Best Defensive midfielder in the Universe.

Playing in the DM area doesn't = DM imo.

The Messiah wrote:

Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:When Cabaye has become a DM you know your doing your job wrong

Pardew

He's not a DM and I don't even know who brought his name here, where the likes of Toni kroos, Yaya Toure, Gustavo, De Rossi and Busquet are being mentioned

He did once play DM at Lille. I followed him whilst he was there because I thought he was a brilliant prospect (represented France at every level too) and would make a good signing for Milan. Anyway, he quickly developed his distribution skills at DM, then CM and was moved even further forward by coach Rudi Garcia in 08. He easily made the transition to being the team's playmaker, scoring 15 goals from that position in 09-10.

Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:I'm not bringing his name here

Do you read the thread? he was brought up by someone else

I'm just at the fact he has become a DM and he has became one.

LOL @ Kroos a DM btw

I know you didn't bring up the name, I was just saying I don't know who brought up the name.

Cabaye is obviously not a DM, it's like sayng Modric is a DM, Tiote is a DM though.


and yes Toni Kroos is a false 8, he's a box to box play-making roaming attacking defensive holding midfielder.

he is similar to Muller who is a false winger, attacking supporting striker or Alaba who is a box to box attacking defensive central midfielder winger fullback.

They are hybrids.

I haven't seen that much of Kroos at Bayern tbh. I saw plenty of him at Leverkusen and he was a full-blown AM there. I can't imagine him playing any further back than CM.

Forza Rossoneri wrote:I haven't seen that much of Kroos at Bayern tbh. I saw plenty of him at Leverkusen and he was a full-blown AM there. I can't imagine him playing any further back than CM.

Well, back in the days when he was on a season and half long loan to Leverkusen he played as a left winger, but he also played as attacking midfielder though, (whenever they changed their tactics and play with 2 strikers)


But in Bayern, since the departure of Van Bommel, Van Gaal converted him to holding midfielder just like how converted Schweinisteiger to Holding midfielder.

he still needs to work on his tackling and develop with experience.

Messiah make a thread about how Bayern is better than Madrid (its true btw)

Forza Rossoneri wrote:De Rossi.

Although I do rate Busquets, his diving habits are sickening and that is why he will never be anybody's hero.

Gustavo is a good player, but he suffers from too much reshuffling in the Bayern midfield. He needs to be allowed to take his place and make it his own.

And I agree with vlafy: Yaya, Cabaye, Vidal & Song are no longer DMs. Lucas hasn't played much and Brave Scotty Brave Scotty Brave Scotty Parker is not top DM calibre imo.

It seems i am not the only one there who is really watching football .

But to be fair, i don't like Busquets.I'm not saying that he isn't a top class DM, but i can't put him in my personal TOP 10 DM's (obviously because i don't like his style).

Abramovich wrote:Messiah make a thread about how Bayern is better than Madrid (its true btw)

I am working on it, but I want it to be creative and funny, still looking for a way to mix humors with fact and draw a similarity between how Ronaldo carried Madrid across the red sea and how Jonah carried his people across the Aegean Sea who were being chased by Barcelona.


Working on it and it's a big project, one that will blow people minds off. Looking for the rights words and how to start it, but in the end people will get the humor while also recognizing the truth in it.

(Hydra) this is the only word I have picked out for now and may represent one of the club.

Bayern will definitely be the hero and the victor.

it's going to be hard mixing everything together but it's a crazy ideal, if it works out people will love it and if doesn't people wouldn't, so I have to deliberate on it.

I'm pretty sure Vidal won the ball last season more than any other DM in top level football and he also contributes nicely to ball retention and can score. His dribbling skills often go unnoticed due to him being a play breaker and he's dribbled his way forward and grabbed himself a goal on many occasions.

For me after last season, Vidal.

Yes he likes to get forward but his primary job is defending and covering Pirlo to allow him to control the game. I class him as a CDM.
If Vidal isn't recognised as a CDM then my vote would go to DDR.

Le Samourai wrote:Roman Neustadter is the best defensive midfielder in Bundesliga.

He is VERY mediocre and honestly Jones is way better. I would rather play Holtby with Jones or play Hoger in there.

Roman is just a Granero type of player.

On Topic Gus is one the best. Lucas Levia or the others would not make anything more than Bayern's Reserve team which plays in 4th Division.

Lets be honest Lucas leiva whatever is nothing amazing going forward & he offers very little in that respect. So as a pure Destroyer Gus is Ridiculously fast,a very good tackler,is WAY WAY more versatile & is developing his offensive skills.

If you wanna say DDR who is freaking awesome or Vidal if you want to count him as one,then no issues. But freaking Lucas or Song. Song is Garbage defensively.

Cabaye cant defend as a sole DM.

Gareth Barry is a pile of garbage.

De Jong is an out right brilliant destroyer with 0 attacking skills & probably past his bets but still a great destroyer.


But how are these people much better than Gus?? Who is this troll in a Dos Santos picture. He is a bigger troll than our good humourous messiah.

DM's don't need to offer much going forward imo.

TomJuve wrote:I'm pretty sure Vidal won the ball last season more than any other DM in top level football and he also contributes nicely to ball retention and can score. His dribbling skills often go unnoticed due to him being a play breaker and he's dribbled his way forward and grabbed himself a goal on many occasions.

For me after last season, Vidal.

Yes he likes to get forward but his primary job is defending and covering Pirlo to allow him to control the game. I class him as a CDM.
If Vidal isn't recognised as a CDM then my vote would go to DDR.

Vidal isn't really a DM either though, he doesn't exactly sit in front of the back four (or three in this case)

He has immense workrate, but that doesn't make him a defensive midfielder in my mind

My vote also goes to De Rossi

Yohan Modric wrote:DM's don't need to offer much going forward imo.

That's a classical example why king will make a better coach than you.

Also when he said offer much going forward, I don't think he means much as in what Oezil, Kroos etc offers, he means it like Martinez and Vidal way.

Yohan Modric wrote:DM's don't need to offer much going forward imo.

A very valid way of thinking. You like an absolute destroyer. However that will give you only a very good team who are always playing at their 90%. FACT

If you have a DM who apart from his defensive work can open spaces with his creativity it takes the whole team to a Whole New Level. A full freaking level higher.

Which is why Vidal IMO is a ball playing DM. I dont know why on earth DM's have to De Jong type.

Again nothing against having a Pure Destroyer but a ball playing creative DM adds a whole new dimension to the team.

Having an free flowing team also has its disadvantages, there is no true style that works in every and any situation.


Also please guys do not call Sergio Busquets a defensive midfielder, he does so little defending and when he does its much more positional, forcing the opponent to make mistakes and destroy their shape.

If Sergio Busquets is in the discussion than i'd say he's the best on the planet hands down. I'd take him 10 times out of 10 for my team above Luiz Gustavo or any other player.

chinomaster182 wrote:Having an free flowing team also has its disadvantages, there is no true style that works in every and any situation.


Also please guys do not call Sergio Busquets a defensive midfielder, he does so little defending and when he does its much more positional, forcing the opponent to make mistakes and destroy their shape.

If Sergio Busquets is in the discussion than i'd say he's the best on the planet hands down. I'd take him 10 times out of 10 for my team above Luiz Gustavo or any other player.

Let see what Busquets can do in your team and not Barcelona/Spain...? even I will look like a great player if you put me in Barcelona/Spain set up while playing there for a long time, it's the system and not the players, they have become expect in the system.

That's the reason why I don't rate Busquets, Xavi, Iniesta and co, I rate Toni Kroos, Pirlo etc higher than them because all they have done is got used to a system, that don't allow the opposition tackle them hard and then give easy short passes and get favourism from the ref, like Van Gaal once said even prostitutes can become hard to beat when they get used to a system.


But I do rate Messi though.

You do have a point, however there is still the fact that besides the system, Barcelona players are extremely gifted with their feet.

Sergio Busquets has a very good technique, his first touch is one of the best in all football, he usually takes less than have a second to make a pass. Of course he can make passes that quick because he knows his teammate is going to be well positioned and he has no need to check, however its not like the passes are made automatically, he plays with the ball at his feet like its nothing.

The harder the opposition tries to press him, the more he chuckles and makes them prey of his game. Its very hard to dispossess him.

Just this alone makes him a very very valuable player, add in the fact he can go back and slot in as CB, the fact that he is so positionally intelligent he can trap opponents into making a mistake, the fact that he is an excellent dribbler or the fact that he is one of the tallest in the team of midgets and its easy to see why he's an undisputed starter.

chinomaster182 wrote:You do have a point, however there is still the fact that besides the system, Barcelona players are extremely gifted with their feet.

Sergio Busquets has a very good technique, his first touch is one of the best in all football, he usually takes less than have a second to make a pass. Of course he can make passes that quick because he knows his teammate is going to be well positioned and he has no need to check, however its not like the passes are made automatically, he plays with the ball at his feet like its nothing.

The harder the opposition tries to press him, the more he chuckles and makes them prey of his game. Its very hard to dispossess him.

Just this alone makes him a very very valuable player, add in the fact he can go back and slot in as CB, the fact that he is so positionally intelligent he can trap opponents into making a mistake, the fact that he is an excellent dribbler or the fact that he is one of the tallest in the team of midgets and its easy to see why he's an undisputed starter.

All these can be said about all Barcelona players, I can take Busquet name out and replace with Alves, Xavi, Iniesta and it will still make sense and as for slotting in as CB, I can replace his name with Yaya Toure(although I rate him) Macherano and it will still make sense.


In conclusion it's the system, that's why it applies to all Barca players.

So you think you can make a Goal Legacy XI, put them into a time machine, reverse time, put them all into La Masia and out will come a team that is as good as this current Barcelona team?

Raptorgunner wrote:

Agger makes getting fouled look awesome

chinomaster182 wrote:So you think you can make a Goal Legacy XI, put them into a time machine, reverse time, put them all into La Masia and out will come a team that is as good as this current Barcelona team?

I don't understand what you mean but what I believe is that Barcelona are advantage takers, they really enjoyed their moment didn't they..? They took advantage of a time when great teams like Bayern-1998-2001, Madrid 1999-2002, Juventus 2000-2003, Milan 2004-07, Liverpool-2005-07, Arsenal-2002-04 all fell in numbers. (Great suffering)

They really ate and enjoyed their cake to a large extent without no one to share it with them except for some English teams, United and Chelsea, even with that they needed favouritism to get pass Chelsea and then again Arsenal and many more.

What do you expect when you have Madrid with Drenthe, Bayern with Lell, Breno and co, Arsenal with Old Campbell, Juventus in Seria B, Milan players all getting old, coming up against Barca who were at their peak between these years.

Barcelona was never the best of time, lack of competition between 2006-10 is trully the best of all time and Barcelona players really enjoyed their moment and ate their fat big cakes all by themselves and they are still eating.


Now that Madrid, Bayern Munchen, Juventus are back lets see how far they will go, especially since teams like Chelsea, Man City and Dortmund has also evolved, I am dying to see Liverpool, Milan, Inter and Arsenal come back to their days of glory.


I am dying to see all Barcelona fan boys and glory hunters migrating in bunk and Manchester United also benefited from the great suffering but in a lesser degree compare to Barcelona.


This is the reason why people rate Barcelona player so highly, now that the going is about to get tough, there will be competition, Barcelona will be floor and flood in up coming years, starting from last season.


Now players like Hazard, Kroos, Oezil, Kawaga, Reus, Vidal, Muller are ready to take away their days of free glories.

De Rossi is the best DM on the planet. No doubts about it.

Gustavo may have more pace and be physically more impressive, but DDR has been gifted in other ways that cant be taught.

His timing is second to none. He seems to appear at just the right moment with outrageous sliding tackles and timely interceptions. Its like he comes out of thin air, because you think its a pure goal scoring chance for the opposition and then as if out of no where DDR comes in and saves the day. His tackling technique is superb, hes aggressive, hard nosed, passionate, and above all else never gives up on the ball. He also has the technique to pick out passes and evade players in a way most "destroyers" could not dream of.

I will admit I have not watched Gustavo as much as De Rossi, but I have seen enough to know that hes not on DDRs level...yet. Perhaps one day he will be able to take the tittle, but for now I dont really even think an arguement can be made on his behalf.

This thread is a great read though! Keep it going!

Well, I didn't see anyone like him to contain both CR7 and Özil together for the large portion of the game last season.


I don't think DDR is better than him defensively, not at all. DDR is the better play overall though through his tactical discipline and playmaking skills. Song, Cabaye or Lucas have nothing on him defensively. I don't know what chinomaster was smoking

His latest...

DDR is very good, as a matter of fact I don't know what in the universe made me forget about him when I was making this thread.


Gustavo is the most destructive DM in the game, he's restricted a lot in Bayern and he's still developing. One good thing about him, is his pace and time tackling, ability to tackle without getting booked by the ref.


If I was the coach I would try using this formation.



-------------Gustavo-----------------
------Martinez------Kroos/Schweini----

I doubt if Bayern will concede up to 15 league goals with Gustavo directly in from of the defence, we'll dominate an team in the world.