Re: the bitter spanish waiter..

by fatman123 Fri Oct 14, 2011 2:15 pm

Lord Spencer wrote:Apparently the finances of Liverpool disagree with some of what you guys are saying. Clearly Liverpool spent more since 2004 than MUnited according to the numbers posted by one poster above.

Regardless of Rafa's legacy in Liverpool and Valencia; he is coming off as an ass by these frankly "look at me" remarks. Pretending MUnited are only on top due to money while he spent more, Chelsea spent more, MCirty spent more. Chelsea got something out of their spending but are on a bad spot now, and they could not get a CL yet. MCity are yet to be seen.

This thread disintegrated into attacking Rafa's credentials as a manager, while it should have been an attack on Rafa as an analyst. He chooses what to see to base it on the situation instead of seeing what the situation is.

In my book, a better manager than Rafa could have won more with that amazing Liverpool squad. I don't consider Ancellotti a great manager for the same reason.

Apparently though, saying Rafa is not a great manager becomes an insult towards him. He is a good manager, sometimes brilliant but his shortcomings are there to be seen.

Get over it, Rafa is not the greatest thing since sliced bread.

im assuming your getting for only winning one scudetto at milan?
yet you manage to forget all his other honours:
x1 Coppa Italia
x2 UEFA Champions League
x2 UEFA Super Cup
x1 Serie A
x1 Italian Supercup
x1FIFA Club World Cup

and really you could almost add another CL and CWC because he pretty much won that CL final vs 'pool (not who coached that 'pool side too)

and his work at chelsea was top notch (in patches), imo he should be coaching for a new contract this season

by Lord Spencer Fri Oct 14, 2011 2:23 pm

mr-r34 wrote:"amazing Liverpool squad"

When was this?

If a prime Gerrard, Carraghar, Kuyt, Mascherano, Xabi Alonso, Riise, Torres, Reina, and the skinny Israeli guy don't create an amazing squad then I don't know what does.

Unless all the players above are mediocre, in which case it is my mistake.

Not to mention:

Hyypia, Kewell, Arbeola, Insua, Aurelio, Crouch, and Pennant who were not too shabby either.

Not to mention the people who did not get integrated very well into the system.

It is my mistake though, those players are obviously championship material and not an amazing team at all.

by che Fri Oct 14, 2011 2:26 pm

Lord Spencer wrote:

Regardless of Rafa's legacy in Liverpool and Valencia; he is coming off as an ass by these frankly "look at me" remarks. Pretending MUnited are only on top due to money while he spent more, Chelsea spent more, MCirty spent more. Chelsea got something out of their spending but are on a bad spot now, and they could not get a CL yet. MCity are yet to be seen.

again... these "look at me remarks" are answers in an interview... it's not like he's standing in the middle of london with a megaphone screaming his views at the pedestrians

and while i don't agree 100% with what he said, you can see his point in saying how much man utd spend... ffs 12 of their current players cost more than 15 mil (de gea, jones, smalling, vidic, ferdinand, valencia, carrick, anderson, nani, young, rooney, berbatov), that's their entire starting 11 bar evra and maybe rafael

but of course it's the man who destroyed valencia and liverpool so everything he ever says is wrong out of principle...

by zizzle Fri Oct 14, 2011 2:30 pm

he's still on Inter's payroll ffs

by Lord Spencer Fri Oct 14, 2011 2:34 pm

fatman123 wrote:
Lord Spencer wrote:Apparently the finances of Liverpool disagree with some of what you guys are saying. Clearly Liverpool spent more since 2004 than MUnited according to the numbers posted by one poster above.

Regardless of Rafa's legacy in Liverpool and Valencia; he is coming off as an ass by these frankly "look at me" remarks. Pretending MUnited are only on top due to money while he spent more, Chelsea spent more, MCirty spent more. Chelsea got something out of their spending but are on a bad spot now, and they could not get a CL yet. MCity are yet to be seen.

This thread disintegrated into attacking Rafa's credentials as a manager, while it should have been an attack on Rafa as an analyst. He chooses what to see to base it on the situation instead of seeing what the situation is.

In my book, a better manager than Rafa could have won more with that amazing Liverpool squad. I don't consider Ancellotti a great manager for the same reason.

Apparently though, saying Rafa is not a great manager becomes an insult towards him. He is a good manager, sometimes brilliant but his shortcomings are there to be seen.

Get over it, Rafa is not the greatest thing since sliced bread.

im assuming your getting for only winning one scudetto at milan?
yet you manage to forget all his other honours:
x1 Coppa Italia
x2 UEFA Champions League
x2 UEFA Super Cup
x1 Serie A
x1 Italian Supercup
x1FIFA Club World Cup

and really you could almost add another CL and CWC because he pretty much won that CL final vs 'pool (not who coached that 'pool side too)

and his work at chelsea was top notch (in patches), imo he should be coaching for a new contract this season

A great manager would not choke as much as Ancelotti does. He as you witnessed first hand cannot reverse a downward spiral. He also get complacent; for those honors you mentioned these are honors he should have had if not for complacency, Carlo is too nice to be a great manager. Only assholes can become great managers:

-Juve losing title in last game of the season, to prime asshole Capello nonetheless.
-2003, Milan got the CL but they had the depth to compete for Serie A as well, they didn't.
-2004 CL, losing 4-0 to Deportivo when 3 goals up in the first leg.
-2005 CL, a reversal that should have never happened if Carlo locked shop instead of going all out.
-2007, failing to qualify for the CL in a clutch match against Fiorentina.

I am confident in Carlo's abilities as a manager, but he is not cruel enough to be able to win everything under the sun. He cares more about having a good time, unlike great managers who want to see the defeat in their enemies more than their own victory.

by Lord Spencer Fri Oct 14, 2011 2:42 pm

che wrote:
Lord Spencer wrote:

Regardless of Rafa's legacy in Liverpool and Valencia; he is coming off as an ass by these frankly "look at me" remarks. Pretending MUnited are only on top due to money while he spent more, Chelsea spent more, MCirty spent more. Chelsea got something out of their spending but are on a bad spot now, and they could not get a CL yet. MCity are yet to be seen.

again... these "look at me remarks" are answers in an interview... it's not like he's standing in the middle of london with a megaphone screaming his views at the pedestrians

and while i don't agree 100% with what he said, you can see his point in saying how much man utd spend... ffs 12 of their current players cost more than 15 mil (de gea, jones, smalling, vidic, ferdinand, valencia, carrick, anderson, nani, young, rooney, berbatov), that's their entire starting 11 bar evra and maybe rafael

but of course it's the man who destroyed valencia and liverpool so everything he ever says is wrong out of principle...

A close number of Liverpool, Chelsea, and MCity's current layers cost more than 15 mill. It is more pronounced with MUnited because they are very different from last years as their old guard is standing down.

As for him answering the interview, he could have just as simply declined to answer, or spoke in facts like in how Liverpool and Chelsea spent similar amounts of money to MUnited and yet failed to compete against them in the long run. What he said, even if an answer to a stupid question is just a trolling comment. He is becoming known to throw around controversial comments since starting his "vacation".

This does not depend on his Valencia and Liverpool days, but rather his comments now.

by che Fri Oct 14, 2011 5:34 pm

Lord Spencer wrote:

As for him answering the interview, he could have just as simply declined to answer, or spoke in facts like in how Liverpool and Chelsea spent similar amounts of money to MUnited and yet failed to compete against them in the long run. What he said, even if an answer to a stupid question is just a trolling comment. He is becoming known to throw around controversial comments since starting his "vacation".

seriously?

so when asked "is alex ferguson the main cause of the success of manchester united" he shouldn't say his opinion which, though obviously biased, is based on facts, but instead go with some semi-relevant politically correct bullshit to appease a rival?

and maybe, just maybe, he's making more controversial comments since his "vacation" because, i dunno, he's an analyst now and interacts with media a lot more than he used to when he was a coach?

by Lord Spencer Fri Oct 14, 2011 7:43 pm

che wrote:
Lord Spencer wrote:

As for him answering the interview, he could have just as simply declined to answer, or spoke in facts like in how Liverpool and Chelsea spent similar amounts of money to MUnited and yet failed to compete against them in the long run. What he said, even if an answer to a stupid question is just a trolling comment. He is becoming known to throw around controversial comments since starting his "vacation".

seriously?

so when asked "is alex ferguson the main cause of the success of manchester united" he shouldn't say his opinion which, though obviously biased, is based on facts, but instead go with some semi-relevant politically correct bullshit to appease a rival?

and maybe, just maybe, he's making more controversial comments since his "vacation" because, i dunno, he's an analyst now and interacts with media a lot more than he used to when he was a coach?

Get the question right.

According to ESPN.com, he was asked about the influence of SAF in MUnited's success, he was not asked if he was the main reason for their success.

His answer was that he is not a reason for their success and that the money spent on players is the reason.

He did not give SAF any credit at all. Sorry, but if you say something as absolute as that then your a crap analyst and should just take a new job. Like a conspiracy theory author.

"to appease a rival", he is an analyst now he needs to get off his Liverpool days. They are not rivals anymore.
Of course, him being a lazy analyst who does not research or explain his facts nothing better would be expected from him.

Just call a spade a spade on this one.

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