Re: Paul Pogba - The resurgence

by Thimmy Sat Jun 22, 2019 10:29 pm

You don't need my opinion to see that he was Man United's best performing player, purely based on statistics. He's not injury prone, and he's the main orchestrator and penalty taker on the team. I can't explain what motivates Pogba to try and perform well, other than him being in a good mood. Sports mentioned him being dependent on a leader character to some extent, and that honestly makes sense to me, based on how I've seen him perform when no one and no thing has been there to motivate him. Sports also drew comparisons to Messi and Ronaldo. Well, those two are not only exceptional talents, but they know how to motivate themselves to convert their talent into results on a very consistent basis. They're not exempt from criticism when they don't put in the effort, but at least they do put in the effort often enough to make it difficult to argue against how indispensible they truly are. I don't think it's been mentioned often enough how much of an expert in self-motivation C. Ronaldo is. He might be a narcissist, for all I know, but it definitely works for him. CR7 and M10's qualities are more than just their goals and assists, but more importantly, their ability to decide matches based on talent and effort = sustained performance level. Yes, some degree of effort is necessary, even if you have more talent than you know what to do with.

Pogba can walk around and throw his arms in the air for 80 minutes, bag two assists from attacking build ups that he only put the finishing touches on, and Sports would argue that he was man of the match, although he didn't actually watch the match. There's a certain Barca fan who likes to use such statistics to back up every and all of his claims, and I thought it was common knowledge by now that statistics don't tell you the whole story. As much as people like to think that Man United are pure shit across the board, Pogba has benefited massively from the effort of others on the team. He can be a difference maker, that's his greatest strength, but I'm underwhelmed by how often he makes a difference - stat king or not, world cup winner or not, Juventus prodigy or not, french or not, Sport's sponsor or not.

It's not like I have an agenda against him. I would be absolutely ecstatic if he had a work rate and professional attitude that I could approve of. He's a rare breed of both physical and technical talent, but his frustrating lack of consistency and skewed talent to performance ratio at club level leaves a sour taste in my mouth. I don't think he's a reliable performer. I would, of course take his low effort assists and penalty goals over no assists and no goals, but I largely interpret that as an indication of his individual statistics being flattered by the performance of the team.

by Hapless_Hans Sun Jun 23, 2019 2:59 am

Pogba is a world class player who made a terrible decision going back to Man United, so his decision making can be classed as dubious.
But there's no doubt he'd add considerable quality, star power, and entertainment value to Real's team, as he's awesomely skilled.

by futbol_bill Sun Jun 23, 2019 3:16 am

Mr Nick09 wrote:
futbol_bill wrote:

Nick saying Flo will buy Pogba, Neymar plus a RW regardless of costs! Then he calls us numpties for reading a contrary opinion.
you are a Numpty to @me with fake statements, never said anything remotely close.

Now shut the fck up and never @me again with lies

Mr Nick09 wrote:
Firenze wrote:for 150M you can have your very own Coutinho esque signing

I just don't see you spending that
125 mil + 25 in bonuses is very doable. We will do it because Zidane wants it, and Perez promised things to Zidane

Mr Nick09 wrote:Perez will pay the 222 mil if given the chance

I suppose these posts were made by some ghost Nick! There are plenty more!!

by Mr Nick09 Sun Jun 23, 2019 4:40 am

if you dont understand the conditional maybe it's a factor of your age. like i said, dpnt @me again

by futbol_bill Sun Jun 23, 2019 4:56 am

Conditional my ass, as I said there are numerous posts out there from the assumingely ghost Nick, saying Flo will spend whatever it takes to sign both Pogba and Neymar. Maybe you didn’t say same about getting a RW, but you did say we would get one.

And by the way your exact words were “never said anything remotely close”. Stop playing semantics.

by Mr Nick09 Sun Jun 23, 2019 4:59 am

so you were lying about the RW thing? i see, cant trust liars, dont @me

by futbol_bill Sun Jun 23, 2019 5:03 am

The point was you constantly are insisting you know Flo so well that he will get the players you think fit at the club. Are you still trying to lie saying you didn’t say these things about Neymar and Pogba?

For such a bullshit artist, it’s rich that you think you are calling me out!

by Mr Nick09 Fri Jul 05, 2019 10:26 am

Exclusive: Mino Raiola says that Paul Pogba is determined to leave MUFC this summer.
"Everyone within the club from the manager to the owner knows Paul’s wishes.
“Everyone knows the willingness of Paul to move on. We are in the process of that"
Story here:
https://t.co/QHVN1oe61O

Allow it, Pogba to Madrid

by The Demon of Carthage Fri Jul 05, 2019 11:20 am

The EPL transfer window closes in exactly a month from now. Come on Ed, you can do it. Do not succumb to the demands of that mercenary and his greedy agent.

One month. Just. One. Month.

by Firenze Fri Jul 05, 2019 11:24 am

will have to happen in the next week or so because we won't sell without a top replacement

don't think it's going to happen unfortunately

last thing we need is an unmotivated Pogba who doesn't want to be there, feeling slighted we didn't let him leave, playing week in week out

man's gonna have a 6.5 on WhoScored next season in the PL

by halamadrid2 Fri Jul 05, 2019 12:41 pm

Deadline day swap between Bale and Pogba will happen

Bale is not wanted, Pogba wants to leave. Utd want Bale and ZZ wants Pogba. Most logical scenario

by futbol_bill Fri Jul 05, 2019 12:54 pm

halamadrid2 wrote:Deadline day swap between Bale and Pogba will happen

Bale is not wanted, Pogba wants to leave. Utd want Bale and ZZ wants Pogba. Most logical scenario

Lol, Hala, as if price tag doesn’t matter. Pogba 150M, probably worth 100 to 120. Bale 80M, probably worth 10.

Quite simply Bale is planning on being highest paid golfer in world next season!

by sportsczy Fri Jul 05, 2019 1:00 pm

Pogba is worth 150... that's not the problem. We're just trying to not pay the 150 in cash but include players. The story is 90 mil + Isco or Bale. I think Man U wants Bale... but wants us to eat a lot of his wage. That's the negotiation. We may end up sending Isco and bale + 90 mil.

The other variable is Isco and/or Bale accepting the transfer. They can say no.

by The Demon of Carthage Fri Jul 05, 2019 1:10 pm

Didn't know you had inside info on what's happening at the negotiation table, sports.

The only thing we know for certain at this point is that Pogba wants to go to Madrid, Madrid wants him and that United doesn't want to sell. All the other details you have mentioned are just your own interpretation which may or may not be true.

Also, Bale + Isco + 90m for Pogba? Good god, man! Do you want Madrid to be the laughing stock of Europe?

by The Demon of Carthage Fri Jul 05, 2019 1:12 pm

The fairest deal, if Pogba MUST come to Madrid is a straight swap with Bale. One numpty for another numpty. And I wouldn't add a penny or any other player in the deal (not even freaking Vasquez).

Somebody, preferably Firenze, should ride to Old Trafford and smack some sense into that delusional mercenary.

by Valkyrja Fri Jul 05, 2019 1:52 pm

Any deal involving Bale is good business

by sportsczy Fri Jul 05, 2019 3:33 pm

I don't have any sources other than the media in France (the real guys like the couple in marca that we all know for Real Madrid) saying that Man U have requested £150 million and Madrid have offer 80-100 mil euros and players... that's been out there FOR MONTHS. Not sure what the shock is about.

Man U is trying to max out the transfer and, until they actually need the money, they're in no hurry. Madrid and Pogba are the ones who want it done.

Do you not remember Modric and Bale playing hardball with Spurs until the last second and then coming to Madrid very late?

It's just negotiating. Pogba is just putting more pressure on Man U because they saw what happened to De Gea. Not going to happen with Pogba. He (through Raiola) will burn the house down first.

by Firenze Fri Jul 05, 2019 3:51 pm

Broken Bale isn't someone we're gonna want to chase or value that highly

I'd 100% do 90m + Isco + Bale or even 80m

by sportsczy Fri Jul 05, 2019 4:22 pm

I actually don't think it's a bad deal for Man U either... they're not 1-2 players away from being a contender. More like 5 or 6. Getting a couple of really good players and cash does more for Man U than keeping Pogba.

That's just me though. Woodward is a mystery in terms of what he's thinking lol.

by Glory Sat Jul 06, 2019 2:47 am

In what universe is getting two overpaid rejects not a bad deal for United? Isco is a good player no denying that, but will he be willing to turn out for an EL team week in and week out. No fking chance if I am being honest. He will have no interest coming here, will pocket obscene amount of money and turn out to be yet another underwhelming signing in our long list of underwhelming signings. Less talked about Bale, the better. If these fks go and get Bale after all the trouble we are currently having with wages, player power and everything, then that will be it, the final nail on a once great club. Official demise. The sad indication that we are no longer a football club.

I don’t know the confusion here. Sell for 150 mil. If Real don’t have 150, sell for 120 mil, if Real don’t have 120, then loan him out for a season with an obligation to buy or bloody pay in instalments. Just get it done. Don’t want to go near any player of Real Madrid honestly, especially right now, when we are an EL team. None of them will be interested to come to united right now.

Its fking embarrassing how this club is operating. Practically begging this cnut to stay after him repeatedly stating that he will be somewhere else rather. I don’t know the logic here. If we are in a position of say a Spurs, on the verge of challenging for major honours, then squeezing out 1 more year from a player like pogba will make sense. But now, this is a perfect opportunity, to sell all these mercenaries and players who don’t want to be here and start afresh. There’s no real expectation and pressure on Ole. No one is expecting a title challenge from this team. We have got time. Instead what they are doing is they are desperately trying to keep an uninterested player who holds such a big influence in the dressing room. It can only go one way from here, really.

by NeganIsco Sat Jul 06, 2019 3:36 am

Pogba can't possibly ruin his career in that shitthole.

United will not win the league or UCL in the next two decades.

by urbaNRoots Sat Jul 06, 2019 4:15 am

Man Utd would be idiots to accept any offer including Bale but they may not have a choice if Pogba throws a fit.

by Glory Sat Jul 06, 2019 4:36 am

Kaveh Solhekol: “Paul Pogba thinks he can do better than Manchester United. He doesn’t want to hang about playing in a club who are finishing fifth or sixth in the Premier League, he doesn’t want to play in the Europa League, he wants to play in the Champions League.” #mufc [Sky]
— United Xtra (@utdxtra) July 6, 2019

Kaveh: “Behind the scenes are United are saying this is the time to get rid of him. United are looking for £150m. Madrid have problems with FFP because they’ve spent so much money already but I think if they want him they’ll find a way of structuring a deal.” #mufc [Sky] pic.twitter.com/wI5a3ILUxY
— United Xtra (@utdxtra) July 6, 2019

by The Demon of Carthage Sat Jul 06, 2019 5:10 am

Glory wrote:In what universe is getting two overpaid rejects not a bad deal for United? Isco is a good player no denying that, but will he be willing to turn out for an EL team week in and week out. No fking chance if I am being honest. He will have no interest coming here, will pocket obscene amount of money and turn out to be yet another underwhelming signing in our long list of underwhelming signings. Less talked about Bale, the better. If these fks go and get Bale after all the trouble we are currently having with wages, player power and everything, then that will be it, the final nail on a once great club. Official demise. The sad indication that we are no longer a football club.

I don’t know the confusion here. Sell for 150 mil. If Real don’t have 150, sell for 120 mil, if Real don’t have 120, then loan him out for a season with an obligation to buy or bloody pay in instalments. Just get it done. Don’t want to go near any player of Real Madrid honestly, especially right now, when we are an EL team. None of them will be interested to come to united right now.

Its fking embarrassing how this club is operating. Practically begging this cnut to stay after him repeatedly stating that he will be somewhere else rather. I don’t know the logic here. If we are in a position of say a Spurs, on the verge of challenging for major honours, then squeezing out 1 more year from a player like pogba will make sense. But now, this is a perfect opportunity, to sell all these mercenaries and players who don’t want to be here and start afresh. There’s no real expectation and pressure on Ole. No one is expecting a title challenge from this team. We have got time. Instead what they are doing is they are desperately trying to keep an uninterested player who holds such a big influence in the dressing room. It can only go one way from here, really.

If the deal goes through with you pocketing 90m on top of getting Isco and Bale and Pogba moving to the other direction, it isn't you who should be seething, it's us.

Isco is elite and has proven that time and time again at Europe's biggest stage. Bale is not as valuable as he used to, but he still has some value. After all, two-time EPL player of the year is not something you can easily overlook.

What has Pogba done to warrant such a crazy deal where two 4-time CL winners have to be used as makeweight in addition to 90m euros to get him?

Am I being crazy here? Hasn't Madrid watched him play, like, AT ALL this season? He's the only player whose value keeps rising up even though his performances have gone down the tubes ever since he took off that Juve shirt.

You'd be lucky to have Isco and a winger like Bale in today's market while also getting extra cash to spend it somewhere else. We, on the other hand, we'd be borderline insane to spend that much and lose a couple players in the process to bring that delusional, overrated prima donna and watch him play like crap 90% of the season. Not to mention getting sanctioned with FFP in the process.

Even if we were to turn a blind eye to his dreadful performances on the field, how could anyone be interested in hiring this mercenary after we've all seen the way him and his toxic agent have been treating United?! Is this how you treat a club that went through hell and back to sign you, paid you a fortune, and trusted you to be the focal point of the team to lead them back to glory? The minute the ship start sinking (which by the way he was a major contributor to it sinking), you pack up your crap and leave?

I have no sympathy or even a shred of respect for selfish unprofessional like him. Not only shouldn't Madrid even entertain the thought of signing him, United should relegate him to the lowest division possible.

This sorry excuse for a football doesn't deserve to wear the red shirt of Manchester. Keep him away from Madrid please.

by Mr Nick09 Sat Jul 06, 2019 5:12 am

FFP, more clueless journalists, we just sold players for about 50% of what we paid in transfer fees, but nope, FFP will get us Laughing

Not to mention that we signed players are part of the 2018-2019 budget, and now it's the 2019-2020 budget since july 1, and FFP gives you about 2 years to balance your books. playing checks, not checkers

by Mr Nick09 Sat Jul 06, 2019 5:19 am

@Glory i understand your concern, another way to look at things is that signing elite players now can also push the group to see past the europa league. The EL is not the target here, top 4 finish in the EPL is and having Bale included in the deal can help you make a leap forward.

But as you say, if both teams are committed to make the deal they will find ways

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