Re: #ThankYouDanielBryan - The Official WWE Thread - Part 23

by Jay29 Wed Dec 09, 2015 12:12 am

A lot of those guys were actually allowed to express themselves and benefited from better booking than the shit they're serving up now, and the brand split which helped build actual stars with sustainable presence. I mean, could you imagine that Jericho/HBK feud happening now? Or Edge not getting the Rollins treatment? Would Eddie or Mysterio even be given the world title in this era?

I don't think the current roster is even that bad, but their talent is just being wasted by a creative team that doesn't know how to build compelling characters and storylines, and a company that's determined to overexpose its favourites (Cena, Reigns) and underexpose the people fans actually want to see (Ambrose). They messed up the talent transition big time by pandering to the same guys over and over and not taking the time to develop new talent, and now they're paying for it big time.

As far as I'm concerned, WWE is dead.

by Onyx Wed Dec 09, 2015 1:35 am

Dat TNA.

#ThankYouDanielBryan - The Official WWE Thread - Part 23 - Page 15 12348145_931196953615458_5597785093928170915_n

by Onyx Wed Dec 09, 2015 1:49 am

Wouldn't say WWE is dead. I mean they still have established guys they can bring back. Cena, Bryan, Taker, Lesnar, Sting. Guys like Hardy, Jericho, RVD, Batista and the Rock as well. Could create a decent main event program out of that.

Plus they have the Cena heel turn ace up their sleeve if things get really really bad.

They can put on a decent show, but unfortunately they just cba currently.

by M99 Wed Dec 09, 2015 2:45 am

The roster is very talented. But they are fixated to push one guy as the face whether we like him or not. That means they will do shit with the people that fans want to see because they fear their chosen one getting overshadowed. This is why people are just stopping to watch.

by M99 Wed Dec 09, 2015 5:25 am

Oh well at lease we have this

#ThankYouDanielBryan - The Official WWE Thread - Part 23 - Page 15 0121T5y

by Onyx Wed Dec 09, 2015 2:10 pm

As noted, Monday's WWE RAW, with the final hype for TLC, drew 3.054 million viewers, down from last week's 3.17 million viewers. The final rating for the show was a 2.15 rating, down from last week's 2.21. This is a new record-low rating since the show moved permanently to three hours. The previous low was the November 23rd episode, which garnered a 2.16 rating. It is also the lowest rated episode since September of 1997.

by Onyx Wed Dec 09, 2015 2:17 pm

Still remember this, goat return.

by Casciavit Wed Dec 09, 2015 6:17 pm

Gonna buy into the hype and watch Lucha Underground hmm

by Onyx Wed Dec 09, 2015 11:34 pm

Another goat Russo vid. #HireRussopls

by Onyx Thu Dec 10, 2015 9:15 pm

HHH on RAW being 3 hours:

Triple H was asked about giving NXT the first hour of Raw in order to make the booking of the three hour broadcast easier. He said he’s heard the suggestion, but if they just add another hour of live content that it all becomes the same. There might be a way to do it differently but he doesn’t know, but what eh does know is that doing three hour of live TV every week is too much at times. He has issues watching a two-hour movie. He also notes that they need to become more creative and more focused on the shows. They’ve had some unfortunate injuries and it’s on them to build a better format for the shows. They’ve heard the frustrations of people and they feel the same way.

by Jay29 Thu Dec 10, 2015 11:01 pm

Three hours was a decent idea to begin with since it meant more TV time for some guys who needed it/deserved it, but all it's proven is that it's very difficult to keep everyone's attention for that amount of time, and to actually fill up the time effectively without resorting to rubbish. And when your show is absolutely rubbish as it is right now, the three hour format makes it even less appealing.

by M99 Thu Dec 10, 2015 11:03 pm

They get more money from sponsors/advertisements in three hours. Viewers have gone down but they are making more money than they did when everyone was watching two hours.

WWE is not in any trouble at all despite viewers leaving day after day. They are getting huge sponsors. Toys R Us is sponsoring TLC and freakin Coca Cola is sponsoring the Slammys. It's going out of business despite what MT says. Sadly that means the product will continue to be shit.

by silver Fri Dec 11, 2015 7:12 am

Disagree, 3 hours was a terrible idea to begin with. No one has the attention span or time to watch 3 hours of Raw every week.

More TV time for some guys just meant more rematches, and variations of the same match every week.

They should have just kept Raw and Smackdown separate rosters. Gave TV time to everyone without over-exposing them, and freshens up the rosters every couple of years with the brand draft. I still remember John Cena appearing on Raw for the first time on the Highlight Reel, or Kurt Angle on Raw for the first time in 3 years face to face with HHH. It was epic.

by Onyx Fri Dec 11, 2015 5:19 pm

Business wise 3 hours makes sense with all the sponsors and stuff, but quality wise it sucks.

Who cares if x superstar isn't being given a chance with a 2 hour show? The fans simply deserve the best product. It's not for them to worry about. What they should do is look at segment by segment viewership with the 2 hour show. If the fans tune out of a certain segment on a consistent basis, then either repackage the superstar or replace them with somebody who isn't on TV. It's not the fans problem if a certain superstar isn't getting over.

by Pedram Fri Dec 11, 2015 10:11 pm

silver wrote:
They should have just kept Raw and Smackdown separate rosters. Gave TV time to everyone without over-exposing them, and freshens up the rosters every couple of years with the brand draft. I still remember John Cena appearing on Raw for the first time on the Highlight Reel, or Kurt Angle on Raw for the first time in 3 years face to face with HHH. It was epic.

Yeah there was a time when Smackdown was consistently producing better shows than RAW (2003-2007), at some point Smackdown had Brock, Undertaker, Angle, Eddie, Benoit, Orton, Batista, JBL, Mysterio.

I liked brand split, there was a real sense that SD and RAW were actually competing against each other as independent brands and it made the Survivor Series even more special.

by Onyx Fri Dec 11, 2015 10:24 pm

Only thing is back then the roster was stacked with star power after the whole WWE/WCW thing, so they could easily split them onto 2 shows. However by 2010 a lot of them started to retire, became part timers or they left, which meant it was best to just have one roster.

Nowadays they barely have enough star power for one show, let alone 2. Cena/Orton/Bryan are the only 3 full time main eventers they have and they're all out currently.

by M99 Fri Dec 11, 2015 10:35 pm

They don't have stars because they are refusing to build any except for one. Bray Wyatt could have been a star if he did not lose 1000 matches and look like a bitch every single time. Dean Ambrose could have been a star if they took advantage of his momentum and booked him like an actual star instead of making him Reigns's sidekick. Owens could have been a huge star already if he won his feud with Cena. Everyone is given shit booking just because they don't get too popular and overshadow their chosen one, it's *bleep* ridiculous.

by Onyx Fri Dec 11, 2015 11:21 pm

Imo this year we should've gotten:

A Wyatt takeover story which would've culminated with Bray winning the title.

An Ambrose title run. Rollins' reign lasted 6 months too long. Around June when they were feuding, Ambrose should have won the title.

Reigns should have turned heel and been repackaged with a new character.

Sandow should have been IC champion at least after splitting with the Miz. The guy was one of the most over guys on the show. Soon after he would've won the MITB instead of Sheamus.

Owens after beating Cena should have been built up to face Lesnar at a PPV this year.

by Onyx Sat Dec 12, 2015 12:23 am

Jimmy Wang Yang thought the match started when the bell rung. @00:03

by zizzle Sat Dec 12, 2015 12:57 am

Let's not overrate the current roster, 99% of these guys cant cut a decent promo to begin with. These guys worked the indies where they have spot matches in front of 20 people, moved to NXT where they have the same type of match in front of 200 fans, and suddenly we expect them to be stars just so they are on Raw? The stars of the AA era worked for years in the territories and performed in packed arenas for years and years until they figured out what worked and what didnt work. The stars of the Ruthless Aggression era worked along side with these legends for years and were given the time to slowly develop without the enormous pressure of being THE stars. The "stars" of today are amateurs who are still learning the business, Just look at Roman Reigns, in the last year his matches became 10 times better, his promos became 100 times better, and he's just starting to find himself, but because the WWE was so desperate to have their next top star they pushed him to the moon when he clearly wasn't ready. The WWE *bleep* up with Punk and now he's gone forever, stumbled into Bryan but he got injured, and now we're left with a roster of wanna bes. No Owens is not a star,, and neither is Ziggler or Cesaro. I love and respect these guys for what they do in the ring, but they cant really sell shows..

by M99 Sat Dec 12, 2015 1:21 am

Agreed on Ziggler and Cesaro, but not on Owens. He has everything to be the top heel. Rollins, Ambrose and Wyatt are all stars too.

by Onyx Sat Dec 12, 2015 1:37 am

Other than Punk and Bryan, 2 exceptional cases, no indy star is good enough to carry the WWE.

They all lack charisma, mic skills and character. When they're on the indys, the focus is on wrestling ability. How many holds can you do, how many flips do you know. What people don't realise is the casual fans don't give a crap about that. It's fake. If you look at the attitude era, how did the WWE build up their audience?

It certainly wasn't through workrate internet smarks. It was through TV audiences who want characters and soap opera esque storylines. The casual audience. They watched because of the stories and characters. The nudity, violence, skits, promos etc. The highest rated segment in WWE history was a party celebration with Mick Foley and the Rock. The attitude era was full of 5 min matches with interferences and stuff happening outside the ring. Why? Because that keeps viewers interested. Not some 20 min workrate match with 7 commercials.

NXT certainly isn't the future either. It's a product geared towards smarks full of indy darlings such as Sami Zayn, Balor, Apollo Crews, Itami etc who can't cut great promos, lack charisma and don't have a character. The first step they need to take is make NXT its own brand and create a new developmental. Start focusing on promos, characters, acting ability and being larger than life.

by zizzle Sat Dec 12, 2015 3:25 am

M99 wrote:Agreed on Ziggler and Cesaro, but not on Owens. He has everything to be the top heel. Rollins, Ambrose and Wyatt are all stars too.

I kinda agree with what Austin and Pall Heyman think about Wayett, and its the fact that he talks and talks but he never really says anything. In an interview Heyman talks about one of his promos when he first started where he went to the ring and entertained, and when he went backstage feeling good about himself Dusty said "where's the money, how will your promo sell tickets" or something like that. That's where Wayett is right now, and the fact that he keeps jobbing makes him sound like a fool who talks big but never delivers.

I partially agree about Rollins, he will be something one day, but he isnt there yet, and so is Ambrose (bad booking doesnt help either). I dont buy into the owens hype just yet. He can talk but he's not top level, he can wrestle but basically everyone can these days. His heel antics are not innovative in any way. I can see him becoming the lone wolf self serving type of heel, but then again he looks like the kid of guy you wanna play video games and drink mountain dew with so you cant really hate him.

by RealGunner Sat Dec 12, 2015 9:36 am

Yohan Modric wrote:Other than Punk and Bryan, 2 exceptional cases, no indy star is good enough to carry the WWE.

They all lack charisma, mic skills and character. When they're on the indys, the focus is on wrestling ability. How many holds can you do, how many flips do you know. What people don't realise is the casual fans don't give a crap about that. It's fake. If you look at the attitude era, how did the WWE build up their audience?

It certainly wasn't through workrate internet smarks. It was through TV audiences who want characters and soap opera esque storylines. The casual audience. They watched because of the stories and characters. The nudity, violence, skits, promos etc. The highest rated segment in WWE history was a party celebration with Mick Foley and the Rock. The attitude era was full of 5 min matches with interferences and stuff happening outside the ring. Why? Because that keeps viewers interested. Not some 20 min workrate match with 7 commercials.

NXT certainly isn't the future either. It's a product geared towards smarks full of indy darlings such as Sami Zayn, Balor, Apollo Crews, Itami etc who can't cut great promos, lack charisma and don't have a character. The first step they need to take is make NXT its own brand and create a new developmental. Start focusing on promos, characters, acting ability and being larger than life.

Agreed. But don't think Bryan can carry WWE. Not until he has shown he can cut a decent promo and stop using YES chant for every little thing.

by RealGunner Sat Dec 12, 2015 9:41 am

There really isn't any stars in WWE atm tbh apart from the usual Lesnar, Cena, Bryan n Orton.

Doubt Ambrose will be pushed enough to be a star. Rollins doesn't have it in him. Reigns has the tools but he is already hated by 70%

Bray is done. People are more interested in flashing their phone lights than actually listen to his promos now.

Owens has potential but Vince thinks he is too fat. So he is going to mid card for life.

by Tomwin Lannister Sat Dec 12, 2015 10:38 am

WWE is doomed so long as in 2015 and beyond they think that people will invest in to Weekly 3 hour shows based around one wrestler with everybody else looking like crap in the process.

And until they realise something that's downright pathetic and embarrassing I.E you can't pull off an underdog story if the UNDERDOG is TWICE AS STRONG AND HAS A 5X BETTER WIN/LOSS RATIO than the people up against them.

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