Re: 2022 Qatar World Cup

by che Thu Sep 19, 2013 5:46 pm

BarrileteCosmico wrote:Upon further reflection I don't think this is that big a deal. Why should nations with such hot summers be denied the opportunity to host a WC?

because it's a massive health hazard for the players as well as the thousands of fans? (i was gonna say millions but lol, like qatar could fit that many)

hosting the biggest sporting event on the planet is a privilege not a right, if your climate isn't suited to thousands of people lounging and drinking outside throughout the tournament then you're not suited to be a host country, plain and simple

by The Franchise Fri Sep 20, 2013 11:45 am

BarrileteCosmico wrote:
jibers wrote:because it disrupts most club games ffs. It only makes sense. Club precedes over NT whether people like it or not. Those are the people paying them their fat cheques. **** FIFA and their corruption.
Clubs have 9 years to plan ahead. Aside from the increased risk of injury (which can be mitigated with a stretched out season), it should disrupt club football only marginally more than a winter break.

Disagree. What plans can you do? Does it matter if its 9 years or 90 years, if they play during winter, they are going to be more tired than they usually are the second half of the season. Way more injuries and probably because of all the fatigue, lower levels of performance.

by Grooverider Fri Sep 20, 2013 12:08 pm

disgrace disgrace disgrace.

FIFA and Qatar are both corrupt a holes that have ruined a summertime football tradition.

Hopefully nations will boycott the event and they will be forced to hold it either somewhere else or in the summertime as usual.

I feel sorry for the other nations that lost out on hosting the event because of corruption and back-handers.

RUINED and i refuse to watch.

by TalkingReckless Fri Sep 20, 2013 3:58 pm

Hopefully this finally forces the Euro leagues to play during the summer.

As much i like watching footy during the End of the year holidays, i rarely get to as i am busy with family and friends, and there will be less snow outs or those rainy/snowy games

by zizzle Fri Sep 20, 2013 4:13 pm

The Franchise wrote:
BarrileteCosmico wrote:
jibers wrote:because it disrupts most club games ffs. It only makes sense. Club precedes over NT whether people like it or not. Those are the people paying them their fat cheques. **** FIFA and their corruption.
Clubs have 9 years to plan ahead. Aside from the increased risk of injury (which can be mitigated with a stretched out season), it should disrupt club football only marginally more than a winter break.
Disagree. What plans can you do? Does it matter if its 9 years or 90 years, if they play during winter, they are going to be more tired than they usually are the second half of the season. Way more injuries and probably because of all the fatigue, lower levels of performance.

But it does make a difference, they can gradually cut short the summer break while extending the winter break, and instead of going 9 months strait with only a short winter break the players could benefit from having a longer breaks half way through the season. It's no wonder that most injuries happen in the 2nd half of the season so a long winter break will be welcomed.

by donttreadonred Sat Sep 21, 2013 1:34 pm

BarrileteCosmico wrote:Upon further reflection I don't think this is that big a deal. Why should nations with such hot summers be denied the opportunity to host a WC? Moving the WC to another country would effectively exclude any country near the Ecuator.

By this logic, The Olympic Committee should consider Qatar for the Summer Olympic games.

I'm sorry, but a Qatar World CUp is nothing short of a mistake. Even Sepp Blatter has admitted as much.

It's utterly incomprehensible that an unbiased committee could simply overlook the facts about a host site's climate for a tournament that is traditionally held in the summer. It's not as though they were considering switching the tournament to the winter when they awarded the competition to Qatar. The idea that FIFA are doing this out of some sort of equity for "hot-summered" nations is frankly farcical. I'm all for giving people the benefit of the doubt, but there is no evidence to support it in this case. Besides, FIFA waived their right to my good faith a while ago.

by BarrileteCosmico Sat Sep 21, 2013 4:10 pm

The Franchise wrote:Disagree. What plans can you do? Does it matter if its 9 years or 90 years, if they play during winter, they are going to be more tired than they usually are the second half of the season. Way more injuries and probably because of all the fatigue, lower levels of performance.

You can plan to hold the WC qualifiers all at once during the previous summer getting rid of international breaks, giving club football an extra month and a half or so they don't normally get during the club season. You can cut the summer break shorter and extend the season. I don't necessarily disagree that the final stretch will have more injuries than a usual season, but i think it's going to be less than what people expect.

In any case better fatigue than actual incidents during the summer, given that the WC is going to happen at Qatar regardless.

by FalcaoPunch Sat Sep 21, 2013 6:27 pm

The fact that there are so many thoughts as to how to make this World Cup work should mean that hosting it there is going to be a problem.

One way or another

by Rebaño Sagrado Sat Sep 21, 2013 9:22 pm

RedOranje wrote:
Rob Harris ‏@RobHarris 5m

If anyone's interested - my quick schedule showing how a winter 2022 World Cup could fit around the Premier (cont) http://tl.gd/n_1rmdchd
If anyone's interested - my quick schedule showing how a winter 2022 World Cup could fit around the Premier League without too many issues >>>
Seasons ends as normal in May 2022, followed by an international date .

June 2022 – no football when WC would usually be played

July 2022 Chps Lge playoffs.

July 22 2022, PL season starts.

CL group stage start in mid-late August.

Transfer window closes Aug 31

Sept international week – Euro 2024 qualifiers

Oct international week – Euro 2024 qualifiers – serving as competitive World Cup prep games which are better than friendlies

PL season stops by Nov 3, allowing for mandatory 2-week FIFA player release.

No need for a rest period as it is midseason. Link up with teams. Pre-WC warmup by Nov 10 – fly to Mid East.

WC group stage done by early Dec. so most players return to clubs globally. Many clubs can go on mid-season tours of Asia/US.

Dec 18 World Cup final.

Dec 26 Premier League resumes.

June 2023 PL season ends.

June/July 2023 African Nations, perfectly suited to southern African nation...

August 2023 PL season starts as usual.

Makes plenty of sense to me.

by rodri Mon Sep 23, 2013 7:47 pm

They didn't know that there is a hot weather in Qatar before giving them World Cup?
If not, what did they care about? Only about money in letters or what...

by zizzle Wed Sep 25, 2013 12:44 am

How many more must die for Qatar's World Cup?

Nick Cohen - The Guardian

With the European football association, Uefa, reaching the unavoidable conclusion that you cannot play competitive sport in the 50C heat of a Qatari summer, the way is clear for the international football association, Fifa, to break with precedent and make a decision that does not seem corrupt or senseless or both.

All being well, the 2022 tournament will be held in the winter. Just one niggling question remains: how many lives will be lost so that the Fifa World Cup™ can live up to its boast that it is the most successful festival of sport on the planet. "More workers will die building World Cup infrastructure than players will take to the field," predicts Sharan Burrow, general secretary of the International Trade Union Confederation. Even if the teams in Qatar use all their substitutes, she is likely to be right.

Qatar's absolute monarchy, run by the fabulously rich and extraordinarily secretive Al Thani clan, no more keeps health and safety statistics than it allows free elections. The Trade Union Confederation has had to count the corpses the hard way. It found that 83 Indians have died so far this year. The Gulf statelet was also the graveyard for 119 Nepalese construction workers. With 202 migrants from other countries dying over the same nine months, Ms Burrow is able to say with confidence there is at least one death for every day of the year. The body count can only rise now that Qatar has announced that it will take on 500,000 more migrants, mainly from the Indian subcontinent, to build the stadiums, hotels and roads for 2022.

Not all the fatalities are on construction sites. The combination of back-breaking work, nonexistent legal protections, intense heat and labour camps without air conditioning allows death to come in many guises. To give you a taste of its variety, the friends of Chirari Mahato went online to describe how he would work from 6am to 7pm. He would return to a hot, unventilated room he shared with 12 others. Because he died in his sleep, rather than on site, his employers would not accept that they had worked him to death. There are millions of workers like him around the Gulf. When we gawp at the wealth that allows the Qatari royals to buy the Olympic Village and Chelsea Barracks, we miss their plight, and the strangeness of the oil rich states, too.

How to characterise them? "Absolute monarchy" does not begin to capture a society such as Qatar, where migrants make up 99% of the private sector workforce. Apartheid South Africa is a useful point of reference. The 225,000 Qatari citizens can form trade unions and strike. The roughly 1.8 million migrants cannot. Sparta also comes to mind. But instead of a warrior elite living off the labour of helots, we have plutocrats and sybarites sustained by faceless armies of disposable migrants.

The official justification for oppression is, as so often, religious. Migrants and employers are bound by the kafala system – taken from Islamic law on the adoption of children. "Kafala" derives from "to feed". Nourishment is the last thing the system provides, however. It delivers captive labour instead. Migrant workers cannot change jobs without their sponsoring employers' consent. As Human Rights Watch says, if workers walk out, the employers – the adoptive parents – can say they have absconded and the authorities will arrest them.

In order to leave Qatar, migrants must obtain an exit visa from their sponsor. This stipulation means that they can be held hostage if they threaten to sue over a breach of contract. Wouldn't it make a bracing change if the religious leaders we hear condemning free speech as blasphemy so often could find the time to damn this exploitation?

It is not just poor construction workers who suffer. One might expect that Fifa would have been concerned about the fate of foreign footballers working under kafala contracts. Abdeslam Ouaddou, who once played for Fulham, has warned players not to go near Qatar. Speaking from experience – he played for Qatar SC in the Qatari domestic league – he said that if a player is injured or his form drops, the club can break his contract. If the player goes to lawyers, the club (as "sponsor") can refuse to let him leave the country until he drops his case.

Ouaddou got out of Qatar after much tortuous negotiation. But French player Zahir Belounis, a former captain of the team Al-Jaish, is trapped in the country with his family and hasn't been paid for two years. When he went to the international press, he was threatened with defamation proceedings.

After promising the International Trade Union Confederation that it would ensure human rights were respected in Qatar, Fifa tells me that it is "promoting a dialogue" to ensure dignified working conditions. Sharan Burrow's colleagues say all they hear is PR flam.

It is not just Qatar in 2022. The corruption and waste around the 2014 World Cup has provoked riots in Brazil. As for 2018, Putin's Duma has already restricted the rights of workers preparing the stadiums for the World Cup.

Fifa strikes me as a decadent organisation in the political rather than literary meaning of the word. It is an institution whose behaviour contradicts all of its professed purposes. If it cared about football, it would not even have thought of staging a tournament in the Qatari summer. If it cared about footballers, it would take up the case of Belounis. And if it respected human life, it would say that the kafala system could not govern World Cup contracts.

I don't know how much longer sports journalists can ignore the abuse Fifa tolerates. The World Cup is overturning all the cliches. People say that "football is a matter of life or death", said Bill Shankly. "It's more important than that." Shankly was joking. Qatar and Fifa appear to mean it. Sport is "war minus the shooting", said Orwell. There may not be any actual shooting in Qatar but workers will die nonetheless.

The quote that ought to haunt all who love football is CLR James's paraphrase of Kipling: "What do they know of cricket that only cricket know?" James was writing about how sport was bound up in the Caribbean with colonialism, race and class. Anyone writing about the World Cup must also acknowledge that the beautiful game is now bound up with racial privilege, exploitation and the deaths of men, who should not be forgotten so readily.

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/sep/21/qatar-human-rights-sport-cohen

by Grooverider Wed Sep 25, 2013 8:31 am

Its disgusting that a worldwide event such as the World Cup should take place in a backwards and corrupt nation like this, might as well have the 2026 WC in North Korea ffs

by MaestroFavre Mon Oct 21, 2013 5:08 am

I just remembered initially when Qatar's Geo Engineers stated that they had planned to use man made clouds to block the sun in the stadiums. Laughing

What happened to all their cooling technology that was supposed to be implemented in the stadiums? Laughing

by Pedram Mon Oct 21, 2013 6:34 am

MaestroFavre wrote:I just remembered initially when Qatar's Geo Engineers stated that they had planned to use man made clouds to block the sun in the stadiums. What happened to all their cooling technology that was supposed to be implemented in the stadiums?

They still have a lot of time to implement it.

by zizzle Mon Oct 21, 2013 9:06 pm

another reason to hate on Qatar

A Qatari poet has been sentenced to life in prison for an Arab-spring-inspired verse that officials claim insults Qatar's emir and encourages the overthrow of the nation's ruling system, his defence attorney says.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2012/nov/29/qatari-poet-jailed-arab-spring

by MaestroFavre Tue Oct 22, 2013 5:04 am

Pedram wrote:
MaestroFavre wrote:I just remembered initially when Qatar's Geo Engineers stated that they had planned to use man made clouds to block the sun in the stadiums. What happened to all their cooling technology that was supposed to be implemented in the stadiums?
They still have a lot of time to implement it.

Honestly, you're right but considering there hasn't been any news on that subject or fresh documentation in approximately 2 years, I would think that it is safe to assume that it probably will not happen. Additionally, the whole basis of this thread is based on what is said in the title and I know that we both understand that there probably won't be artificial clouds implemented at the World Cup if they are considering changing the season in which the tournament is going to be played in. So as much as I am insinuating it, I really do believe that the idea has been abandoned.

by 7amood11 Tue Oct 22, 2013 6:53 am

First of all, the World Cup is still 9 years away, and I'm pretty sure you don't have the slightest clue on whether they will implement the stadium cooling system or not, so have some patience. Second of all, the "they" whom you are talking about is FIFA, not Qatar. All proposals to move the World Cup to the winter have been from FIFA's side, not Qatar's.

by The Sanchez Tue Oct 22, 2013 9:41 pm

Grooverider wrote:Its disgusting that a worldwide event such as the World Cup should take place in a backwards and corrupt nation like this, might as well have the 2026 WC in North Korea ffs

Also 2030 in Afghanistan...

by Pedram Fri May 16, 2014 10:02 am

Blatter finally admit it.

"Of course it was a mistake [to award the World Cup to Qatar]," Blatter told RTS.

"But we all know that mistakes are made in life.

"Technical reports from Qatar stated that the temperature in summer is too high to play football. However, this didn't prevent the executive committee from awarding the World Cup to Qatar with a large majority."

by rwo power Fri May 16, 2014 10:20 am

In in a normal company, they would probably fire the people responsible for such a costly error. In the FIFA they all keep they jobs and probably even get more money, just for fun...

by guest_07 Fri May 16, 2014 11:52 am

The Sanchez wrote:
Grooverider wrote:Its disgusting that a worldwide event such as the World Cup should take place in a backwards and corrupt nation like this, might as well have the 2026 WC in North Korea ffs
Also 2030 in Afghanistan...

might as well have a wc in syria

there will be an awesome atmosphere

by farfan Fri May 16, 2014 1:07 pm

why can't sissy football players play in the heat?

in thailand , pro boxers fight at noon in open arenas in ridiculous humid climate and 40 + degrees celsius ...

by VivaStPauli Fri May 16, 2014 2:29 pm

Oh they don't have to, Qatar promised us air conditioned arenas!

by FalcaoPunch Fri May 16, 2014 2:48 pm

farfan wrote:why can't sissy football players play in the heat?

in thailand , pro boxers fight at noon in open arenas in ridiculous humid climate and 40 + degrees celsius ...

How do fans from all over the world handle that considering the temperatures may not be anything close to what they experience in their home country?

Kudos to the boxers.

by farfan Fri May 16, 2014 3:50 pm

FalcaoPunch wrote:
farfan wrote:why can't sissy football players play in the heat?

in thailand , pro boxers fight at noon in open arenas in ridiculous humid climate and 40 + degrees celsius ...

How do fans from all over the world handle that considering the temperatures may not be anything close to what they experience in their home country?

fans need to stop being sissies too :coffee:

by Jonathan28 Fri May 16, 2014 4:52 pm

Having the tournament in the summer is fine, I have no idea what the problem is. I used to play hours of football in over 40 degrees of heat during the summer back home in Botswana, you're not going to fall over and die ffs.

I'm looking forward to going to Qatar, I need to see the sun again ffs, it's non existent up here in Scotland.

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