Re: The US Politics Thread

by Casciavit Yesterday at 8:53 pm

Pedram wrote:Reddit is the most botted social media out there. DNC shills actively uses r/politics and other main default subs to push their pro-establishment messages which are absolutely not popular in real life.

100%.

The live threads last night and the surprise they had lmfao. rofl

by BarrileteCosmico Yesterday at 8:57 pm

@Pedram already blaming the centrists when Kamala was perceived as farther left than Trump was to the right. Laughing

As a proud centrist my take is that the Dems lost because they were too far left in relation to the electorate.

I thought Kamala ran a better campaign than expected, but she should have disowned Biden and instead she said "I wouldn't do anything different from him". So here we are

Dems forgot that they ran and old white man in 2020 because you need one to beat Trump. Running a mixed race woman daughter of college professors Californian who was appointed was always going to be a race stacked against you, unfortunately.

At least in 2028 we'll have a clean slate. We'll see how much damage Trump does until then.

by Vibe Yesterday at 8:59 pm

One fact also shocked me about Kamala.

She is 60, I had no idea until today. Would have gave her 50 tops. Fabulous looking woman, prettiest 60 year old I've ever seen tbh.

She's the same age as Walz. Would have though he was 15-20 years older.

by Pedram Yesterday at 9:01 pm

The hosts of MSNBC’s Morning Joe (with Mika Brzezinski dressed in black for the occasion) engage in a ‘real honest conversation’ about why Kamala Harris lost: “A lot of Hispanic voters have problems with black candidates … They don’t like each other.” pic.twitter.com/QQG5UGqL5t
— Drop Site (@DropSiteNews) November 6, 2024

But but... i though Republicans were the party of racism?

These MSNBC morons have been embarrassing themselves non stop today. been watching their post election coverage not because i enjoy it, in fact they make me cringe, but as they say, it's like a slow car crash, you can't look away. rofl

by Vibe Yesterday at 9:03 pm

Blaming the latinos never goes out of fashion tbh

by Pedram Yesterday at 9:14 pm

BarrileteCosmico wrote:@Pedram already blaming the centrists when Kamala was perceived as farther left than Trump was to the right.

As a proud centrist my take is that the Dems lost because they were too far left in relation to the electorate.

I thought Kamala ran a better campaign than expected, but she should have disowned Biden and instead she said "I wouldn't do anything different from him". So here we are

Dems forgot that they ran and old white man in 2020 because you need one to beat Trump. Running a mixed race woman daughter of college professors Californian who was appointed was always going to be a race stacked against you, unfortunately.

At least in 2028 we'll have a clean slate. We'll see how much damage Trump does until then.

Bro the fuck are you on about. Kamala was literally campaigning with Dick fucking Cheney. Laughing

they actively shunned the left. they were courting Nikki Haley type of voters. she ran the most centrist campaign she could to get those mythical moderate Republicans and they still voted for Trump by 95% margins. rofl

This triangulation strategy might have worked in the 90s with Clinton but not in this age were politics is extremely polarized. complete failure but Democrats will never learn their lesson. they would rather lose power than give an inch to the left. they are still paying the price for blunting the Bernie movement in 2016.

by Pedram Yesterday at 9:40 pm

It should come as no great surprise that a Democratic Party which has abandoned working class people would find that the working class has abandoned them.

While the Democratic leadership defends the status quo, the American people are angry and want change.

And they’re right. pic.twitter.com/lM2gSJmQFL
— Bernie Sanders (@BernieSanders) November 6, 2024

Americans didn't deserve this man.

by BarrileteCosmico Yesterday at 9:46 pm

I don't have the source on hand (I think it was Pew Research), but Trump was considered "too far right" for 30ish% of the population while Kamala was "too far left" for 40ish%. The reason she took the never Trump Republicans around with her is that she needed to moderate her image.

by Pedram Yesterday at 9:52 pm

BarrileteCosmico wrote:I don't have the source on hand (I think it was Pew Research), but Trump was considered "too far right" for 30ish% of the population while Kamala was "too far left" for 40ish%. The reason she took the never Trump Republicans around with her is that she needed to moderate her image.

The story that is about to be pushed hard is that Kamala Harris lost because she was too far left. It will be pushed because this is the Democratic establishment’s go-to explanation for all its failures. https://t.co/vDKgRyaml4
— Jacobin (@jacobin) November 6, 2024

No doubt the center will try to push this false narrative that Kamala was "far-left" but i'm not sure many people will buy it this time.

If Democrats are smart they will use this failure to activate the base and create their own version of the Tea Party.

by sportsczy Yesterday at 10:10 pm

I think people are focusing on idealogues as opposed to what actually won/lost the election. Each side has 40% idealogues... you don't need to convince those. They're in the bag. You need to convince the 20% moderates and independents. What do they care about?

Their wallet
Their safety
The future of their kids

Saying "Trump is evil" a million times isn't enough. Say something that appeals to these people's concerns ffs.

Kamala did something unprecedented though, I'll give her that... she managed to piss off the Jews and Muslims at the same time Laughing

That took talent. Likely lost Michigan because the Muslim citizens protested by not voting for her and lost Pennsylvania because 3 percent of the population there is Jewish.

by elitedam Yesterday at 10:51 pm

There is a difference between being perceived as too far left versus actually being too far left. No matter how centrist the Dem candidate is, they will always be branded as a dangerous commie.

So why not run someone with some actual progressive ideas?

I know the US is more conservative than people usually think, but there are some progressive issues that are pretty popular. Stuff like abortion, legalizing the devil's lettuce, affordable health care have had a lot of success as ballot initiatives.

I think running on abortion is smart, but running on just abortion was a terrible idea. It felt like everything else was minimized, an afterthought.

In the end, I think she was just a poor candidate that only got as far as she did because there was no real primary.

by Pedram Yesterday at 11:07 pm

NEWS: Thanks to a provision buried in the tax code, Elon Musk will now be in a position to be eligible for the largest personalized tax gift in the 250-year history of the United States of America. https://t.co/mDKNYazSsh
— David Sirota (@davidsirota) November 6, 2024

This guy is already the biggest winner of the election.

by sportsczy Today at 12:37 am

elitedam wrote:There is a difference between being perceived as too far left versus actually being too far left. No matter how centrist the Dem candidate is, they will always be branded as a dangerous commie.

So why not run someone with some actual progressive ideas?

I know the US is more conservative than people usually think, but there are some progressive issues that are pretty popular. Stuff like abortion, legalizing the devil's lettuce, affordable health care have had a lot of success as ballot initiatives.

I think running on abortion is smart, but running on just abortion was a terrible idea. It felt like everything else was minimized, an afterthought.

In the end, I think she was just a poor candidate that only got as far as she did because there was no real primary.

Because you lose. Harris tried desperately to distance herself from progressive policies such as:
- open border
- extreme regulation on fossil fuels (biggest reason for inflation in the US as oil prices went from $2 to almost $4)
- wokeness for lack of a better term

These were the 3 biggest issues for those who voted for Trump per exit polls: 1) the border 2) the econonomy and 3) free speech/cancel culture.

She couldn't do it and lost.

People were fed up with it.

by BarrileteCosmico Today at 12:41 am

elitedam wrote:There is a difference between being perceived as too far left versus actually being too far left. No matter how centrist the Dem candidate is, they will always be branded as a dangerous commie.

So why not run someone with some actual progressive ideas?

I know the US is more conservative than people usually think, but there are some progressive issues that are pretty popular. Stuff like abortion, legalizing the devil's lettuce, affordable health care have had a lot of success as ballot initiatives.

I think running on abortion is smart, but running on just abortion was a terrible idea. It felt like everything else was minimized, an afterthought.

In the end, I think she was just a poor candidate that only got as far as she did because there was no real primary.

The problem is that a lot of progressive ideas are unpopular. What's progressive these days? Climate policy, trans rights (to the extreme that the government knows better than the parents), Gaza, affirmative action, cancel culture, student loan forgiveness, MMT, etc.

Are there good progressive ideas too? Yes, absolutely, but just look at where the Biden administration spent their political capital. Their signature bill was the IRA and CHIPS act, which was basically a bill that promoted manufacturing in red states (which didn't help it at all) and that promoted green energy investments. Is green energy important? Yes. Is it in an everyday American's top 5 issues? Hardly.

(There was also a provision in the IRA about lowering medicaid costs - that was really good and popular! I wonder why it was barely mentioned since I forgot about it until I just googled it now)

Imagine if Biden had spent his political capital on a federal minimum wage of $15, minimum parental leave of 12 weeks, and minimum 4 weeks of vacation per year. That would have been really impactful to millions of Americans. What Biden actually chose to focus on? Not so much.

I think this is what Bernie got at in the tweet posted above. The Dems have forgotten about the basics. At this rate in 10 years the GOP will be the party of the working class and the rich while the Dems become the party of the middle and upper middle class.

At any rate I think Kamala was given a very hard hand to play. Biden pretty much set her up for failure, and regardless of who was running or on which platform the damage had already been done. Cumulative 20% inflation and 1.9m illegal immigrants granted asylum. Incumbents lost everywhere in the post-Covid world and it makes sense for the US to follow that trend.

by sportsczy Today at 12:45 am

Pedram wrote:
NEWS: Thanks to a provision buried in the tax code, Elon Musk will now be in a position to be eligible for the largest personalized tax gift in the 250-year history of the United States of America. https://t.co/mDKNYazSsh
— David Sirota (@davidsirota) November 6, 2024

This guy is already the biggest winner of the election.

He took a huge risk. It was 50/50 going in. The safe bet would have been to keep quiet and let whoever wins, wins. He's already the richest man in the world. But for those who don't know, this is why Musk backed Trump so hard:

Before the age of 18, Musk's son was allowed to transition to becoming a woman without consent from his parents. It happened in 2022. That triggered Musk. You can google it and read about it.

So there is a very personal reason why he's become conservative... and a good one.

by BarrileteCosmico Today at 12:46 am

Pedram wrote:
NEWS: Thanks to a provision buried in the tax code, Elon Musk will now be in a position to be eligible for the largest personalized tax gift in the 250-year history of the United States of America. https://t.co/mDKNYazSsh
— David Sirota (@davidsirota) November 6, 2024

This guy is already the biggest winner of the election.

He got ridiculed by everyone for over-paying for Twitter, but how much is the power to elect a president worth? At any rate hard to see that relationship last.

by elitedam Today at 1:07 am

I feel like we're agreeing with each other. I stated some positions that I think are popular. I'm not talking about fringe stuff. Minimum wage increase was another one I forgot to mention. The FL amendment was passed with 60% of the vote, even as it was trending red.

by Myesyats Today at 1:33 am

Pedram wrote:
The hosts of MSNBC’s Morning Joe (with Mika Brzezinski dressed in black for the occasion) engage in a ‘real honest conversation’ about why Kamala Harris lost: “A lot of Hispanic voters have problems with black candidates … They don’t like each other.” pic.twitter.com/QQG5UGqL5t
— Drop Site (@DropSiteNews) November 6, 2024

But but... i though Republicans were the party of racism?

These MSNBC morons have been embarrassing themselves non stop today. been watching their post election coverage not because i enjoy it, in fact they make me cringe, but as they say, it's like a slow car crash, you can't look away.

Its insane to me how simplistic the democratic outlook is. If you’re Black, Latino, any minority - you must vote blue. It’s heresy not to.

A lot of POC have realized that they’re only being exploited for political gain with no tangible change to speak of.

Obama won because he was a great candidate with a message that resonated at the time. Kamala lost because she was terrible and hastily swapped candidate with no primary. Why make it all about race? People have ears for ducks sake. Listen to Obama speak. Kamala sounds like a parrot. Lots of words, no substance. People will vote for a charismatic and intelligent candidate regardless of race. I personally think Michelle Obama could’ve won this.

by BarrileteCosmico Today at 2:17 am

The de-racialization of American politics and death of identity politics is undoubtedly one of the silver linings of this election.

There's still a widening gender divide, which is interesting because most women say they're not interested in dating someone of the opposite party but most Gen Z men voted for Trump and most Gen Z women for Harris. Wonder how that will play out for them.

by BarrileteCosmico Today at 2:22 am

elitedam wrote:I feel like we're agreeing with each other. I stated some positions that I think are popular. I'm not talking about fringe stuff. Minimum wage increase was another one I forgot to mention. The FL amendment was passed with 60% of the vote, even as it was trending red.

I guess the difference is that to me the fringe stuff is the progressive agenda. The stuff further to the left than most in the party. That's the kind of thing you might find in progressive publications.

Stuff like lower medicine prices, abortion available everywhere, min wage increases is pretty standard liberal (ie centrist) policy.

I'll agree the line between them is not always clear.

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