Football agents - Evil behind scenes?

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Post by Art Morte Thu Aug 16, 2012 6:46 pm

Have agents of players got too much power?

I remember a while ago an interview where Pardew blasted agents, saying they're responsible for making players' valuations sky high. A moment ago I saw this in the Rumours thread from Wenger:

Wenger is said to be furious Song's agent is actively looking to move the player out of Arsenal, and wants to meet with the Cameroon international to discuss the future on a one-on-one basis.


Agents get paid percentage of transfer fees when they're negotiating deals for their players. Isn't that a flawed system? Like, you're selling a sofa to your friend and you agree with him that 50 bucks is a fair price. Then another friend comes and sits his ass on the sofa, saying "this bitch isn't moving before I get 20 bucks".

I don't think it's good that agents are motivated by raising transfer fees through the roof.

If you got an opinion, share it.
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Post by Swanhends Thu Aug 16, 2012 6:48 pm

Agents are lawyers what do you expect lol

Although tbh its even worse in Europe than in the U.S because we have salary caps and no transfer fees here
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Post by Kaladin Thu Aug 16, 2012 6:55 pm

Mino Raiola must be sitting on an island of gold right about now
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Post by rwo power Thu Aug 16, 2012 7:58 pm

Well, both Hoeneß and Watzke have already addressed that and stated that they think the agents have too much power, and I wouldn't put it past them to talk the other BL teams to support them. They said they are not willing to have the clubs paying the agents' fees anymore and want to change that so that the players have to pay the whole agents' fees. If they manage to push that through, this would change the system a bit, I'd say.
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Post by BeautifulGame Thu Aug 16, 2012 8:04 pm

Well if Players dont want to move and clubs dont want to pay ridiculous wages what exactly can agents.

Agent are just an excuse and convinent scape goat.This is their job at the end of the day.
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Post by Great Leader Sprucenuce Thu Aug 16, 2012 8:08 pm

El Shaarawy wrote:Mino Raiola must be sitting on an island of gold right about now

I wonder how much he got for the Anita transfer as we don't like dealing with agents and refuse to pay them and he's notorious in getting huge fees for his work. hmm

I f*cking hate agents btw Mad
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Post by CBarca Thu Aug 16, 2012 8:10 pm

Agents suck. The only good thing to stem from agents is the movie Jerry Maguire.
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Post by rwo power Thu Mar 06, 2014 12:11 pm

terrance511 wrote:"But, in this moment, the people who surround them try to make them rich before they start their career."
dostoevsky wrote:The point he raises concerning the tendency of young players to feel that they deserve immense contracts before truly proving a thing has merit though.
I guess very often it is more like "The people who surround the players try to make themSELVES rich before they even start their career."
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Post by dostoevsky Thu Mar 06, 2014 12:15 pm

Meanwhile Raiola is right in the middle of it all making a mountain of cash out of both sides.

Football agents - Evil behind scenes? Il-vero-re-del-mercato-e-sempre-Mino-Raiola_h_partb
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Post by sportsczy Thu Mar 06, 2014 12:33 pm

In any profession, the goal is to make as much money as you can while doing what you like... why should the players not get paid as much as they can? Simple market economics. Completely invalid argument to me.

This same group of people broke league records and played extremely well the year before with Mou... and they are doing great this season too.

Mou's problem is that he can't take responsibility for his own failures.
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Post by VivaStPauli Thu Mar 06, 2014 1:23 pm

It's not even like agents shouldn't get filthy rich, there's so much money in play, they should have their slice of the pie.

But having them gain a percentage of each transfer fee puts agents in a ridiculous spot of obvious conflict of interest. They should be on wages, paid by the player. Maybe get a cut off the player's wages. But like it is now, many agents will tend to favor a move, whenever it's an option.
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Post by sportsczy Thu Mar 06, 2014 2:00 pm

Agents play a key role for players making the money that they are... they're not necessary for the top players perhaps. But for the middle of the road and lower level players, they are crucial. They create a marketplace for these players who would otherwise have nowhere to play.

So for me, agents deserve the super money because they've created a marketplace that has benefited all football players... and football leagues tbh.

For example, look at Raiola's roster of clients: http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/en/mino-raiola/details/berater_282.html.

You obviously recognize the top names there... but there are 2x unknown kids that he's helping develop and he also represents players that are way past it.

Keep in mind that the only reason that Pogba was able to leave the black hole that he was in at Man U and become the current player.... is because Raiola managed his career.
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Post by sportsczy Thu Mar 06, 2014 2:04 pm

and getting a % of the fee is not a conflict of interest....  because they also get a % of the wages.  The wage component represents, on average, 50% of the total fee for the agent.

For example, Silva got sold for 45 mil to PSG.... and he's going to earn 48 mil in wages over the 5 years he is there.  His agent takes the same percentage from both numbers.

In reality, agents perfectly represent the economic interests of the player because they earn the most as the player earns the most...  that's their job.  Now if a player wants to sacrifice economic gain for other reasons, that's his choice.  But the agent has a duty to present the best deals possible for his clients.
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Post by rwo power Thu Mar 06, 2014 2:16 pm

The problem is more that the agent gets the fee from the club, too. He should get paid solely by the player as the player is the person who benefits from the agents' services. AFAIK the ECA is currently discussing that problem, and they ponder what they can do about it.
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Post by sportsczy Thu Mar 06, 2014 2:23 pm

rwo power wrote:The problem is more that the agent gets the fee from the club, too. He should get paid solely by the player as the player is the person who benefits from the agents' services. AFAIK the ECA is currently discussing that problem, and they ponder what they can do about it.
 I completely disagree.  The club is also getting the benefit of the agent creating a marketplace for his player...  it's to his advantage that the selling club sells the player for as much as possible.  Completely deserves his fee. If the selling club is able to negotiate for the buying club to pay the fee, that's not the agent's issue. By contract, it's the selling club that is responsible for his fee.
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Post by rwo power Thu Mar 06, 2014 2:37 pm

By the way, here's a current article on the topic:
reuters.com wrote:Players are losing out financially due to excessive fees paid to agents and football must address this, Arsenal chief executive Ivan Gazidis said.

"Most clubs pay to the limit when they buy a player and so wherever this money goes it will still be the case of paying to the limit," Gazidis told a news conference following a meeting of the European Club Association (ECA), the organisation which represents European football clubs, to discuss the current transfer system.

"If I was a player or a players' union this would concern me. Players should make more money as the money paid to the agents should be going to them.

"There is a lot of money given to agents and it is in our interests to change this."

Gazidis said it was not a case of "trying to evade responsibility".

"I know we are involved in agreeing to pay these amounts," he said. "There are a lot of complications though as you are often dealing with cross-jurisdictions and agents have a role."

A study published by the ECA in a two-year period from 2011 to 2013 showed agents' commissions totalled $254 million - 14.6 percent of the value of the 865 transfers which took place involving European clubs.

"We know there is a problem and that there needs to be new regulations dealing with intermediaries. These are the numbers that we have found and it is for everyone to make their own conclusions," said AC Milan director and ECA vice-chairman Umberto Gandini.

The report did find that the present transfer system allows for free movement of players.

"We can see that the transfer system is working for the reasons that it was set up," said Gandini.

"The Bosman ruling applies as out of contract players are allowed to leave without any restrictions. The thing is that players' unions always want more and more and more. In general terms though the system is working."
Source: http://uk.reuters.com/article/2014/03/04/uk-soccer-eca-gazidis-idUKBREA231P620140304
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Post by rwo power Thu Mar 06, 2014 2:41 pm

Here's another article:
worldfootballinsider.com wrote:Financial controls in European football will soon extend to regulation of agents under plans being drafted by the European Club Association.

Coverage of the ECA's press conference at Soccerex in Manchester this week was dominated by headlines focusing on it winning concessions from UEFA on new financial fair play rules.

But Karl-Heinz Rummenigge, the ECA chairman, also revealed that two other proposals designed to cut club costs had received the backing of the 93 clubs from 53 UEFA member associations who attended the organisation's general assembly in Manchester. These are squad size capping and slashing agents' fees.

The ECA wants to introduce a squad cap of 25 players at national and European level but with unlimited use of U-21 players.

Noting the financial burden of agents on clubs, Rummenigge said the ECA was talking with stakeholders, including the European Football Agents Association, to bring in regulation.

Manchester United CEO David Gill, an ECA board member, said: "I think we are going to see some interesting developments in this area in the course of the next 12 months.

"All clubs endorse that change is required and therefore I think it will happen."

The ECA said 70% of all deals do not involve licensed agents. The lack of proper regulation has led to soaring fees and means clubs can be forced to foot huge bills to seal transfer deals.

Gill added: "We are moving to a much more simplified system which will hopefully bring greater control."

The details must still be worked out, but Gill said detailed contracts would likely be drawn up under an intermediary system that would "put the onus on clubs and players to manage their affairs".
Source: http://www.worldfootballinsider.com/Story.aspx?id=33059
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Post by sportsczy Thu Mar 06, 2014 3:18 pm

so basically, the clubs want to act as the regulators for player movements... good luck with that Laughing Neither the players nor the players' unions would ever go for that and rightfully so. Without the players and players' union approving this, the deal goes nowhere. It would go to court and get shot down as owner collusion against employees... what a waste of time unless they get the players to buy into it.
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Post by Donuts Thu Mar 06, 2014 10:30 pm

why are some people acting like the agents grab a gun and put it on the players face and say YOU MUST MOVE TO THIS CLUB.
no..
the player hires the agent, and fires him if he wishes to do so.
some players prefer family members as their agents, which is fine also all the agent does is try to find the club willing to put the most money into his client, aka which club VALUES him the most as some players take that into a high priority of feeling valuable.

now if a company owns a part of your share like in South America.. that's a whole different story.
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Post by fatman123 Fri Mar 07, 2014 7:26 am

Mendez is just as bad as any of them really, there was that thread on here not long ago about he and Chelsea co-owning heeps of players around the world, through that Chelsea even managed to get a cut of van Wolfswinkels tranfer to Norwich rofl

Plus look at his player list, this the guy who got Man U to sign Bebe Laughing
http://www.transfermarkt.com/en/gestifute/details/berater_413.html
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Post by VivaStPauli Fri Mar 07, 2014 9:39 am

Players are often kids, though, they grow up sheltered, and especially if they start their career at like 16 or 17 lack a healthy dose of perspective. They rely, obviously, on the advice of their agents, who are occasionally even family members.

Now, those agents operate in a system where they have a financial incentive to advise a move, the bigger the transfer fee, the better. Of course not all of them are going to advise against the player's best interest, are some are bound to do it, because, again: conflict of interest.

That's like hiring a real estate agent who's being paid by the guy selling you the house, in a percentage of the selling price. You really think he's going to get you a fair deal?
He might, but the market tells him something else. You put altruism directly against monetary interest here, where it might just as well go hand in hand (make the agent's fee dependent on the player wages only).
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Post by sportsczy Fri Mar 07, 2014 3:06 pm

You can fire your agent ANYTIME YOU WANT. You're not married to him unless there's this 3rd party ownership thing, which i agree should get banned. It's a problem in South America... nowhere else really.
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Post by Forza Fri Mar 07, 2014 3:17 pm

Swanhends wrote:Agents are lawyers what do you expect lol

Although tbh its even worse in Europe than in the U.S because we have salary caps and no transfer fees here
Not necessarily. In many cases one of the player's family members is their agent.

---

It should also be noted in this thread that corrupt agents who controlled up to 20% of the player market were a big part of the Calciopoli saga. The GEA World player agency operated by Moggi's son pretty much controlled which players went where. In fact, it was investigations into this agency that led to the full extent of the corruption involving Juventus and other teams being uncovered.
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Post by danyjr Sun Mar 08, 2015 1:09 pm

I can sell Pogba to PSG or Man City in a heartbeat - Raiola
Goal.com wrote:Paul Pogba has agreed to stay at Juventus in the long term, according to his agent, despite insisting he could sell him to the likes of  Barcelona, Real Madrid, Bayern Munich and Chelsea 'in a heartbeat'.

The 21-year-old has once again been in inspired form for reigning Italian champions Juve and had been linked with a €100 million move away from Serie A this summer.

Pogba has a long-term contract with the defending Serie A champions, which does not expire until June 2019, and Raiola says he intends to stick it out.

"We made a pact with Juve: Paul doesn't have to leave," representative Mino Raiola told Tuttosport.

"I spoke to president Andrea Agnelli, directors Pavel Nedved, Beppe Marotta and Fabio Paratici, so they all agree. The club doesn't need the money.

"He is wanted by seven clubs and that is certain, because they all told me so.

"The ones that can afford him are Real Madrid, Barcelona, PSG, Bayern Munich, Manchester United, Manchester City and Chelsea.

"If I just whistled, I could sell Pogba tomorrow to PSG or City in a heartbeat. But Paul did not tell me to find him another club.

"What are his chances of staying? As of today it's 99 per cent.

"Juve agree with our approach, which is that they will only sell if Paul asks to leave and there's a suitable offer. Of course, it could become one per cent, it depends on the market."

Raiola also admitted that he negotiated with Madrid a year and a half ago.

"Real wanted him 18 months ago, but I didn't like the attitude Madrid had with me.

"Juve asked for about €50 million and Real told me it was a ridiculous sum. Even Carlo Ancelotti told me that and he adores Pogba.

"I don't have to sell him, though. I advised Paul to only leave Juve if he finds a club that desperately wants him. Right now it's easier to remain in Turin than to leave. Juve are the side with the advantage."

What the hell...this punk talks as if he owns the player himself. These mercenaries are becoming more powerful than clubs and football originations in football.
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Post by halamadrid2 Sun Sep 20, 2020 2:13 pm

Agents are ruining the game with their greed

Fifa needs to do something

Mendes, Raiola etc fill their clients with poisonous ideas only because they want to get the hefty commission that comes with the moves
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