Do we need to sign a CB this winter?

The winter market is coming up and the rumor mill is at it again. Should we sign a CB or wait for the summer? There's no doubt that for me Puyol needs a long term replacement. Can Bartra be that replacement? Possibly, he has had a very good last few games and I'm excited to see how long he can keep that up. Even in that event Puyol is nearing retirement and we need more CBs in the roster. There is a definite need to add someone.

I think it will depend on Puyol's fitness over the following 2 months. If Puyol arrives at the winter break healthy without hiccups then we have 4 very good reasons not to sign anyone.

Yes we do, Puyol is most likely finished and Mascherano simply can't play as a CB. We need at least one CB, and a good one, to push Piqué back to his level.

We need a new centerback.. but the thing is who is elegible to play for the Champions league, who is not cup tied.
is it worth it to buy an average defender and not buy a world class one in the summer due to the buy in the winter?

Yes, without question. But I also believe its basically pointless if they cant play in the CL. Thats where the biggest problem will be, when the opponent will actually put the defence under pressure.

Relying on Puyol in any way is foolish. Even when he comes back, he wont last long without a new injury.

Donuts wrote:We need a new centerback.. but the thing is who is elegible to play for the Champions league, who is not cup tied.
is it worth it to buy an average defender and not buy a world class one in the summer due to the buy in the winter?

So, in your opinion there isn't a single great CB in the world who doesn't play in the CL currently?

I guess Varane or Marquinhos came from a CL team then...

free_cat wrote:

Donuts wrote:We need a new centerback.. but the thing is who is elegible to play for the Champions league, who is not cup tied.
is it worth it to buy an average defender and not buy a world class one in the summer due to the buy in the winter?

So, in your opinion there isn't a single great CB in the world who doesn't play in the CL currently?

I guess Varane or Marquinhos came from a CL team then...

name some who would start for our team, and would actually be sold.
Because I can't.

Well nobody expected Marquinhos or Varane to start when they came straight away either.

Donuts wrote:

free_cat wrote:

Donuts wrote:We need a new centerback.. but the thing is who is elegible to play for the Champions league, who is not cup tied.
is it worth it to buy an average defender and not buy a world class one in the summer due to the buy in the winter?

So, in your opinion there isn't a single great CB in the world who doesn't play in the CL currently?

I guess Varane or Marquinhos came from a CL team then...

name some who would start for our team, and would actually be sold.
Because I can't.

How am I gonna convince you that some CB you have not seen play is good enough for us if you didn't trust a player already in our team just because you haven't seen him much?

(Bartra)

shame on me again for striking a conversation with you, last time I'll say this, quote me when I say Bartra is not a good player.
All I simply stated was he will rot in the bench after we buy a world class CB (aka one with a name such as Thiago Silva, David Luiz, etc).
I know how horrible because one negative thing about a Catalan player and your linear vision kicks in and you go straight to the defensive.

and you have yet to name some people who would walk into our starting centerbacks who would be available this december and not cup tied.

Sport reporting that the CB of choice is Balanta. I would be very happy with him, although River play deep he's fast and I think he would adapt. He would also be available to play the CL. His composure is unlike that of any of his age-peers and he plays with the ball (he played as a DM and CF in Colombia before being used as a CB by River). And River needs to sell. The club is not able to pay it's staff. That being said it being an election year Pasarella might want to get an electoral 'win' by selling for a high price.

So yeah I think there are good options out there, but I'm not convinced we need to get them right now. I really want to see how Puyol evolves. Bartra's level has exceeded my wildest expectations.

I quite like Bartra but I still don't like relying on Puyol, Pique, Masch, and Bartra for CB's considering Puyol is pretty much done at this point, Pique has been nowhere near his best for a long time, and Masch will never be a top CB despite doing well against most La Liga opponents. I always feel he's liable to do something stupid and give up a goal no matter how solid he looks in a game. Either way, we need a CB.

As people have already pointed out, what's the point if he's cup tied? If Balanta is where we're going, I have no opposition as I have not seen him play, but if he's good enough then I do hope we take the gamble.

Otherwise I guess I'd rather wait until summer.

Donuts wrote:shame on me again for striking a conversation with you, last time I'll say this, quote me when I say Bartra is not a good player.
All I simply stated was he will rot in the bench after we buy a world class CB (aka one with a name such as Thiago Silva, David Luiz, etc).
I know how horrible because one negative thing about a Catalan player and your linear vision kicks in and you go straight to the defensive.

and you have yet to name some people who would walk into our starting centerbacks who would be available this december and not cup tied.

You don't have a future ball, so your future predictions only mean that you think Bartra is not good enough. Oh, and you did say Bartra is not good enough saying that we will sign a "better" CB.

There are several not cup tied CB we could try to sign. They are a gamble but they could be good enough to start or rotate with Pique bringing him to his best level: Dedé, Balanta, Hector Moreno, Mathieu or Abdennour.

Next summer we could only add to that list Koscielny, Rakitsky, Vertonghen, and...? Thiago Silva, Kompany, Ramos or Varane are clearly not feasible options....

BarrileteCosmico wrote:Sport reporting that the CB of choice is Balanta. I would be very happy with him, although River play deep he's fast and I think he would adapt. He would also be available to play the CL. His composure is unlike that of any of his age-peers and he plays with the ball (he played as a DM and CF in Colombia before being used as a CB by River). And River needs to sell. The club is not able to pay it's staff. That being said it being an election year Pasarella might want to get an electoral 'win' by selling for a high price.

So yeah I think there are good options out there, but I'm not convinced we need to get them right now. I really want to see how Puyol evolves. Bartra's level has exceeded my  wildest expectations.

If he is good enough, we better get him now.

Waiting around and seeing what happens will only mean someone else will get him and yet again we are left with nothing because we are too slow.

Bump.

Has anyone changed their views since?

Negative.

How many games Puyol played? He hasnt got a new injury and still he hasnt played as much as I assumed by this point.

Bartra is doing well, Puyol will get injured again and now Pique seems fragile. I obviously dont count on Mascherano with any confidence.

We should sign someone.

Someone established, someone less known and you have been scouting, whoever, whatever.

Agreed. Bartra has impressed me so far, but if we intend to go all the way in all competition a defender will be needed.

Well, i think i changed my view. I do not think we can lure in a very good defender that is not cup tied, therefore we should just see this season through in the light of Bartra's good impression. Although, I would not mind a defensive minded LB of Abi's style who can fill in as CB when needed just in case Puyol has another injury (and he will probably have). Anyone has an idea about such player?

Dont think Umtiti is cup tied, but he is only 20 so obviously patience is required with him.

I did not know Umtiti before, but from some highlights i watched it appears as if he is better going forward than Abi. How is he as a defender?

No because it's impossible that someone good enough and not Cup tied will come in in January and adapt fast enough and improve on what we already have until February when the knockout stages of the CL start. Certainly not some unknown 20 year old kid like Umtata, Umtito, Umtikitaka ... whatever.

Dedé is surely better than Mascherano and not cup tied.

futbol wrote:No because it's impossible that someone good enough and not Cup tied will come in in January and adapt fast enough and improve on what we already have until February when the knockout stages of the CL start. Certainly not some unknown 20 year old kid like Umtata, Umtito, Umtikitaka ... whatever.

Exact same logic is why we never signed guys like Varane and now we have fodders.

The Franchise wrote:

futbol wrote:No because it's impossible that someone good enough and not Cup tied will come in in January and adapt fast enough and improve on what we already have until February when the knockout stages of the CL start. Certainly not some unknown 20 year old kid like Umtata, Umtito, Umtikitaka ... whatever.

Exact same logic is why we never signed guys like Varane and now we have fodders.

Meh. Varanes don't grow on trees. Zidane just randomly tries to get everything that is French to Madrid and Varane happened to be a special talent. Pure luck by a club that isn't exactly renowned for their scouting abilities. We can't randomly buy based on potential in the hope of landing another Varane. It fails once ... mhmmkay. It fails twice and we're already in a situation in which we've spent 10s of millions and have 2 players with long contracts with no resale value on our hands which we will loan out to 5 different clubs. Keirrison still got a Barca contract.

We apparently tried to sign the next best youngstar but the 19 year old with 1 season in Europe under his belt got snapped away from an Arab club for € 35 million. Tito also insisted on T. Silva only all summer.

Dede? Pls, no one here watches Cruzeiro games. Just namedropping highly rated FIFA players. Let's stay serious.

There is no one available in the winter market who will improve us. Or let me phrase it this way: It's not impossible with lots of luck but it's highly improbable. We do need a centerback soon but we can hold on until next summer with Pique, Mascherano, Bartra and Puyol.

I don't watch Cruzeiro, but my brasilian friend does, and says Dede is a great player. And I watched a couple of games from Vasco and he is really a good player.

Dedé indeed is a great CB, one who Milan typically missed after heavy scouting of his talent. It would be a difficulty to acquire given he just switched clubs last year, raising his expense possibly beyond his intrinsic worth.