Lets look their respective team results:

ManC before spending spree league position
15 - 14 - 9 - 10, after 5 - 3 - 1 - 2 - 1
Napoli before spending spree and Maradona league position
3 - 4 - 9 - 11, after 8 - 3 - 1 - 2 - 2

The similarity on those 7 last seasons is uncanny.

3. Direct contribution and their effect on team results for Maradona, Messi and the 4 R's.

Can we all quit comparing Messi to Maradona? - Page 2 21j3lvm

Messi carried Barcelona 2 seasons (11-12, 12-13) like Maradona did once in Napoli (1990).
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