Transfer Rumours V4

neuro, being rude and being a troll is not the same thing even though neither is desirable. Yes language does matter to me but once I get to know and appreciate a person for some time and become accustomed to his kind of communication I will try to adjust accordingly.

messixaviesta wrote:neuro, being rude and being a troll is not the same thing even though neither is desirable. Yes language does matter to me but once I get to know and appreciate a person for some time and become accustomed to his kind of communication I will try to adjust accordingly.

not just rude...but anyway better we just disagree here and move on...

neuro11 wrote:

messixaviesta wrote:neuro, being rude and being a troll is not the same thing even though neither is desirable. Yes language does matter to me but once I get to know and appreciate a person for some time and become accustomed to his kind of communication I will try to adjust accordingly.

not just rude...but anyway better we just disagree here and move on...

Yes that's best. Let's concentrate on the title decider thread any way for today.

BarrileteCosmico wrote:@Alex: Against elche I feel like you watched a very different Messi. He was as motivated as I've ever seen him. If he didn't make runs you thought he should have perhaps you should be criticizing his positional awareness rather than his attitude. It was very clear he wanted the win.

Wrong.He was his usual lackluster self in the first half.He tried in the last 30 min of the match sure but thats not good enough for me.You may accept that but I dont.
I accept 100% from him every minute of every match and not just 30 min in one match(and that too one match out of every 50)

neuro11 wrote:

messixaviesta wrote:neuro, being rude and being a troll is not the same thing even though neither is desirable. Yes language does matter to me but once I get to know and appreciate a person for some time and become accustomed to his kind of communication I will try to adjust accordingly.

not just rude...but anyway better we just disagree here and move on...

I think you should maybe go over your own posts.You call me rude and a troll and i have not said anything back.I ask you to debate the points I have raised.You completely ignore them and attack me instead.
yet I am the rude one.

alexjanosik wrote:

neuro11 wrote:

free_cat wrote:You are kinda blind to be honest. Messi had a good attitude against elche. Alves also had a good attitude, he always does, but he did nothing really, adriano was more dangerous, and again he was nowhere in elche counters (although they didn't come from this side this time). No one says alves should go for his lack of attitude but for his poor performances. Having attitude is great, but you need to perform. Same goes for Alexis and Mascherano.
Ps. I say this but I'm not sure we should sell Alves or not, because I don't see very good replacements.

Not really...He is just an anti-Messi troll.... a coutner to Harmonica actually....

Please bring constructive posts.I bring facts to the table.If you can,please counter my facts instead of calling me a troll.
fact 1: In our glory years,the dynamism of our forward line was amazing.Right now I can name 20 teams with a more dynamic forward line.And the reason is that our superstar cant be bothered to put in an effort.If you have any doubts watch our games from 3,4 years ago and compare to now.

Fact 2: He offers no movement whatsoever thereby making our attack predictable and stale and also ruining attacks.The amount of times this season Alexis,Pedro,Alves,Alba got in behind the defense only to find our superstar lazing around the middle of the pitch  
All he does now is drop deep,clog up the midfield,demand the ball in areas he should not thereby forcing the midfielders out of position,try the throughball between the fullback and CB which doesnt work anymore.Rinse and repeat.The big teams read it like a book and its no surprise we are toothless against them.

Fact 3: Our pressing is garbage because our superstar thinks its beneath him to do any work for the team.
Few years ago we were the best pressing team on the planet.Now we are not a top 50 team when it comes to pressing.And this has also led to our defense being put under more pressure than it is capable of dealing with.The pressing point is so self evident that I am not even going to bother explaining.

He is a liability in offense and he is a liability in defense.Please state why you think I am wrong with a reasoned argument instead of just calling me a troll.

I think yesterday's game perfectly illustrates my point.I was spellbound and in awe watching Atletico press us like hounds yesterday.And they were doing it in the 80th minute with the league already in the bag.It was coordinated,intense,systematic and we just couldnt deal with it.
Even the goal they scored was a direct result of their pressing.yes they scored off a corner but how did they get corner after corner?They got it because they pressed relentlessly and didnt allow us to breathe and get out of our half.They pinned us back for a good 10 min with their pressing,won corner after corner and eventually it paid off.
Now compare that to our pressing.In comparison it was amateurish.It was humiliating and embarrassing and sad watch us trying to press.At times it even looked comical.We couldnt pin them back for even 10 seconds.We needed to pin them back for 10 min like they did us but we just couldnt do it because our pressing is a joke now.I forgot the last time we pressed like Atletico did yesterday.I think it was 3 years ago.

Bottom line.We need pressing back and we need it back now.It is an indispensable part of the modern game.All the top teams have it and we need it too else we will continue to struggle like we have been doing.
I am sure the Messi apologists will come up with even more excuses on why we shouldnt press.The last few ones were hilarious.
The first was that if he presses,he will get injured.I dont think there is any factual evidence to support that.Even if he were,we should find a solution so that he doesnt get injured while pressing.If we cant find a solution then he can be sold and we get someone who wont get injured while pressing.
The second excuse was that it is actually on the coach's orders that Messi doesnt press and that it was all part of some grand tactical masterplan and that not pressing is actually better for the team.That not pressing actually gets the best out of Messi and the team.
Well looks like the grand tactical masterplan has worked.We have won a grand total of 1 major trophy in 3 years by not pressing while other teams who copied us have enjoyed remarkable success.So the plan seems to be working just fine.

I am waiting for the next excuse.I am sure it will be just as hilarious.

I fully agree Alex. With these posts and with the one in the Atleti match thread. Alves might've been somewhat error prone defensively this season but his offensive contributions were still solid and he puts the utmost effort into what he does. Alexis has also given his all for this club and in the progress he managed to play a lot of decent to good games and he scored a commendable amount of goals (whether them being tap-ins most of the time or not, he was there to tap them in ffs, he showed up and got it done). Speaking of showing up, he decided the game against Madrid with that beauty and would have provided us the title with that screamer against Atleti if our defense wasn't sleeping during that corner. Who's idea was it to leave one of the best headers in La Liga, Godín, completely unmarked? I could go on by stating how absolutely shit Pedro was throughout the season and especially in these last two games. In the game against Elche he did EVERYTHING wrong; it wasn't even a Segunda worthy performance. If we sell Alexis and keep Pedro it is another sign of how clueless our board is.

I've been reading on this board how everyone says that we need a complete overhaul. How we need to sell all of the deadwood. I completely agree; there is no way around it. Adding Messi to that list of people to be sold might be a taboo (seeing as he is, when fit and willing, the best player in the world), but this lack of hunger and desire you speak of is probably most apparent with Messi. I truly wish this wasn't the case but I see no indication of this changing. Or is it maybe the new contract negotiations? Will he get some of his spirit back when he gets yet another raise of his salary? Is that what it takes? And will he start sulking again when Madrid raise Ronaldo's salary again to make him the best paid player? It is an endless cycle with Barça as the losing party. I really wish it would've been different, but it might just be the case that selling the best player in the world would benefit our team. And now, when he is still worth a shit ton of money, would be the best time to do this.

Luis Enrique: "Interested in Jeremy Mathieu? I like him. I like all good players and Valencia have many good players."

Is this real life? If he wants Benatia and Mathieu he's Pep on steroids for me.

Alves-Pique-Benatia-Mathieu

BAH GAWD.

Alves is going to PSG after the WC.

Valkyrja wrote:

Fußball wrote:Luis Enrique: "Interested in Jeremy Mathieu? I like him. I like all good players and Valencia have many good players."

Is this real life? If he wants Benatia and Mathieu he's Pep on steroids for me.

Alves-Pique-Benatia-Mathieu

BAH GAWD.

Don't you think that Mathieu and Alves are both too old for the full-back positions ? IMO you should go for someone younger or sell Alves and buy a younger RB like Danilo.

Abidal was very good with 32. Mathieu is 30. I wouldn't expect him to bomb the left side up and down anyway. Rather stay back and make it a back 3 like Abidal. Even if he can give 2 good years that would be enough already. Until then some talent might emerge. We have a very promising leftback in Grimaldo in La Masia who dominated with Spain U19s with 16.

Alves however might be to old indeed to dominate the right on his own. I just don't know who to replace him with. We are linked with Cuadrado who is playing SS these days.

alexjanosik wrote:

BarrileteCosmico wrote:@Alex: Against elche I feel like you watched a very different Messi. He was as motivated as I've ever seen him. If he didn't make runs you thought he should have perhaps you should be criticizing his positional awareness rather than his attitude. It was very clear he wanted the win.

Wrong.He was his usual lackluster self in the first half.He tried in the last 30 min of the match sure but thats not good enough for me.You may accept that but I dont.
I accept 100% from him every minute of every match and not just 30 min in one match(and that too one match out of every 50)

I had to log in to give my two cents on the Lionel Messi discussion.

Firstly: On Alexjanosik:
This guy was one of the Biggest Messi admirers since he came onto the scene. He even said that Messi was the 2nd GOAT player after Johan Cryuff, amongst other things.
Yes, Alex can come off as a radical to an extent, but that is a huge part of his value as a poster on this forums, and it is not like he doesn't back it up with sound arguments in any case. One of the most honest posters I have seen in any forum,tbh.

moving on...

Initially, when I started back on the forums in the past month or so, I was alarmed that some of the vets like Dani and Alex were slagging off Messi. Since I haven't watched Barcelona too regularly and merely followed results and stuff along those lines this season, I genuinely believed the Messi apart from injuries and a few criticisms was still carrying out business as usual and his numbers reflected that for anyone who doesn't watch Barcelona too often.

However, in the past couple of months, since the Second El Clasico, I took out some time, and started to watch Tata's Barcelona, and I was literally shocked at how the team was playing. Loads of crosses, shit defensive play(a throwback to Rijkaard's 07-08 team,tbh) and a few players who seemed to be going through the motions.

With regards to the third mention:
Leo Messi was one who was most guilty of going through the motions and not looking the least bit interested apart from his El Clasico hat-trick at the Bernabao which was a wonderful performance for him.

I am a huge fan of Leo Messi,btw, being an Argie fan for many years makes me an even bigger fan of the guy and I dearly hope he turns up at the World Cup and does us all proud.

I have a few theories on why he has been lethargic this season.
His lack of pressing has been going on for a couple of seasons now,tbh, however, he has taken that lack of pressing to a whole new level.
I think that could be due to the WC coming up, the injuries he has had...and the third, a fallout with Tata due to being shunted to different positions, being asked apparently to take less touches of the ball and the crossing the ball tactics that were employed to my dismay.

Alex in another thread has said Messi based on his performances should be sold. I respectfully disagree on that notion as I believe if the next coach can get him motivated enough and tell him off enough to at least seem interested, then there is not a player in the world who can hold a candle to him and he becomes priceless.

IF, he continues as he has this season, then, even as a huge Leo Messi fan, I'd also be the first to say, let him go and for the good of the team, attempt to replace him with the Huge Amount of $$ we would surely receive in the event that he is sold.

Since Bacary Sagna is joining Manchester City who here wants Pablo Zabaleta?

He can rotate with Alves so that the Brazilian doesn't have to play that many games day in day out at this age. He can also fit in at left back when needed.

A player I have always liked and thought is very underrated.

If were going to keep Alves, I much rather take a risk on a youth player and see if he progresses under alve's wing, but then that means we need to first
a) find one
b) sell montoya

Alves apparently has already told PSG that he is coming over there according to several reports. Whether they are true or not is a different question but I can see him leaving. He hasn't been happy with how the board has been treating him and its his last year with the club as well. Zaba would be a good replacement with Montoya backup.
So is Rafinha going to be a midfielder who is going to 'replace' Xavi or is going to 'replace' Roberto's rotation role? Been rumours that we'll get the following players:
Jeremy Mathieu
Oliver Torres
Mehdi Benetia
Would really love to see all three of these players at the club and individually they shouldn't be worth more than 30 mil
Still probably need to look at a right back (if Alves is leaving). Promote Masip as the back up keeper. No need to fund anymore in the goalkeeping department.

Zabaleta already 29. Piszczek (dont rate him that highly anyway) will be 29 by next season also.

Dont see the point replacing Alves with these players.

I bring up Piszczek, mainly because of his defensive abilities, along with his work rate.
his 1.84m tall figure would also be a huge plus. and convincing him to leave dortmund shouldn't be all that hard.
To find a replacement of Alves is almost impossible, not many players like him let alone that are good but we could just try to re-invent his role to benefit our flaws.

I know, but at 29 years old...its kinda pointless. If we have to replace him, then for me, it should be done properly and that is finding a guy who can actually improve and play a good 4-5 year spell.

Like Arsenal probably will do by signing Aurier to replace Sagna.

anyone heard anything about yaya.....according to british papers, his agent said he is unhappy with how he was being treated and would not mind to accept a lower salary to return Barca....

Apparently the club wants to keep Mascherano, but only if he is willing to strictly play the midfield from now on (specifically back up to Buscuits, as the club plans to sell Song). Club plans on signing two center backs so Mascherano will not be needed at center back anymore; if he accepts the role. Smart move by Lucho; should of been done along time ago

Speaking of right backs, what about Hugo Malo? Sure he isn't world class, but if you guys are talking about getting a guy to learn under Alves for at least a year then he could be it. He's been rated highly as a prospect for a long time now and developed well under Enrique at Celta. He's probably around the same caliber as Montoya imo. Just an idea as a under study since Montoya was pretty annoying last season

Also, the clubs plans to loan out Oier this season. That pretty much guarantees Masip will be the back up unless we sign another keeper willing to back up MaTs. Didn't realize Masip was so short btw, he's only 5"10 apparently. That's really short for a keeper

He is short, but even i din feel it (strange??) when i saw him......would be interesting to see him in some small games....in last 2 seasons there had been no place for the young guys in the team. we almost never tried them. i hope lucho will be different.

Iker is like 6''1ish, thats not the same range as 5"10ish

thats like having Mascherano in goal vs some one like Ronaldo for example.

Not that I'm knocking Masip, he's obviously talented. I'm simply saying I had no idea he was so short. I thought he was  at least 6"0

As for Lucho, given he's already personally made sure the club recalled Deulofeu and Rafinha, and promoted Masip, it's apparent he wants to go back to giving time to the B teamers which is awesome

Idk, all I'm saying is that I wasn't aware Masip was so short. I'm also not going to sit here and compare him with what another guy that's slightly taller and so happens to be the one of, if not the greatest goal keeper of our generation can do with a similar height. Thats unfair to Masip.

Anyways, I'm not GK expert and will let RWO chime in on this if he comes across this thread

windkick wrote:Apparently the club wants to keep Mascherano, but only if he is willing to strictly play the midfield from now on (specifically back up to Buscuits, as the club plans to sell Song). Club plans on signing two center backs so Mascherano will not be needed at center back anymore; if he accepts the role. Smart move by Lucho; should of been done along time ago

Speaking of right backs, what about Hugo Malo? Sure he isn't world class, but if you guys are talking about getting a guy to learn under Alves for at least a year then he could be it. He's been rated highly as a prospect for a long time now and developed well under Enrique at Celta. He's probably around the same caliber as Montoya imo. Just an idea as a under study since Montoya was pretty annoying last season

Also, the clubs plans to loan out Oier this season. That pretty much guarantees Masip will be the back up unless we sign another keeper willing to back up MaTs. Didn't realize Masip was so short btw, he's only 5"10 apparently. That's really short for a keeper

This will be fun. I hope Masche improved in overall Barca's game, cuz he was really bad at replacing Busi when he did that in his first season.