Why is Cronaldo compared to Messi rather than RvP, Gomez, Huntelaar etc?

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Post by la bestia negra Wed Feb 08, 2012 3:51 pm

aleumdance wrote:
Khaledbarca wrote:Messi >>>>> RVP = Cristiano #Fact

i don't get the logic behind this

the logic of a barca fan

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Post by VanDeezNuts Wed Feb 08, 2012 3:52 pm

:facepalm: barca fans. #logicnotneeded

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Post by Ali Wed Feb 08, 2012 3:53 pm

stunt wrote:Rvp comparable? Maybe this season, not before. Ronaldo and Messi have been playing at this level for years.

Some people have selective memory.

RvP has been performing everytime he plays , not just this year, the last 3 years are a testament to what I'm saying
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Post by Harmonica Wed Feb 08, 2012 3:54 pm

jibers wrote:Why did you create this thread Jiopsi. I'm curious. It is universally accepted that Messi is #1. You can compare anyone to anyone. Is there some rule against it? I'm actually astonished tbh.
I'm just fascinated why does the comparing continue? It has been a mismatch for years, and the difference has grown and grown, so that currently Penaldo is more like any other high profile striker. But why are they compared. Probably mostly because of the overall goal haul?
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Post by S Wed Feb 08, 2012 3:56 pm

stunt wrote:Rvp comparable? Maybe this season, not before. Ronaldo and Messi have been playing at this level for years.

Some people have selective memory.

This.couldnt agree more.
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Post by Harmonica Wed Feb 08, 2012 3:56 pm

aleumdance wrote:
Khaledbarca wrote:Messi >>>>> RVP = Cristiano #Fact

i don't get the logic behind this
Seriously?
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Post by jibers Wed Feb 08, 2012 3:57 pm

jiopsi wrote:
jibers wrote:Why did you create this thread Jiopsi. I'm curious. It is universally accepted that Messi is #1. You can compare anyone to anyone. Is there some rule against it? I'm actually astonished tbh.
I'm just fascinated why does the comparing continue? It has been a mismatch for years, and the difference has grown and grown, so that currently Penaldo is more like any other high profile striker.

So Messi shouldn't be compared to anyone then? Ronaldo was the Global superstar before Messi. It only makes sense. They are the faces of the two biggest rivals in Spain and they have similar statistics, and 'don't perform' for their NT teams. I don't really understand. I know this is a forum and you can debate what you want but who should we compare Messi to? Xavi? Mismatch in what way. The whole logic behind this is stupid because to know it is a mismatch you have to compare, as you have done using statistics. So you have contradicted yourself no?
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Post by Guest Wed Feb 08, 2012 3:58 pm

and welcome to my ignore list

and lol 7 points

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Post by EarlyPrototype Wed Feb 08, 2012 4:00 pm

I agree they shouldn't be compared.

One is good penalties and the other isn't. banana
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Post by Harmonica Wed Feb 08, 2012 4:03 pm

jibers wrote:
jiopsi wrote:
jibers wrote:Why did you create this thread Jiopsi. I'm curious. It is universally accepted that Messi is #1. You can compare anyone to anyone. Is there some rule against it? I'm actually astonished tbh.
I'm just fascinated why does the comparing continue? It has been a mismatch for years, and the difference has grown and grown, so that currently Penaldo is more like any other high profile striker.

So Messi shouldn't be compared to anyone then? Ronaldo was the Global superstar before Messi. It only makes sense. They are the faces of the two biggest rivals in Spain and they have similar statistics, and 'don't perform' for their NT teams. I don't really understand. I know this is a forum and you can debate what you want but who should we compare Messi to? Xavi? Mismatch in what way. The whole logic behind this is stupid because to know it is a mismatch you have to compare, as you have done using statistics. So you have contradicted yourself no?
Of course it should, but why do we mostly always get the Messi vs. Penaldo? So your only argument, is that they are compared mostly because both are superstars or were? I agree on that somewhat.

And you don't need statistics to see it's a mismatch, you can see it already everytime they play.
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Post by Harmonica Wed Feb 08, 2012 4:04 pm

Crimson wrote:and welcome to my ignore list

and lol 7 points
Why is Cronaldo compared to Messi rather than RvP, Gomez, Huntelaar etc? - Page 2 Di-KYL0

You're such a feeble minded person.
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Post by billionmillion Wed Feb 08, 2012 4:10 pm

Crimson wrote:and welcome to my ignore list

and lol 7 points
:lucas:
sometimes i wonder when Crimson will change his attitude and grow up Cool
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Post by Guest Wed Feb 08, 2012 4:18 pm

This post was made by jiopsi who is currently on your ignore list. Display this post.

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Post by Zealous Wed Feb 08, 2012 4:21 pm

jiopsi wrote:
jibers wrote:Why did you create this thread Jiopsi. I'm curious. It is universally accepted that Messi is #1. You can compare anyone to anyone. Is there some rule against it? I'm actually astonished tbh.
I'm just fascinated why does the comparing continue? It has been a mismatch for years, and the difference has grown and grown, so that currently Penaldo is more like any other high profile striker. But why are they compared. Probably mostly because of the overall goal haul?

Why is Cronaldo compared to Messi rather than RvP, Gomez, Huntelaar etc? - Page 2 U0uHq
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Post by Harmonica Wed Feb 08, 2012 4:23 pm

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Post by stunt Wed Feb 08, 2012 4:32 pm

jiopsi wrote:
vanDEEZ wrote:
stunt wrote:Rvp comparable? Maybe this season, not before. Ronaldo and Messi have been playing at this level for years.

Some people have selective memory.

obviously the comparison is this season..
It applies to last season as well:

Messi 10-11

Why is Cronaldo compared to Messi rather than RvP, Gomez, Huntelaar etc? - Page 2 Dm-TBES

Penaldo 10-11

Why is Cronaldo compared to Messi rather than RvP, Gomez, Huntelaar etc? - Page 2 Dm-6CNN

Messi 53 goals, 17% penalty or tap-in, 53% directly assisted. 28 assists.
Penaldo 53 goals, 38% penalty or tap-in, 75% directly assisted. 18 assists.

11-12

Messi 37 goals, 16% penalty or tap-in, 35% directly assisted. 21 assists.
Penaldo 31 goals, 42% penalty or tap-ins, 71% directly assisted. 8 assists.
RvP 28 goals, 32% penalty or tap-ins, 86% directly assisted. 8 assists.

Penaldo has always been the striker, who needs service, like RvP, like Gomez, like Huntelaar currently are.

It applies to last season aswell? Show me RVP's stats.

As far as I can see, last season, 23% of ronaldo's goals were "self", which I assume means he made them alone, while only 19% of Missi's were "self". Which, according to your all mighty, all-knowing stats, means Ronaldo scores more goals alone on average than Missi. Which means, he needs less service than Missi.


Last edited by stunt on Wed Feb 08, 2012 4:35 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by Guest Wed Feb 08, 2012 4:32 pm

lmfao Z hahaha

and

This post was made by jiopsi who is currently on your ignore list. Display this post. :coffee:

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Post by Harmonica Wed Feb 08, 2012 4:36 pm

stunt wrote:
jiopsi wrote:
vanDEEZ wrote:
stunt wrote:Rvp comparable? Maybe this season, not before. Ronaldo and Messi have been playing at this level for years.

Some people have selective memory.

obviously the comparison is this season..
It applies to last season as well:

Messi 10-11

Why is Cronaldo compared to Messi rather than RvP, Gomez, Huntelaar etc? - Page 2 Dm-TBES

Penaldo 10-11

Why is Cronaldo compared to Messi rather than RvP, Gomez, Huntelaar etc? - Page 2 Dm-6CNN

Messi 53 goals, 17% penalty or tap-in, 53% directly assisted. 28 assists.
Penaldo 53 goals, 38% penalty or tap-in, 75% directly assisted. 18 assists.

11-12

Messi 37 goals, 16% penalty or tap-in, 35% directly assisted. 21 assists.
Penaldo 31 goals, 42% penalty or tap-ins, 71% directly assisted. 8 assists.
RvP 28 goals, 32% penalty or tap-ins, 86% directly assisted. 8 assists.

Penaldo has always been the striker, who needs service, like RvP, like Gomez, like Huntelaar currently are.

It applies to last season aswell? Show me RVP's stats.
It's not the point really, you can see Penaldo hasn't changed from last year at all, so the high profile striker mold still applies to the past.
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Post by la bestia negra Wed Feb 08, 2012 4:39 pm

billionmillion wrote:
Crimson wrote:and welcome to my ignore list

and lol 7 points
:lucas:
sometimes i wonder when Crimson will change his attitude and grow up Cool

not the only one that needs to grow up
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Post by stunt Wed Feb 08, 2012 4:51 pm

The way Ronaldo scores goals doesnt mean he's a striker, it's just his style, anyone that watches him play knows he's not a striker, but a mix beetween that and a winger, whilst messi actually spends more time closer to the box than him.

Statistic-wise RVP might be closer to Ronaldo than Messi is, but we all know who to compare. Style of goals doesnt mean shit about your position. You can actually have different styles and similar stats. That's why you can never compare players through stats.


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Post by Lord Hades Wed Feb 08, 2012 4:53 pm

its wonderful how you tell others to grow up yet arent mature enough to call ronaldo by his real name
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Post by Harmonica Wed Feb 08, 2012 4:56 pm

stunt wrote:The way Ronaldo scores goals doesnt mean he's a striker, it's just his style, anyone that watches him play knows he's not a striker, but a mix beetween that and a winger, whilst messi actually spends more time closer to the box than him.

Statistic-wise RVP might be closer to Ronaldo than Messi is, but we all know who to compare. Style of goals doesnt mean shit about your position. You can actually have different styles and similar stats. That's why you can never compare players through stats.

The point also wasn't to box players to exact "striker" mold, it was just to point out how similar style of goals they (excluding Messi) score, and what they need to do that. They all need service. That's is the biggest difference between Messi and the rest.

Stats doesn't always say much on surface, you have to analyze and interpret them to fully understand the situations.
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Post by stunt Wed Feb 08, 2012 6:14 pm

Dude. Ronaldo and Messi are both unorthodox players who have different roles, and different styles, none of them is a pure striker. But that doesnt mean they cant be compared. They are compared for the same reason Pele and Maradonna were/are compared.

Because they are, by far, the best players on the planet at this time and because they both score huge amount of goals, and as you've probabbly heard, a goal is a goal and you win games by scoring them, it doesnt matter how.

You're assuming comparisons can only be made based on similar positions and style, and if that were true, which it isnt, then you would be (partially) correct.

If we are gonna be honest, you cant compare Messi's style, position and even his role in his team with nobody else, but you also cant compare Ronaldo to nobody else around, because even though he has striker atributes (and his stats reflect that) ronaldo isnt a pure striker, he scores plenty goals using his speed and positioning as a winger.

Ultimately, they are incredibely unique players who give huge contributions to their teams, and that's also part of why they are compared. RVP, Rooney and Gomez are all just strikers, incredibely good, but just strikers. Ronaldo and Messi do more stuff than that.

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Post by Harmonica Wed Feb 08, 2012 6:26 pm

stunt wrote:Dude. Ronaldo and Messi are both unorthodox players who have different roles, and different styles, none of them is a pure striker. But that doesnt mean they cant be compared. They are compared for the same reason Pele and Maradonna were/are compared.
Yes I agree their roles aren't the same, as most pure strikers. But Penaldo still scores goals similar to a pure striker, like RvP, Gomez and etc. Messi doesn't. Nor does Cronaldo/RvP/Gomez provide other players like Messi does. That was the point. And I agree also the, although rough, Pele/Maradona comparison.

Because they are, by far, the best players on the planet at this time and because they both score huge amount of goals, and as you've probabbly heard, a goal is a goal and you win games by scoring them, it doesnt matter how.
I don't agree, I rate Benzema better player this season at RMA. Also RvP has been atleast as good as CR7.

You're assuming comparisons can only be made based on similar positions and style, and if that were true, which it isnt, then you would be (partially) correct.
My only observation was the style of goals they score, the position was just to illustrate better what I was trying to say, which obviously failed miserably.

If we are gonna be honest, you cant compare Messi's style, position and even his role in his team with nobody else, but you also cant compare Ronaldo to nobody else around, because even though he has striker atributes (and his stats reflect that) ronaldo isnt a pure striker, he scores plenty goals using his speed and positioning as a winger.
The style of goals, and service to others disagrees here.
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Post by Lex Wed Feb 08, 2012 6:54 pm

stunt wrote:RVP, Rooney and Gomez are all just strikers, incredibely good, but just strikers. Ronaldo and Messi do more stuff than that.
What utter testicles. Try watching a PL game once in your life, brah, before you come out with such baloney. RVP actually has more overall assists than Ronaldo this season, while Roonay, who was forced to play as a CM this season for United, is equalling assists with Ronnie. To claim they don't offer anything else other than goals is, quite frankly, an insult to anyone who watches football's intelligence
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Post by ijomer Thu Feb 09, 2012 12:55 am

hahahahha Missi made me laugh HAHAHAHA if he could IF IF IF IF he could score penalties, he would have 70 goals per season LOLOLOL

too bad he can't
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