EPL Passing Styles

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Post by Bellabong Tue 20 Nov 2012 - 2:23

EPL Passing Styles PByCV

Stoke :bow:
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Post by Swanhends Tue 20 Nov 2012 - 2:35

is this actually based on something or just completely made up?
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Post by jibers Tue 20 Nov 2012 - 2:37

Passing is becoming to big a deal am. Well I guess thats the trend. It was trequartistas, Powerful cms, nows igts tiny cm and passing statistics.
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Post by Onyx Tue 20 Nov 2012 - 2:42

What does narrow and wide mean in terms of this image?

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Post by The Franchise Tue 20 Nov 2012 - 2:47

Through the middle of the pitch or using the wings I would guess.

Looks made up to me anyways.
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Post by RedOranje Tue 20 Nov 2012 - 2:54

Wolverhampton Wanderers?
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Post by donttreadonred Tue 20 Nov 2012 - 3:01

RedOranje wrote:Wolverhampton Wanderers?
Last year's graphic I suppose... Still would prefer a little more data and a little less subjectivity.

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Post by Bellabong Tue 20 Nov 2012 - 3:30

SO I HERD U LIEK SAUCE

HTTP://disciplesofbeane.com/2012/11/19/analyzing-style-of-play-through-stats/

Tl;dr Long pass percentage and defensive third passes determine long/short
Amount of crosses and fullback touches determine width.
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Post by RedOranje Tue 20 Nov 2012 - 3:37

donttreadonred wrote:
RedOranje wrote:Wolverhampton Wanderers?
Last year's graphic I suppose... Still would prefer a little more data and a little less subjectivity.


So given that several clubs have since changed manager and several others have altered their playing styles due to change in players this tells us even less than the nothing it did in the first place? Awesome!
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Post by Swanhends Tue 20 Nov 2012 - 3:40

Phritz wrote:SO I HERD U LIEK SAUCE

HTTP://disciplesofbeane.com/2012/11/19/analyzing-style-of-play-through-stats/

Tl;dr Long pass percentage and defensive third passes determine long/short
Amount of crosses and fullback touches determine width.

scratch Fullback touches in the final 3rd would be an indicator of MORE width, not less...Fullbacks usually play wider than midfielders/forwards in the final 1/3rd :coffee:


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Post by BarrileteCosmico Tue 20 Nov 2012 - 4:00

I'm struggling to understand why fullback passing in the final 3rd is considered more narrow... his explanation isn't really convincing either.
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Post by mattpfeffer Tue 20 Nov 2012 - 4:38

Hey! I'm the creator of this graphic, and I'm also the editor of Disciples Of Beane!

I'm not sure what gave you the impression that fullback involvement is a factor against total width, but it's not. In the case of Stoke, very little of their attacking comes from their fullbacks, which is indeed a factor against their width, but this is aggregated against in my calculations due to their large use of 'classic' wingers. When a team plays with classic wingers, a fullbacks attacking space is already being occupied.

I use fullbacks in general, however, because fullback involvement is a much more consistent measure of how the team is playing it's football. Analyzing the performance of a team's wingers can be very misleading due to the varied role wingers's play in today's game. They often move inside when in possession, or move to the centre of the pitch when looking for space. Fullbacks however, they provide width much more consistently, and are therefore a better total indicator of 'team width' It should be noted there are many other factors besides this that went into my calculations.

This is indeed based off of Opta's 2011/2012 advanced stats. Unfortunately, they have not released this season's stats yet.

This thread is called 'Passing Styles.' I'd prefer not to think of simply where the passes go such but rather as a total picture of how a team plays.

Me and my buddies provide content like this pretty regularly, so if this is the kind of stuff you're interested in visit us at disciplesofbeane.com!

I'll try to reply to any questions anyone might have here, but you can also contact me at my email which is posted at the site.

Thanks!

Matt


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Post by Swanhends Tue 20 Nov 2012 - 4:49

mattpfeffer wrote:I use fullbacks in general, however, because fullback involvement is a much more consistent measure of how the team is playing it's football. Analyzing the performance of a team's wingers can be very misleading due to the varied role wingers's play in today's game. They often move inside when in possession, or move to the centre of the pitch when looking for space. Fullbacks however, they provide width much more consistently, and are therefore a better total indicator of 'team width' It should be noted there are many other factors besides this that went into my calculations.

But then you have Swansea (Most FB touches in final 1/3rd) as the narrowest team, with Stoke (Least FB touches in final 1/3rd) as the widest

I understand the line of reasoning that Stoke uses classic wingers who generally stay near the touch-line and try to cross it, I'm following there, but it seems like you're trying to have it both ways by assuming one thing to be true and then reaching a conclusion that seems to contradict the original assumption

Edit: Here are some FourFourTwo StatsZone charts that I think illustrate my point:

Check how many of De Guzman's passes were either at or to the right touchline vs Newcastle

EPL Passing Styles JDG

and while they weren't particularly successful, check the locations of Swansea's take-ons

EPL Passing Styles Take+Ons

Much the same story in other games. Here are some charts from Chelsea:

EPL Passing Styles Pablo+Final+Third

Here especially, look at how Ki (Korean Xavi :bow:) uses so much of his possession to switch the ball from wing to wing

EPL Passing Styles KI

Obviously your chart was from last season so its not current, but while Swansea has undergone some changes, I certainly don't think it has been anything THAT drastic (especially in terms of the spacing they use)


Last edited by Swanhends on Tue 20 Nov 2012 - 5:18; edited 4 times in total
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Post by mattpfeffer Tue 20 Nov 2012 - 5:07

Swansea's 'width' aggregate score is pulled down due to their complete lack of crosses in attacking areas.

In terms of your point, I think you misunderstood what I was trying to say. If a team plays with traditional wingers, I do not weight their fullbacks contribution as heavily into my final number. A team like Man City who rarely had width up front, their width numbers were more based off their fullbacks contributions.

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Post by Dutti Tue 20 Nov 2012 - 6:23

Passes In Defensive Third / Game

I found basically no real correlation to winning, so I decided this could be a nice way of evaluating how much a team likes to play the ball shorty. Something like passes in middle third would of shown bias to team’s who won the midfield battle (good teams). The amount of passes in a team’s own third can basically be at the team’s own discretion, and therefore indicative of the kind of approach they’re trying to play.

I really don't get this lol
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Post by Onyx Tue 20 Nov 2012 - 14:15

Don't the fullbacks always provide the width?

They're usually out wide so it's inevitable.

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Post by Zealous Tue 20 Nov 2012 - 14:40

Clearly Wigan have the best ratio of passing.
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Post by Great Leader Sprucenuce Tue 20 Nov 2012 - 15:31

Thought the graph was a bit strange but then i realised it was last season Laughing

Because this season we have made Stoke look like Barcelona tbh.
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