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Post by The Madrid One Sat Jun 25, 2022 6:51 am

I've started watching some Bellingham clips because of all the rumors and he actually looks a lot like the type of player I wished a while back that Reinier Jesus would become like. Who knows if Reinier can still do it, some real stagnancy with him, in no small part probably because of his weird player profile. If he's a CAM he might as well turn into an attacking b2b interior type of CAM/CM.

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Post by Thimmy Sat Jun 25, 2022 9:10 am

When it comes to Bellingham, I really don't think Youtube montages do him justice. He's not typically a flashy player. Similarly to Fede Valverde, his work rate is excellent, and I really value him for being able to consistently perform on a high level for Dortmund. His performance level since he made his debut for Dortmund has been far beyond what I expected from him.
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Post by halamadrid2 Sat Jun 25, 2022 11:45 am

I'd be wary of Bellingham tbh. I've watched him for England and he lookes incredibly out of place. I'd want to see him succeed in another league before we spend that much on him imo
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Post by futbol_bill Sat Jun 25, 2022 6:11 pm

This is the guy rumoured to be a 2023 purchase! Like Nick said, it sures sounds unreliable. There is talk of both Modric and Kroos retiring next summer. Only then will we be looking for another MF unless the noted three youth become failures.
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Post by Mr Nick09 Sat Jun 25, 2022 7:33 pm

futbol_bill wrote:Interesting that he is turning down Liverpool because he feels with all the attacking options they have, his playing time will be very limited! It really the same case at Madrid. He’s definitely on the move, but I’m concerned he is favoring Italian teams. They never seem to have money and are always after loan deals!
in what universe is Liverpool interested in Asensio to the point that he turned them down?
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Post by Clutch Sat Jun 25, 2022 10:02 pm

halamadrid2 wrote:I'd be wary of Bellingham tbh. I've watched him for England and he lookes incredibly out of place. I'd want to see him succeed in another league before we spend that much on him imo
tbf every player in england looks out of place

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Post by futbol_bill Sat Jun 25, 2022 10:30 pm

Mr Nick09 wrote:
futbol_bill wrote:Interesting that he is turning down Liverpool because he feels with all the attacking options they have, his playing time will be very limited! It really the same case at Madrid. He’s definitely on the move, but I’m concerned he is favoring Italian teams. They never seem to have money and are always after loan deals!
in what universe is Liverpool interested in Asensio to the point that he turned them down?


Here’s where I read it.

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/marco-asensio-liverpool-24288235
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Post by Thimmy Sat Jun 25, 2022 11:14 pm

halamadrid2 wrote:I'd be wary of Bellingham tbh. I've watched him for England and he lookes incredibly out of place. I'd want to see him succeed in another league before we spend that much on him imo


That's a good point. I have no idea why he doesn't perform for England. One could argue that he only excels when he's playing for Dortmund, but as I've mentioned before, one of his greatest strengths is that he performs well, even when Dortmund are pinned back in their own half or are struggling in general. I imagine there are specific reasons why he looks out of place for England. Has he been playing out of position?
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Post by Thimmy Sat Jun 25, 2022 11:16 pm

Mr Nick09 wrote:
futbol_bill wrote:Interesting that he is turning down Liverpool because he feels with all the attacking options they have, his playing time will be very limited! It really the same case at Madrid. He’s definitely on the move, but I’m concerned he is favoring Italian teams. They never seem to have money and are always after loan deals!
in what universe is Liverpool interested in Asensio to the point that he turned them down?


Probably in the same universe where Man City were interested in CR7 and Pogba, only for both of them to turn them down. Seems like classic cases of agents doing their best to increase market values by influencing rumors that a lot of people assume to be true.
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Post by futbol_bill Sat Jun 25, 2022 11:50 pm

Well he does have Mendes as his agent!

There were more articles from same source ” liverpool echo” that said Kloop wanted to play him as an AM behind his attacking forwards. That is a more natural position for him. He played very well for NT lately. He has lots of problems imo, being first with his headset, but he is not a winger and that’s a reason for his problems at Madrid. Actually I don’t understand why Madrid keeps signing AMs when they don’t play with a formation that could use that role.

In any event, I believe he is as good as gone, just a matter of time.
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Post by halamadrid2 Sun Jun 26, 2022 12:58 am

Thimmy wrote:
halamadrid2 wrote:I'd be wary of Bellingham tbh. I've watched him for England and he lookes incredibly out of place. I'd want to see him succeed in another league before we spend that much on him imo


That's a good point. I have no idea why he doesn't perform for England. One could argue that he only excels when he's playing for Dortmund, but as I've mentioned before, one of his greatest strengths is that he performs well, even when Dortmund are pinned back in their own half or are struggling in general. I imagine there are specific reasons why he looks out of place for England. Has he been playing out of position?
Southgate seems to be experimenting alot. I think the best games Jude has played is when he's been played further back as part of a pivot if you like. The times he's played further up he's flattered to deceive. I don't I can't put my finger on it but England have needed one of their midfielders to make things happen but none of them have stepped up.
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Post by halamadrid2 Sun Jun 26, 2022 1:01 am

According to Marca Mariano's agent has informed the club that his client would like to leave.

That's potentially Bale, Asensio, Mariano and Jovic leaving in the same summer. This could be the best summer in ages
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Post by futbol_bill Sun Jun 26, 2022 8:40 pm

Update on transfers:

Asensio - 4 clubs have expressed interest; Milan, Liverpool, Arsenal and Spurs. Club is asking 40M for him and of course Milan are saying we want a gift and don’t have 40M. This one will go on for a while while Asensio is saying he won’t show up for training camp (in 2 weeks) if he doesn’t have a concrete renewal offer.

Jovic - close to a deal with Florentina. Loan deal itself is agreed with Rmad paying half of salary, issue is mad insisting on a buy after 1st year.

Ceballos - nothing concrete yet, although Betis is interested, but expecting gift re transfer price.

Vallejo - club pushing towards Espanyol and he thinks he should stay. New coach at Espanyol previously had him at Granada and would like him.

Mariano - Fenerbahce is interested offering him 4M salary (same as he had at Mad) plus bonuses, but he is asking 5! No talks with mad yet.

Kubo - looks to be heading to la Real on new loan deal

Reiner - looks to be heading to Sporting on new loan deal.

Brahim - staying at Milan for another year.

Mayoral - on hold pending sales.

Odriozola - returning and reportedly to be Dani’s backup.

Bale - gone full Hollywood!

Isco - nothing yet.

Marcelo - wants to stay in Madrid or close buy as oldest son is in academy. Talking with both Getafe and Vallalodid.
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Post by futbol_bill Sat Jul 02, 2022 7:50 pm

As I follow the so called “exits” being so frustrating slow,  I’ve come to some conclusions. It’s seems noone is willing nor able to pay the price RMaD is asking. Same thing seems to be happening with Bayern.

It looks like la liga teams, do not have the funds for transfers nor salary. Take the case of Ceballos. Both Betis and Ceballos would like it to happen, but Betis has only 8M available for transfer, far below what Real want and in addition, Ceballos would have to lower his salary to fit within their salary structure. Interesting one alternative for Betis is Isco (rumors are both Betis and Sevilla are after him). In Isco’s case there is no transfer  price, but he also would need to lower his salary!

So the alternative for Ceballos is Milan, and like all Italian teams, they are always interested in some loan deal rather than outright sale.

I’ve come to the conclusion that the only buyers in this marketplace are The two (maybe it’s 3 now) oil state teams, ManU, Pool, Chelsea, Arsenal plus occasionally one of the lower EPL teams. Then there is Bayern and RMad who carefully compete by going after as much as possible low transfer costs or evolving youth. And finally there is Barca desperately selling off future income to try to stay competitive.

Astounding when you think of the gap there now is between the haves and have nots!
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Post by The Madrid One Mon Jul 04, 2022 9:47 pm

What I don't understand is why the club isn't more assertive and insightful with situations going on at RB, RW, and ST for example. We've been running thin in those positions for yeaaaars. I was watching some videos by Tifo Football and Squawka the other day about potential transfers to Man United and whatnot and they start listing all these relatively unknown players from the top 5 leagues with stats (not the end all be all but still informative metrics) and technical descriptions and it makes it seem like there is a world of potential out there while we have been passively surviving with the likes of Asensio, Mariano, Jovic, Lucas, and Odriozola as our options ffs.

In the case of Asensio or Odriozola for example, aside from anything having to do with Spanish quotas, I don't understand what is the reluctance to straight out directly boot them out. Mariano doesn't convince his managers yet it seems like he's the one holding the club by the balls and with all the leverage... I'd mention Lucas but I imagine his case is tied up with the quota thing.

It is negligence to go out there next season acting as if the belief is that Benzema won't get injured and won't dip in form and that Rodrygo will for sure come through as a right winger, which isn't even his ideal position or a position where he's been all that good in outside of specific goal scoring scenarios inside the box. Hate to break it to those under a different understanding but Rodrygo still has a world to prove and he actually comes off as a bit diminutive and lacking to me in several ways and I doubt the future really runs through him owning that flank.

We could be doing more. Young phenom prospects, prime world beaters, and seasoned end of contract specials like Alaba and Rudiger aren't all that's out there, there have to be resourceful, worthy, more than functional players who can actually offer interesting variables without having to break the bank.
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Post by futbol_bill Mon Jul 04, 2022 11:04 pm

Well MTO, I think I can answer most of your questions!

First off, although club is financially well off, it is the result of prudent financial management. Quite frankly the club can’t openly compete with several EPL teams and oil state teams. That’s why Flo has been looking at both youngsters and low transfer fees sales.

Secondly you are basically suggesting WC players only on squad. That’s not possible both financially nor practically. Coaches basically play mostly starters and WC players don’t come to be backups!

Thirdly, club hasn’t had a lot of transfer funds, for past 5 years, available until this year.

The plan re Benzema as I understand it, is after Asensio is gone, purchase a RW that can also play as a CF. The target is Gnabry. Plus it looks like Mayoral will be back as a third CF. Plus there are signs that Hazard may finally prove his value and if so they would have the option of playing him as a false 9.

Jovic was a poor purchase and Mariano also. Issue with Mariano was giving him a 4M, 4 year contract. Absolutely astonishing! That plus his total lack of ambition!

Asensio is going, but the guy does have talent. I believe his issues are inconsistency, poor mindset and his proper position being an AM not used at RMad. But he has looked very good with NT. He also took a long time to recovery from injury. Bottom line, he also was a poor choice for this club.

Lucas is a squad player, able to contribute in multiple positions and has had the confidence of both of the last two coaches. You need squad players such as He and Nacho in your squad numbers.

Rodrygo is still a prospect. Keep in mind he is a year younger than Vinicius and only a year ago, we were all saying the same things about Vinicius that are now being said about Rodrygo. If they get Gnabry, then he will get occasional opportunities to continue his development. Don’t forget, there also may be competition with Hazard for the third forward position.  remember that the original plan was for Mbappe!
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Post by titosantill Wed Jul 06, 2022 5:22 am

futbol_bill wrote:As I follow the so called “exits” being so frustrating slow,  I’ve come to some conclusions. It’s seems noone is willing nor able to pay the price RMaD is asking. Same thing seems to be happening with Bayern.

It looks like la liga teams, do not have the funds for transfers nor salary.



lol when have these hungry looking la liga sides (barca excluded, even though they dont even bother to bid) been able to buy anyone from madrid? i cant think of anyone we ever sold to a la liga side that brought in a nice influx of cash. same goes for barca, i dont think they've sold anyone to a la liga side that warmed their pockets. thats why most clubs in spain get into loan agreements with real and barca. they pretty much paid atletico money for them to have him.

madrid and barca keep this league afloat, it would be interesting to see the number of players who are on loan or part owned by madrid/barca in other clubs in the league. and even with more funding from the league, these hungry ass clubs will still be run like an ice cream shop rather than a ball club
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Post by titosantill Wed Jul 06, 2022 5:33 am

atleti make some signings here and there but definitely not from us, and its not just the rivalry, it also has to do with salaries. i cant remember who floyd mayweather was talking about, but i remember him saying (i'm paraphrasing), that when other celebrities want his ex-girlfriends, those ex-girlfriends are used to a certain lifestyle that even those other stars can't match. and its similar to madrid players and other la liga sides....has been like that for the longest, nothing new
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Post by futbol_bill Wed Jul 06, 2022 6:49 pm

Tito, why did you just comment on la liga part of my post? I was trying to make the point that there are only a handful; Oil state clubs, ManU, Chelsea, Arsenal and Pool, of clubs that are buyers in this marketplace. Then you have RMad, Bayern and maybe Juve trying to selectively compete. Plus there is Barca selling off part of their future earnings to try to stay relative. That’s only 10 to 12 clubs! There may not be a super league, but there sure are just a handful of Super Teams!
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Post by futbol_bill Sat Jul 09, 2022 6:38 pm

I think a lot of players are just now finding out that the marketplace has changed big time! After several years of constantly increasing transfer prices and salaries, it is going in the opposite direction. There still are some high valued sales, but it is only amongst 10 clubs and generally speaking a relatively low number of players. So even when a player can find a club interested in them, there are still issues with transfer price and salary. Take the cases of Jovic, Mariano, Ceballos, Asensio and Dembele!

Much of this has to do with the financial impact of the pandemic, but also the FFP that is in effect in Spain ( not just transfer prices, but full salary load vs operating income as well). I don’t know the rules in Italy, Germany or other countries, but it seems as if most countries are at least concerned about both transfer prices and salary load. The only exceptions seem to be PSG and EPL teams and maybe Barca. Barca are dealing with a huge (much worse than was previously known) financial mess and are basically relying on selling off future income to try to stay competitive. EPL teams with their television deal are likely still within reasonable limits although I would question both City and Chelsea at this point.

I wonder where all this will lead to in future. I think it is obvious that in the near term, those 10 clubs will stand out in front of everyone, while rest will be a tier two. And salary structures will be the same (2 completely different tiers), which means sales from top tier to second tier, means drop in salary for players.

It really sounds like all the concerns about “Super League” are actually happening!
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Post by futbol_bill Tue Jul 12, 2022 9:57 pm

Looking like both Asensio and Ceballos are going to stay after realizing their aren’t greener pastures out there!

If true that basically completes squad. Only real issues are

1. Will Vallejo go to Espanyol
2. What to do about Mariano.
3. Who will be the backup to Benz: Mariano, Mayoral or Latasa
4. And settling the loan deals for Kubo and Reiner, looks like La Real and Vallalodid.

So bottom line, we have a weakness at Right Wing, hoping for Rodrygo breakthru. - the alternative will be to play a 4-4-2 formation more often.

And we will see more false 9, especially when we need a Benz replacement.

I think it is largely same as last year except much better backups and alternative to a set 11.

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Post by futbol_bill Wed Jul 13, 2022 6:55 pm

No news about sales, but it sure sounds like Asensio and Ceballos are staying.

The sales are listed as
1. Vallejo - I believe the option of Espanyol is still available for him.
2. Odriozola - look like his defensive play is still an issue and Carlo is super impressed with Vinicius Tobias. There is talk that he will start season at Castilla, but be added to first team as soon as Vinicius Spanish passport comes thru. In the interim, sounds like Lucas is backup to Dani Carvajal.
3. Either Mariano or Mayoral. There is interest in Mayoral, but club has put a 10M price tag on him. Mariano playing his annual “I have contract” game. He did have a solid offer from Turkey at same salary and yet he insisted on a bump in salary of another million! I think only a contract buyout will work, but if it was me I would do it. There also is Latasa, at Castilla available if both were to be dealt.

That leaves the loans of Kubo and Reiner to be completed and squad size would be 22, leaving room for 1 or 2 additions from Castilla.

I haven’t heard any more about Isco and Marcelo! Last I heard Isco was going to negotiate with both Sevilla and Betis after some vacation? And
with Marcelo he wanted to stay near Madrid and was considering Getafe and Valladolid? Has anyone heard anything?
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Post by halamadrid2 Wed Jul 13, 2022 9:34 pm

Isco is close to joining Sevilla

Seen some rumours that Carlo is open to the idea of selling Hazard. Hopefully we can find him a club

It's between Mayoral and Mariano for the back up role and we are trying to get rid of one of them. Both are expendable, Mayoral seems to be the only one willing to try himself elsewhere. Mariano is just an overpaid mascot right now.

I have seen other clubs leave out players they want sold from their preseason squads. I don't know why we never do that. Unwanted players are comfortable sitting around eating into our wage budget.

Asensio is another one refusing to leave despite having the writing on the wall that he is surplus to requirements. He doesn't care about the WC squad it looks like. Carlo is top nice. He needs to tell these lazy mf that they won't be playing next season so they can start looking for greener pastures elsewhere
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Post by halamadrid2 Thu Jul 14, 2022 1:13 pm





Seems to be a common theme amongst our benchwarmers
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Post by Mr Nick09 Thu Jul 14, 2022 5:03 pm

From Asensio’s point of view it’s better to leave on a free transfer because it doesn’t look like there are clubs ready to invest 30 millions to sign him.
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Post by Mr Nick09 Thu Jul 14, 2022 5:07 pm

According to Revelo, Carlo wants odriozola out. He is 4th option after Carvajal, Vasquez and Nacho
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