Re: Boxing thread

[LeSwagg James]

Well apperently it works like this.

After the plaster like substance is inserted, nothing actually happens. Once we starts to sweat it gets wet and turns hard, like plaster.

So it takes 4 rounds or so, which cooincidently was when Margs punches started to get to Cotto. Take that for what it is.

But nothing was suspected at the time so that was never investiaged. He got caught before the fight with Mosely.

So I guess the decision came about from he never got caught wearing it when it was hard, so it is feasable he didnt know about it.

Overall, its a load of crap and he clearly would of known. I think Bob Arum probably paid someone off and he got away with just 1 year.

I find it strange how Cotto´s promoter continues to plead the innoncence of Margarito.

Yeah has to be a load of crap, you said they get hard with sweat right? I'm sure he noticed how hard it gets after the fight when he's taking it off..

Cotto was probably pissed when he heard about the Mosely incident and obviously thinks that is why Margarito beat him.. I think he just wants to get revenge lol, probably told his team to not say anything that would jeopardize the fight

I hope he beats the shxt out of that cheating bastard

[The Franchise]

Exactly. But then again, offically he only wore it in the Mosely fight and he never got to fight that with them.

So if he is telling the truth and he only used them for the Mosely fight, which he got caught before they went hard, then he never of felt what they feel like taking them off hard.

If he did use them for fights before that, like Cotto or Cintron, then yes he clearly would of known. But nobody knows or can prove he used them for those previous fights. Though Cotto has some photos which look quite suspecious.

But im with you man, I hjope Cotto drills him.

The problem is, cheater or not, Marg can take a punch aswell as anyone in the division and is naturally the bigger fighter. Cotto´s punches may not hurt Margs enough.

[The Franchise]

Intresting 24/7, shame there will only be 2 episodes.

Anyway, I dont know about you guys, but im pretty convinced Marg had loaded gloves to beat Cotto the first time. I mean, Mosely has a great chin, but the way Margarito was just sledge hammering Cotto was too much. He hit Mosely, he smashed Pacman with clean shots and neither looked like going down. Both have better chins than Cotto, but Cotto got smashed worse then even Pacman did to him. Look at the cuts in the vids, look at the damage.

If Cotto beats him now, im 100% convinced Margarito cheated the first time. I think both fighters have declined from their first fight, that fight took alot of both and since both have been smashed around bad by Pacman. They arent the same guys.

That being said, if all of a sudden Margs doesnt have the snap in his blows he did in the first fight..then it just looks suspecious.

[The Franchise]

[The Franchise]

Wanted to watch the fight again, see if I could learn something. Posted it here in case anyone else wanted to.

Anyway, I did not.

Cotto is the superior boxer, far superior. He hits harder, he is faster and has a better jab, left hook and can move his feet better.

But none of it matters.

Margarito can take his punches and walks him down. From the first minute, Cotto hits him harder and with cleaner shots. But Margs has too great a chin and it too big. He keeps coming, keeps coming.

Eventually the constant pressure got to Cotto, he isnt used to moving so much backwards, he isnt used to punching so often keep someone away, he fights at his own delibrate and slower pace. This was too much.

He got tired and Margs just kept coming with that solid chin and great body work.

Cotto could win on points, but the point is he would never last 12 rounds at this pace. I just dont know what Cotto is going do.

Im afriad this fight will be the same, except faster like Dywer said.




In other news, Saul Alverez easily beat Cintron last night. Cintron once a title holder I believe, or at least a contender, just got countered by Canelo and eventually got taken down by a right hand in the 4th. After that, it was only a matter of time.

Alverez impressive, so patient for a kid with such a big punch. They are talking about a fight with Chavez junior, but some issues about that still in terms of weight. Would make a very intresting fight thats for sure.

[The Franchise]

On the boxing forum, they make a good point however.

Against Mosely, the very next fight for Marg, he couldnt walk him down as much and couldnt apply the same pressure because Mosely went to the body a ton and tired him a little.

It is strange that Cotto, a renowned body attacker didnt attack the body much at all in this fight. He hit Margarito at will but all in the head.

I would say thats true and Cotto should do that, however Mosely had a iron chin and Cotto does not. Cotto hit Margarito more, with more power, but didnt take them nearly as well.

Then again, maybe Margs was hitting Cotto with plaster in his gloves lol

This is what makes the rematch intresting to be honest. The only doubt about Margarito not destroying Cotto again is the plaster. If he wore plaster last time, then I say its 70/30 in his favour. If he didnt use plaster, then its 99/1.

[Great Leader Sprucenuce]

MAY 5TH...I'M HERE. I'M WAITING! LETS MAKE THIS FIGHT HAPPEN

I been told the boy May 5th is open. I told him May 5th is open...Now you know me... and all the fans, May 5th is the date. Sign the contract! Sign the contract! I'm waiting," he said.

"Now I can't be sitting waiting all day, now. You want a fight, let's make it happen. May 5th! This is exclusive. May 5th, let's make the fight. I'm here. I'm waiting," he added.

"What's going on? You said you a clean athelete and you said you would take the tests and all that. Well let's do it," Mayweather said in the video.

http://www.fighthype.com/pages/content11263.html?
utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

[Guest]

oh snap.......

[The Franchise]

Bon Arum is in trouble now.

I do believe Pacman wants to fight, but he is controlled by Arum like a puppet master. You can tell in all the interviews.

He has been called out, big time now, and if he doesnt respond in some way he is going to look like a clown. He needs to get to Bob Arum and make it happen, if he is the fighter we believe him to be.

[RealGunner]

David Haye

[The Franchise]

Pacquiao's controversial win clouds approach for choosing next fight

- Late Saturday night, long after Manny Pacquiao, Bob Arum and the rest of Pacquiao's shellshocked entourage had left the MGM Grand, a beleaguered Freddie Roach held court with a handful of reporters. Like the rest of Team Pacquiao, Roach was baffled by how Juan Manuel Marquez, a 9 1/2 to 1 underdog the night of the fight, was able to make Pacquiao look so mortal. The difference was, Roach wanted to talk about it.


"I can't believe I was so f*****g wrong," Roach said. "I thought we were going to walk right through him. I thought he was going to come in with all that muscle, try to bang with Manny and he would get him out of there. But I honestly thought we needed to win those last two rounds to win the fight."
Turns out, he did. Judge Robert Hoyle, who scored the fight 114-114, gave the last two rounds for Pacquiao. Flip one, and it's another draw. Dave Moretti, who scored it 115-113 for Pacquiao, split the final two rounds. If he gives both the rounds to Marquez, it's a draw. If Pacquiao had let up even a little in those last six minutes he would have, in the minds of the judges, lost the fight.


I say 'in the minds of the judges' (the third, Glenn Trowbridge, scored it an absurd 116-112 for Pacquiao) because in the opinion of many ringside observers, he did. I scored the fight 116-112 for Marquez. I thought Marquez carried most of the early rounds, I thought that Marquez landed the cleaner, crisper, more impactful punches, and I thought Marquez dictated the tempo throughout the fight. And I wasn't alone. I was immersed in phalanx of respected boxing journalists. Tim Smith of the New York Daily News. Ron Borges of the Boston Globe. Bob Velin of USA Today. Each shared the same opinion: Marquez won the fight.

Roach doesn't have a problem with that thinking. He saw what we did. He saw it early, too.
"First round," Roach said, a frustrated scowl on his face. "Manny started moving into right hands, just like we worked on not doing. He fell right back into the old way he fought this guy. I was afraid of that. The writing was on the wall and I said to myself, 'this is going to be a long night.' The way he moves, he dictates Manny to move into that right hand. And he did it all night long. His footwork is excellent. That was his biggest advantage in the fight."

I asked Roach if Pacquiao and Marquez fought three times, would the results be any different.
"No," Roach said. "That's why I really don't want to fight him next. But you know, it wouldn't be right if we didn't give him a rematch. It would be bulls**t if we didn't."


Of all the potential storylines that were bandied about by reporters before the fight, the idea that the only two viable opponents (sorry, Tim Bradley) Pacquiao could potentially face -- Marquez and Floyd Mayweather -- have a style he simply has few answers for was never discussed. What Marquez proved is that if you are a brilliant counterpuncher, if you have excellent footwork and if you come into the ring without the slightest trace of fear of Pacquiao, you can beat him. Think about it: Pacquiao and Marquez have fought 36 rounds now and, with the exception of one or two, every one of them has been close. History will officially record that Pacquiao won two of those three fights but many will say that Marquez deserved to win all three of them.

But this is about Pacquiao, and where exactly he goes from here. Arum says he would like to make a rematch. There are not many reasons not to. The atmosphere in Las Vegas for fight week was electric. Thousands of Filipino's and Mexicans swarmed to the city. Their passion was palpable. The arena was completely sold out and the gate ($11.7 million) was just a shade under the $12 million Pacquiao pulled in against Oscar De La Hoya. Although any projections on pay per view buys are several days away, Arum says the tracking numbers suggested 1.5 million buys are not out of reach. A fourth fight (and a fifth, and a sixth) would be a competitive cash cow.


Which makes it all the more noteworthy that Roach doesn't seem to want any part of it. And though we didn't discuss the possibility of a fight with Mayweather, I would imagine that Roach is a lot more concerned today about Pacquiao's chances against Mayweather than he was last week. When I asked Roach who his ideal next opponent would be, he said something I thought I'd never hear.
"Maybe a tuneup fight," Roach said.

Now, that's unlikely on so many levels. The public isn't going to pay for Pacquiao to work out his issues against Steve Molitor or Joel Casamayor. So unless Pacquiao wants to go back on HBO, that's out of the question. That would be a tough sell on Arum, too, who is looking at a finite window to make money off Pacquiao before he makes politics his full time job.

That's what makes another fight with Marquez more probable. Though I don't buy into the, 'Well Floyd crushed Marquez so he would crush Manny' argument (Muhammad Ali, Joe Frazier and George Foreman debunked that long ago) that has polluted Twitter and that I think Marquez, who is an aggressive counterpuncher -- whereas Floyd likes to stick the right hand and run -- is just built to fight Pacquiao, the melancholy mood that permeated the press room on Saturday makes me think no one from Pacquiao's team is going to be calling anyone from Mayweather's camp anytime soon. You just don't go into a Mayweather fight with an obvious flaw in your style that Mayweather could easily exploit.
Marquez makes the most sense. Roach acknowledged that he will have to go back to the drawing board. All the work Roach and Pacquiao had put in since the last Marquez fight clearly didn't have much of an effect in this one. But there are few better brains in boxing than Roach's and he has a pupil willing to learn. Get back in the lab, learn a few more tricks and perhaps next time you can put some punctuation on this historic rivalry. Then, move on to Mayweather.
Who thought last week anyone would be concluding that?


Read more: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/writers/chris_mannix/11/14/pacquiao-marquez/index.html#ixzz1f2SvWX72

[Great Leader Sprucenuce]

I said from day 1 that i though Bob Arum was stopping this fight from happening, it always seemed to me that both Pacquaio and Mayweather wanted the fight.....

It was always going to be difficult for Mayweather to deal with Arum, considering thier history but i dont think i envisioned it to be this difficult.

Also LOL @ Haye

[The Franchise]

COTTO WINS VIA STOPPAGE!!!

Hell yes........get in.

Cotto did so well, so smart...the changes he made, everything....fantastic.

Margarito..no power without loaded gloves and he got his eye smashed in a again.

Good fight and im stoked.

Probably get into the differences in the fight tommorow.

[Rebaño Sagrado]

Damn Margarito is so slow and weak it was painful to watch.

Good for Cotto finally got revenge.

[The Franchise]

Great to see Cotto win, he made some great changes from their first fight.

First time, he ran for 4-5 seconds then stopped, threw punches, took punches then ran again.

This time, he was constantly on the move. Never stopping and never getting caught on the ropes.

Anytime he did, he tied Margarito up, turned him around and/or physically moved him back to the center of the ring.

Secondly, Marg clearly has eye problems. He went blind early in the fight and was damaged in that same eye. His career as an elite is over, Pacman has destroyed that eye.

Also, Margs clearly didnt have the power in his punches as he did in the first fight. He barely hit Cotto with anything clean. but even when he did Cotto wasnt smashed by them like in the first fight. I think it does make Margarito look like a clear cheater with loaded gloves the first time around. It really does look like it.

Only negative from Cotto..used to be the best body punched in the world for me, now he rarely throws it. I dont know why...especially in this fight. If he did he would of won easier I think. Maybe at these bigger weights he is afraid of the uppercut when he stoops low. I dont know.

[Guest]

Don't be to be off-topic, but I think this thread should be called the boxing thread. I don't see the point in mixing Boxing and UFC in the same thread, seems people on goal legacy either support boxing or UFC.

[paddy]

Pacquiao won that fight for Cotto in my honest opinion. Margarito has been brawling his entire career, 17 years, and he never, ever, cut that easily. Cotto fought the best fight he possibly could, he took the smart approach. he just kept nailing that eye and moving away. By the half way stage Marg couldn't see out of that right eye, it was completely shut.

With that said, Cotto never once hurt Margarito. He could easily have fought on those last few rounds and stayed on his feet. He was putting pressure on all the time, and Cotto's face was pretty badly marked up, but there was no way Tony would have won that fight. He couldn't even see where he was throwing his punches, never mind seeing Cotto's never ending barrage left hooks.

Cotto learned from his mistakes last time, no doubt about it, but I wonder how differently things would have been had Pacquiao not ripped Margarito's eye asunder. I would have an asterisk beside this win for Cotto, just like I would have an asterisk on Margarito's win in the first fight with the handwraps scandal. Still, that was the best Cotto has looked in years. It's great to see him back at the top. It saddens me though that Maragrito's career is over. He was always an entertaining fighter. He has the best chin I've ever seen, and his villainous persona on 24/7 was simply epic. He just comes off a a straight up *bleep* who doesn't care what anyone thinks. He's a classic Mexican warrior. He can never fight again with that eye though

[Eman]

Don't be to be off-topic, but I think this thread should be called the boxing thread. I don't see the point in mixing Boxing and UFC in the same thread, seems people on goal legacy either support boxing or UFC.

I agree with this point. Perhaps we should start a UFC thread next week when Jones takes on Machida?

In the meantime, I must say that Jason Miller's performance last night against Michael Bisping was possibly the worst performance I've ever seen from him. It could be argued that Bisping was just too good and made him look bad, but I've never seen Mayhem gas like that, and IMO Mayhem has fought guys who are easily better than Bisping in the past. Very depressing fight to watch for me

I also totally disagree with Dana White's assessment that this past season of TUF has produced the most skilled fighters in the show's history. He might have just been hyping up the finale, but there is no way these guys were the best crop of guys ever, even though they put on great fights. If it weren't for the fact that they are competing in relatively new weight-classes, I don't think any of them would be good enough to one day be title contenders.

[The Franchise]

Pacquiao won that fight for Cotto in my honest opinion. Margarito has been brawling his entire career, 17 years, and he never, ever, cut that easily. Cotto fought the best fight he possibly could, he took the smart approach. he just kept nailing that eye and moving away. By the half way stage Marg couldn't see out of that right eye, it was completely shut.

With that said, Cotto never once hurt Margarito. He could easily have fought on those last few rounds and stayed on his feet. He was putting pressure on all the time, and Cotto's face was pretty badly marked up, but there was no way Tony would have won that fight. He couldn't even see where he was throwing his punches, never mind seeing Cotto's never ending barrage left hooks.

Cotto learned from his mistakes last time, no doubt about it, but I wonder how differently things would have been had Pacquiao not ripped Margarito's eye asunder. I would have an asterisk beside this win for Cotto, just like I would have an asterisk on Margarito's win in the first fight with the handwraps scandal. Still, that was the best Cotto has looked in years. It's great to see him back at the top. It saddens me though that Maragrito's career is over. He was always an entertaining fighter. He has the best chin I've ever seen, and his villainous persona on 24/7 was simply epic. He just comes off a a straight up *bleep* who doesn't care what anyone thinks. He's a classic Mexican warrior. He can never fight again with that eye though

Good to see ya Paddy, been a busy man I bet.

Cant dissagree with your take there too much, though I hate Magarito a bit more and I aint dissapointed his eye is messed up. Call it Karma or whatever, but I dont feel sorry for a guy who did what he did.

I do like the attitude though, I do like that he dont give a shit and I find it entertaining...but I cant feel sorry for him one bit.

Cotto looked good, but he still isnt the same fighter he was previously. I dont know where the body punching has gone...its shocking.

[paddy]

Hey Dani, long time no see!

In case I disappear for another six months or something I have a recommendation for all of you - ITV are showing a documentary on the Nigel Benn-Gerald McClellan fight on Monday at 11.05, The Fight of Their Lives. I'd imagine it will be well worth checking out

[RealGunner]

how come you are so busy these days ?

[The Franchise]

Hey Dani, long time no see!

In case I disappear for another six months or something I have a recommendation for all of you - ITV are showing a documentary on the Nigel Benn-Gerald McClellan fight on Monday at 11.05, The Fight of Their Lives. I'd imagine it will be well worth checking out

No longer in the UK, ITV may be hard to come by lol

Though, I may be able to find a way around that. Worth checking out no doubt.

[Great Leader Sprucenuce]

Nice to see Paddy is still around, your boxing insight is missed

I'll check the documentary out and cheers for sharing.

Also Dani is the Cotto and Margs fight worth checking out i forgot all bout it, is it a fight worth watching?

[The Franchise]

Nice to see Paddy is still around, your boxing insight is missed

I'll check the documentary out and cheers for sharing.

Also Dani is the Cotto and Margs fight worth checking out i forgot all bout it, is it a fight worth watching?

My opinion yes. But I think though its a better view live then watching it over because while Cotto was winning there was always the fear of what happened last time and Margarito´s ability to punch and not get hurt.

Watching it over, knowing the result, it lacks that drama but I think its worth a watch still.

[Great Leader Sprucenuce]

Simply cant wait for this fight, iam much more interested in this than the Khan and Peterson fight this weekend.....

I got it Ward on UD.

[The Franchise]

Is that this Sat too?

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